When they say "Secure the Borders", do they mean BOTH borders?

[maveric]

Or just the one where the brown people live?
Heard a guy say "I dont care about the Canadian border. Its the Mexicans that bother me".

If they beef up the border by Mexico will they do the same to the Canadian?

Just wondering.

[babylonsister]

1. Not that I've heard; be very afraid of Mexico. That is all. nt

[piedmont]

2. Just the one with nearly a million people illegally crossing every year. nt

[maveric]

4. Do Canadians cross illegally?

I think so.

[piedmont]

6. Do we have nearly a million Canadians entering and staying illegally each year?

Are there 12-20 million Canadian citizens in the U.S. illegally? I don't think so. If there are, I'd support tightening security along that border to the level of that on the Mexican border as well.

[Zookeeper]

11. Not 12 million.

I think the Canadians are more concerned with keeping US out.

[monktonman]

17. Yes they cross illegally

I married one.
She lived and worked in the USA for years without a second thought of getting caught.

[leftofthedial]

3. just the brown ones

poor brown ones who don't look like "us" and don't speak the same as "us"

[Gormy Cuss]

5. By "borders" they mean the land and water borders

south of the 54th parallel.

[Berry Cool]

7. In other words, no need to worry about terrorists trying to sneak into the country

through Canada, where they know it will be easier. No problem!

[seemslikeadream]

8. They'll be securing the Canadian border so we can't leave!

[Jim Warren]

9. How are they gonna fund it?

They don't have the money. This latest tissue wrap about $4B for increased border security is crapola to quiet the storm by righties but it ain't gonna happen because the bushies are pulling this one out of their ass: funding is keyed to the "fees" they are touting that will be collected from immigrantion candidates.

[rustydog]

10. No it is GOP code for get angry at the beaners. A bigot chant

[Madspirit]

12. deleted...moved down...n/t

[msongs]

13. the US only hs one border, and it encompasses the entire nation. nt

[uppityperson]

14. Neither the E or W or N, primarily the S

I really wish they'd get more cargo screening in place.

[LostInAnomie]

15. Absolutely! We should keep those 5-10 Canucks that sneak across each year out.

They might infect the public with ideas of universal health care, living wages, and price controlled meds. :eyes:

The border with Mexico is a problem because there are about a million illegal immigrants flooding over a year. 99.99% of the Canadians that come over the border do so legally and leave.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[yes2truth]

18. Respectfully disagree.

You said "I promise you, if the people in Mexico spoke English, had blond hair and blue eyes and freckles, we wouldn't be hearing nearly the bitching and moaning and whining. They would be setting up shelters for them."

The real issue is the problems caused by OVERpopulation, not illegal immigration. Illegal immigrants just happen to be the major factor in contributing to the problems that result from OVERpopulation.
I assume you know what at least some of those problems are, but if you don't - here's a hint: OVERpopulation provides HUGE ECONOMIC benefits to the ruling class at the expense of the rest of us.

[Cleita]

20. By overpopulation do you mean too many brown people?

:rofl: Really think about what you just said.

[yes2truth]

36. OVERpopulation = too many people for the available resources...

resulting in huge social costs that come at the expense of all except the small percentage of wealthy persons (and business interests) that benefit financially.

[uppityperson]

22. Whose OVERpopulation do you mean? Respectfully asked.

[Madspirit]

24. Nope

The Ruling Class always has someone for the white working class to blame. Always. Even when they USE the very people they are demonizing. It's called divide and conquer. My dad's generation blamed blacks for "taking all the jobs and driving down the wages".

...and it's actually much more complicated than either of us are able to express in our two paragraphs of Extreme Knowledge of the World.

I do KNOW this though. I am a Texan. I have many illegal friends. They work hard to make a better life for their families. I also don't know a single person who has ever lost a job to one.

...and I know that NOTHING will ever convince me that it isn't MOSTLY racism that makes this such a angry topic. ...because PLEASE, if it wasn't racism, no one would call them criminals SIMPLY because of their resident status. USUALLY we only call...oh...you know...killers and rapists and child molesters and bank robbers and Bush, etc. criminals.

We call Mexican illegals criminals and act like it has a big "c". Taking into account the number of them who are children...well, I certainly don't call babies or little kids criminals. OTHER than their resident status, most are hardworking, family-oriented folks, not criminals with a big "c".

...and if it wasn't based in racism, people wouldn't talk about them like they are from a fucking other planet, dripping with scorn and disdain. Watch the words people use when talking about illegals from Mexico. It's borders on hysteria. It's not based in the brain at all.

The only brown people we welcome are the ones escaping big bad Communism. Do you know our policy with Cuba? It's called "wet foot/dry foot". If they are caught in the water, they are sent back but the MOMENT their feet touch the sand, they are LEGAL. So brown people who vote mostly Republican and are escaping from countries with leaders so macho it makes our presidents cover their private parts and weep in embarrassment at their teeny weanies....are good and welcome. ...because we love shoving it in Castro's face.

Too bad they don't have to come over in boats from Mexico and too bad Mexico isn't Communist. The Rio Grande barely trickles in places and the people who come over, when they do become legal, mostly vote Democratic. ...and the people from Mexico aren't fellating the president in mutual anti-Communist masturbation... So...fuck 'em, is the overwhelming opinion.

They don't steal anything from us. That is a myth. ...and the main reason the Ruling Class doesn't want amnesty is because if they become legal and get some rights, the Ruling Class won't be able to treat them so badly as workers.

Lee

[yes2truth]

37. YEP. The costs of OVERpopulation are huge.

If you are one of those that benefit from having a 10,000 low-income persons move into your city, thereby reducing the available supply of affordable housing, and YOU happen to own some apartments, you'll be able to raise the rent and reap a windfall.

I'm surprised you aren't more knowledgeable about the high costs of OVERpopulation.

[iverglas]

23. you have illegal friends ...

I have illegal cousins. Illegal where you're at, that is. ;)

My oldest boy cousin, a year older than me, moved to the US from Canada a couple of decades ago. I don't know the actual story, don't think he was planning on leaving for good, but he met somebody, they got married ...

As the years passed, coming home to visit became an increasingly difficult proposition. He has a conviction for pot possession from about 1970. He doesn't know what might be in whose computer, so he is reluctant to chance it. He and his wife have a business in the US, and they have a couple of kids, and everybody's life would be ruined if he got stopped.

So when our grandmother was very old, in the mid-90s, he did come to visit her once. He didn't come for her funeral. He chanced it once about 5 years ago when his mother was rapidly declining with Alzheimer disease. He didn't take the risk when she died.

Imagine being that isolated from your entire family. There has to be strong motivation to overcome all one's natural ties. In his case, it was his own new family. In the case of people crossing the other border into the US, and people who come into our two countries in North America from other places in other ways, the motivation, just wanting a decent life, has to be pretty strong.

When I practised immigration law, I took it very very seriously when someone got picked up for staying in the country illegally. I thought it was a disaster for them. Then one day, a client's attitude made me look from a different angle. Yes, having to leave might be quite awful -- but that was the worst that could happen. So as far as being all worried about being in the country illegally ... well, they weren't really. And I thought about how I'd feel kinda the same way if I were, say, to go to the US and live illegally. Big deal.

It does flow the other way around too y'know! An immigration officer of mine told the tale of being out to dinner with a bunch of friends at a Tex-Mex restaurant, where the server assigned to their table had quite the Texan accent of her own. One of those perky blondes they have so many of down there. So, said Wayne, where ya from? His wife kicked him under the table, but he persisted; an immigration officer's work is never done. Austin, she drawled. He continued with his light-hearted chatter -- she was living with her Canadian boyfriend, didn't have status ... and next day, sent an enforcement officer around. He said he figured it was time she got married. She did, and eventually he approved her for status.

[TahitiNut]

25. If you believe you see someone spreading racism on DU, hit Alert.

Repeatedly smearing DU and DUers (with whom you disagree) is disruptive of valid, rational, and legitimate discussion of an issue that's difficult enough without trying to make broad brush allegations of racism.

Insofar as the "blond hair and blue eyes" exception you claim, it's horse manure. My grandparents were Norwegian immigrants during WW1 ... and were called "filthy Scandahoovians" by the bigots. My grandfather, a skilled machinist with a 4th grade education, leared to speak English with no accent whatsoever (as wwell as French and Italian) and had a vocabulary that permitted him to blow away people (teachers and professors) at Scrabble - and was still called such names. Folks can be against illegal aliens, undocumented workers, and even non-immigrant worker visas and NOT BE a racist at all. Indeed, such folks can be black, Hispanic, or any ethnicity and still hold such opinions - and it's NOT 'racist.'

Read http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2006/03/paul_krugman_th_1.html

It's the role of moderators to handle bigots of any kind and using the Alert function is the way we can keep some semblance of civility in the forums.

Thanks. :hi:

[Madspirit]

29. Then evidently

You evidently haven't noticed the WAY they talk about Mexicans...like they are filth. I stand by every word I said. ...and others have noticed it too. See the other posters where I answered?

"Those people" etc....pretty telling in my opinion. ...and I have alerted on racism to no avail, more than once. We are an organization not a Perfect Thing...not sacrosanct.

...and the history you are citing, which would also cover the Irish...discrimination....is history. We haven't changed any since then? That's really sad and pathetic.

...and maybe the Mexicans don't want to be exactly like Donna Reed. Neither do I. Screw assimilation. I am not a pro-Borg. I don't WANT to be straight white and uptight and neither do my Mexican friends and they are proud of their accents and their language.

Lee

[TahitiNut]

30. So, every nation on the face of the earth is racist.

Those nations that enforce their immigration laws even more than the U.S. are even more racist? That would include Mexico, Canada, and even Tahiti - in fact the overwhelming majority of nations. Fascinating.

[Madspirit]

31. PS

...and it was THE point of the OP so I shouldn't be chastised for it.

...and I won't compare us to other nations though yes, certainly, other people can be racist too.

...but this about Mexico and US...a country famous for it's incredible racism, history of racism, present day racism...racism all around...

Lee

[entanglement]

38. True - some of the restrictionists / nativists don't even attempt to hide their bigotry

[Cleita]

19. I can't see how they would build three fences with roads in between

them across the US/Canada border like they are going to build across Mexico considering a lot of it crosses mountains and some pretty hairy wilderness areas. I hope they don't. We have Caribou that migrate between BC and E. Washington/Idaho. I have seen a herd on the American side when I was up there. It would be a change to muck this up. There will also be ecological damage on the southern border, but no one thinks of that.

[treestar]

21. It's because the Mexicans are more desperate and willing to work for

less for the same job, and that should not be! Mexicans should rather be willing to starve than work for less than that, just because they should acknowledge that Americans are superior beings with greater right to live!

[TexasProgresive]

26. LOL,, Ha, ha, snort, sniffle, hehehehe! you are so funny! n/t

[Hangingon]

27. Both borders

There is a flood across the southern border but the nortern border is extremely vulnerable too.

[jcrew2001]

28. The NHL has a lot of illegal immigrants, Eh!

we need to deport those hockey playing beer guzzling trouble-makers. They're stealing our jobs - i wanted to play in the NHL - that must be why they're no longer on tv, immigrants are ruining the nhl.

Canada is not a 3rd world country and they have universal health care, and a stable economy, there is no strong overwhelming migration of canadians into the US. its also cleaner than the US, and you can drink at 18.

Why do u like ken camineti? isn't he dead?

[Monk06]

32. "If they beef up the border by Mexico will they do the same to the Canadian?"

Short answer no.

US/Mexico Border = 1951 miles

US/Canada Border = 5,525 miles

Europe/Soviet/Warsaw Pact Border = 2141 miles

The US/Mexico and Europe/Warsaw Pact Borders are/were roughly
the same length. The Warsaw Pact Border was enormously
expensive to guard and maintain and yet defections
(illegal immigration to Europe) was a constant irritation
for the Russians.

The Canadian Border is 2.5 times larger than either and 80%
of it is not only unguarded it's unmarked. There are hundreds
of places in BC alone where you could cross into the US
without knowing that you had left Canada.

[jcrew2001]

33. If I move to canada or dodge the war - does that make

me an illegal alien? They have free health care, a stable economy, and clean cities - If I were them, I would worry about Americans crossing into canada!

[amandabeech]

34. During the Vietnam War, draftees did go to Canada.

At that time, Canada let them stay.

At this point, Canada has agreed NOT to take in U.S. draft "dodgers." Of course, if the Canadians dump their Conservative government, things may change.

Canadians take immigrants, but not as many as the U.S. does. I assume that they have some problems with people overstaying visas more than U.S. citizens walking across the border.

[MrSlayer]

35. I don't know if that's what "they" mean but it is what I mean.

Close them both is my stance.

[BlooInBloo]

39. Nope. Mainly the brown border.

[Elspeth]

40. There are Canadians who are guest workers in the northern US

I don't know whether they are legal or not.