When Obama is called 'inexperienced' ... is that code for "boy"??

[TahitiNut]

Poll question: When Obama is called 'inexperienced' ... is that code for "boy"??

The repeated theme of "naive" and "inexperienced" seems to be an echo of a melody I've heard before.

:popcorn:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. It's code for...

"we can't think of a good reason not to vote for him."

[LSparkle]

6. Exactly ... or code for "you haven't waited your turn to run"

They're forgetting that we're NOT the Rethuglican Party (hierarchical/seniority counts).

[Gman]

2. It just plain means he's inexperienced.

and he shows it more often than not.

[aquart]

3. No. And I call him "green."

It's the feeling I get off him, and nothing has happened to change it.

He is still a remarkably able, intelligent human being. Not my primary choice but if he's the candidate, he has my vote.

[ccpup]

4. isn't there a

WTF category on this Poll?

[H2O Man]

5. Yes. n/t

[TahitiNut]

15. Thank you for the sanity check, sir.

There was an 'aura' - body language, expressions, tone - in front of the AFL/CIO that has nagged at me. At the same time, Obama seemed on edge for reasons more than just the questions. Considering the home-field 'comfort' it just seemed to add up to something a bit sour in my mouth. I don't know how much is conscious and how much is serendipitous - or how much is my abstract imagination. (That's why I slept on it - twice - before posting.)

[H2O Man]

17. There are some odd

dynamics coming into play in the democratic primary. Of course, no one would notice that just from reading DU, where discussions about the abilities of each candidate are nothing, if not civil. Ha!

But, there is a lot of pathology in this country. And tension brings it towards the surface. We can predict with zero chance of being wrong that the next few months will be marked by far more of these odd dynamics reaching the surface.

[TahitiNut]

19. Yep. That tracks with my perceptions as well.

It's a bit insidious that language can be so two-tiered and someone can be completely devoid of such intent and use the same words with honest and unbiased intent ... but be (in effect) a Typhoid Mary.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. I Have Contributed To Both Obama's And Edwards' Campaign

I also respect your opinion but I don't see the attacks on Obama as being racially motivated....

I think the fact that he's being called inexeperienced is more a function of his youthful appearance and enthusiasm than anything else...

It seems, for better or worse, that candidates like Dodd, Biden, Richardson, and Hillary Clinton have been around forever and comapared to them Obama looks like a novice...


If it is racism I am really disappointed...

[H2O Man]

22. I am sure that

many good and sincere people do believe Obama is too inexperienced; I see posts from people that I am confident are not saying it in any other way than to express their concern. I have no problem with that.

I also am aware that there are other people, who will speak in a way that is intended to appeal to the darker impulses of segments of our society. I am sure that we will continue to see code words that attack Clinton because she is a woman -- although many good and decent people have other serious questions about her.

Those who peddle hatred will use words in a manner different than the way non-hateful people do. This election cycle will provide a huge amount of evidence of that.

[TahitiNut]

24. Yep. I agree. And good people can (unknowingly) act as 'carriers' of the code.

Rather than employ code-free terms, the commonly-used words are chosen.

From years of seeing threads on DU, it seems that many DUers believe that anyone employing such 'infected' terms must themselves be diseased. That's what's so maddening about coded language - it can be used by uninfected people and then THEY get attacked. It creates a 'friendly fire' madhouse.

(It's one of the reasons I thought this poll might be interesting, too.)

[H2O Man]

26. Right.

Words have power. Sometimes they are used in a positive manner, sometimes not. But one thing is for sure: there are people involved in the "perception management" business, who are often employed in campaigns, who understand how different words appeal to different people.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

27. The Media Is Good At Putting "Bugs" In People's Ears ...

I was an enthusiastic supporter of Obama before he even announced, in fact as far back as when his book, The Audacity Of Hope , came out... But the attacks on him as being "inexperienced" make me question my original judgement... That being said, I'm supporting him financially and look forward to voting for him in the primaries...

[H2O Man]

38. Dick Cheney

had extensive experience. But he is an evil man.

Obama doesn't have Cheney's experience. But he's a good man.

[frogcycle]

49. It's all in the eye (or ear) of the beholder

I doubt that most who use the expression mean it that way. We all know there are plenty out there who are already "agin him" for having more recent ancestors from the dark continent than they have, and they probably hear it that way - that no matter how much experience he gets, he'll never be "experienced" enough because 'those people' just cannot cut it. But if it weren't "experience" it would be something else. I seriously doubt that "playing the race card" can have much affect - them as wishes they still had their hoods aren't blind - don't need reminding. The rest of us won't be swayed by it. And I really don't think there is much of it going on, except with people like limburger. And even they feel compelled to insist he is a muslim, because being black just isn't negative enough these days! Isn't that cool!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

25. I Have Been Watching The Debates Closely

Hillary Clinton is not my first choice and she's certainly not the first choice of people here but she's the most adroit and agile politician I have seen since her husband arrived on the national scene fifteen years ago...Obama has a more than formidable opponent... She might have even surprised him... And if she's gets the nomination she will not be a pushover...She's tough...

[H2O Man]

35. I agree.

I think that there is a strong group of democratic candidates. The most recent debate was, in my opinion, very impressive. I think our "second tier" candidates are far better than the "top tier" republicans. Still, because of the nature of politics in the past couple of decades, I think that we can't take anything for granted. It will be important for everyone to invest time and money in bringing about democratic victories in the White House and Congress.

[babylonsister]

28. What we have to look forward to in this election cycle is extremely

depressing. I wish you were wrong, but fear you're right. When a woman and a black man run for prez for the first time, in this current political climate, I fear it's going to get ugly. Civility seems pretty lost to me.

[H2O Man]

37. If you have a family

that has issues we call "dysfunctional," they may do okay when things are going along smoothly. Add some tension, increase the level of stress, and those issues will surface. The same holds true in a nation, and we are going to see it. I will say that I do not think it needs to be depressing -- we can take advantage of this opportunity to address some of those "hidden" issues that many people deny exist.

[TahitiNut]

41. In business, the Japanese call it "lowering the water."

(The metaphor is lowering the water in a river to find the rocks on the bottom.) Of course they use it (putting the business under stress) to find operational problems ... but the idea of systems under stress is the same.

[H2O Man]

43. Exactly.

We see some of those same type of dynamics here on DU when it comes to the issue of impeachment. There are those who recognize that this nation has some very serious problems, and we need to "lower the water" in order to deal with them. And there are others who believe that while there are problems, we should keep them submerged. In social work, I saw the same thing in many families: some people wanted to put the cards on the table, and deal with problems head-on; others wanted to avoid dealing with the most serious ones to whatever extent possible.

[tritsofme]

7. Then what does it mean when people call Edwards inexperienced?

nt

[hedgehog]

9. We posted together - and I think your question feeds into my thinking.

Edwards may be a rich lawyer now, but he's too sympathetic to working people to understand how the world works (sarcasm). Of course, in some circles he may have a big mansipon but he's still a kid from the mills.

[TahitiNut]

16. Then what does it mean when people call Edwards articulate?

:eyes: :shrug:

[hedgehog]

8. Maybe not exactly, but close enough for me!

It has a lot to do with the fact that he's not quite a memeber of the club.

[bigtree]

10. he's young, looks young

has limited national or international experience, limited executive experience

They certainly don't need to remind folks that he's black by throwing around veiled epitaphs.

[global1]

11. If HRC Says 'She's Our Girl" Is She Implying That Obama "Is Our Boy".....nt (sarcasm)

[DemBones DemBones]

30. 60 year-old women shouldn't refer to themselves as "girls,"

even if sixty is the new forty.

[mondo joe]

32. 60 year old women should call themselves whatever they like.

Just like everyone else.

[DemBones DemBones]

39. It's funny when people on your Ignore list reply to you. nt

[frogcycle]

51. 60 year old women should call themselves whatever they like.

just like everyone else

there - now you know what he wrote, and you can put me on ignore too

[ismnotwasm]

12. Could be

He's already dubbed "The Magic Negro". Race is going to be a factor. No way around it, no way out of it, he a black man who is running for president. I'm sure some who use the "inexperienced" label might like to say "uppity" instead.

[Karenina]

13. He's "not "qualified""

;-)

[H2O Man]

18. Right.

He needs to be patient.

[Madspirit]

14. Yup..k&r Tahiti...n/t

[KoKo]

20. NO...I think he REALLY IS...Inexperienced! Let him spend some time in Senate or Even in

a Dem Administration...and see how he learns. He has so much potential ...but the M$M PUSHED HIM FAR BEYOND. I won't vote for someone who the M$M chose to Prop UP and USE as a tool.

Bothers me about OBAMA is that "HE TOOK THE BAIT AND RAN WITH IT!"

[rucky]

23. 2-4 n/t

[DemBones DemBones]

29. He's "called inexperienced" because he IS inexperienced.

John Edwards has only a couple of years' more experience, and Hillary a few more than that.

The irony of this campaign is that the four Democrats with the most years of government experience are all considered "bottom tier" candidates while the three with the least experience are the "top tier."

Being pretty is apparently essential, at least at this point. Maybe people will wake up eventually.

[nini]

31. Not necessarily.. They're after him because he's a strong candidate..

and have to go after something.

[Grandrose]

33. You bet!

Inexperienced = boy and naive = uppity and basically he is out of his place, this was to be the coronation of the Woman President and Hillary's turn.

The audacity :evilgrin: of Obama to even consider and throw a monkey wrench into the best laid plans!

Frankly...I do not care if he wins the nomination (this time), I just love the fact that he is the future and a real possibility for the first time. All I can say is, some of us will keep our eyes on the prize!:D

[YellowRubberDuckie]

34. Yes....

Because everything that is directed towards people of color is code for something racist.
:eyes: :sarcasm: (<---Just in case it wasn't clear)
Duckie

[izzybeans]

36. Inexperienced

funny how experience seems to matter only in his case. Especially from those who cry rivers about the old boys club in politics. Now all of the sudden a man with considerable experience is inexperienced. It certainly is code.

I see two codes: one that believes that because he doesn't triangulate on certain issues means he's inexperienced (hence Hillary's bullshit about not being allowed to say what you feel as a presidential candidate). The second definitely is the "look here boy, your experience is limited to shining my shoe, now get to shinin' and make me laugh".

Either way they are funny little lies that people tell themselves to justify their stances. In one instance, pandering assholes. In another, racist assholes. One can't be reduced to the other, but they are both there glaring, grinning wide with shit-stained teeth.

On edit: he's in his late 40s for fuck sake. How much experience do you need. You know that aged like a fine wine just doesn't apply to our species. We reach a certain age and stop developing. He's in his prime. The rest are decaying sacks.

[WillyT]

40. Dammit TN, Don't You Know That Racism Has Been Erased From These U S's of A's ???

Don't you go playin the Ace of Spades, er... I mean that irrelevant race card.

There is NO WAY, in this day an age, that anyone would try to make a grown black man look small.

And BTW... While were at it, there is NO WAY that any of my Democrat or Liberal brothers and sisters have a speck of racism in their hearts. We've all grown up in the U S of A Dammit, and not only do we not tolerate that kind of thinking, but we are IN NO WAY influenced by the 500 year history of our own country. NO WAY!!!

:banghead:

[treestar]

42. Wasn't JFK called inexperienced

That is always going to be said of any relatively young candidate.

Geez, it's been said of Hillary, too.

[TahitiNut]

44. Rarely, if ever. And he was never criticized as naive.

Even Nixon didn't go that far out. Then again, he had PT-109. (How soon people forget!)

It's only in the years since that younger candidates have been eager to compare themselves to JFK's age ... but forget that JFK commanded a PT boat in WW2. (Funny ... the people who try to make the self-serving comparisons - like Danny Quayle - conveniently "forget" about that.)

[Terri S]

45. Bill had a thing or two to say about 'experience'

link

[VP505]

46. Obama is

inexperienced because the DLC wants Hillary as the nominee. IMO, what is more important than some arbitrary standard for experience is a willingness to surround himself with experienced and seasoned advisor's and being smart enough to know when he doesn't have answers and seeks advice for those who do.

[Zomby Woof]

47. I suspect it is

Lincoln only served one term in the House. Two years. No governorship, no senate seat.

If we really cared about "experience", we wouldn't have had to endure either Bush. One served in the House for only two terms (4 years), and the other occupied the Texas governor's mansion for a short time. The rest of their offices were appointed.

So yes, there is veiled racism at work in deriding Obama's "experience". Stick to his positions on the issues, and nothing else.

[global1]

48. Let's Cut This Inexperienced Crap Out - Like The Chimp Was A Walking, Talking .......

storehouse of experience when he took office. Hell he's been in the job now for 7 years and he still doesn't know what he is doing. All this talk on DU between all the different supporters of the Dem primary candidates is just giving fuel to the Freepers. All these comments that we're making (myself included) will come back to haunt us once we pick the Dem nominee. But next time it won't be coming from within - we'll be attacked from the Right.

[frogcycle]

50. which is exactly why

we need to freaking stop this shit.

the "negative campaigning" on this board is appalling