Obama goes after Fox News

[dancingme]

E-mail from his office:

"In the past week, many of you have read a now thoroughly-debunked story by Insight Magazine, owned by the Washington Times, which cites unnamed sources close to a political campaign that claim Senator Obama was enrolled for “at least four years” in an Indonesian “Madrassa”. The article says the “sources” believe the Madrassa was “espousing Wahhabism,” a form of radical Islam.
Insight Magazine published these allegations without a single named source, and without doing any independent reporting to confirm or deny the allegations. Fox News quickly parroted the charges, and Fox and Friends host Steve Doocy went so far as to ask, “Why didn’t anybody ever mention that that man right there was raised — spent the first decade of his life, raised by his Muslim father — as a Muslim and was educated in a Madrassa?”

All of the claims about Senator Obama raised in the Insight Magazine piece were thoroughly debunked by CNN, which, instead of relying on unnamed sources, sent a reporter to Obama’s former school in Jakarta to check the facts.

If Doocy or the staff at Fox and Friends had taken to check their facts, or simply made a call to his office, they would have learned that Senator Obama was not educated in a Madrassa, was not raised as a Muslim, and was not raised by his father – an atheist Obama met once in his life before he died.

Later in the day, Fox News host John Gibson again discussed the Insight Magazine story without any attempt to independently confirm the charges.

To be clear, Senator Obama has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim, and is a committed Christian who attends the United Church of Christ in Chicago. Furthermore, the Indonesian school Obama attended in Jakarta is a public school that is not and never has been a Madrassa.

These malicious, irresponsible charges are precisely the kind of politics the American people have grown tired of, and that Senator Obama is trying to change by focusing on bringing people together to solve our common problems."

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/horsesmouth/2007/01/post_15.php

[swimboy]

1. I hope he takes 'em down!

They are beyond awful and into evil irresponsibility. Oh, and brainwashing.

[Warpy]

15. And beyond innuendo into outright slander

Somebody has got to grow a pair and sue these assholes.

That's the only way to discourage imitators.

[walldude]

25. In order to win a slander case he has to prove that

Fox knew the story was fake. While we all know it wouldn't matter to Fox, and they probably knew the story was bullshit, to prove it in a court of law will be difficult.

[Warpy]

33. What makes you think WINNING is the point?

Threatening to cost them more money than they want to spend is the point. Threatening to expose them in court is the point.

Hell, they could settle out of court for a dollar and the point would be made that Democrats are sick and tired of the lies and are beginning to fight back.

Winning in a courtroom isn't everything. It would just be the icing on a poisoned cake.

[walldude]

51. Because losing would mean that Fox proved in a court

of law that it made an "honest" mistake. Nobody had to sue CBS to make Dan Rather step down.

[Warpy]

63. The point is to settle

Trust me, Pox would love to make it all go away more than they would love to win.

Ignoring liars, bullies and a libelous press won't make it go away, you know.

Did the Swifties go away because Kerry didn't sue?

Did PT911 go away because members of the Clinton Administration didn't sue?

How much lying are we supposed to take?

Oh, right, we're supposed to be afraid to lose a case in which lying in order to hurt someone's career can easily be proven. We're afraid to expose bullies in the whore press because they might say more bad things.

[Tigress DEM]

65. I don't know. News agencies are SUPPOSED to check facts

and not KNOWINGLY print something they can't prove is true.

The FCC may have a higher standard that simply isn't practically applied in most cases because once the lie has been told the damage is done and most people in the spotlight don't have time to do extensive court battle.

[canetoad]

2. Look on the bright side

Be grateful this has come out now, with two years to go. It can be thoroughly hashed, rehashed, disproved and put to rest long before the business end of the campaign.

[montieg]

8. That certainly doesn't mean it won't be used in a whisper campaign

I was in the fight agaist the same tactics when Rove rehashed the alcoholic/druggie/lesbian shit against Ann Richards that got Bushit his governorship here in Texas. They are masters at it and it WILL come up again.

[AtomicKitten]

3. Obama is practicing

for dealing with the GOP Wrecking Machine.

Well done!

[Kerrytravelers]

4. Seems like he won't be tolerating the swift boating.

It's a shame it happened to Kerry, but I'm glad to see Obama has learned from the past events and is actively responding.

[Dr Fate]

17. I may be wrong, but it seems like he is tolerating it. What did he do, exactly?

All I see is that he expressed some concerns on an obscure website that swingvoters dont read.

Call me back when he accuses FOX news commentators, on camera, to their faces of lying about his record.

[Kerrytravelers]

23. I'll call you when Fox allows him on to defend their claims.

Don't wait by the phone! :rofl:

[Dr Fate]

31. Fox does not allow Obama on their shows- since when? I've seen him on many times.

Please show me the quote from Obama where he says FOX has ever refused him a slot on one of their shows.

HELL- show me ANY "star" Democrat who makes this oft. repeated DU claim that media shows "wont allow them on."

Are we really saying that FOX has now banned Obama from their shows?

Does that mean we expect Obama to point out that he is being censored or not allowed equal time by FOX?

For that matter, he could go on one of FOX's competitors and accuse them of lying or banning him from their shows- it would be the next best thing. THAT would be "fighting" in a way that the public at large would see it, not just net-roots DEM activist donors.

In any event, your reply still does not tell us how Obama is fighting FOX- obscure web-text read only by the activist DEM choir aint it.

[Kerrytravelers]

35. Oh, for heaven's sake.

What is with all the hostility?

:crazy:

[Dr Fate]

38. Hostility? I'm just trying to find out how obscure web-text equals "fighting FOX."

Rather than just writing me off as "hostile"- perhaps you could back up your argument with something factual that FOX wont let Obama on their shows.

Or at the least, tell us how obscure web text is adequate for fighting a major international network, FOX News.

I'm not hostile, just tired of DUers thinking that obscure web-text is "fighting" and making the tired old "they wont let him on TV" excuse w/o backing it up. I've been seeing this BS on DU for years now.

[Kerrytravelers]

40. See post #27.

As far as Fox, see that little emoticon :rofl: No one said they banned a Democrat from Fox News, however, no matter that Obama says, the follow up after he leaves will be an attack on what he just said and some silliness from Fox to further distort any form of discussion.

Really, you read too much of DU history into my posts. I have no idea what you are directly referring to. I don't think I've ever crossed paths with your before (I could be wrong, but I don't recall) and my response was just jesting back with a "don't wait by the phone"

Really, I think you misread my tone and my intent. Perhaps I did the same to you. This dungeon of tubes we call the Internet doesn't always translate body language and facial expressions very well. :)

[Dr Fate]

43. I see-Obama cant confront FOX for lying because FOX will just lie more. Got it.

So instead, he posts some text on the internet so that some in the donor base will think he is fighting FOX- got it.

First your excuse was that-FOX wont let him on their shows for a rebuttle-- now your excuse is -if he did a televised rebuttle- they would just tell even MORE lies about him.

There is just as much, if not more of a chance of FOX news telling more lies about him with his web response as opposed to a TV rebuttle- so I dont understand your excuse.

I'm not reading history into your posts- I'm just watching history repeat it self in your posts. Your excuses mirror those that I have seen here for years.

And no one says he needs to give a press conference every time FOX lies about him- what I am saying is that he can bring up lies FOX tells about him whenever he goes on their shows-or other shows. If they censor him or refuse him access, then I need to here HIM (as opposed to DU theorists) say so.

No hostility to you, Obama or anyone at DU meant- but this business of thinking that text on Liberal web-sites is "fighting" anyone gets us nowhere.

[Kerrytravelers]

46. Not an excuse, just responding to your post.

I really have no idea what you want from me. I do, and perhaps incorrectly, get the sense that there is no way I can respond that will satisfy you. I am not an avid watcher of Fox. I am familiar with the games they play. I'm not an insider on the Obama team, nor do I know anyone who is. I was simply responding. For some reason, my posts have caught your attention and have, for some reason, been very unsettling to you.

As I do not enjoy arguments or flame wars, I am going to bow out now, for I get the sense that I am, quite frankly, pissing you off. I see no need for the super-nuclear block function, but perhaps we should not respond to one another if we can not communicate on such a meaningless little thread without getting heated. Again, perhaps I am at fault here in that I am projecting my reaction onto your tone and intent.

Whatever I have done that has singled me out, I am sorry. Goodbye and I'll see you around on DU. :hi:

[Dr Fate]

49. No hostility meant at all- I just expect people to back up their arguments.

I'm not being hostile and I am not singling you out- if you look I asked several people in this thread similar questions. If you were to do a search of my past posts, you would see that I am always asking the same questions I asked you.

I have nothing against you what-so-ever- please dont read my insistance that people back up their theories and arguements as being mean, hateful or anything like that.

One of the functions of a political message board at it's best is to hash things out and to figure out what is fact and what is not- agreement for the sake of politeness gets us nowhere, in my opinion.

In any event, I hope you are right in your prediction that Obama will eventually adress examples of media bias in a meaningful way.

[sandnsea]

21. An email?

How is that responding more than the Kerry campaign??

[Kerrytravelers]

27. Two years away and he's already responding.

If he gets the nomination, he will have built up a whole war chest of responses to the propaganda.

I hardly expect him to call a press conference every time faux news lies about him- at least at this point. If he gets the nomination, then he most likely will have to respond more publicly to their bullshit.

I don't believe I said he responded more than Kerry. I said he learned from what happened to Kerry. I worked for the Kerry campaign. It was rough seeing someone you truly believed in trashed, lied about and swift boated. I'm glad to see that Obama has watched what happened and is actively building a response to the nonsense. I wasn't slamming Kerry. I was praising Obama.

[Dr Fate]

32. Exactly my point too- thanx. n/t

n/t

[Kerrytravelers]

36. Yep. Looks like you got me.

:eyes: Because what I said was so controversial or slanderous.

[Dr Fate]

39. Er- I'm not trying to "get" anyone. I'm making a point that web-text aint jack.

When Obama is ready to accuse FOX of lying to a mass audience via TV or major News paper Op-Ed- as opposed to making the accusation in a forum where only net-roots DEM activists/donors will see it, then we will have something.

[Kerrytravelers]

41. I responded above, but I'll add here.

I wouldn't be surprised if he is simply giving his supporters fodder for responses at this point. I also wouldn't be surprised if he did, at some point further down the campaign trail, have a very well written level-headed and mature response to the barrage of insanity. As he appears to be one who is very good at handling himself publicly (so far) I bet he already has a game plan.

But what the hell do I know? I'm just some poor schmuck pounding away on the keyboard when I should be getting work done. (Working from home has it's upside and it's downsides... like being completely distracted by DU!)

[Dr Fate]

44. LOL! Same here- I hope you are right. I'll continue to press regardless. n/t

n/t

[Kerrytravelers]

47. Well, I wish I'd read this before post #46.

:hi:

I guess perhaps I was at fault for misreading your tone and intent.

My apologies! :hi:

[Dr Fate]

50. No worries- I am sure we are on the same page on most things.

:)

[Dr Fate]

53. See post #45- looks like I may have been wrong in any event-hopefully.

n/t

[Kerrytravelers]

57. I'm glad to hear he's on CNN as well!

Hopefully all the Democratic candidates do the same thing in regards to swift boating attempts!

[tabasco]

30. Highlight of the swift boat campaign: Purple Heart bandaids.

This is how republicans honor veterans.



It will be all about race with Obama. With their codewords, the scurrilous corporate media will portray Obama as a welfare-loving, Cadillac-driving, uppity Negro who needs to be put in his place. "Swift boating" is about to get a whole lot uglier.

[Kerrytravelers]

42. Yuck. I could do without that picture!

:rofl:



And you're right. It's going to get nasty like we've never seen nasty before! They were outraged a white man (Kerry) challenged them. How dare an uppity houseboy dare question them! Oh, the outrage.

It sicken me. :puke:

[AlCzervik]

5. "If Doocy or the staff at Fox and Friends had taken to check their facts"

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

yeah like thats ever gonna happen. Good For Obama for speaking out.

[JacksonWest]

61. If they checked facts, it wouldn't be FOX..

[bling bling]

68. Heard that. Good point. n/t

[Raydawg1234]

6. I wonder if he can sue them for libel

we need to hit them where it hurts, the pocketbook

[northernsoul]

26. Libel suits are difficult for "public figures" to win

"Public Figures" like Obama have to prove that defamatory content was published with malicious intent. Although, in this case, this appears to be precisely what was going on - the problem is coming up with the hard evidence to prove it.

[LoZoccolo]

7. It's shitty journalism to hide behind someone else's shitty journalism too.

Fox News seems to think that all they have to do is say "Insight Magazine says..." to free themselves from having to independently verify a story like every other credible news source would. It's the same thing that was pointed out in Outfoxed where they say "some people say..." when asking a question in order to spread a rumor.

[spoony]

34. Yes!

It's such a dirty, intentional trick to use some anonymous "other" to cover their own rumour-mongering. Maddening.

[Supersedeas]

64. propoganda's the word...not journalism

[LouisianaLiberal]

9. Bush's family is much more like the house of Atreus

than Obama's. I think we should support a complete review of Obama's father's activities. And it would only be fair to investigate George Walker, *'s great grandfather, who financed the production of Zyklon B at I.G. Farben. Oh, and then perhaps *'s grandfather,who did the following:

"On October 20, 1942, the US Alien Property Custodian, under the "Trading With the Enemy Act," seized the shares of the Union Banking Corporation (UBC), of which Prescott Bush was a director and shareholder. The largest shareholder was E. Roland Harriman. (Bush was also the managing partner of Brown Brothers Harriman, a leading Wall Street investment firm.)

"The UBC was established to send American capital to Germany to finance the reorganization of its industry under the Nazis. Their leading German partner was the notorious Nazi industrialist Fritz Thyssen, who wrote a book admitting much of this called "I Paid Hitler."

"Among the companies financed was the Silesian-American Corporation, which was also managed by Prescott Bush, and by his father-in-law George Herbert Walker, who supplied Dub-a-Ya with his name. The company was vital in supplying coal to the Nazi war industry. It too was seized as a Nazi-front on November 17, 1942. The largest company Bush's UBC helped finance was the German Steel Trust, responsible for between one-third and one-half of Nazi iron and explosives.

"Prescott Bush was also a director of the Harriman Fifteen Corporation, (this one owned largely by Roland's brother, Averell Harriman), which owned about a third of the Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation, the rest owned by Friedrich Flick, (a member of Himmler's "Circle of Friends" who donated to the S.S.)."

Source: http://www.lpdallas.org/features/draheim/dr991216.htm

Then, maybe we can get to investigating *'s father's activities. Hey, they brought it up.

[dubyaD40web]

10. I did my research.

And I found out Doocy is a douche. No really, I did! :-)

[sonias]

11. Way to fight My Obama!

Never let them hold you down!

Sonia

[Dr Fate]

18. Exactly what did he do to "fight" them- other than some text on a low-traffic website?

I'm not trying to bash Obama- I'm just trying to see how this web text is really "fighting" Fox news.

[dancingme]

48. He did address the "Madrassa" on CNN last night

and said he has always had to deal with people making up stuff about him since he entered politics. But he didn't mention Fox News last night.

[Dr Fate]

56. Good- a thread about that w/ transcripts would have been more welcome, in my opinion.

I apologize for jumping the gun if I did so- but my ultimate point stands- responses need to be on TV, not just on websites.

Frankly, I think he should have mentioned FOX by name, as a signal to the media that we will make specific accusations when they lie- but at least he did adress this on the tube.

[dubyaD40web]

12. Freeperland........

Unbelievable

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1772984/posts#comment?q=1

[Patiod]

14. And they get a toofer - smear Sen. Obama AND Sen. Clinton

Love how they attribute it to the Clinton campaign.

[Ilsa]

13. Thanks. I've already started my 2008 Campaign "Favorites" folder

to file pages like this for later debunking.

[Dr Fate]

16. "goes after them" how? On an obscure website that no one reads?

Call me back when he goes on their shows and says it to their faces.

[proud2BlibKansan]

19. Good for him!

[grace0418]

20. Aside from anything else, so the fuck what if he *IS* Muslim? I know. I get it.

Mainstream America won't vote for a Muslim candidate. And certainly I would have my qualms about voting for someone who was a "radical" Muslim, as Fox news is falsely (big surprise there) charging. But then I also have issues with radicals of any religious stripe.

But if his father was a Muslim and he was raised Muslim (whether or not he was), I don't give a flying fuck. I don't care if he's a Christian either, or an aetheist. Can he do the job? That's what I care about.

I am so fucking sick of Fox News and their evil brethren making issues out of non-issues. It's how the word "liberal" somehow became a dirty word.

[Libby2]

24. Amen, Grace!!

I couldn't have said it better.

[grace0418]

29. Thank you!

Can you tell shit like this really gets my goat?

[GETPLANING]

22. Ann Coulter had a word for this..

SLANDER

[northernsoul]

28. To be precise, it is Libel

Slander is spoken defamation, Libel is defamation published via some kind of fixed media. At least, that's what they told us in law school.

[nolabels]

37. The other billion or so that follow that religion do not think that

In ways he is damed he if responds and they know that too.
Carrying on a conversation is not possible when bigots are involved in any part of it.

[ellacott]

45. I'm glad he's refuting this

This was debunked on snopes for awhile. This was first circulated as an email.

He has also been on a stations this morning with his reaction to the SOTU speech. Each newsperson asked him about the story and CNN's debunking. He responded to each and said the same thing he said in the web posting. He did more than release a statement on an obscure website.

He doesn't have to appear on Fox. I'm glad he chose to respond and in more venues than an obscure website. He's doing more than Kerry did. Clinton had a rapid response machine and they put out press releases. It would be nice if he appeared on those Fox programs but it's not crucial and he won't lose the election because he didn't go on fox regarding this one story.

Those freepers who are still posting and commenting on this story would not vote for him anyway. They're looking for anything that would disqualify him, just like many Dems are doing.

[Dr Fate]

52. Thanks for this info-thuis is more like it- on what shows did he do this?

???

[ellacott]

71. He did it on CBS and MSNBC eom

[Matariki]

54. so now saying someone is muslim is a "malicious, irresponsible charge"

i understand that Obama is angry at this misrepresentation, but where in the constitution does it say a Presidential candidate had to be a Christian? I thought a person simply had to be over 35 and a US citizen by birth.

[stanwyck]

55. Let's all take on Fox, and all the other

liars on hateradio and the internet. Let's continue to expouse these people as the outright liars they are. Neal Boortz was flogging this story on his show. Make him feel the heat. He lied to his audience. We need to call every one of these traitors to democracy who believe spreading falsehoods against opponents is patriotic. It's not. It's unethical and destructive. If the right has legitimate issues, then they should bring them up and discuss them.
This is lowest common denominator behavior and we need to fight it every day. We can't get the real work done when the lowlife media keep clogging up the airways with this sludge.
Call them out.
Neal Boortz: you blasted this story from your radio show. Time to tell the truth.

[brettdale]

58. kick

kick

[3121guitarist]

59. Keith Olberman and Al Franken are all over this one.

I'm quite sure..lol

[JacksonWest]

60. Who cares if he is or was a Muslim? This sounds like red baiting"Obama has never been a Muslim"

Sheeesh.

That being said.....OBAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Pacifist Patriot]

76. Seriously. This is what drives me nuts.

Quite frankly, I can't see where the religious affiliation of our leaders has had much to do with the quality of leadership.

And I hate how this is like the "So when did you stop beating your wife" question.

[Bucky]

62. This better not be even *close* to the last word on this smear

Fox is on the ropes with this. It's time to hammer them, demand an on-air apology, and demand it nonstop long past their first feeble attempt to pass off a semi-apology.

[sofa king]

66. This morning CNN reported the original source was H. Clinton's campaign.

Haven't seen a word about it since. Anyone know anything about this unusual twist?

Edit: Oh, the source for that factoid is also the Moonie Times and Insight Magazine.

Never mind.

[wiley]

69. Not a factoid, an outright lie.

I mind you even bothered to post it at all. Wouldn't Hillary just claw him to death?

:spank:

[progressoid]

67. I expect to see some RW emails about this in the future. With them the truth is optional.

[rman]

70. US govt has been supporting Wahabism for quite some time;

it's the state religion of Saudi Arabia.

WAHHABISM
STATE -SPONSORED EXTREMISM WORLDWIDE
Testimony by Alex Alexiev
Senior Fellow, Center for Security Policy
U.S. Senate Subcommittee on Terrorism, Technology and Homeland Security
Thursday, June 26, 2003

http://kyl.senate.gov/legis_center/subdocs/sc062603_alexiev.pdf (PDF)

"...Wahhab’s extreme doctrines contradicted and stood on their head major tenets of traditional
Islam and in a real sense represent an outright falsification of the Muslim faith.

To name just one egregious example, a key postulate of Wahhab’s teaching asserts that Muslims
who do not believe in his doctrines are ipso facto non-believers and apostates against whom
violence and Jihad were not only permissible, but obligatory. This postulate alone transgresses
against two fundamental tenets of the Quran – that invoking Jihad against fellow-Muslims is
prohibited and that a Muslim’s profession of faith should be taken at face value until God judges
his/hers sincerity at judgment day...."

[Cass]

72. Good. I'm glad he's addressing these ridiculous charges in this manner.

Faux "News" is a total joke. How they get away with saying they are a news channel is beyond me.

It would be great if Obama had the opportunity to set the record straight on Faux "News" but I doubt they'll let that happen. For now, the reality-based community will have to be content to point and laugh at their shoddy "journalism" from afar.

[dancingme]

73. Rush is also spreading the lie

of course Limpballs has to make sure his Dittoheads think that Obama is a radical Muslim.

"The story seems to have started with Insight magazine, then bounced to Fox News Channel, then to myriad other conservative media outlets including the popular Rush Limbaugh radio program. Often hosts repeating the false charges did so while bemoaning the notion that the Clinton campaign was investigating Obama's past, a charge that remains unproven and unsubstantiated."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=2822061&page=2

[bagrman]

74. Did I hear that Clinton was spewing the same rhetoric ???

[creeksneakers2]

75. I'm very glad to see

our candidates responding quickly and forcefully to lies from the RW attack machine. The machine has only lasted this long because politicians on the left tried to ignore it.

[cascadiance]

77. I was born in Indonesia too! Am I a Muslim extremist?

Someone will probably try to take a pot shot at me on that subject too down the road. Even though I was born there of Christian American parents, and we all left when I was still just a baby then.

This guilt crap the corporate media keep on trying to inflict on others is just out of hand. We need some SERIOUS lawsuits that will make these people pay for their criminal actions! I'm not a huge supporter of Obama, as I'm still a little concerned about his corporate leanings myself, but this sort of thing has got to stop!

We should be evaluating Obama on more constructive issues, not lame tabloid style libel and slander like this!