"I had to make myself not think of them as people.."

[shance]

Iraq Veteran: "I had to make myself not think of them as people.."

when we were in Kuwait we got debriefed about our mission...Briefed That: OUR JOB WAS TO STRIKE FEAR IN THE HEARTS OF THE IRAQI'S..thats what they told us you can do whatever it takes...were not gonna hold anything against you ..your not gonna get charged for anything..DO WHATEVER IT TAKES IN THE FIELD TO MAKE THEM FEAR YOU


after the debriefing they had us go clear out the bunkers...after The Air Force had bombed the crap out of them..so we had to go in there and make sure..that everything in there was dead still..


Q:were alot of those at close range?...yea at close range

they would actually feel the hot muzzle of my rifle..on their forehead..


i thought i was gonna be cool...be the best..go protect my country...make sure my people don't suffer...so much pride for my country...my government...my home...ship to korea..
for one week..to pick up some more people..stopped in Kuwait..and then went straight to Baghdad...once i got there my whole aspect of the country changed..when we were in Kuwait we got debriefed about our mission...Briefed That: OUR JOB WAS TO STRIKE FEAR IN THE HEARTS OF THE IRAQI'S..thats what they told us you can do whatever it takes...were not gonna hold anything against you ..your not gonna get charged for anything..DO WHATEVER IT TAKES IN THE FIELD TO MAKE THEM FEAR YOU...and they told us to be brutal..to not feel...they said we're not there for them...we got our own purpose..we're not there for them...THE GENEVA CONVENTION..THAT DOESN'T MEAN CRAP!...just some political crap...once I heard that..I said whatever happened to..the Army values?..the stuff you pumped us up for?...whatever happened to?...we're going over there to Liberate the people? Operation Iraqi Freedom..more like operation iraqi slaughter....and so we..I remember..uhh..when I first got there..after the debriefing they had us go clear out the bunkers...after The Air Force had bombed the crap out of them.. so we had to go in there and make sure..that everything in there was dead still..so..uh..whether there was women, children or whatever..if they weren/t dead we had to go in there and finish them off..drag the bodies out.."


An Iraq war veeran tells of atrocities he and fellow other soldiers committed regularly while in Iraq. I have never seen this level of honesty from a U.S. soldier who directly participated in the slaughter of Iraqi's.


When we were doing the night raids in the houses, we would pull people out and have them all on their knees and zip-tied. We would ask the man-of-the-house questions. IF he didn't answer the way we would liked, we shOOt his youngest kid-in-the-head. We would keep going, this was our interrogation. He could be innocent. He could just be an average joe trying to support his family. IF he didn't give us a satisfactory answer, we'd start kiLLing off his family until he told us something...IF he did not KNOW anything..HE was SOL."

http://www.ivaw.org/

[acmavm]

1. There is no justification for this soldier and those like him. They

know right from wrong, they had a choice to make.

[shance]

5. There is little choice when you are given commands and are in a war zone

Don't blame the ones who were commanded to take these actions.

Blame those at the top who GAVE them the orders.

[acmavm]

8. I was just following orders did NOT work at Nuremburg. We

would not accept that excuse then, we must not accept it now.

[stillcool]

18. blaming victims of

circumstance feels good. I did it for years. My dad was a WWII vet, and while I do not know the details of his experience in that war, I know very well the consequences. I blamed him until the day he died for fucking up my life. According to some yardsticks, he and I did not deserve the air we breathed. I wish I could give it back, and make everyone feel better. But then what would you say?

[Rosemary2205]

2. I am suspicious.

IF the story is true, I don't believe this is systemic. I just don't.

[Hangingon]

9. I'm not suspicious. I just plain do not believe it.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

3. Any Real Source Or Just This No Name One?

Unless I can see a link with a shred of credibility from a news standpoint, I won't give this any weight; as terrifyingly horrible as it was.

[sharp_stick]

4. Making the world safe for democracy

Christ on a stick, sounds like Vietnam all over again. I can just see the surge in PTSD cases coming in a few years when these kids come home and try to start normal lives. You can't do this kind of nightmarish shit and not expect to be completely fucked up for the rest of your life.

Of course our beautiful military will do just what they did to the Vietnam vets, forget them and let them become street people, bums and criminals.

I hate Republicans and stuff like this reminds me of why.

[patrice]

6. Are there any statistically legitimate estimates of how many of our

soldiers had this kind of experience? Certainly not all of them were involved in this sort of thing, but how many? 10%? 30%? 50%? 70%? What do you think?

[shance]

7. Why not take a look at Vietnam?

Better yet, why not ask an Iraqi Vet who has actually been there?

[patrice]

10. Well, anyone who wants to can say, "This is not Viet Nam" and

that isn't the particular argument I am interested in engaging in.

And unless one asks a enough Iraqi Vets, from a valid cross-section of the general population, whatever you get from asking an Iraqi Vet is anecdotal and does not necessarily represent anything at all about the group of Iraqi Vets as a whole.

[rinsd]

16. How about a real Iraqi vet instead of a liar?

This does no favors for the anti-war movement.

By repeating easily(and previously) debunked atrocities gives cover for when real atrocities come to light.

I think MacBeth was a setup.

[Nickster]

11. Weird, no source from the OP and not a single hit on The Google for any key phrases.

This wouldn't be that Jessie guy that was debunked awhile back now would it?

[rinsd]

13. Yes it is. The OP is cribbing from a post on another website. (nt)

[Nickster]

15. Cool, just had a feeling that it was that debunked story again. But I guess the OP knew that. n/t

[rinsd]

12. Jessie MacBeth was shown to be a fraud a longtime ago.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Macbeth

But of course those at the site that shall not be named can't be bothered with facts.

[Nickster]

14. Here we go.

http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=36627&archive=true

[shance]

17. Statement by Iraq Veterans Against the War

An IVAW spokesman said Pepperspray Productions pulled the video "until further questions could be answered". The anti-war spokesman would not provide details whether Macbeth's veracity was at issue .


The statement by IVAW:

"Iraq Veterans Against the War recently learned of a video interview with Jesse MacBeth that directs viewers to IVAW's website and phone number. IVAW was not made aware of the creation of this video program and our input on it was never sought by its producers. Jesse MacBeth is not a spokesperson for IVAW and any claims made by MacBeth about his service have not been verified. We are currently investigating these claims and will have a full statement pending its resolution."


Besides IVAW, reporter Dahr Jamil, who concentrates on war coverage missed by the mainstream, also pulled the Macbeth story and video clip from his web site, pending further investigation and relaying to readers the IVAW's response.


Although the controversy created by the Macbeth video is far from over, it is just another example of how a search for the truth requires vigilant daily reporting. By unfolding "every once" of a story on a daily basis, the truth of course eventually surfaces and the people are apprised exactly how it occurs, sometimes by a very twisted and illogical turn of events like appears to be unfolding in the Macbeth story.

[Nickster]

19. Oh my Lord. You aren't really going to try and sell this crap here are you?

This story has been debunked 12 ways from Sunday. Just do a little search and you'll see the overwhelming evidence that was presented against him from his faked DD214 to published news stories that place him out of Iraq when he claims to have been in Iraq. His lack of knowledge of how the uniform is worn, etc,etc,etc.

This is a fake story, and I'm now extremely curious as to your intentions for posting it here.

[shance]

24. Not at all. I am trying to figure out what the truth is.

I am still looking for any other information and I ran across this statement.

Jesse McBeth may very well be an "imposter". I have no idea. But why in the world would someone lie like that?

Thats what doesnt make sense.

[Nickster]

26. No, I don't think you are at all. You're selectively picking out statements from the very beginning

of this controversy. Use the power of The Googles and look for yourself, or are you just trying to get a few anti-war folks to say things you can cut and paste onto other boards?

[rinsd]

27. Who knows why someone would lie like that?

Why is * such a sociopath?

Why does MacBeth apparently beat women?

http://www.co.pierce.wa.us/cfapps/linx/calendar/GetBooking.cfm?booking_id=2006319064

Why do people do anything so horrible?

I wanted to add here Shance that there are a great deal of real atrocities being committed. And hoaxes like this cast doubt on the veracity of those stories. That's why I think either he has some serious issues or he was a setup from the getgo.

[rinsd]

20. Have you seen what he claims?

I'm not talking about the atrocities.

I'm talking medals won. Injuries endured including shootings and stabbings.

[Nickster]

21. Wanna see his real DD214?

http://www.qando.net/details.aspx?Entry=3957

He was a boot camp washout.

[bdamomma]

22. these soldiers were just trained/brainwashed to be killing machines

I just don't know what to say anymore, no one values life anymore.

[rinsd]

23. I agree but hoaxes like this serve only one purpose and that is to put doubt into reality

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Macbeth

[rinsd]

25. Also this POS MacBeth likes to beat women apparently.

http://www.co.pierce.wa.us/cfapps/linx/calendar/GetBooking.cfm?booking_id=2006319064