What do you think of Biden?

[ThomWV]

I ask this question not because I want to see him either praised or torched? I just don't know a lot about him other than that he has been around for a long time, is well experienced, and the several times I've listened to him I've liked what I've heard. I am not familiar with his voting record nor ties he may have that might seem unsavory. So tell me about him but please don't get nasty or just give a campaign slogan answer.

[underpants]

1. I like him

I've always liked him but I knew he wouldn't get the nomination. He may just be campaigning to become the next Sec. of State :shrug:

[shadowknows69]

2. I wouldn't cry if he got the nomination I know that much

I think he'd be a really good President. He's smart. That alone would be a vast improvement in the oval office. Yeah, I guess my expectations are a little low these days.

[tekisui]

3. I have always liked Biden.

Not, loved, but liked. He talks straight, knows what he's talking about. Sometimes his mouth gets him in trouble, I prefer that to careful, calculated parsing.

[Mist]

6. I think that's why I like him--he doens't talk in sound bites, so I get a

better feel for what he really thinks.

[dmallind]

4. I did some relatively significant consideration of him recently

In the end I kept with my Richardson then Edwards 1-2, but Biden probably slots in at 3 now. He's a capable, statesmanlike, pragmatic and skilled politically. He's also however not going to excite too many people in the age of American idol politics. Sadly we ALL get the elections that MOST of us deserve, and the sensible yet not celebrity candidates will never do that well for national office for the forseeable future IMO.

[maine_raptor]

5. I like him too

Oh, I know he's got folks upset with his support for the Bankruptcy Bill and backing by MBNA, but his got a good head on his shoulders when it comes to foreign policy. I'd have no problem marking my ballot for him unlike others that are currently at the head of the pack.

[bdamomma]

7. just a suggestion:

listen to him, and if you need to go to his site to read his stance on the issues, here you go: http://www.joebiden.com/home

go check out his videos on the DU political video site too. Look him over and listen to what he has got to say.

[saltpoint]

8. I think very favorably on him for a lot of nuts-and-bolts reasons on

one hand and for the loftier-ideal reasons on the other.

IMO a good intro to a fair Biden analysis is to consider his morning commute on an Amtrak train to and from Delaware into Washington. He's done it for years. I like his taking trains in between his two serious commitments -- public service and personal family.

More recently I like that he put John Bolton's eggs in the scrambler and turned it on 'high.' Bolton was bad news and Biden led the fight in the SFRC to send him packing. Bush recess-appointed Bolton but the conscious of the Senate ultimately forced Bolton out. It's a good idea for Republicans not to mess with the Democrats on the SFRC generally and Biden especially.

And he's personable. He appears to genuinely get the importance of a third shift worker on an all-night wage-earning treadmill up to the foreign head-of-state. There's just this impressive broad range to him that I've respected for a long time.

If we all woke up tomorrow and Joe Biden were in the White House, it wouldn't piss me off one bit.

[porphyrian]

9. Mostly, I don't. -n/t

[Virginia Dare]

10. I think he'd make a pretty good President..

he probably won't get the chance though. His mouth has gotten him in some minor trouble, but considering the thing that is posing as a President right now, that shouldn't be an issue.

[madokie]

11. give me Joe and I'd be happy

I always like to listen to him talk as I can understand what he's saying to me. I know he has voted a few times that I don't understand or agree with. I don't want a representative in my government whether on the local level or the President to have the same view of the world as I do on everything.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

12. i like him. sensible, solid guy. not perhaps overly exciting but he is running for president

and not cult leader

[bryant69]

13. I like him - I don't think he has much of a chance.

He seems strong on foreign affairs, but he's not saying what the base wants to hear there.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[blondeatlast]

14. I've admired him for a while now, but was sorely disappointed with some of his votes(that's the

trouble with Senators and Congresspeople).

Still, I think he's got the stuff to begin to win back some respect from the rest of the world. He's well-infoirmed, straightforward, not flashy and I appreciate that.

Right now, he's at the top of my list and has been for a few weeks. That could easily change though--I'm utterly undecided at this point.

[Tesha]

15. Biden is too pro-corporate to be my preference, but...

Biden is too pro-corporate to be my preference
but if he happened to win the nomination, I'd
have no qualms at all about supporting him in
the General Election and I think he'd have
good, positive coat-tails for other Democrats.

My demographics: *STRONGLY* preferred Gore,
prefer Kucinich, dislike Edwards and Obama,
*STRONGLY* dislike Hillary to the point that
I probably wouldn't vote for her in the
General.

Tesha

[mulsh]

16. it would be helpfull if he wore corporate logos ala nascar

He's a senator from Delaware which has very generous laws re corps. just saying. aside from not trusting him any more than any other pol I think he's OK. won't get to be pres but I can't knock him for trying.

[WheelWalker]

56. Just like to point out that as a US Senator, Biden doesn't have anything

to do with Delaware's laws or who those laws might or might not "favor." That's state legislature and state senate. Delaware's reputation, and preference, as a haven for corporations goes back to the 18th century or thereabouts, I believe. Read up on Delaware's Chancery Courts.

[mmonk]

17. Good candidate, smart, a consensus builder.

[bdamomma]

18. just a reminder

Thursday, Dec. 13
Des Moines Register: Democratic Presidential Candidates Debate
On C-SPAN3 at 2pm ET

I think it will be on C Span too, check your listings.

[in_cog_ni_to]

27. Hey! Thanks for that reminder! I didn't know this would be aired during the day today!

I thought I was going to miss it because I'll be gone tonight. Thanks!:hi:

[Happyhippychick]

19. Like him a lot and sort of have a crush on him.

What can I say? We've got some pretty hot democratic candidates this time around.

Or am I just comparing them to Fred Thompson?

[youthere]

25. Carrot top looks good compared to Fred Thompson.

[KittyWampus]

20. He's got a solid center/left record. Doesn't run from his record. Speaks plainly. Has gravitasl

is strong on Foreign Policy.

Has a son slated for Iraq.

Relates to people well.

Very strong family.

Is a good example of the Fighting Irish the Democratic Party used to have.

[Marr]

21. I don't trust him at all.

He gives me the same vibe Kerry did last time around. Way too inside the Beltway, way too professional politician. Incapable of seeing the real problems because he's too close to them.

[WheelWalker]

57. That's interesting....trust is my strongest feeling toward him. I've looked him over

pretty good, and I fail to find any history of deceit, deception or claim jumping.

[regularguy]

22. I like him.

He's a little too hawkish/conservative for me, and puts foot in mouth a lot, but I think he's smart competent, and honest. I think he's been the best in the debates that I've seen; I like that he doesn't seem like he's repeating canned answers.

[lovuian]

23. His crediblity and Trust is broken

because he was a major hawk for the war in Iraq

thats why otherwise he has really showed a change of heart
but one wonders still if you can trust him

[in_cog_ni_to]

29. His vote on the Bankruptcy Bill and support for the CC companies is stopping my vote.

I wonder who he REALLY supports in this country.:( CC Corporations or its citizens?

[1corona4u]

33. Let's have a look, shall we...just to be fair...

JOSEPH R. BIDEN JR.: CAREER PROFILE (SINCE 1989)

Top Industries
The top industries supporting Joseph R. Biden Jr. are:
1 Lawyers/Law Firms $6,265,871
2 Real Estate $1,172,230
3 Retired $853,148
4 Securities & Investment $839,775
5 Misc Finance $499,470
6 Misc Business $462,641
7 Business Services $455,925
8 Health Professionals $382,275
9 TV/Movies/Music $364,666
10 Lobbyists $333,185
11 Finance/Credit Companies $294,650
12 Misc Manufacturing & Distributing $294,249
13 Pro-Israel $272,700
14 Commercial Banks $269,050
15 Education $249,725
16 Insurance $223,975
17 Retail Sales $186,400
18 General Contractors $175,550
19 Accountants $136,935
20 Democratic/Liberal $129,490

So, that's about a $563,000 bucks in 18 years. Or $31,000 a year in contributions. I doubt he did it for the banks, at all.

[in_cog_ni_to]

42. Oh. Pardon me. It must have been a favor for the ex-executive VP of MBNA then. his son, Hunter Biden

:eyes: And if you don't believe he still has connections within the banking industry/corporations, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.

I also wouldn't vote for him on the mere fact that certain supporters have NO compassion for poor people (you already admitted that to me in a post last week) who may not have been as fortunate in life as they were. How do they know the circumstances of people not being able to pay their bills? They don't, yet all the blame is laid on them, not on the CC corporations who hand out CCs like candy..... That sounds like someone who belongs in "the other" party. NOT the Democratic Party. Candidate's supporters say a lot about a candidate...like Ron Paul supporters are racists, Huckabee supporters are fundies, McCain supporters are warmongers, I see certain Biden supporters as selfish with no empathy....ESPECIALLY those who DEFEND his vote on the bankruptcy bill. Defending the indefensible in such a way as to place all the blame on the poor is....well, INDEFENSIBLE.

So, may I suggest you save your little lists of statistic for those who care and not hijack this thread? Joe Biden won't be getting my vote so you're wasting your time.

[1corona4u]

47. Huh...

As I have posted many, many, times on this board, Joe voted for the BK bill, for women and children. Under the old BK laws, divorced women with children were the last ones to be paid, if the deadbeat dad filed a BK. Now, they are the first ones to be paid. If you ever question why Joe votes for anything, go look at the floor statements on his website. They will clearly give you an idea of where his interest were. Not in some bank, as has been previously speculated on. There's just no denying that Joe has stood up for women's rights, in a big way. As in the violence against women act, and now, the International violence against women act. But, no "bill" will ever work for all people. There are a lot of people who respect the revisions of the 2005 BK bill. I am one of them.

My best friend is about to reap the rewards of this bill. Her X has just filed a BK, after leaving her without ANY child support, for 2 children, 8 & 6, for 4 years, and just on Thursday of last week, thought that he could get out of paying her by filing a BK. Well, it's people like him that will not be able to get away with it now. He claimed to have lost his 135K yr. job, and had protested ANY request for documentation for his current financial status. Her attorney called for deposition, forcing discovery. Then came back and filed a BK. I know for a fact that he hid money, and that he is also still working, under the table. Under the new law, he will be fully investigated by the courts.

A Senator sometimes has to vote for a bad bill, if there is something in it they truly want. I believe that was Joe's dilemma on the BK bill. But you can look for yourself, and see his financial contributions from banks from 1998, and it's not very impressive.

[1corona4u]

49. I didn't hijack any thread..

I posted facts, that specifically addressed a few of the comments here.

PS. I'm not trying to "get your vote". I could care less who you vote for.

PSS. Credit cards are optional, not manndatory. Optional.










(Why is it, that some of the DK supporters are such bitter, hateful people. I wonder....)

[in_cog_ni_to]

54. News flash! I'm not a Dennis Kucinich supporter or a Hillarry supporter, so that

doesn't wash. I'm not hateful. I just have a good memory for posts people have made stating the poor don't deserve any help and they deserve to be in the situation they're in because they CHOSE to use the credit cards. I remember that post. Now THAT was hateful.

[Marr]

55. Now that's odd.

Several times now, I've seen Hillary/Biden/Obama supporters immediately call anyone who criticizes their candidate a Kucinich supporter. Why is that?

[ThomWV]

52. I take note of the fact that I see no Military Contractors in his list of contributors.

[KittyWampus]

38. Perhaps you forget the Biden-Lugar Amendment. Or prefer not to let facts get in your way.

[WheelWalker]

60. Those who don't trust Joe Biden might consider asking their physician for

an Oxytocin patch.

[youthere]

24. I like Joe, and I will be caucusing for him Jan 3.

[frogmarch]

26. I've always liked Biden, He's my #2 choice

Edwards remains my #1 choice.

[EFerrari]

28. I seem to remember that someone raised a question about his ties

to credit card companies but I can't honestly remember much more than that or if I double checked myself. Also, he has occasional problems with his off the cuff remarks. I like him in general. He seems much less packaged than most and usually sounds like a Democrat, not a Republican Lite.

[0007]

30. I like Biden a lot. My goodness why would you want to ask us here at DU

to make up your mind? You can find his voting record and anything else you would want to know about him if you look.

[PatSeg]

31. I've looked at all the candidates and in the end

Biden seems to have the most experience and knowledge that we need now, and he's actually capable of getting things done. People listen to him on both sides of the aisle, as do foreign leaders. He is a pragmatic idealist.

I would suggest that you listen to some of his speeches, especially his appearances at small events in Iowa where he answers voters questions. He has clear, informed answers for anything that is thrown at him, answers based on his many years of experience. There are no sweeping generalizations or canned political slogans.

He's definitely worth a look.

[wuushew]

32. Biden's R.A.V.E. Act is a piece of garbage

For such a legal "expert" he he sure likes the string together disparate elements that are completely unrelated into an unhappy morass.

Joe Biden doesn't want people opening up dance clubs or selling glow sticks apparently.

[1corona4u]

35. Actually, wht he doesn't want....

are the "club drug"(Ecstasy,GHB, Ketamine, and Rohypnol)pushers, and their promoters preying on kids. I think it's a good thing, as many kids fell into this trap. These "promoters of these "rave" events, would send out flyers, telling the parents, that there would be no alcohol at these events, but once the kids got there, there would be club drugs for sale. That is what the bill specifically addressed. You can read his floor statement for the facts of the bill;



"Unfortunately, most raves are havens for illicit drug use," said Biden. "Enacting the RAVE Act will help prosecute the promoters who seek to profit from exploiting and endangering young lives. The bill also lays out a plan to educate youth, parents and other interested adults about the dangers of Ecstasy and other club drugs associated with raves."

Recent statistics from the Partnership for a Drug Free America show that teen use of Ecstasy has increased 71 percent since 1999. Across the country, thousands of teenagers are treated for overdoses and Ecstasy-related heath problems in emergency rooms each year. Much of the abuse of Ecstasy and other club drugs happens at all-night dance parties known as "raves," where unscrupulous rave promoters do everything they can to profit from the illegal drug use at their events.

Biden, who recently chaired a hearing in the Caucus on International Narcotics Control to examine the phenomenon of raves, noted that it is common for rave organizers to go to great lengths to portray their events as safe so that parents will let their kids attend by advertising them as "alcohol-free parties." "But even as these promoters work to make parents think that their events are safe, they send a different message to kids. Their promotional flyers make clear that drugs are an integral part of the party by prominently featuring terms associated with drug use, such as the letters "E" or "X." And by doing so, the promoters get rich as they exploit and endanger kids," said Biden.

http://biden.senate.gov/newsroom/details.cfm?id=183785&&&search_field=rave%20act





Personally, I feel the best way to find out more about Joe, is by reading his floor statements. It's fine to say he voted this way, or that way, but without knowing WHY he voted a particular way, and the logic behind the vote, it's just reactionary to suggest they were "bad votes". Not all will agree with him, but I think it's important to hear him out on the votes. He's definitely not known for being a liar.


http://biden.senate.gov/newsroom/statements.cfm

[BonnieJW]

34. I like him a lot.

I would not mind a Biden/Edwards or Edwards/Biden ticket.

[gateley]

36. I trust him to do what's right - not what the political winds are suggesting.

A current example is that Biden called for an independent counsel in the CIA/Torture tapes from DAY ONE, and continues to. This appears to be unpopular among the majority of dems as they seem willing to let Mukasey's in-house investigation be the "search for the truth". What you see is what you get, and I feel as though I see HIM, not his 'candidate persona'.

I would sleep better with him in the White House.

[1corona4u]

37. My sentiments exactly.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

39. I would love to have a conversation with him but I don't quite trust him. My older son likes

him a lot.

[robcon]

40. Blowhard.

Very famous for making speeches instead of asking questions on the Judiciary Committee and the Foreign Relations Committee.

He is also somewhat noted for plagiaring a speech from a British politician in the 1988 presidential campaign.

I've seen him on Imus and C-Span a few times in the last few years, and he seems impressive enough. Would be great as Secretary of State: good on foreign/military issues.

[wuushew]

41. Biden voted yes on D.O.M.A.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=104&session=2&vote=00280

[in_cog_ni_to]

43. That's just freakin' disgusting. Shame on him.

:(

[jillan]

45. And Dennis voted against SCHIP - really disgusting!!!

edit to add links

http://www.buckeyestateblog.com/dennis_and_his_progressive_screw_you_salute_to_ohios_children

http://www.airamericaplace.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=24327

http://www.iowaindependent.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=1178

[1corona4u]

50. Yes, truly disturbing....

[jillan]

44. Huge Biden supporter here - and I will answer your question -

Biden is often labelled as a moderate - but in reality


And - play around with this site for awhile, it also dispells some Biden rumors -
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/select.asp?Ind=E01

you can check him more at this site
http://www.issues2000.org/Senate/Joe_Biden.htm

and at

http://www.joebiden.com/home

[question everything]

46. The recent AARP Newletter has an interesting observation

His old mother is living with him and his wife, apparently, stays at home.

He commented how not many people are lucky that one spouse is at home to provide living space for an elderly parent, as an alternative to putting the parent in a home.

Hillary Clinton, apparently, also has her mother living in he Washington home while McCain, whose mom is 91 and lives alone, says that she is doing just fine..

[jillan]

48. Jill Biden is a college professor.

I don't know who takes care of Joe's mom at home during the day.

[PatSeg]

65. It is a very close knit family, so there's probably

always someone around to watch over her.

[book_worm]

51. Of all the candidates he's the one whose best experienced to be president.

[gateley]

53. Yep. That sums it up perfectly! nt

[Swamp Rat]

58. Sharp as a tack

I'd vote for him if he won the nomination.

[WheelWalker]

59. On Edit - moved to more appropriate thread

[Blue_In_AK]

61. Joe Biden has become my favorite candidate

closely followed by John Edwards. If these two were on our ticket in any combination, I would be a very happy camper.

[MilesColtrane]

62. He talks a good talk, but walking...?

For me, it's hard to trust someone who's been at the top of U.S. government for 35 years

[WheelWalker]

64. See your doctor. Ask for the Oxytocin patch. It'll help.

[faithfulcitizen]

63. Wonderful! Courageous! Fantastic! nt.

:)

[HughMoran]

66. They did a nice bio on him on ABC nightly news

I was watching local news due to snow here and then nightly news came on. The bio was favorable - he seemed like a decent guy.

[PatSeg]

67. I just watched the clip of that bio

Very touching. I loved the film clips of Biden when he was younger. He looked like a KID when he was elected to the senate.

[HughMoran]

69. His wife and 1 kid was killed before he was sworn in.

He was fighting back tears when recounting that moment. I can relate to how he feels.

[PatSeg]

70. His one son was in a body cast

He spent every day at the hospital. The ABC bio played the part where he said, Delaware can get another senator, but my boys can't get another father.

[Greyhound]

68. He might suck slightly less than Clinton for the average person. n/t

[Truth2Tell]

71. Well,

Here’s an informative DU Post on Biden:

Clinton's and Biden's history of attacking war critics in the Democratic party; The Nation

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3816788

And this is what Joe Biden thinks about the views held by many of the Democrats who post on DU:

From: "Progressive Internationalism: A Democratic National Security Strategy" by the Progressive.. ahem.. Policy Institute, and endorsed by Joe Biden:

Too many on the left seem incapable of taking America's side in international disputes, reflexively oppose the use of force, and begrudge the resources required to keep our military strong. Viewing multilateralism as an end in itself, they lose sight of goals, such as fighting terrorism or ending gross human rights abuses, which sometimes require us to act -- if need be outside a sometimes ineffectual United Nations. And too many adopt an anti-globalization posture that would not only erode our own prosperity but also consign billions of the world's neediest people to grinding poverty. However troubling the Bush record, the pacifist and protectionist left offers no credible alternative.

http://www.ppionline.org/ppi_ci.cfm?contentid=252144&subsecid=900020&knlgAreaID=450004

If you don't think Biden agrees with these DLC positions on National Security and trade, just read the speech he gave to the DLC to celebrate the release of this paper:

As this document stresses, which I hope you'll all read, the right place is, quote, "the vital center between the neo-imperial right and the non-interventionist left" -- end of quote. We want to see America exercising its strength and leadership. It will not be shy about exercising its responsibilities to combat terror, tyranny, genocide or oppression.

http://www.ndol.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=106&subid=122&contentid=252157

Nothing scandalous about any of this. But people should understand where Biden is coming from. He has a history of behaving like a "centrist," DLC, American Empire, Lieberman, Credit Card Company, AIPAC, NAFTA Democrat. He's buried a lot of this under the sheets for his Presidential run (at least for the primaries).

I like the "new" Biden, and I'd love to believe that he hasn't just shifted to "defend the Constitution and stop the war" mode because he's running in a Presidential primary. But I gotta tell ya, it's a hard sell.

Edit to add: I have a hard time getting a particular image out of my head from back in September 2003 - as it became clear that Saddam had no WMD, the war was going to be a huge clusterfuck, and the war's approval ratings were dropping from the 70%s to the 40%s - when Joe Biden took to the talk show circuit with Joe Lieberman and John McCain to try and shore up public support. One particular appearance - on Good Morning America - where Joe became heatedly animated and declared that "We must Win!" "We must win!" It was extremely disturbing and it just sticks in my head.