Plame:Fitzgerald has agreed to turn over transcripts of interviews of Bush and Cheney over to Waxman

[sabra]

http://www.projo.com/news/content/valerie_plame_brown_12-05-07_JE84T76_v22.1f7da2e.html

<snip>

After her hour-long speech and question-and-answer session, Plame dropped one bombshell almost casually.

She said a lawyer had called her just before her talk began and told her that special prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald had agreed to turn his transcripts of interviews with Mr. Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney over to U. S. Rep. Henry Waxman, D-Calif., who is known for his relish for investigating wrongdoing by Republicans.

Plame said she didn’t know whether the Bush administration would allow the transcripts to be sent to Congress.

[Beetwasher]

1. Oh Man!

That's pretty cool.

[Botany]

2. Oh my!

:popcorn:

[Wizard777]

3. It's a catch 22. If Bush is not involved. Then he cannot claim Executive Priviledge.

If he is involved then you have grounds for a criminal investigation. Again he claim executive priviledge. So they will probably invoke state secrets.

[napi21]

86. I don't think EP even is a question. This info is in the possession of

Fitz, not the WH. I don't think Shrub has any control over who this info is turned over to.

[babylonsister]

4. YES! Go for it, Rep. 'Bulldog' Waxman!

:thumbsup: :woohoo:

[SpiralHawk]

46. "Roh, roh." - Jeff Bulldog Gannon, official Bush White House Male Prostitute

[berni_mccoy]

5. Cheney's about to have another Heart Attack and Bush just had an accident in his pants. K&R!

:kick:

[madokie]

6. due to the fact I can't accept that everyone who can aren't going to stop this cabal

Now having said that, lets let the fun begin,

[simmonsj811]

7. K&R

:bounce: :toast: :kick: Sorry couldn't help myself imo

[Benhurst]

8. ...

Recommended :bounce: #5

[bleever]

9. Oh, to get a peek at those.

Recommended.

:)

[spanone]

10. they will fight it in the courts....never see the light of day

[pacalo]

18. Comments like yours make me feel so much at home here. :)

I'm the faithful, everything-is-going-to-be-okay type & my husband feels a duty to add some reality. I tell him he'd be a much happier person looking at the positive side. :hi:

[spanone]

30. i'm a totally positive person. i'm totally positive that they won't allow it.

:toast:

[pacalo]

41. I hear ya'...but I'll hang on to hoping for justice.

:toast:

[harmonicon]

54. there are still courts?

[barbtries]

58. yes, but i really wonder

if there are any courts that are not presided over by bushie whores...

[bdamomma]

11. kick

[yodermon]

12. whoah! would love to hear more details/confirmation of this

I didn't think fitz could act on his own like that; i.e. he needs the approval of the justice dept., right?

[rox63]

14. Fitz generally doesn't say anything until he knows it'll happen

So I'd guess he either got approval to release them, or he has found that he has a legal right to do so. I wonder if it'll be redacted in any way?

[yodermon]

19. it's Fitzmas: TNG ! n/t

[Horse with no Name]

23. He already has the approval

He was appointed Special Prosecutor.
It was his investigation.
He can release anything to Congress if they subpoena him which he told them when he wrapped up the Plame case.

[yodermon]

29. ok. i was expecting another stonewall from the justice dept.

since the DOJ appointed Fitz (via Comey), I thought that any subpoena of Fitz could possibly be challenged by Mukasey.
Although Fitz has powers equivalent to the atty general wrt this case, so i guess i'm just wearing one of these :tinfoilhat:

[defendandprotect]

65. THAT would be great --- !!!

True, Fitz did try to push it towards Congress ---

[aquart]

78. You sure? You really, really sure?

Because I'm not used to good news anymore.

[Catherine Vincent]

31. Fitzgerald IS the Justice Department!

:)

[Demeter]

52. OR at Least, the Only Part of It That Functions To Spec Anymore

[Javaman]

13. Man, there are several people that need to stay off of small planes. nt

[annabanana]

15. Yowzaa!

I hope they leak all over everybody!

[EFerrari]

16. Fitzgerald and Waxman will never stop. This is excellent!

:kick:

[Greyskye]

17. Thanks for the Fitzmas present!

:kick:

[leveymg]

20. Noose tightens.

Time for Cheney to have his debilitating medical emergency. Bush will go on a long Crawford vacation.

[Spazito]

21. Oh my, very interesting AND encouraging....

Thanks for the post, much appreciated!

Recommended.

[Horse with no Name]

22. Bush has no say over this one

:)

[lamp_shade]

24. k

[Imagevision]

25. Why no M$M?? - Where is Keith Olberman when you really need him...?!?

[rockybelt]

28. Have you noticed

that Olbermann has lightened up quite a bit? He doesn't seem to be the bull dog that he always has been. There have been numerous opportunites to go after the chimp and darth but hasn't done it. I wonder why. Has MSNBC put a muzzle on him?

[Pachamama]

37. No, haven't noticed at all - KO is just as much of a Bulldog as always and since this is new news,

he hasn't covered it yet....My guess is that tonite he will be covering it....

MSNBC a muzzle on him? Have you heard his special comments in the last few months? His commentary in recent days on the NIE? MSNBC muzzling KO - That's so unlikely...Keith Olbermann would stand up live on national television and denounce any such efforts if that was true....

[rockybelt]

48. Oh yeah

I love his special comments. I call everybody I know to be sure they watch. Maybe its just that I am so goddamned mad that everybody else just seems blah to me. He does sound as he has a cold now, though.

He has plenty of BBs for a special comment now.

[Pachamama]

68. In follow up - did you see KO's special comment tonite? I think this summarizes it:

His description of Bush - "A manipulative machiavellian snake oil salesman"....

Had a bunch of other colorful words along with liar and that Bush is not fit for serving as President.

So, as I said earlier today, there is no muzzling of Keith going on, that's for sure....

[rockybelt]

79. Yeah

man was I wrong! I'm happy to see that I was wrong. Go get 'em Keith!

[rodeodance]

76. this story needs Keith----but the NIE is taking his time thrus. night

[OneGrassRoot]

38. I don't know...here's my impression of KO of late...

I think he is "over them." He has crossed the line from anger to complete disgust. He (rightfully) doesn't try to refer to them in any respectful way, as he would do earlier when he would implore them to do the right thing and not destroy the Constitution and this country.

I think he has gone beyond anger - not sure if that's helpful or not for our cause, as we desperately need angry media people to stand up and speak out.

[WorseBeforeBetter]

61. His anger came through this evening...

but I know what you mean about the "over them" comment. I see that more in Richard Wolffe--he often seems to be in complete disgust and doesn't hide it very well.

[OneGrassRoot]

72. Yes, KO REALLY kicked butt tonight!!! WooHoo!!! n/t

[WorseBeforeBetter]

60. Are you kidding me? I'm sure someone will post KO's 12/6 special comment...

be sure to tune in. I don't remember his exact words, but Bush is a lying Machiavellian snake-oil salesman and Cheney is evil. I hardly consider that muzzled.

[Mythsaje]

62. Maybe.

You be the judge.

http://thenewshole.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/12/06/501450.aspx?CommentPosted=true#commentmessage

[DCKit]

26. "... his relish for investigating... Republicans." makes Henry sound petty.

Henry Waxman would investigate ANYONE who broke the law and would probably be far more aggressive with a fellow Democrat. That would make it personal.

[benld74]

27. Another early Fitzmas to you all!!!

[rodeodance]

32. whow whow WHOW

[SharonRB]

33. Happy Fitznukah to everyone!

:woohoo:

[sabra]

34. I will be lighting a candle tonight in honor of this... lol

[VWolf]

35. "Plame said she didn’t know

whether the Bush administration would allow the transcripts to be sent to Congress."

Well, I know, unfortunately.

[progressoid]

39. Yup, me too.

[JuniperLea]

36. I thought "no transcripts" was part of the deal...

Like no oath...


???

[H2O Man]

53. no.

There are transcripts.

[socretes73]

40. Turn Over ALL the Transcripts in an Unredacted Fashion

and THEN I can believe that progress is being made.

Bush and Cheney are lying out their ass- you and I both know it.

[ejbr]

42. REDACTED!!!! n/t

[ejbr]

43. REDACTED!!!! n/t

[whistle]

44. By who?

[lonestarnot]

55. by whom?

[ejbr]

82. By Patrick "let's let Rove lie five times under oath" Fitzgerald, of course! n/t

[ejbr]

81. By Patrick "let's let Rove lie five times under oath" Fitzgerald, of course! n/t

[lovuian]

45. I guess we will see if we get another Executive priveledge

enactment

But yes Fitzmas

[kimmerspixelated]

47. YIPPEE!

Go Fitz Go!

[MasonJar]

49. I don't want to be a spoiled sport, but didn't Fitz already agree to turn them

over, but the WH stopped the transfer?

[sabra]

59. here's what gives me some hope that there's something new going on

Waxman sent a letter early this week to the AG asking for help. Plame indicated a lawyer contacted her about Fitz. The timing seems to indicate something might be happening?

[rodeodance]

77. keeping my fingers and toes crossed for something good.

[madrchsod]

50. neither one of them were under oath

and since these "interviews" were never entered into the grand jury testimony there is little the white house can do. if these interviews would have been under oath then the white house would have a solid case for privilege..

[Missy Vixen]

70. Doesn't matter if they were under oath

It's a crime to lie to a federal prosecutor, oath or not.

We're about to find out if a crime was committed. I feel confident in stating the answer to that statement is "yes".

Julie
still president for life of the PFEB

[H2O Man]

73. Can you provide

any support for your claim that the interviews were not presented to the grand jury?

Being under oath or not plays no role in the ability of the White House to claim privilege if the issue is pushed in court. They would claim privilege; the only issue is how serious congress is.

[happygoluckytoyou]

51. HOW MANY WAYS CAN YOU SAY "i don't remember"

WE ARE ABOUT TO FIND OUT

[tuvor]

56. This time they're really really REALLY in trouble!

Yeah, right. I'm tired of getting my hopes up over sure things for the past five long damn years.

[bluesmail]

57. and isn't this the Real Reason

for outing Plame? States secrets to boot. Big time K & R

[bonito]

63. K&R!

[AikidoSoul]

64. Can H2O Man please clarify the legal steps that can be taken here?

He is the one who best seems to have a grasp on whether anything can come of this.

[H2O Man]

71. Sure.

When Mr. Fitzgerald gave the press conference on the day that I. Lewis Libby was indicted, several reporters asked if he was able to discuss the role of other individuals in the scandal. Michael Isikoff was hoping to get him to discuss other people's roles. Mr. Fitzgerald had noted that, unless a person was indicted, the general rule was that he could not discuss their role.

The Libby trial was, of course, a format where we learned some of what the grand jury had heard about other people's roles. While the only grand jury testimony presented was that of Mr. Libby, the public did see some other evidence (such as Cheney's notes), and heard witnesses who had testified to the grand jury, including one who had made a deal in return for his testimony.

After the trial ended, and Rep. Waxman asked Mr. Fitzgerald for information on the investigation, his first response was a letter, in which he noted that he had limitations, but that a significant amount of documentation was made public during the Libby trial. Since then, there were other discussions between Rep. Waxman's office (and related people) and those connected to the grand jury/FBI investigation.

One of the things that is important to keep in mind is that Mr. Fitzgerald was part of an already established, large and highly qualified team. It included men and women who are career investigators, who do not participate in "politics." This includes some from the counterespionage units of the FBI. It wasn't a coincidence that Mr. Fitzgerald had some discussions with McNulty, who was running the neocon/AIPAC espionage investigation at the time.

Rep. Waxman has expressed a limited, focused interest in the Plame scandal. This was recently noted in a good essay on FireDogLake. What I'd add is that the limited, focused investigation has to do with how Ms. Plame's identity was shared. This isn't about the identity's act; rather, it has to do with possible espionage. That was, as I've noted several times, the greater focus of Mr. Fitzgerald's investigation, and it is what the federal judges who ruled that Patrick could force Miller and Cooper to testify noted as the significant underlying crime.

Because of this focus, Rep. Waxman was able to have a limited amount of information released. It is not the grand jury testimony, and doesn't include many significant parts of the FBI investigation, or Mr. Fitzgerald's interviews with Bush or Cheney. The Department of Justice is "stonewalling" on this -- and that is the term that congressional staff uses in discussions on options for accessing the necessary documentation to move foreward.

It's a judgement call when mere stonewalling becomes obstruction. My opinion is that we have passed that point. The problem is not Mr. Fitzgerald, nor is it the people who have made careers of going after those who engage in espionage against our country. Those who are interested in this should read the 2nd edition of James Bamford's "A Pretext for War," as the additional section focuses on this topic. Again, those involved in the "intelligence" part of the Vice President's push for war happened to include some involved in both the Plame and the neocon/AIPAC espionage scandal, and they were from the Office of Special Plans. The OSP, which had no congressional oversight, was also pushing for military strikes on Iran. Small world.

Anyhow, Rep. Waxman needs to take the next step, which involves going to court to gain the release of the documents that the DoJ is never going to share with them willingly.

[G_Leo_Criley]

74. Thank You

Thanks H2O Man for this excellent explanation!


glc

[peacetalksforall]

88. It seems Cheney and team have no respect for Congress. Are we

saying that the impetus for release is being requested by Congress, the permission for the release of background has been approved by the appropriate person, so the obstruction, if there is obstruction, will be against Congress, not Special Counsel (Justice Dept)?

Since Nixon, the belittlement and disregard that Republicans hold for Congress and the balance of power has gone down the drain. Nixon stood against the Justice Dept. Congress wasn't that involved, except in a face saving way. In Iran-Contra, the same group betrayed Congress (broke Congressional laws), but not laws governed by Justice pertaining to the White House - no one went after the lies of the P and VP (only the player crimes of Colson, North, etc.)?

What I'm targeting is my doubt about the disdain Cheney holds for Congress and their subsequent weakness. It seems Cheney and lawyers pay more attention to the Justice Dept (meaning those in Justice that they haven't bought). The question is - is the legal right of Congress as strong a right in calling obstruction - as strong as the Justice Dept?

How much bargaining power does Cheney have with Waxman? Would this be Fred Friendly again?

Where we're really at is a pick-up by Congress to complete the investigation of the law on the books about exposing certain CIA employees? And we're at the top of the pyramid of players?

I'm trying to fit this in my head. And I fear that this decades old WH team will find some way to kick Congress again. Laugh and demean them. Or that Rep. Waxman will be sent a note to back away - a note sent by our own people.

Is the OSP in the WH or the DOD? If the DOD, are we talking about the group who has one in jail and some others who are fighting jail?

How soon it gets all fuzzy. Help please. Thanks!

[orleans]

66. when? not soon enough n/t

[proReality]

67. If anything good comes out of this, I swear...

I'll believe in Santa again.

K&R

[LaStrega]

69. Dammit.

I'm usually a 'the-glass-is-half-full' kinda bird, but I'm jumping on the redacted bandwagon. I mean hell, they redacted parts of Plame's breastfeeding bit in her book fer chrissakes. What on earth do her bewbs have to do with national security?

Never the less, I'm holding out hope. And here's hoping, unlike the Cubbies letting me down (over and over and over), I won't yet again be dissapointed.

subpoena subpoena subpoena ~ impeach impeach impeach!

[G_Leo_Criley]

75. K & R n/t

glc

[L. Coyote]

80. "A nation that sits silently demonstrates complicity." kick

[npincus]

83. the 2 Shitheads were not under oath

Legally, they covered their asses.

[H2O Man]

84. It makes

no difference.

[Trucker Bob]

85. Listen up Shrubya....

the fat lady is about to start singing.

[robertpaulsen]

87. K & R & B! Let's hope this puts impeachment back on the table!

:kick: