Mandatory Health Insurance....I can't wait

[Crazy Dave]

Even with health coverage my $7300 emergency room bill (kidney stones) is going to cost me around $3200. No telling what the follow-up visits are going to cost.

That price didn't include the $104 for the prescriptions I had to get on the way home.

[ingac70]

1. Me too...

Love spending thousands only to have the insurance deny coverage that is in the policy!!

:sarcasm:

[cyclezealot]

37. when will Americans reaize

they are being screwed by the insurance companies and say enough is enough. A family of four over 50 pays about One Thousand dollars a month. Only to be told , coverage denied. We are fools. When will the likes of Hillary, realize one bounced premimum payment and your coverage is denied.

[TransitJohn]

2. Insurance is

extortion and racketeering, plain and simple.

[harun]

9. And just good ole fashioned stealing, except they are about

to make us sign up to have this theft done to us.

[TransitJohn]

22. Yep

which is why it's extortion. What a racket.

[gateley]

3. Are you saying you want mandatory health INSURANCE? nt

[Crazy Dave]

8. No. I want government funded single payer health coverage

But the front running candidates want us to pay for it and to make it mandatory. Funny though, most Americans want free health care but what does that matter to them right?

Depending on whose plan and whose responsible for paying for it, you or your employer, it's a disaster waiting to happen. Look for more jobs to go to countries abroad where employee health coverage doesn't affect profit margins.

[NashVegas]

24. I Don't Think Most Americans Want FREE Health Care

I think most of us want affordable health care, and we want the service we receive to match the cost that comes from our pockets.

When we pay $150-$700 per month on health insurance, we think it's reasonable to expect that will cover all of our costs.

Universal health care was never even an issue until the 1980s, when corporations got involved with health care and sent prices skyrocketing. My parents never had a pot to piss in, and my mom had 3-4 surgeries / skin grafts in the 1960s - and I never heard a single peep of complaint about medical bills at that time.

[Crazy Dave]

28. Times have changed

"Affordable" now means less coverage with higher deductibles. Being self-employed I also have to buy my own business liability insurance as is required by several clients who do a lot of city and state work. I was offered a different policy once with a very low premium with the same $$ coverage as was required on paper but it was explained in detail that it would never pay a claim. In other words, I pay a premium, they give me a certificate that I can give my clients proving I have the required insurance, but in reality that's all the policy is, a piece of paper.
I'm sure these type of policies will be sold in the tens of thousands across America. Cheaper and more affordable than paying a penalty for not having insurance and cheaper than a regular policy that won't pay a claim anyways.

[NashVegas]

29. When I Write "Affordable Health Care"

I mean affordable as meaning that most people can afford to pay for it, and that there is indeed, a valuable service that will be performed, in exchange for the fee.

I believe the health insurance industry sees it your way.

That's really nuts, what you're putting up with.

[cyclezealot]

38. nothing in life is free. we all realize that

just our private insurance plans are the masters of giving us the shaft at our great expense. And for what. Canceled coverages.

[Union Thug]

4. Universal Single Payer is the ONLY real solution

Maybe mandatory health insurance will be the wild success that mandatory auto insurance has been... Here in Washington we were promised a utopian world where everyone would be covered and the cost to insure drivers would drop (so that everyone, of course, could afford it). Guess what...the prices went up, and there's still a need for uninsured motorist coverage.

[senseandsensibility]

5. That's what I'm afraid of , union thug.

Not to mention that mandatory health insurance has not been a success in Mitten's former state.

[yy4me]

36. Or that Mitten was not a success in his former state.

[Crazy Dave]

15. I use that comparison a lot

And just like "mandatory" auto insurance, high risk drivers can be compared to those considered high risk with poor health and/or existing conditions. High risk drivers pay out the ass for very low coverage with very high deductibles and people who are forced to buy nsurance against their will should expect the same.
So if you are a middle-aged person with heart problems or cancer it's either pay $10,000 a year for health covrage or...I've heard the penalties and/or fines for not having it can run into the thousands of dollars, increasing every year.

No matter how the candidates or their staffers who troll around here on DU try to spin it, five or six years from now if this should happen will prove both me and you were right.

[demodonkey]

21. Well........ I guess the powers that be want them to check out the lyric of the Theme From "MASH"??

:eyes:

http://www.lyricsdownload.com/the-mash-suicide-is-painless-lyrics.html

if you are a middle-aged person with heart problems or cancer it's either pay $10,000 a year for health covrage or...I've heard the penalties and/or fines for not having it can run into the thousands of dollars, increasing every year.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

6. Right now, if I were forced to get health insurance,

it would take half of what I make each month. My husband has been out of work for over two years, suffering from a malady that was finally diagnosed. THANK GOD for our doctor, who took payments and even "forgot" to charge for some treatments. There are still good MDs out there who are interested in their patients more than their wallets. And those MDs hate the insurance companies as much as I do.

I guess if I was forced to get health insurance, I'd quit my job and fall through the cracks.

[UndertheOcean]

7. this sucks , sorry you are going through that

where did compassion go in this country

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

19. I found it with my doc

She isn't rich, but she really does her best to HEAL people.

[Crazy Dave]

10. Not only that

There are no doctors (except those on the insurance company's payroll) in favor of mandatory coverage. They have a hard enough time being allowed to treat their patients and an even harder time getting paid for when they do. This will make the insurance companies richer and more powerful and Americans will be worse off than they are now.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

18. Blue Cross won't cover my doctor

She tends to argue with insurance companies about treatment. She has this quaint notion that all the meds the patient takes should be considered before writing a scrip.

[dipsydoodle]

11. I'll try to convey to you a direct financial comparison

with the UK's NHS. That is mandatory health insurance and covers everything from pre-birth until death.

Whatever you earn the first c. $10000 will be free of contibutions. Therafter you'll pay c.11% on everything you earn up to c. $68000. In the same way your employer will also pay c. 12% on everything you earn over the $10000 - to infinity. Your personal contributions are above and in addition to whatever normal tax you pay. The NHS contributions will also provide you with a pension of c. $200 a week from statutory retirement, whether or not you do infact retire, women aged 60 and men aged 65.

In 2006 the total number of people employed by the NHS was 1.3 million - the NHS is one of the world's largest employers. So - if you now multiply that by the proportionately larger pop. of the USA you'll figure roughly how many jobs would be created if the USA followed the UK's model.

[napi21]

12. Mandatory Health Ins. is necessary BECAUSE a HUGH cost

right now is to treat people who have no insurance! That cost is a direct writeoff at the hospital level, but is so high, the hospital must pass that cost on to all other patients they treat. If EVERYBODY paid a small amount, the pool would be big enough to reduct the cost to everyone who needed care.

As to your copay, I understand. I broke my ankle last year and I had to pay $2,500 out of pocket, and the only reason it wasn't higher than that was because our ins. has an annual cap on your op expenses. Meds were on top of that too. Any new federal plan must address the copays. I know several of the Dem plans have already addressed the the refusal of the ins. co's to use pre-existing conditions and they demand that treatment decisions be made by the physicians not the accountants!

Something lese you need to know if you think Kucinich' plan is great. There ARE deductibles with Medicare! Here's a link to the info.

http://www.medicareinteractive.org/page2.php?topic=counselor&page=script&slide_id=183

Inpatient Hospital Care $1,024 deductible for each benefit period
No coinsurance for days 1 to 60
$256 daily coinsurance for days 61 to 90
$512 daily coinsurance for 60 lifetime reserve days

That deductible is for the hospital bill (Part A), and I don't know how many other charges might no be covered completely. Part B is for Dr. visits, and there are copayments there too, plus it costs over $100 per month for each person.
edit: Here's a link to the cost of Part B.
http://www.medicareinteractive.org/page2.php?topic=counselor&page=script&slide_id=552

Monthly Premium $96.40 if your annual income is below $82,000 ($164,000 for couples).
A small number of people with high incomes have a higher Part B premium. To find out how a high income affects your Part B premium, click the link in the GO TO box.


Annual Deductible $135

Doctor and other medical services 20%1

Outpatient hospital care Coinsurance or Copayment 2

Home health care Nothing

Clinical diagnostic lab services Nothing

Other diagnostic tests and x-rays3 20%

Diabetes self-management supplies (glucose monitors, lancets, test strips) 20%

Durable medical equipment (e.g., wheelchairs, hospital beds) 20%4

Physical therapy services 20%

Ambulance services 20%

Chiropractor services5 20%

Outpatient mental health services 50%

Blood 20% after first three pints each year


Then of course there's the cost of Part D (drug coverage). That too is not cheap! The best policy I could find is $30/mo. with copays of $20 for generic drugs, $35 for name brands, and a discount of 20% on any drugs that are not on the formulary.

It's real easy to say "medicare for all", but it's not exactly what you think it is!

[seabeyond]

13. then mandatory pay raise should coincide. too many people dont have enough for food

and roof over the head. having all these "mandatories" that are added expense for the poor is just another trap for them to not being able to accomodate and leaving themselves open to laws broken, penalties charged and the hole of debt dug deeper.

it is really nifty how so many are willing to add bills to the poor, add increases of costs of living without increase in pay.... leaving this very large group set up for failure at a greater extent.

i agree high costs of medical is IN PART all those not paying. that is another of the many issues with our health care. mandatory insurance isnt the answer

[napi21]

14. Medicaid isn't going anywhere. I also read that a proposal has been

made to change the way "poverty" is calculated. The new plan would include the cost of rent and the other necessities of life. Yes, the proposal was made by Bloomburg, but I think it's a great idea and I intend to send the info on it to my current Wash. officials, and also all the Dem Candidates. THAT also would help level the playing field for the low wage earners. It's a lot more expensive to rent something in NYC than it is in Dubuque Ia.

I honestly believe all the Dem candidates have good ideas on beginning to fix HC. As someone else posted, it took a long time to get where we are, and it's going to take time to get out. We need to do everything we can to make sure the Dem gets elected! God help us all if they don't!!!!

[Rosa Luxemburg]

16. long live the NHS!

if the UK can have a national health system so can we

[Crazy Dave]

20. Hell...what about Cuba?

Even a poor communist dictatorship can afford it for it's people. And just like the lies and horror stories you hear about Canada's or France's health care not being as good as ours and that you have to wait forever for treatment, I personally know a lot of people from Cuba who say that the health care system there is excellent. As it is also in Canada, France and the rest of the developed nations.

BTW - You wait forever or never for treatment here in America if you don't have any insurance which now is no guaranty of treatment or payment of benefits even if you do have it.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

41. I think the GOP want us to be ill so their friends can make money

[and-justice-for-all]

17. Why the fuck cant they just initiate UHC??

We already have Medicare, that's like 50% of the way there. If some one is doing something that worlks and has worked for decades, it is a good idea to follow suit. Duh!

[walldude]

23. You want a solution to the health care crisis? I can fix it in less than a year.

All we need to do is cancel all the health benefits for all branches of Government. Let them try to pay out of pocket for decent health care. I guarantee once half of Congress and the Senate can't get health insurance because of "pre-existing conditions" they find a solid solution, fast.

[NashVegas]

26. Agreed

wordy-word

[REP]

25. What the hell did they do??

Isnt SOP an xray, fluids and pain meds? (I've passed over 150 stones and had one removed surgically, but have never been to the ER for one.) Good god that's a lot of money!!

[Crazy Dave]

27. You nailed it

Pain meds., an I.V., a CAT scan, wrote two prescriptions and a lunch :shrug:

[WillowTree]

30. Exactly right.

No one ever talks about how high the charges for the services themselves are. My Dad's bill for one pre-op visit, a two-hour surgery, and 7 follow-up visits was over $13,000. Mind you, that was just the surgeon's fee and didn't include the hospital, anesthesiologist, assistant surgeon, consultants, radiology and pathology and all the other ancilliary charges ad nauseum.

Someone had better take a long, hard look at what we're being charged for the treatments themselves, not just at what insurance costs.

[Skittles]

31. YES

I keep wondering why all the focus is on HOW TO PAY FOR HEALTHCARE while very little attention is paid to answer the question WHY DOES IT COST SO F***ING MUCH?

[WeCanWorkItOut]

32. Exactly. The high cost is a major issue. So why don't newspapers cover it?

Here's an example. In the last few years the cost of "imaging" has been really going up. Why? One reason seems to be that doctors are sending patients to smaller imaging centers for CAT scans and so forth. (I've read suggestions that some may have a conflict of interest here.) These smaller centers charge more. The result for the economy is a few billions of dollars a year extra.

Or so I gather from what I've been reading, the latest by J. Newhouse, editorial in the New England Journal of Medicine. Also there's something buried in a presentation referred to by Krugman, from the McKinsey Institute. But this stuff is hard to get at: NEJM is subscription only, most of the time. So it's really the job of the media to look at it, and bring to us. But they don't. Why not?

And this is one of the smaller health cost issues.

It's hard to deal with a major challenge when most opinion leaders won't talk about it.

[Crazy Dave]

33. Health care in America is all and only about profits

The insurance companies and the hospitals have shareholders that are rich and their main priority is to get richer.

You've heard the stories and they are no exaggeration. $10 or more for one dose of Tylenol, $12 for one band-aid. etc.

[Crazy Dave]

35. Happy New Year

And welcome to DU WeCanWorkItOut :hi:

[emanymton]

34. Health Coverage For ALL Is A Right (Like Free Universal Education)!

.
Why is this even being questioned?
.

[Thothmes]

39. Trouble is

Free Universal Education isn't. It costs billions upon billions of dollars each year to provide "free" education. The same is will be true of Universal health coverage. This is why it is being questioned. Who's ox will be gored by the taxes that will have to be levied to cover the program is the political question that has to be answered. JMO

[emanymton]

40. USA should guarantee health care to every person ...

.
The right of universal free education for all is the jewel in the crown of our great free society. It should be clear that a child who does not receive adequate health care, like a child who does not receive an adequate education, does not have the same chances in life as children who get both education and health care.

Staggering costs of education are paid by the citizens who benefit from being a part of a well-educated society. The costs of universal health care will also be carried by the same citizens who benefit from a being part of a healthy society.

The American people offer free education because it's the only way to ensure every child gets an education. USA should guarantee health care to every child, for the same reason. Giving every child a fair chance is the American way.
.