1 or 2 more young male soldiers lost their genitals yesterday

[donsu]

by one military doctor.

re: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1173625


that makes 27 to 54 genitals cut off young soldiers this month by that doctor.

what's the count for the past months of the occupation counting all the genitals removed by all of the military doctors?

one thousand? genital-less young men?

have they formed a support group? support group for the families?

does anyone even care?

calling Cindy! what do you and yours know about this?

BRING THE TROOPS HOME NOW

[TahitiNut]

1. A supply of eunichs to guard the harems of the future.

:puke: :puke:

[donsu]

4. eunuchs lost their balls as young children - they didn't lose their penis

they could still have sex but could not create children

our young men have lost it ALL -

these young men are devastated. simply devastated.

and it is our fault.

[Tesha]

5. The method varied depending on the culture. (NT)

[TahitiNut]

13. Are you sure you're not confusing castrati with eunuchs?

Maybe we should ask Lorena. She seems to be the foremost advocate of hyper-radical circumcision.

[donsu]

17. I thought the castrati were eunichs?

nt

[TahitiNut]

20. It's a question of when, why and how.

Across the spectrum of eunuchs, the castrati are a 'special' kind. It was done before puberty to boys already identified for their singing voices and limited to a surgical (in the way of those times) cutting of the tubes to the testes. (Since the 'state of the surgical art' was poor - often done by barbers - fatal complications were not uncommon.)

In some places and times throughout history, eunuchs were created by what we could best call a "transsexual" operation - the removal of all external genitalia. Further, this might be done at various ages and for various purposes... often to completely preclude the possibility that they'd either penetrate or impregnate women - either generally or specifically.

[donsu]

25. didn't know they sometimes removed everything - thanks for info

nt

[MrPrax]

31. These poor guys are the involuntary type...

Don't believe me -- how about that Bible:

"For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it." -Matthew 19:12

That incidentally is one of the Biblical classics used as edict for everyone from Skoptzy to The Elect cult that circulated among early Mormonism. That's right -- they cut their own equipment off as an act of devotion.

In some cultures being a Eunuch was considered an honour position and in some places (China, ME kingdoms) a necessity to advance in the court 'service' trades. Japanese Generals took their eunuchs into battle with them...they were like an elite honour guard.

Also anyone with a sense of the arcane might remember that in Norman Spinrad's Iron Dream, the ultimate show of 'Trueman' loyalty to Jaggar (and his Steel Commander) was self-castration just before they all blast off into space.

[yardwork]

2. Wow. I didn't know this. The injuries from this war are horrific.

And bushco is cutting healthcare for veterans.

[firefox_fan]

3. Not to be cynical, but I'd rather lose my genitals than my brain

[mondo joe]

7. Are those the only choices?

[firefox_fan]

8. Ok, how about genitals, eyes, brain or

complete facial disfiguration. What's your pick?
I'd go for genitals anytime.

[mondo joe]

9. I'd prefer not fighting in an illegal war, if it's all on the table. NT

[GaYellowDawg]

10. Eyes.

I'd like to have the option of reproduction open.

[firefox_fan]

12. I used to, before I studied genetics...

And realized that 99% of my genes are transmitted by OTHER humans and primates reproducing anyway...

[Joe Chi Minh]

15. For you to speculate in that way, I'm not sure you haven't already lost the latter.

I would have thought the horrific nature of this thread would have overwhelmed the reader to the exclusion of academic speculations about preferences regarding the relative 'merits' of various kinds of mutilation over others.

[firefox_fan]

23. Apparently, you thought wrong...

It happens.

[mainer]

21. me too. Is this weirdness about genitals a guy thing?

Because I'm a woman and I'd much rather keep my eyes and my brain intact. A lot of people can't reproduce -- that's where adoption comes in.

[Posteritatis]

34. Part of it, I think, is the cringe factor

There's a whole lot of nerve endings in that area, which is why it's one of the most painful places a male can get hit. Most guys have at least some experience with that, enough to know that (A) it sucks and (B) it probably could have been worse.

Ever hear an injury described, seen one, etc., and suddenly you swear you could sort of feel it yourself? I assume a lot of people get that sort of thing about one thing or another (paper cuts seem to be "popular" there, for example). They aren't necessarily rational, either. I'll hear of someone getting severed leg and I'll go "ow," while I'll hear of someone, say, sliding four or five feet on rough asphalt in a skateboarding wipeout and visibly shudder, even though that's a less severe and far more recoverable injury.

Am I getting that across properly? I'm going goofy with the heat here and could fail a Turing test today. I think that sort of thing is going on with this.

Most guys I know get that kind of reaction about significant (or even mild) injuries to the genitals; the whole Fear Of Being Emasculated thing aside (which is there for a lot of people), there's simply the fact that most guys know how much any injury there hurts, and a little part of our minds will just kinda go twitching in the corner upon hearing of any injuries there which involve the terms "shrapnel" or "bullet" or "high explosive" or "couldn't find them afterwards." Basically, there's already a baseline for appreciating how fun that sort of thing isn't, there's a degree of empathy for such things, and there's the awareness of Oh My God Did That Guy Ever Have It Worse. Cringe.

So to answer your question, I think to a point it is a guy thing. I don't necessarily think it's about reproduction, or even sex - at least exclusively - though. A lot of it could be an awareness - an extremely limited one, but one nonetheless - of what the victims might be going through, and a reaction to that which certainly is some kind of instinctive, hind-brain sort of thing.

[dogday]

6. The guys that started this war don't have to worry

about that problem, no do they?

[femrap]

19. Maybe someday when they find somethemselves locked

up in The Hague....

[SpiralHawk]

11. "Ass pimples are, like, way worse." - Rush Limbaugh

"I mean, tough shit for the soldiers and all that, but what about ass pimples? The only good thing we republicon chickenhawks can say about ass pimples is that at least they got us MILITARY DEFERMENTS so we did not need to serve America for even five minutes. Smirk, smirk, smirk. But otherwise, believe me, ass pimples are Total Hell. Now where did I put my Oxycontin?"

- Rush Chickenhawk Republicon Limbaugh

[shadowknows69]

14. Just another log to heap upon this pyre of misery

Bring them home now!!!

[riderinthestorm]

16. A fact that needs broadcasting in front of every recruiting station in the US.

:cry:

[donsu]

18. yes - body armour protects your body but not your genitals

whether you keep your genitals or not is a roll of the dice

[TahitiNut]

22. In Nam, pilots usually SAT on their flak jackets for just this reason.

:shrug: DemoTex would be best able verify this.

[Bunny]

24. This is a stupid question, but can't they be issued a protective cup or something?

:shrug:

[donsu]

26. I wondered too - when men fought with spears/swords their armour

had a flap? like thing to protect their privates.

[Bunny]

28. They wear cups when they play sports. Could they make a kevlar one or something?

Probably wouldn't be very comfortable to wear, but it beats the alternative, I would think.

[Posteritatis]

30. Probably the degree of force involved

A sporting injury would place fewer joules on the jewels than, say, a round of ammunition or a piece of shrapnel.

With the fact that you'd mostly be protecting soft tissue in that area (and not just the genitals, either), a bit might inflict a lot of damage anyway, just from the cup itself channeling the impact, in the same way that a hit on torso armor can sometimes break ribs.

There'd be difficulty in making armor that's both tough enough to be reasonably useful without being heavy or bulky enough to impede movement more than it would already be in full kit (where the discomfort is more worth it since it's covering your "I need these to live" bits, rather than 'just' your "I really really really want to remain attached to these" bits). I'm just speculating wildly, of course, but I know I wouldn't necessarily want any armor I was wearing into combat to, say, put my legs to sleep or something. (I'm actually recovering from a bad nerve pinch in one leg as it stands, and have been for a month. Fuckin' ow.)

Anyone more Clued on the matter able to chime in? Would it be possible to make armor-grade protection here that wouldn't potentially cause as many problems as it would prevent?

[Bunny]

32. Okay, that makes sense. Not possessing that particular set of 'bits', and thus having never worn a

cup, I'm not familiar with the pitfalls of such gear.

[Recursion]

38. The flak jackets have that flap

But even when they stop shrapnel the concussion can be very damaging.

Body armor is very very heavy and hot, both of which can kill you and/or slow you down. So, it's always a trade-off; the principle seems to be to protect the brains, heart, and liver because you can survive just about anything else.

[Recursion]

33. We are, kind of

The flak vest has a codpiece that covers the groin and hips, but if there's a powerful enough explosion it usually just means the difference between genitals that are already gone completely and genitals injured so badly they have to be amputated. Sufficient concussive force can destroy the blood vessels, which are very big and close to the skin in the genitals.

[chaska]

27. Army of one ... dumb sumbitch....

I don't reckon them soldier boys gave much thought to the possibility of losing they bits and pieces before signin' up. That'll learn 'em.

[depakid]

29. What surprises me most is that people didn't realize this

I would have thought that anyone looking at the types of injuries that these people are receiving would understand that it's not just legs and arms being shredded and blown off.

Perhaps it's not a comfortable subject- it's certainly not good for recruiting, but it's an inevitable consequence of the weapons being used.

[Chulanowa]

35. It's the pro-war propaganda

Killing the other poor sum'bitch is supposed to be heroic. You're told that if you don't, you're less of a man, you're a sissy-girl. When you come back from the war, you're taught you'll be more of a man, because, lord knows, the definition of manliness to the right is killing other people.

Losing your balls to an IED blast really screws up this propaganda. So, they don't cover it.

[riderinthestorm]

36. It's not just balls, it's the penis getting amputated.

I just went outside and asked my husband about this - how much of an enlistement deterrent it would be to him if meant there was a possibility of getting his penis cut off and he was uhm, pretty explicit about how persuasive that message would be to most 18,19, 20 year olds.


edited for clarity since the heat is getting to me

[MrSlayer]

37. I would ask them to cut off my head as well.

Horrible.

[riderinthestorm]

39. A kick (in the balls) for the pm crowd. nt