The sickening revelation that Bush watched the torture tapes

[kpete]

Did Bush Watch the Torture Tapes?
Scott Horton
PUBLISHED December 27, 2007

The Times (London) Washington correspondent, Sarah Baxter, reporting with a summary of the developments in the case involving the CIA’s destruction of recordings of the treatment of Abu Zabaydah, points to the growing belief in Washington that President Bush viewed the torture tapes. Baxter reports:

It emerged yesterday that the CIA had misled members of the 9-11 Commission by not disclosing the existence of the tapes, in potential violation of the law. President George W Bush said last week he could not recall learning about the tapes before being briefed about them on December 6 by Michael Hayden, the CIA director. “It looks increasingly as though the decision was made by the White House,” said Johnson. He believes it is “highly likely” that Bush saw one of the videos, as he was interested in Zubaydah’s case and received frequent updates on his interrogation from George Tenet, the CIA director at the time.

It has emerged that the CIA did preserve two videotapes and an audiotape of detainee interrogations conducted by a foreign government, which may have been relevant to the trial of Zacarias Moussaoui, the Al-Qaeda conspirator. The CIA told a federal judge in 2003 that no such recordings existed but has now retracted that testimony. One of the tapes could show the interrogation of Ramzi Binalshibh, a September 11 conspirator, who was allegedly handed to Jordan for questioning.

In this regards, the sequence of statements out of the White House is extremely revealing. It started with firm denials, then went silent and then pulled back rather sharply to a “President Bush has no present recollection of having seen the tapes.” This is a formulation frequently used to avoid perjury charges, a sort of way of saying “no” without really saying “no.” In between these statements, two more things unfolded that have a bearing on the question.

John Kiriakou clarified his statements about the purpose for which the tapes were made. It was to brief higher ups about the process of the interrogation. Reports persist that one “higher-up” in particular had a special strong interest in knowing the details of the Abu Zubaydah case. His name is George W. Bush.

Are Bush’s denials that he has seen the torture tapes really credible? I don’t think so. And having seen them, the interest in their destruction would be equally fierce, which helps account for the involvement of the White House’s four most senior lawyers in the process. No doubt about it.


more at:
http://harpers.org/archive/2007/12/hbc-90002025
via:
http://prairieweather.typepad.com/big_blue_stem/2007/12/the-sickening-r.html

[Lars39]

1. Heck, I bet he's got his own copy in his nightstand.

[helderheid]

2. His snuff tapes. n/t

[Mnemosyne]

22. Exactly, helderheid, exactly. :( n/t

[Donnachaidh]

3. can you expect less from a guy who used to stuff firecrackers up the rear ends of frogs?

It's difficult, but I'll refrain from the usual 'hand lotion and a box of kleenex' jokes I could make about his 'viewing' the tapes. :puke:

[Richard Steele]

4. If they've switched to "no present recollection", then he's seen them. End of story. nm

[rocktivity]

34. At least when Reagan said he couldn't remember anything

he COULD have been telling the truth....

:eyes:
rocknation

[Demeter]

5. There's No Other Reason To Record the Torture

Certainly not as evidence of war crimes!

[L. Coyote]

11. Was there a live feed to Langley and WH Ops? Is this why recordings exist?

Asking the right questions makes all the difference, ie. the Watergate tapes.

The right question today is, "Was there a live feed? to Bush? to whom?"

[KansDem]

6. Just like Hitler watching movies of the slow executions of those who plotted against him

The trials and executions were reportedly filmed and later reviewed by Hitler and his entourage. These films were later edited by Goebbels into a 30 minute movie and shown to cadets at the Lichterfelde cadet school but viewers supposedly walked out of the screening in disgust.

Wikipedia

Snuff films involving your political opposition must be a characteristic of insane potentates and insane-potentate wanna-bees.

[peacetalksforall]

9. Isn't it a matter of who is worse - those who decided to use the torture,

those who decided how far to go, those who sought approval, those who gave approval, those who closed their eyes/covered ears-mouths?

I have nothing but contempt for all, especially the White House lawyers.

BUT WE SHALL BRING HONOR AND INTEGRITY TO THE WHITE HOUSE.

AND WE SHALL WEAR SUITS AND TIES IN THE OVAL ROOM.

Lobbyists for war profiteering and control, friends for whom the lobbyists work - always wear suits and ties, don't they, except when playing tennis and pumping the road, iron, golf balls - with their friends.

[L. Coyote]

7. CIA chief to drag White House into torture cover-up storm

Horton excerpt plus just two of the articles he links.

In George Bush’s America, however, lawyers who specialize in making torture and abuse possible are promoted. Indeed, they become attorney general and get appointed to Court of Appeals judgeships. And one of the key figures in this disgraceful saga is Steven Bradbury, the “acting” head of the Office of Legal Counsel. Many senators demanded that Michael B. Mukasey withdraw his nomination to head the office after it was learned that he had issued memoranda enabling waterboarding and other torture practices. In fact, it was later learned that Bradbury was brought into the job in a rush when his predecessor, Daniel Levin, started exploring the need to impose limits on waterboarding. Levin was fired so that Bradbury could come in and confirm that under Bush torutre knows no limits.

============================
CIA chief to drag White House into torture cover-up storm
Sarah Baxter - Dec 23, 2007 - http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article3087293.ece

THE CIA chief who ordered the destruction of secret videotapes recording the harsh interrogation of two top Al-Qaeda suspects has indicated he may seek immunity from prosecution in exchange for testifying before the House intelligence committee.

Jose Rodriguez, former head of the CIA’s clandestine service, is determined not to become the fall guy in the controversy over the CIA’s use of torture, according to intelligence sources.

It has emerged that at least four White House staff were approached for advice about the tapes, including David Addington, a senior aide to Dick Cheney, the vice-president, but none has admitted to recommending their destruction.

Vincent Cannistraro, former head of counterterrorism at the CIA, said it was impossible for Rodriguez to have acted on his own: “If everybody was against the decision, why in the world would Jose Rodriguez – one of the most cautious men I have ever met – have gone ahead and destroyed them?”

The tapes recorded the interrogations of Abu Zubaydah and Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, two suspected Al-Qaeda leaders, over hundreds of hours while they were held in secret “ghost” prisons. According to testimony from a former CIA officer, Zubaydah was subjected to waterboarding, ......

============================
Operation Stop Talking - By Laura Rozen - Dec 21, 2007
http://motherjones.com/washington_dispatch/2007/12/john-kiriakou.html

Washington Dispatch: John Kiriakou called it hypocritical for the White House and Congress to point fingers at the CIA for its harsh interrogation techniques. Now his former employer, with the help of the Justice Department, is trying to shut him up.

When spies speak, they often draw trouble.

After news broke earlier this month that the CIA had destroyed videotapes showing agency operatives using harsh techniques to interrogate two terrorism suspects (among them Abu Zubaida), John Kiriakou decided it was time to step out from the shadows. Speaking to ABC News, among other news outlets, the 14-year veteran of the CIA, who retired in 2004, said he had been part of the team that interrogated Zubaida after his March 2002 capture in Pakistan. According to Kiriakou's account, Zubaida broke after being waterboarded for 35 seconds, providing information that "probably saved lives."

Though he did not personally use the controversial interrogation technique on the detainee, Kiriakou said he believed at the time that it had been effective in getting the Al Qaeda suspect to talk. He since has come to have his doubts about the use of waterboarding. "Like a lot of Americans, I'm involved in this internal, intellectual battle with myself weighing the idea that waterboarding may be torture versus the quality of information that we often get after using the waterboarding technique," he told ABC News. "And I struggle with it."

After Kiriakou became one of the first CIA officials to publicly discuss details of the agency's rough treatment of Zubaida, the Department of Justice, according to McClatchy's Jonathan Landay, this week opened a criminal investigation into whether Kiriakou had disclosed classified information. ..........

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[L. Coyote]

10. Testimony: Bush personally involved " interrogation of a high-ranking al Qaeda suspect"

http://public.cq.com/public/20061122_homeland.html
CQ HOMELAND SECURITY – SPYTALK
Nov. 22, 2006 – 7:08 p.m.
A Senate Mystery Keeps Torture Alive — and Its Practitioners Free
By Jeff Stein, CQ National Security Editor

.... On March 17, 2005, Schmidt interviewed Maj. Gen. Mike Dunlavey, the retired former commander of Task Force 170, which was in charge of Guantanamo interrogations.

In his report, first obtained last April by the Internet magazine Salon, Dunlavey described himself as “a trial lawyer” who had “done over 3,000 interrogations” during his “35 years of intelligence experience.”

Under oath, Dunlavey said that Rumsfeld was “personally involved” in the interrogation of a high-ranking al Qaeda suspect, Mohammad al-Qahtani.

So was Bush, Dunlavey testified. ....

[Mnemosyne]

23. I knew it,

cannot even comment further without being disappeared.

[smoogatz]

12. Bush is a sick, sadistic freak.

But we already knew that.

[Solly Mack]

13. Been saying it

Of course he watched

[MiniMe]

14. Bush's version of viagra

He probably gets a hard-on every time he watches the tapes.

[formercia]

19. Killing also does that to people

The term' getting off on killing' is very real.

It wouldn't surprise me. That sadistic prick has the right personality for it.

[Mnemosyne]

24. Mexican cult bordertown slaughter 1981? n/t

[formercia]

29. Practice for the big job to cum.

Branding pledges with a red hot piece of coat hanger is another.

That one is documented.

[Mnemosyne]

31. And surely all evidence of the

slaughter has long ago disappeared, even from *'s mind, or what is left of it anyway.

Remember a SF reporter during 2000 that asked about it? * did not deny it; he acted disgusted at being asked about something that, "may or may not be true."

Strange answer, imo, very strange.

[formercia]

32. Caligula

I read somwhere that that's his staff nickname at the White House.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3169501&mesg_id=3169569

It comes from Caligula being his "daddy's little soldier" as a child. Roman troops gave him the nickname.

[Mnemosyne]

37. I read a book on him once and saw a nasty film with

Malcolm McDowell, iirc. What a vicious pig!

I have no doubt *'s nickname is Caligula. Wasn't his nick in the S & B 'Temporary'? Add in the torture tapes and we can really be proud.

Argh!

[Supersedeas]

15. such are the fetishes of power -- cruelty and lying

[SoCalDem]

16. The only question I would have is this..

Did he have buttered popcorn or air-popped with his "movies"..

You KNOW he watched them.. He LOVES that sort of stuff..:puke:

[Mnemosyne]

25. "And I'm proud to be an American,"

:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:
:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:
:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:
:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:


:cry:

[libodem]

17. Sickening is right!

Surprising, not.

[killbotfactory]

18. It's probably shown at high-ranking GOP parties

[dailykoff]

20. Beyond belief.

When will these criminals be brought to justice?

[tom_paine]

21. Those tapes must be a little sticky by now.

I am sure the circle jerks are fantastic.

[formercia]

33. Analise the DNA

to determine who belongs to the encrustations on the tapes.

[Divine Discontent]

26. well this is disturbing to hear... we all thought it, but reading this

and hearing his "no present recollection of seeing the tapes" line or whatever, just sums up the fact that it's a way to get out of hot water, or attempt to.

war criminal - georgie boy

[L. Coyote]

27. Recommended.

http://harpers.org/archive/2007/12/hbc-90002025

[focusfan]

28. it would'nt suprise me if

Bush wasn't kin to Hitler

[UTUSN]

30. He plays with Saddam's swords and guns

No, I've never seen that said anywhere, I have no link, but I firmly believe it.

[rocktivity]

35. No doubt the tapes were destroyed at the White House's order

Yesterday, a reporter told Thom Hartmann that Kiriakou wants immunity from prosecution in exchange for fingering the top birds.

:headbang:
rocknation

[ForeignSpectator]

36. If there was a way to take a look into Bush's "soul", would you dare to??

What sadistic perversions would you see?

The frogs, his comments about Karla Tucker and the tapes are just hints...