Presidential Debate (tonight)

[H2O Man]

Am I correct that he democratic candidates are going to be on MSNBC tonight? I believe it is in Hanover, NH, with Tim Russert serving as moderator. It should be on at 9 pm est.

Are people planning to watch?

[mmonk]

1. My son in college wants me to record it.

Guess I will.

[H2O Man]

4. I plan to.

I hope the topic of Iran is mentioned.

[mmonk]

5. Me too.

And I hope it's a question they can't wiggle out of answering.

[H2O Man]

7. I have been

sending donations to a few of the candidates. Should any give what I consider the wrong answer, I will re-direct the next donation to those who answer correctly.

[mmonk]

9. That's been my mo so far as well.

I sent Dodd a contribution lately for his work in attempting to restore habeas corpus.

[Vadem]

72. So have I done the same as you! ... n/t

[Nite Owl]

2. Planning on it

but the way my day has been going who knows what can happen between now and 9pm. Just one of those days.

[JNelson6563]

13. Here's hopin' it gets better!

:toast:

[zanne]

3. You bet.

It will also be on C-Span radio. I'm not sure of the time.

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. After the vote this morning

I fear I now know we don't matter

Has been decided... all this is theater.

Sorry to sound that negative

;-(

[H2O Man]

11. I do not think

that you sound negative. I think you sound realistic.

I read an interview yesterday, with a retired boxer. He was asked about the first professional fight he saw in person. He said he couldn't recall the fighters, but he remembers being suddenly aware that the audience was an active part of the event. I think we need to participate in the theater in a more active way.

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. I'm not going to stop sending emails, and calling

but it is a waste of my time

We need more than just demonstrations and emails.

I fear it will take a third party doing surprisingly well in the elections, or worst... a revolution

[zanne]

17. I'm psyched!

I must be the only one on DU who is more hopeful, not less, than I was to begin with! Campaigns are ugly things and smears and skewed numbers are commonplace. Rumors run rampant. Who didn't expect that? C'mon; get psyched with me!

[nadinbrzezinski]

35. And actual voting records are a bitch

as well as the cold realization that we have a war party and a less war party

[zanne]

209. I know that you're being negative and hoping you're wrong...

I do it, too. It always turns out better than I thought it would. There's nothing wrong with hoping.

[Beaverhausen]

8. If Obama shows up I guess we will know if his "stomach flu" was real or not

[KoKo]

10. The only reason I'm going to watch is to see how they react to Throwing their Grassroots Under the

Bus! I expect to turn it off after first 20 Minutes when Russert (the GRAND INQUISITOR before WHOM ALL MUST FALL DOWN) is the Moderator :rofl: Moderator...

But...I'll give it a try. After the Disastors our Senate and House have visited upon those of us who gave them money and support in their "years in the Wilderness" it should be good to hear what they say.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

14. thanks for the heads up Water man !

[H2O Man]

15. We'll see

if you still thank me at the end of the debate! (grin)

[tech3149]

16. Hope y'all keep us cable challenged informed

I'm sure there will be many comments, just provide a few details for context.

[Blackhatjack]

18. It's time for the gloves to come off, 4 mos from the first caucus....

There is an interesting story line developing here, but the candidates have to be willing to cross the imaginary line that has separated them so far. That line? An unspoken agreement that they will not attack each other in the primaries.

I think that Edwards (and to a lesser degree Obama) is going to have to define Clinton as too close to the corporate campaign contributors and special interest groups. THere is lots of ammunition to be used in that area. He also is going to have to address the electibility factor that could be a problem with Clinton's high unfavorable numbers, and her likely energization of the Republican base given their hatred for all things Clinton.

Obama is positioned define himself as being capable of bringing change that Clinton cannot because of her corporate connections. Obama can present himself as a candidate for 'change', but he is going to have to fill out that argument with more than just making the allegation. He is going to have to get down to details to demonstrate that he has thought through the policies that he will promote if President.

IF neither Edwards nor Obama is willing to take Clinton on regarding her weaknesses, she will continue to build support in the Democratic Party by perception as having already won.

Of course recall that Kerry was 19 pts back to Dean at this stage last election cycle. We are long way from the finish line.

[H2O Man]

19. Coming up!

It could have a few interesting exchanges ......

[Cameron27]

20. Is this the "official thread" H2O man?

You might want to put that in the title.

[H2O Man]

21. Too late

to edit this.

[H2O Man]

22. 47 years ago tonight!

Was Kennedy v Nixon -- their first debate!

[TahitiNut]

26. I remember it clearly. I was beginning my senior year in high school.

... knowing that I'd be entering the U.S. Coast Gaurd Academy upon graduation. It had a way of 'enhancing' my interest in the election.

[H2O Man]

29. It changed everything.

By 1964, the republicans were invested in using dirty tactics on tv. Goldwater refused. But four years later, the Nixon era of dirty politics were unleashed.

[KoKo]

37. OMG....brings back memories.....n/t

[KoKo]

39. Keep going with reporting...

I had to turn it off...don't know why...might peek back. I'd rather READ than watch...just something about it.

[H2O Man]

23. Obama unwilling

to say he'll end the war of occupation in 4 years.

[TahitiNut]

24. Nor Clinton, nor Edwards.

:grr:

[H2O Man]

25. Right.

They are saying they will reduce combat troops, but they are hedging.

[me b zola]

28. All three support a permanent presence in Iraq

They all three spoke about protecting military bases and the embassy.

[H2O Man]

30. Oil?

What are the chances?

[TahitiNut]

34. And in no case do they cede to a multinational 'foster care' plan.

It's one thing to mouth the words 'diplomacy' and 'international cooperation' and quite another to COMMIT to that cooperation ... (like Kucinich does).

[H2O Man]

36. What do you think

of Dodd? I like him.

[TahitiNut]

47. He's tied with Richardson as my 4th choice. I like him.

Right now, Kucinich is WAYY ahead in my esteem, with Edwards in second place by a length ahead of the trailing pack led by Obama, then Richardson and Dodd, followed by Biden by a length and then Gravel... then Clinton (a jockey with pockets filled with heavy silver pieces).

[mmonk]

178. Dodd is one I like.

He was second in a candidate test (which checks candidate views with your own) I took in another thread.

[kath]

27. Tim Russert? ACK. Don't think I have the stomach to watch that.

It ain't for nothin' that he was MWO's MediaWhore of the Year at least once, if not twice.

Still missing The Horse...

[H2O Man]

32. It could be worse.

He is asking okay questions. The answers are more troubling.

[me b zola]

31. Woo-hoo, go Richardson!

Does not support a permanent presence in Iraq.

[H2O Man]

33. That was good.

Dodd is also doing well.

[me b zola]

38. Yes. I am warming to both men (Richardson & Dodd)

[H2O Man]

40. He spoke about

how it is not making us safer.

[me b zola]

45. And he is right

I don't understand why more Dems don't talk about this. I haven't forgotten how HRC said that we are safer now then we were before *.

[me b zola]

41. Dennis! HR-1234

:bounce:

[H2O Man]

43. I really like him.

He has been doing well.

[TahitiNut]

78. It's STILL the sanest proposal of all... by far.

[KoKo]

42. Kucinich says "No Iraq Division" .."House Divided Against itself Cannot Stand..."

just turned it back on. What he said sounded good to me...

[H2O Man]

44. Gravel is talking

about Iran. Very good.

[KoKo]

46. Gravel says: Make Congress Vote ...hold them "By Scruff of Neck" make them Vote...Revote

and HOld them TO IT. He's saying Liberman/Kyle Amendment will allow Bush to Invade Iran!

Said Obama has not been there. HILLARY LAUGHS at what he said!

[H2O Man]

49. Her laughing

is getting as old as Rudy's cell phone calls.

[Vadem]

54. I so agree with you, Waterman! It has gotten VERY OLD!!!! .. n/t

[TahitiNut]

62. It was effective when it elicited the image of a woman laughing at a flasher ...

... with an open raincoat. Sadly, that image loses its novelty after a couple of plays.

[KoKo]

93. it did seem, out of place. I didn't expect it...

[Patsy Stone]

51. And then he lambasted Hillary for today's vote.

Wow.

[malaise]

48. Bravo Mike Gravel

Nail them.

[H2O Man]

53. I agree.

He adds to the debates.

[TahitiNut]

55. I agree ... I want him in the debates ... throwing rocks.

His fiscal perspectives are insane, though.

[H2O Man]

58. They are.

His role is limited to pit bull on the war stances of the conservative democrats.

[TahitiNut]

64. He's good at cutting through the kabuki defensiveness of the Vichy Dems.

I love the fact that he's VERY tuned to the same thing Kucinich is saying: They CAN stop the occupation NOW.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

87. He is so needed to bring honesty to the floor and he rocks at it! eom

[ecstatic]

50. Go Gravel! And no, that wasn't funny Clinton! Shame on you!

Her vote today was NOT funny!

[H2O Man]

56. People on MSNBC

had said they wondered if she would respond to a serious question by laughing. It's too rehearsed.

[malaise]

61. All I can say is

Run Al run or 'dog nyam our collective suppers'
(nyam = eat) :D

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

86. Her smiling in her explanation was totally inappropriate. eom

[KoKo]

52. Hillary says we need TEETH in what we want to do with Iran the Terrorist Sponser of Hamas

and the rest.

[KoKo]

57. Dodd says "Stop the Funding...Stand Up and Lead..Bring it to Halt!"

Biden says the vote is NOT for PARTITION.... Russert asking about Israel taking out Nukes in Iran and then talks about Syria.

Russert asks if Israel would be justified in striking Iran...Hillary waffling... Hillary says we don't have enough info...but that No. Korea was putting together Nuke facility and Israli's took it out which was there RIGHT to DO! She supports bombing in Syria....Russert going after her again...and she says she's not answering and laughing. She says NoKorea Freighter came in with supplies to Syria and so Israel was justified to take it out.

[H2O Man]

59. Russert

is doing okay.

[KoKo]

60. Would Hillary make Promise not to Allow Iran to gain Nuke Power.

She says we haven't even "tried" deplomacy and sanctions we haven't had any efforts that way.

[KoKo]

63. Obama now asks about Iran Attack...He says we don't know what happened with Syria

and we know that Bush's efforts have made Iran stronger. We need to take the Diplomatic route to solve this by squeezing Iran Economically. He disagrees with Giuliani and Hillary. But he says "we will do everything we can do to stop Iran from making Nuke Weapons...but we haven't talked with them doing "personal diplomacy." Talk to our enemies and not just friends.

[H2O Man]

65. Edwards is starting

to open up the discussion on Iran.

[H2O Man]

66. Edwards:

"He (Bush) cannot be trusted."

[SeattleGirl]

69. Amen, John!

He absolutely cannot be trusted.

[TahitiNut]

77. That's the sort of clarity that puts Edwards high on my list.

His stance on gays and single-payer keep him out of the lead on my list.

[ecstatic]

67. and was promptly cut off before he could rip Clinton too deeply nt

[KoKo]

68. Praises Biden and Dodd for not voting to allow us to strike Iran...and

apologizes again for his Iraq Vote.

[H2O Man]

70. That was

well done.

[KoKo]

83. Biden up...says Bush not enforcing law and Dodd is up now talking

about what's been going on in NE and praising Biden for what he says. Need better system with flow and deal with those who are here...children, crime problems and a president who could stand behind laws we don't have on books today.

Kucinich says "We Need to remember the promise of the Statue of liberty." Says there's a moral law that's not federal law. Obama says fed laws are not enough ...sponser Immigration Reforms. Hillary says Sanctuary Cities means that local law enforcement means people hide from law and stuff. She says Sanctuary Cities need to enforce laws but they just can't do it because it needs Federal Enforcement.

Gravel is saying we are scapegoating the illegals because we are failing in education,health care..etc..and by building fence on border.

(sorry...I couldn't type fast enough for complete comments.)

[bullwinkle428]

74. Making me feel even better for my support of him!

:thumbsup:

[KoKo]

71. Gravel Chimes in for Diplomacy...Russert goes back to Support for Israel to defend itself.

Gravel says we don't TALK to the other folks in the ME! Do it through Diplomacy.

[H2O Man]

75. Russert seemed quite

focused on the possibility of Israel striking targets in Iran, causing a violent conflict. Of course, we have DUers who say it will never happen. But Russert clearly thinks it could happen.

[ecstatic]

73. I'm glad Richardson called her out on her race based question nt

[KoKo]

76. New England Reporter asks about Immigration and Sanctuaries where some

states are designated as Sanctuaries for Illegals. Richardson says we need to address this issue and he has good points .....Earned Legalization and not Amnesty...learning English, paying back taxes, paying fine for being illegal...but do not DEPORT everyone...and it will take some beauracracy...but cities are being penalized.

[SeattleGirl]

81. The wrong people are always being penalized in the immigration issue.

I like what Richardson said about getting after companies who hire illegals, AND work with Mexico. Those two things seem to be overlooked all the time.

Instead, a lot of people would rather just focus on the illegals, and trying to make them the villains.

[H2O Man]

82. Yep.

Gavel just said that, too.

[bullwinkle428]

79. Biden's smackdown of Rudy!!!

:rofl:

[H2O Man]

80. Biden is doing well.

I think Dodd is, too.

I think I like the 2nd tier candidates a lot better than the top ones.

[Vadem]

84. I'm glad to see that at least, Timmeh, is allowing Dennis and...

Mike to add to the conversation!

Could it be true that the Corporatist are allowing the mere populists to have a word in this very important discussion ????

[TahitiNut]

88. Word.

The top tier is trying to protect the 'entitlement' of being in the top tier ... an inherently CONSERVATIVE attitude. (Think about that.)

There's far more to "freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose" than the superficial meaning - it's about dedication to the Politics Of Abundance (and social safety nets) instead of jealously coveting the meager gains one has for themselves.

[malaise]

90. He's doing great

Dodd's doing fine as well.

[blm]

95. Biden and Dodd are definitely putting up the soundest performances tonight.

.

[bullwinkle428]

103. Biden and Dodd are showing the advantage of years of experience tonight...

...Obama unfortunately continues to struggle in debate format.

[H2O Man]

106. I agree.

They both are doing really well.

[KoKo]

85. After the Break...hope they get to Corporate Corruption, Average American losing in Economy

along with Health Care and NAFTA Reform and Raising Taxes on the Rich to help pay for war...plus our HUGE Trade Deficit!

[Stinky The Clown]

89. At the break, the 2nd tier people seem to be kicking the 1st tier badly

Lots of time to go, however.

[ecstatic]

91. Gee whiz... Fostering petty feuds. For once can they talk about real issues?!

[H2O Man]

92. Dodd does well

on the question of Bush predicting Clinton will be the nominee.

Clinton laughs again. Was there a sale on canned laughs at Wal Mart?

[KoKo]

99. Hillary says it's a 'different time" and her experience with "challenge" against

the special interests give her an advantage in being the "Health Care President." She's saying she learned and Russert is wrong in saying hillary REFUSED to compromise. But, Hillary is saying that so much has happened folks can see today, finally that this is a big problem.

Biden says Hillary can't get Repugs to vote for Health Care...and Biden says Hillary won't vote for anything that is Clinton promoted. (that was a nasty cut at her...I didn't like it) Biden says.."A lot of the "old stuff comes back." What about Biden and the Credit Card Industry...some hypocracy there.

Edwards now comes back on the Hypocracy of the Washington Insiders where the Lobbyists and others come in and make policy... Good on Edwards for going back to Hillary/Biden's past ties. Russert snarks at Edwards saying when he was Senator he said National Health Care wouldn't work...Edwards says it has changed since then...so the time is ready for it...echoing what Hillary said...the time is right for it.

[H2O Man]

94. Who do you see

as doing well? Who is doingother than expected?

[TahitiNut]

100. Dodd and Edwards ... Clinton is overbearing and Obama is waffling.

We may see a "churn" in the field.

Hope so.

[H2O Man]

104. Obama keeps

talking about his position in 2002. He needs to focus on today and the future.

[TahitiNut]

108. He's still in "introducing myself" mode.

He's past the point where he should've gotten 'presumptive' of holding a lead position. When he's not harkeing back to 2002, he's too pedantic ... 1... 2... 3... etc.

[Blackhatjack]

113. Deleted -- in wrong position.

[H2O Man]

119. Yep.

As long as he goes all around and asks each one something equally tough, it's okay.

[Colobo]

116. Obama stated the reasons why he should be our president very well.

[Blackhatjack]

96. Biden raises the Clinton Curse allegation ... Repubs feed on it and makes it more difficult

[TahitiNut]

97. "the 'late' Senator Chaffee"???? (Does Hillary think he's dead?)

:wtf:

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

105. lol! I said to myself, I don't remember him dying??!!!! eom

[TahitiNut]

120. See what heppens when a politician becomes an independent?

:rofl: Hillary probably feels jilted ... and (effectively) says "you're dead to me."

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

194. ....

:rofl:

[ecstatic]

98. That was nasty of Biden, to bring up the past that way

And disingenuously say he's referring to policy.

[Neshanic]

101. Edwards is doing well. The Healthcare question he handled very well.

[Blackhatjack]

102. Edwards made a good point... insurers and insiders will never create universal healthcare....

[KoKo]

107. Russert Challenges Gravel on Condo Business Failure...he says Donald Trump has

gone bankrupt many times. He says he 'stuck the Credit Card Companies with his Debet!" Audience laughs!

[Neshanic]

109. UH oh...Timmy's evil twin appears.

[bullwinkle428]

Oooohhh - brilliant move, Mike! I see Trump starting a new feud,

and Gravel can only benefit from addtional publicity, which "The Donald" will be happy to give him!

[ecstatic]

111. LMAO... true nt

[ecstatic]

110. Gravel: The credit card companies deserved it

Well I'm all for it, but can my debt be excused too? :eyes:

[KoKo]

112. Russert says Kucinich let Cleveland Go Bankrupt...It's when Kuch went agains Utilities!

So, Kucinich says he went into office to stand up for the people.... He says it was an NBC Story. And, he's been re-elected OVER AND OVER...and put his JOB on the LINE against Banks and Utilities...

[H2O Man]

115. Kucinich

handled it really well, in my opinion.

[me b zola]

121. Dennis handled it veryu well

This must be the part of the debate where Timmy does the heavy lifting for the pukes.

[defendandprotect]

114. How did Russert get this AFTER Plame --- ??????

[H2O Man]

123. What?

[defendandprotect]

203. Wasn't Russert involved negatively in the Valerie Plame outing -- ????

Either not being fully open with the public about his role, or whatever . . . . ????

And, we should be getting back to the League of Women Voters, at the least, anyway ---

[KoKo]

117. Russert now going after Richardson going back to every distortion of what he's done in his life...

(I'd like to see Russert go after Repugs like he does Dems) but anyway he accused Richardson of so much i couldn't type it all. Richardson seems to be explaining things well about what he's tried to do. But, he didn't really counter any of the charges that Russert hit him with. Says he's made mistakes but he can 'deliver.'

[Neshanic]

118. Richardson's "choice" come back to haunt him. You will be visited by three ghosts.

Joan Crawford, Liza Minelli, and Larry Craig.

[Blackhatjack]

122. This is the round where Timmy tries to embarrass each of the Dem Candidates

[Dave From Canada]

138. If by embarrass you mean answer difficult questions they've never been asked before.

[Neshanic]

147. Dave ya got that one right.

[Neshanic]

124. How about the kids book, "My Daddy is a Republican".

[Neshanic]

126. Edwards sluffs off responsibility to the kids. Nice.

[Blackhatjack]

133. You missed the point....

Edwards was talking about the fact that you cannot choose beliefs for your child. You misunderstood.

[H2O Man]

137. Exactly.

There is no need to twist what he said. He made a really good point.

[Neshanic]

143. Strange I thought teaching them that all people are equal was not a belief.

[TahitiNut]

145. Exactly. That puts him in the top 10% of parents at the very least.

Too many parents don't even have a clue about that - and try to clone their own attitudes rather than NURTURE their child's ability to make their OWN choices.

[Neshanic]

148. I taught MY little kid that it's up to him to decide if gays are equal to us. How fantastic I am!

[TahitiNut]

173. Do you wear your clothes inside-out, too???

:eyes: :crazy:

[Neshanic]

184. Beliefs and truths, try learning the difference.

[TahitiNut]

192. Civility and respect ... try learning their meanings.

:eyes: Sophomoric word-twisting is just that: sophomoric.

[Neshanic]

200. Let me know when you find that person.

[KoKo]

125. Gay Rights Coming Up now...from New England Reporter....

The book that folks wanted banned about Gay Parents and their child.

[Neshanic]

128. OMG "Obama sez don't let the gays scare ya!"

[Neshanic]

130. Hillary steps through the cow pies.

[Blackhatjack]

127. Edwards just laid it out -- no discrimination against same sex couples

[TahitiNut]

129. Man! Edwards did as good a job on that GLBT question as I could possibly expect of him.

His grappling with his own feelings is, at the very least, honest and candid ... without animosity of any kind. Saying he's not qualified to be 'God' and make such decisions for his own children is VERY enlightened, imho.

[H2O Man]

134. He did well.

People with other agendas may twist what he said, but he was on target.

[Blackhatjack]

142. Yes he did! And insuring the 1100 govt benefits be available to same sex couples was good...

I think Edwards is grappling over the use of the word 'marriage' but is in favor of wiping out any kind of govt imposed detriment or withholding of benefits to same sex couples. That is indeed a step forward.

[bobbolink]

164. when I heard him talk about that months ago, I was so impressed.

Really, the way he brought the discussion to a gut level and an honest level brought tears to my eyes.

If only we could talk to each other like that all the time.

Whyyy.... peace might break out....

[me b zola]

131. HRC implys that sexual sorientation is a choice

[TahitiNut]

139. Yeah... and she thinks unemployment is about education and training, too.

She's really a clueless asshole, sometimes. :grr:

[KoKo]

132. Obama says we have to stop feeding people Fear...if we feed them hope & reason

we can bring people together. He says his wife has sat down with daughters about same sex marriage. Hillary says we've seen issues used for divisive purposes ...says it's up to parental discretion as to how to talk to children and it goes far beyond sexual choices. She says tomorrow Senate will vote against Hate Crimes Bill. The rest of the Dems were not asked this question. Only the Media Top Three.

[mvd]

135. Well what is this - a debate or a forum for Russert to..

personally attack our candidates? I find Russert appalling. Wasn't happy when I heard he would be the moderator.

Gravel has done better in this debate. I agree with his force a vote after vote idea. It's the answer to the unprecedented obstructionism of the Repukes.

Kucinich has been great as always. No one has done poorly.

[Neshanic]

140. Up to the first break good Timmy, all bets are off after that.

[KoKo]

141. He's the "Grand Inquisitor" all Dems must fall down before him and his tough

Gottcha Questions. :sarcasm:

[mvd]

144. Gravel got mad - you could tell

He made Russert do a bit of a double take. I'd bet anything Russert wouldn't do this to the Repukes.

[Dave From Canada]

146. No, it seems to me like he's asking tough question, in which they've never had to answer before.

I wish somebody would have asked Bush about his business background back in 2000. Him and Gravel have something in common.

[mvd]

153. I can't agree - that segment was abusive, and now..

Russert is acting like an expert on everything. Infuriating. Russert is ruining this debate and making it all about him. There's a difference between a tough question and a low blow, slanted personal question.

[H2O Man]

155. Even if he asked

each candidate as nasty question, I could say okay. But he didn't.

[mvd]

158. Well, vigorous debate on the issues is fine

But with Democrats, Russert always acts like an inquisitor and brings up petty stuff.

[H2O Man]

161. Yeah.

It isn't a level playing field with Tim.

[ecstatic]

199. Yes, Tim put WAY too much of his own 2cents in

He should have let the candidates debate amongst themselves.

[Neshanic]

136. Gay update. No equal rights. Not now. That is all.....

[KoKo]

149. Russert bringing up Social Security...We have to cut benefits in half or raise taxes...

Russert proposing changing retirement age...and he's going into taxing entire income of all Americans eliminating the $97,000 deduction.

Biden is in favor of raising the cap...and raise it to age 78 for SS. Says raising cap will do it without raising age.

Hillary...says it's about Fiscal Responsibility. She says deficit ate away everything...and she thinks we need a Bi-Partisan Council to come up with a program...:wow: She's not commiting to Save SS...just wants a Study Group...sheesh...a Bi-Patisan Study Group!

[Cha]

205. Well Fuck that..bi-partisian study group..

We know what they do..goddamn her. bush blew our money on IRaq that she helped promote and now there's not enough money for people who got money taken out of their checks for SS and now they want to slither the money to wall street.

[KoKo]

150. Obama thinks "lifting the Cap" is preferable...but he would go for a study group

to address the problem...and we have to take it on and do anything to strengthen the system. He says reject anything that privatizing.

[me b zola]

151. Obama comes out clearly opposed to privatization of social security

[me b zola]

152. Richardson comes out clearly against the privatization of social security

[Neshanic]

154. Edwards is really coming across well.

[Blackhatjack]

156. Edwards would raise the cap above the first $97000, with a protective zone in $100-200k,

... to protect the middle class, but everyone above it should pay on every dollar they make.

[me b zola]

157. Sweet Jesus I love Dennis

:loveya:

[KoKo]

159. I know....he has a different view...

[Norrin Radd]

195. Me too.

[KoKo]

160. Russert thinks Smoking is killing and wants Dems opinion on it..

Sheesh...what's that about?

[KoKo]

162. I forgot...Obama is a smoker so Russert did that to get him....

[TahitiNut]

166. Yeah... ban smoking in public places (outdoors, too?) but pass out the booze!!

:wtf: :crazy: Fucking insane!

[KoKo]

170. No...all but Kucinich and Richardson who were asked were against alchohol age

and drinking, too. ;eyes: or at least Russert made it sound that way...

[Neshanic]

163. OH brother...the Vietnam Era drinking gig.

[TahitiNut]

169. Yep. 'Cause everyone knows that drunks make better soldiers.

:wtf: :crazy:

Well, at least the smoking lamp won't be lit anymore. :puke:

[KoKo]

165. OMG...Now it's about the Age for Alcohol Use! Biden says Mothers who are alcholics having kids...

So they are discussing whether legal age for drinking should be lowered if young people can go to Iraq why can't they drink. Now they are back onto smoking....

So to deal with health care we've got to get control of these issues is what the Candidates are saying.

Richardson is saying give money for Rehabilitation... At least he's making some sense on this. he brings up Diabetes, heart disease, cancer and the rest... We have mistaken priorites, Richardson says.

Kucinich says we need confidence in young people and talk to people. young people will do what they will do...but a president could talk to people about what they shouldn't be doing.

[Blackhatjack]

167. Kucinich idea of lowering voting age to 16? Hmmm ...

[KoKo]

168. Break Time...that Smoking/Drinking thing seemed to lose folks interest....

[Blackhatjack]

171. Timmy's questions have been crafted to be 'gotchas' ... but overall Dems are doing well

Timmy has not hit upon the real issues that help the voters to decide between the candidates.

[H2O Man]

174. The first segment

seemed pretty good. There was a strange part, with Russert asking a low quality of questions. I hope it picks up for the last part.

[antigop]

172. Did Hillary say she was against privatization of SS? Sorry just tuned in. n/t

[KoKo]

196. She would convene a 'bi-partisan study group' and i didn't hear her say

what she would be for or against...except what the "bi-partisan study group" would recommend. Richardson was totally against privatization as seemed to be the others.

[antigop]

201. Thanks...I'll have to try to find the transcript.. ..n/t

[SeattleGirl]

175. "....or you can have a President who's tall."

:rofl:

[mvd]

176. Dennis also has a great sense of humor

:thumbsup:

[TahitiNut]

182. Yep. "Second-hand smoke" (and mirrors) ... and "... or a President that's tall."

Two of the best one-liners of the evening.

[TahitiNut]

177. TALK CLOCK!

Kooch is getting fucked ... and Timmy must be running for President.

[H2O Man]

180. Interesting.

I think Russert is preventing anything close to a real debate.

[KoKo]

198. hey...thanks for that.... Biden and Kucinich got about same time...

Amazing since Biden is on Russert's show so much. Timmeh WON!

[KoKo]

179. Russert now talking about Money Spent on TV Ads....

Obama says "Time to End Divisive Politics." Invite indies and Repugs to the table. Come together and tell truth to American people.

Asks Clinton about the Two Family Political Dynasty. She says Bill was pretty good President and their values stand but she's 'running on my own...and i can stand my ground.' She doesn't want to turn the clock back.

Asks Biden about Moveon.org. have they changed politics. Biden says it's not 'their party..but i won't chastise them.

Asks about raising gas taxes...to Kucinich. Kucinich gets in that IRAQ WAR WAS ABOUT OIL...and get's some campaign stuff in...GOOD ON HIM! Says you can do this and that or have a president WHO IS TALL! he gots lots of laughs with that.

Asks Dodd about Temporary Ban on All toys from China. He says the PResident should have suspended any products that haven't been tested.

Asks Obama about tepid response about Jena 6. Obama says he was in DC bringing end to War in Iraq...says he's put out many strong statements. IT's and issue that's not black or white but about justice.

Asks Richardson about Boy Scouts and Sexual Discrimination.... Richardson says he would be would fight against sexual discrimination...bring back habeus, not go to war with out congress, wouldn't spy on American people, get the troops out of Iraq, and other good stuff!

Obama says he will do things as fast as the can about getting troops out or SS but you can't do it with magic wand.

Edwards NOT IN FAVOR OF DEVELOPING MORE NUCLEAR POWER...OBAMA WAFFLES SAYING IF WE CAN DO IT SAFELY WE CAN DO IT...IF NOT WE WON'T...Kucinich Says HE BLOCKED Nuke Dump in Ohio...SAYS it's TOO EXPENSIVE and too EXpENSIVE TO STORE.... Gravel is for WIND POWER...

[H2O Man]

181. nuclear power ....

some troubling answers there ....

[Blackhatjack]

183. Timmy is ignoring Edwards, will be interesting to see who got the most face time in this debate...

[Blackhatjack]

185. Timmy gives Clinton extended face time...

[Colobo]

186. He saved her by making her look like a "Tough Independent Woman"

[Cha]

208. That wasn't his mission in 2000..

timmy's goal was to knock her out the debate with rick lazio and it backfired in his fatpotatohead. Now ge wants her in the general so they can knock her off her pedestal and prop up the fascist. I don't want it to get to that..hillary needs to lose for the good of our country.

[KoKo]

187. Did anyone else catch Timmy's Gotcha Question about Torture to HIlary?

He asked a question about if a terrorist was caught and had info on a bomb going off in three days should we beat the info out of him...

He asked the top tier candidates about this...all were against but got to HIllary and she said she didn't think torture was the way to go...but Timmy said..."Senator, that was your HUSBAND who made that statement a year ago! She gave a witty reply...saying "well, I'll talk to him about that."

I can't believe that Clinton EVER SAID he'd BEAT INFO out of a person who said they had a bomb. That was disgusting from Russert...i hope someone checks that.

[aaronbees]

190. Just about every single question from Russert was a right-wing gotcha question

from what I saw (last half hour). Russert was hideous.

I don't know what Bill Clinton said previously about that particular question on "beating" info out of someone, but Russert sure seemed intent on his torture questions. Barf.

[mvd]

188. Good answers (the Sermon On The Mount ones)

That is my favorite part of the Bible.

[TahitiNut]

191. Why not the "Sermon on the Plain" (Luke)?

After all,

# Remove the log from your own eye before attending to the splinter in your friend's (40b-42)
# A good tree does not produce bad fruit and a bad tree cannot produce good fruit, each tree is known by its fruit (43-45)
# Why do you call me Lord, Lord yet not do what I command? (46)

... sound very apropos for today.

[mvd]

197. I agree about the relevance - especially the 3rd part there

The Sermon On The Mount has just been special to me.

[KoKo]

189. Russert winds it up with 'Who's Gonna Win...Yankees or Red Sox."

And...that's the wrap up. Russert says it will be re-broadcast at 1:00 a.m. est...in case there are insomniacs around here.

Good night and Good luck...to all of us...

signing off.

koko

[Blackhatjack]

193. Edwards was making lots of points until Timmy began ignoring him

[Cha]

202. That must be frustrating for

John Edwards and for those who would love to hear more of what he has to say.

[Blackhatjack]

204. Its no secret that Timmy is not an Edwards fan... and that Timmy gave HRC lots of face time

[Cha]

207. I hope he gave her enough

rope. What a farce..shafted by ge..they want hillary so bad it's oozing outta their ass. They want her so they can set up and knock her down.

[Blackhatjack]

206. Pat Buchanan is an idiot when it comes to analyzing Edwards...

[Vinca]

210. I was tired and went to bed. Did they let Kucinich talk?

Just wondering.