I just got terminated by having my accounts turned off

[undeterred]

I'm in IT. Theres a bit of a story behind this, and its not a total shock but I wasn't spoken to or given a letter. I just came home and my accounts are locked. That's how they do it. No meeting, no phone call, no letter, no explanation, no nothing. On Wednesday I told HR I was afraid of my manager doing something like this and she said we NEVER do things like that- we want people to do well here blah blah blah lie lie lie.... She said I was going to have a review soon and then they just shut me down completely.

I feel like I've been brutally stabbed in the back.

I am in Wisconsin. Legally, is there anything I can do?

[niyad]

1. not familiar with WI labour law-just know I extend my deepest sympathy. pour

yourself a glass of wine, and the resident experts here at DU will, perhaps, have some suggestions for you.

is it breaking any sort of confidentiality if you tell us the name of the company? I would prefer NOT to have any dealings with them.

[WorldResident]

2. Why were you afraid of being fired?

Just as a disclaimer, since this is a public board, feel free not to answer any questions at any time. Around here, I doubt you'll be judged negatively.

[undeterred]

9. A couple of reasons

Got a new manager in December. He used to be a coworker, and although I had little history with him, he immediately seemed negative toward me. Then I found out he was soliciting resumes for my position- the manager had never even talked to me once when he did this. So I always felt it was personal although I really have no idea what it was about.

[WorldResident]

17. You're better off not working this guy then

By no means am I trying to minimize the financial pain you will endure, but hopefully in the long run I pray you find a better job and symbolically stick it to this prick.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

19. That kind of behavior sounds like the kind of attitude I experienced

from the start of my last job (and I was only there four months). Never felt like I was "part of the team." I'm since seem them re-advertise my job under a more junior title (I think the person who was working beside me decided she wanted my job after all (she initially was offered and declined). Such bullshit.

[2Design]

24. on Oprah the other day - it was stated to say Thank you for being fired

because it was time to move on anyway - and this way you can - it is tough but staying there is not an option now anyway - maybe somewhere else in the company to there may be something so much better for you anyway
Have you been thinking of leaving anyway and doing something else?

[AZBlue]

63. You're right and I'm sure that he/she will find a much better job

with a much better boss.

It's hard in the meantime though - I know, I've been there.

[XOKCowboy]

50. Ewwww been there....

I now work for a person who used to work "under" me a long time ago. He left and they hired him back in a management position. His only qualification was his impressive asskissing is the general consensus of my coworkers and myself. I have zero respect for the guy and sure enough the company is going downhill under his management. I actually hope that he fires or lays me off so I can get unemployment while I go freelance.

Good luck on the job search but I think you're better off without that kind of stress in your job.

[Selatius]

3. Check you employment contract.

If you see a clause in there that basically says they can release you from service for whatever reason excluding any violation of current federal/state law, you're nothing but a typical case.

All employees who are not contract workers (such as union workers) are technically classified as "employment at will," which basically means your employer has broad latitude in deciding whether you are fired. Union workers typically have protection against rapacious and arbitrary terminations such as yours.

[blues90]

8. I was dumped because of the at will clause

Unless you have a contract they do not need to give you a reason . at will means it's your free will to stay there and their free will to let you go . Unless you were in a racial discrimination of sexual discrimintion dispute which are the only amendments to the at will lousy clause .

[undeterred]

12. Rapcious and arbitrary

Basically means they can do whatever they want. Although they pretend to themselves that they're very fair so they can sleep at night.

[radfringe]

82. have a friend that works maintenance at a college

the college has been cutting back on grounds/general maintenance staff - lots of layoffs and then hiring outside contractors to do the work

recently, the college sold off it's snow removal equipment and hired outside source to do the plowing. My friend also saw a memo directing the sale of lawn care equipment (mowers etc.)

he and his immediate boss went to see the college president to find out what is going on

this is a private college - not state. President told them he could get it down cheaper elsewhere and to expect big layoffs over the next few weeks and not just in maintenance - other departments are going to be sub-contracted out too

my friend's boss asked "But what about loyalty to your employees"

college president snorted "You want loyalty - go buy a dog"

[Pushed To The Left]

84. I would love to see a federal ban on at-will employment! n/t

[Bjornsdotter]

4. I'm so sorry

...this happened to my husband years ago and it was devastating.

:hug:

[Nite Owl]

5. Wow, nothing? And you were lied to also

How do they expect people to put their all into a job when they treat them inhumanely. I'm so sorry and hope someone here has some answers for you.

[hlthe2b]

10. Idiots... no wonder there are those unfortunate violent incidents...

Treat people with respect, that is the bottom line. I'm so sorry this has happened.

[napi21]

6. This is certainly not legal advise, but I wouldat least call HR

first thing Monday morning and askfor an explaination. You have the right to knowin the event theymight say something wrong about you to a future employer.

Idoubt your former boss would take the call, but if it were me, I would call that boss too! I'm just vindictive enough not to want to let them off the hook of not having to verbalize a reason for their actions! To me, it's worth the call!

[undeterred]

15. They are all a bunch of liars

The only good thing here is that I never have to see or talk to any of them again.

The HR lady sat there and lied to me for half an hour this week.

My manager invited me to a pizza lunch today.

My supervisor left without saying goodbye and didn't return my phone calls.

I have been treated like human garbage by these people. Why? Because thats how people act when they are controlled by corporations, which are in turn controlled by the love of money.

[napi21]

28. Actually that's not true of ALL companies. Yes they all are interested

in $$ as #1, butI hate to see you despise ALL companies as being like the one that just fired you. They're NOT! Yes I've worked for some thatreally didn't GAS about their employees at all, but the majority of the ones I've worked for were at least resonable. They didn't bend over backward for their people, but they didn't try to screw them either.

You do what you feel you have to do for YOU, but if it were me, I would hound that HR person daily, even hourly,until I got heron the damn phone, and I would ask for an explaination of what happened.

I was a managerand a director for many years, and there were a few people I had to fire. It would have been really easy to just shut off their account, or send them a written or emailed message "Don't come back tomorrow!" But I COULDN'T have done that! MY eithics dictate that I owed my employees an explaination for why I had to take the steps I did. I think your superiors took the chickenshit way out, and they deserve to have to face you and their decision.

Good luck to you. I hope you get a much better job, and have to opportunity to make sure your former employer regrets their actions.

[undeterred]

33. but why ask for an explanation from someone

who you know has never told you the truth? I talked to her for an hour a week ago friday, and for half an hour on wednesday and both of those conversations must have helped me out the door instead of helped make things better. People in HR do not want to know what is really going on, and if you tell them the truth- the way the truth looks to the people who are employed there- they obviously can't handle it. They promoted someone to management who shouldn't be in management. A lot of people think this, and its becoming fairly obvious. Maybe I was the first one to say it out loud.

This woman is someone I thought I could trust and she is the one who asked for my account to be turned off without saying a word to me, giving me a call, or sending me an email. She's been there for thirty years. I would have to have literally stabbed someone to deserve being treated like this.

This week I also talked to my managers manager because I wanted to tell him I was very concerned about my managers hostility towards me. The conversation lasted less than 4 minutes. Although he once said "my door is always open" it was obvious from his tone of voice that he sure didn't want to hear anything negative about how things were going with the new manager. I'm sure he thinks he's a really good manager and an ethical guy. I think he's a hypocrite and doesn't give a damn about anything about climbing the ladder.

And my supervisor- the guy I spent 40 hours a week with- the guy I went to lunch with a few times a week- the guy I actually thought was my friend and would at least give me a shoulder to cry on if it came to this.... he's the one who turned my account off and he won't return my phone calls at all.

[napi21]

61. My suggestion was for revenge purposes for YOU!

Of course if they lied before they'll most likely lie again! I know that and so do you. They don't want to have to talk to you because it's uncomfortable for them. THAT'S exactly why I said to call them! Remember, I said how they let you go was the chickenshit way of handling an uncomfortable situation. Every time I had to fire someone, I really think it was harder on me than it was on the employee.

I suspect someone much higher up than your manager or his boss & the HR lady either hired your new boss or recommended him, and the people you spoke to were playing CYA to save their own necks. I don't know what the deal is with your supervisor. It is possible he had no choice in terminating your access, and it's bothering him as much as it is you to have done so, and that's why he won't return your calls. he's feeling guilty but wasn' willing to risk his own job for you. BTW, that's no slam to him. You both would have lost.

I guess I'm just a vindictive sort, and I want to put the people that hurt YOU in an uncomfortable position, and having to talk to you would do that.

Please, don't feel you have to take my advice. You do what you feel is best for you.

[undeterred]

71. My bumpersticker says Defend America: Impeach Bush

and my company sells to the Department of Defense. Engines, not weapons. I was worried about the reaction to my bumpersticker but never got one- not out loud anyway. There is someone else at the company who bought a full page ad in a paper for Impeaching Bush.

Maybe somebody doesn't like the bumpersticker.

[michreject]

86. I'd say you did

I was worried about the reaction to my bumpersticker but never got one

I bet the two are related. Bumpersticker/dismissal.

[sweetheart]

36. That's happened to me before

People turn political vendettas in to vicious shakespearean sacking plots.

Getting fired shows you who your real friends are though, and if there are
none, then fuck them.

I'm sure the gods have given you a veiled gift.

Sorry about the assholes, the world's full of them sucking up to the boss,
selling off their souls for a bigger cubicle and a new computer, its pathetic
what the viscious rats will do, but then hardly unpredictable.

[Divernan]

37. Yes, unfortunately, you do have to see them again & show up for work on Monday.

I'm surprised they didn't handle this by giving you your notice late Friday afternoon and having security escort you from the building. NOT that anyone should be treated like that, but that is the usual drill.

You've gotten some erroneous advice and uninformed opinions from some of the posters here.

You are still employed until you receive written notice - you should be given an exit interview reviewing your records to determine what if any sick and leave time you are entitled to be compensated for. Human resources should explain to you about how to continue your health insurance using COBRA, to insure no break in coverage. Your employer may offer help with outplacement, job counseling, etc. The exit interview will cover all this material, and you would be only hurting yourself if you refuse to go to work Monday. In fact, speaking as a lawyer, I'm telling you that if you just don't show up, that could be interpreted as constructive & voluntary quitting, and then you can't get unemployment insurance, COBRA, etc.

Someone commented that unemployment insurance was not very much - that depends on your definition of "very much". In Connecticut it was $438 a WEEK, as of last October. This can vary from state to state. That's close to $2,000 a month, or $11,388.00 for 26 weeks. You want to sign up for this as soon as you are officially fired, cause it takes a few weeks to kick in.

Someone else said, "start calling lawyers". That's pointless until you are officially fired, and probably (if Wisconsin is at employment-at-will state) pointless in any case.

Good luck. I've been lied to and let down by employers also, as have many of my friends and relatives at one time or another. You feel like you've been sucker punched, gut shot, etc. Take the weekend to begin checking out employment information on the web, and to calm down. You may want to/need to use some of your fellow employees as references. Leave them with a good last impression by behaving in a calm, professional manner - even if you're seething inside. If I were you, I'd make it a point to say goodbye to people,and tell them it's been a pleasure to work with them. This approach will be seen as classy. If you're looking for employment in the same field, you never know when you'll run into some of them again - or they might be able to put in a word for you with people they know who are hiring.

[peacetalksforall]

52. I'm glad Divernan was reading - he/she gave good advice.

What kind of papers have you signed? Dig them out and read the small print - you need to be armed with some good principles before Monday.

I don't know how formal your company is, but if they are complying with federal and state rules, they need to do paper work. You need to know a lot more than just having your accounts shut off.

Is Erisa involved? 401k? Commissions? They will probably have to get your signature and date on something? Does anything you signed when your started say anything about unemployment compensation (specifically any exemptions)? You need to know when they are going to send your IRS documents?

HR people do lie. You should face them again. Don't run. Keep notes - write it all down, in front of them.

If the company is big enough to have an HR dept - they've got to let you go much more formally.

Don't run. Ask them the reason they are going to enter in your employment record. Ask them if they are going to supply a recommendation?

You should know whether there are restrictions on communication with your accounts? Might one or more of them call you? Do you want to stay in contact with any of them for networking? What are the rules. They need to tell you. Is speech free or not?

We don't know enough about your business - but don't share details on this forum with all the trolls and instigators.

[Hekate]

85. EXCELLENT ADVICE, Divernan. I hope some of the posters are paying attention to you, esp. the OP.

You are generous with your information.

The only thing I would add is that on occasion a labor lawyer may actually be a good idea. My daughter just got a settlement (not huge, but helpful nonetheless) for wrongful termination -- BUT she had already made up her mind to change careers, figuring that in this relatively small region word would have gotten around about her troubles.

While pursuing her settlement, my daughter emphatically got on with her life by training to do something else.

My son worked for the same unpleasant woman. He was terminated first, after he complained of her sexual harassment of him. He also got a settlement, also small -- his lawyer said that if this were taking place in a large city she would have advised him to keep on with the suit because a jury there would award him a sizable sum, but as it was he would be smarter to be satisfied with making his point.

He was more sucker punched than his sister because of the way sexual harassment is a mind game/power trip. It really shook him up. My daughter had plenty of warning just watching what happened to him -- but they couldn't get rid of her right away because she was pregnant, and she couldn't quit right away for the same reason.

It was his lawyer who told him to get on with his life and not wait around for legal resolution. I've never even met the woman and I respect her enormously for that. He took her advice, got psych counseling, finished up certificates in his field at the local college, got a new job, earned promotions...it's been a busy 3 years.

As for their former boss who caused all this past grief -- as far as I know she is still working for the same outfit. Why she hasn't been forced out no one knows.

Hekate

[dflprincess]

26. Also ask for a copy of your personel file

you have a right to it. I got a copy of mine after I was laid off two years ago - though several of my reviews were missing from it. I kept arguing with HR about that, but gave up when I found a new job.

On the bright side, no matter what it says in your file, about the only questions most employers will respond to now is just your dates of employment, salary level and job title.

Good luck, I hope you find something soon I know what an awful feeling this is.

[undeterred]

34. Why would I give a crap?

I never even had a review. The whole reason this happened is because I heard that my manager was soliciting resumes for my position 3 weeks before he even gave me a review. I would no more care what was in my personnel file than I would want to hear what kind of trash they were talking about me behind my back behind closed doors when they justified this decision to themselves.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

7. I'm so sorry; I live in an at-will state and was terminated without warning.

Still looking for a job after two months.

See if you can collect unemployment perhaps?

http://blog.laborlawtalk.com/2006/11/26/wisconsin-wrongful-termination-laws/

<snip>

Wisconsin Wrongful Termination Laws

If you believe you have been the victim of wrongful termination in Wisconsin, it is worthwhile to investigate the laws in your state. Wisconsin is an employment “at will” state, which means that employees can be fired at any time, for almost any reason. Your employer does not actually have to give you a reason why he decided to terminate you. Also, your employer is not required by law to give you notice if they intend to fire you, lay you off, or they do not have to pay you any kind of severance pay.

There are still a few things that fall under the category of wrongful termination. You cannot be fired on the basis of your race, gender, religion, pregnancy, physical disability, or age (assuming you are of legal working age for the job you are doing). You cannot be terminated in Wisconsin for refusing to break the law, your political opinions, for filing a claim against your employer, or for any reason covered by the Family Medical Leave Act, like maternity leave. Your boss must allow you to serve on a jury, if summoned, and must keep your job for you if you are called up for military service.

Filing a wrongful termination claim and winning your case is not easy, since the laws do not require any reason for termination. The Wisconsin state Department of Labor office can help you if you want to file a claim, and you may find it worthwhile to find a regional branch of the federal Department of Labor as well. Unless your employer has committed an obvious violation of the guidelines listed earlier, then you should hire a lawyer to help you fight for your rights. If you feel are being discriminated against in the workplace, then you should keep a journal of every incident that occurs; that way, if you are terminated, you can prove a record of discrimination in the workplace.

<snip>

[ConservativeDemocrat]

11. Well, still go in to work

You need to make sure everything is official so you can start collecting unemployment. The checks are small, but they're something.

And get over the feeling of being stabbed in the back. Obviously you smelled something like this was coming, which means that the place wasn't the best situation for you. Their unprofessional conduct only seals it for me.

I've been there. No matter how much people tell you it's them, not you, being laid off hurts. But you can't let it get to you. You need to stop worrying about this job, and focus on the next one. The better one. That means getting your resume together, and forgetting the past.

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

[wicket]

14. Excellent advice

:thumbsup:

[undeterred]

18. I don't feel like driving 53 miles to be humiliated

They set this up in an unfortunate way, but hell if I am going back down there.

[Breeze54]

22. You should do it anyway. Wait until Monday morning.

In the meantime? Get a buzz and relax and then start sending resume's asap!

Sorry this happened to you.

IT workers need a UNION!!!!!!!!!!

[TahitiNut]

27. Report for work anyway. Since they didn't NOTIFY you that you're fired, they'll OWE ...

... you pay for the day you show up, even if you're then told you're fired and sent home. Usually, salaried employees are NOT paid by the hour but by the pay period in which they do any work at all - and that includes showing up for work. In some states, even an hourly employee must be paid for a minimu of four hours on any regularly scheduled day they report for work unless previously notified they're fired. If they resist, that's a separate claim with the state's labor department - and those usually get pursued, with penalties for delayed payment.

[SoCalDem]

40. AND, if you just assume they fired you, and don;t go in, they could say they fired you because

you didn;t show up for work. They sound like a bunch of rat-bastards, but I would spend the gas money, and make them face me when they told me..and then go to unemployment

Not showing up for work "could" disqualify you from collecting..

[undeterred]

51. I'm pretty sure this is a no-win situation

When I have tried to talk to the most reasonable people I've been lied to.

The only person I trusted won't return my calls because he doesn't want to be in the middle of it.

I asked HR for help on Friday, 5 days later I had heard nothing. On Wednesday I was told they were working on my job description and planning a review. On Friday my accounts are turned off.

I really can't win no matter what I do; all I can do is walk away.

[Renew Deal]

62. If you don't show up without calling, they might say you quit

Or worse. Just suck it up and show up. Maybe it's a technical error.

[undeterred]

73. Well, maybe I could call in sick.

Then they can't fire me and I don't have to drive down there and I still get paid. I had surgery yesterday and I feel kinda lousy.

[Guaranteed]

78. That's a good idea. Just call in sick day after day and keep

collecting your checks until one of them has the courage to call you and tell you what is going on.

[WorldResident]

20. Very true

Though maybe one night of drinking may help in the process of dealing with the emotional hurt.

:)

[undeterred]

35. I don't drink. Alcohol is a depressant.

[TahitiNut]

42. EXCELLENT judgment. (IMHO, of course.)

Over 16 years since I stopped drinking and not one day of regret - and no bouts of depression, either.

[WorldResident]

80. Sorry, I meant that comment in a half joking spirit

n/t

[Warpy]

30. I second that

you need to be terminated in writing so that you've got something to show the unemployment office. Show up and don't leave until you get it.

Do get a copy of your file if you've had good performance reviews. It can make the difference between collecting and not collecting, between being hired somewhere else and having a prospective employer believe the lies your new broom boss would tell about you.

[JNelson6563]

89. That's right, make it official

Make them fire you and then go right on down the unemployment office. Not showing up on Monday might give them opportunity to claim you were let go because you quit showing up for work.

Besides, you know the score, right? There cannot be any unpleasant surprises for you now. Why make it easy on 'em? Make them tell you you're fired. Don't let them avoid the uncomfortable experience. And when you do sit down with them, don't rail or rant, no. Ask a question or two and then provide nothing else but uncomfortable silence.

Julie

[Dogmudgeon]

13. Here's the drill:

1. Get drunk, have crying spells, or go out and get laid this weekend. Or do all three.

Paraphrasing Marx, "to each according to his (or her) vices".

2. If necessary, sober up by Monday morning.

3. At 9:15 AM Monday, start calling lawyers.

4. Plan your strategy from there. A multi-week vacation may be a good thing, or you may want to hit the street while you're hot.

5. If anyone from your workplace calls, be polite, but offer nothing until you have determined your strategy. Unless they want you back, of course. In which case, if you do go back, wait a month and ask for a big old honkin' raise and/or a chunk of your manager's cold, lifeless corpse.

There is always something that can be done. Maybe not with as much power as you would like, but no one is helpless in these situations.

And remember, no matter how badly you fucked up or you think you fucked up, admit NO culpability. Save any apologies, if they are due, for after THEIR apologies to you.

Addendum(b)

I missed a number of excellent points that other DUer have made, so be sure to add them to your list of things to do.

Good luck!

--p!

[lumberjack_jeff]

16. When they did that to me, they offered to allow me to get my files...

... but they didn't really have to.

Take the king's coin, you play the kings tune.

My solution is to stop accepting the kings coin. One thing's certain in self-employment, I'll be the last one terminated.

[Horse with no Name]

21. I'm sorry

I hope you find something else soon.:hug:

[deadmessengers]

23. If they've not spoken to you yet...

...then you're not terminated. Just shutting off your access doesn't mean you've been terminated. In most states, you're on the payroll right up until you get written notice of termination. If you're a salaried employee and not an hourly wage earner, that can be significant in terms of your last paycheck.

With that having been said, I've been on the other side of this. In my old job as an information security administrator, I've been asked on more than one occasion to quietly turn off the access of people who are either under investigation or about to be terminated for cause. It makes sense - someone who suspects that they're under investigation might be tempted to "cover their tracks", and someone who sees the handwriting on the wall might leave a "going away present" on their former employer's network. This even applies more to people who may have had elevated privileges to crucial systems - you mention that you're in IT, so you almost certainly fall into this category.

Letting someone find out about their termination that way is just sloppy and downright inhumane, and I'm sorry you had to find out that way. But, turning off your access as soon as the decision was made to terminate you is just sound security and risk-management policy.

[bbgrunt]

25. they treat people like this so that they don't have any

chance to extract revenge or mess with the internal workings of the place. Of course, if they treated people like humans to begin with they wouldn't have to be so fearful of retaliation. I am not defending the practice, only saying that you don't have to take it personnally since this kind of abrupt guillotining is standard operating practice in many places.

[undeterred]

39. Yup, thats how people in IT are treated

and I've been afraid of it for weeks. The funny thing is, if they're worried about my skills not being good enough, then why do they think I'm good enough to hack in and mess things up?

[dapper]

29. Not sure what you can do....

I faced a similar situation a few years ago.
I was climbing the corporate ladder, the director of the department left and the company hired a new director who had no IT Experience!!!!
Shortly after he started, I climbed up again as Managment Supervisor. I was even given stock options! A Company Credit Card! A company phone and pager!

I always received awesome reviews and had just received another glowing review and then I was asked to "step down" to a menial position... however, I would be a "Super IT Guy"... that was his words exactly. He wanted me to tell all my employees that I decided to do this on my own because I just bought a house, got married and was expecting a son... and I was like "I'm not lying to anyone" He even called me "inept"?!?

I immediately reported him to HR but half the HR staff was from the company he previously worked for.

Coincidentally, my boss who was right under him had gotten fired or resigned about a month before this whole thing transpired, he also reported his interactions with him to HR. Nothing that i know ever happened to this guy.

As the story goes... my company Outsourced our department to another company who ended up outsourcing to India!!!

Looking back, I should have sued the company for descrimination.

Dapper

[undeterred]

88. Well, this is an IT thing too

Our manager left in October. My supervisor, who is a great guy and very knowledgable, would have made an excellent manager for the department but he didn't apply because he can't stand the politics. That made it a shoe-in for Oracle guy, who knows everything about Oracle, but absolutely nothing about anything else and is a total jerk besides. His judgments on anything outside of his specialty are frightening...and I'm sure time will reveal this. The two parts of IT are in different buildings and I really don't see why they couldn't have two managers- it would have made a lot more sense and been better for everyone, and the problems I had would never have happened. They could have made one higher than the other on the org chart but practically divided the two.

But then someone's resume would have said "managed 3 people" instead of "managed 6 people". So, in the end it all comes down to some manager's ego and somebody's career and not the good of the company or the employees.

I am pretty sure my supervisor will be totally fed up at the idea of having to train another person for my position- there have been 5 in 4 years- all let go- and get out of there himself.

[La_Fourmi_Rouge]

31. This is TYPICAL in IT or any computer-related industry.

You are a pygmy replaceable part and not a human being. You are a ledger entry. You only had the illusion that you were somehow valued as a person or even a valuable contributing member of the team. You are nothing. You ain't sh*t. We owe you nothing: not respect or consideration or pity or any remotely tender expression of human feeling. You are a bug. You have been squashed. Get used to it.

[sweetheart]

79. its typical of slavery

...a boot stepping down on the human face, forever.

[eyesroll]

32. Standard "I am not a lawyer yet and this is not legal advice" disclaimer applies, but:

1. I know this is a longshot, but do verify there wasn't some sort of fuckup -- did someone flip the wrong switch?
2. WI is an at-will state: Absent a union agreement or an individual contract stating otherwise, they can fire you for any reason, or no reason, so long as you're not getting fired because you're female/a certain color/a certain age/etc. (Marital/family status, sexual orientation and even use of legal products outside of work hours are all protected in WI, too.)
3. As far as I know, there's no rule guiding how a person can and can't be fired (aside from mass layoffs). While it's shitty of them to shut off your access, it's probably not illegal.
4. That said, you may have some within-your-company recourse if your supervisor or someone else violated your company's policy -- check with HR on Monday, regardless. Also, keep in mind an employment handbook *may* actually create a binding agreement, so if your handbook spells out a termination policy and your company violated that, you may have grounds for a wrongful termination case.
5. In any case, file for unemployment.

I'll be working in a labor/employment firm this summer, so I might have a bit more insight then (I'll still be a student, though, so I can't give legal advice), but I hope for your sake it's resolved by then.

Sorry this happens. It sucks either way.

[undeterred]

38. Well I found a sticky note on my supervisors desk

with my name on it about 3pm which had me real worried- so I don't think it was an accident. And he would be the one to do it and he won't return my phone calls so its no mistake.

The HR lady sat there and told me that they never fired anyone without cause and due process blah blah lie blah lie blah on Wednesday in answer to my concern that my new manager is trigger happy. She was reassuring me that they had him under control- and she is the one who called my supervisor to turn my account off. So she flat out lied to me. I have sat through a full hour and a half of her lying now, and she is the person I considered most trustworthy in that department- an older woman who has been there for 30 years. After this, I truly feel there is nobody worth having a conversation with.

I am typing on their laptop.

They can send me whatever they want in the mail. Hell if I am driving to Beloit bad weather even one more time to see these lying assholes. They can kiss my butt.

Its my managers birthday tomorrow- I guess this was his present.

[WiseButAngrySara]

41. How can people get away with lying like that? It makes one

paranoid. I presume it was only the liar and you. Your word against hers, right? Does this mean that in the future you should carry a tape recorder to record all conversations so as to prove others' lies? I worked for an ME's office once where people did exactly that to protect themselves from the ME's lies. We're talking about professional people- pathologists, MD's and the M.E. It was a revolting environment to be in.

[Divernan]

43. You can afford your "kiss-my-butt" attitude if you're independently wealthy.

Otherwise you have until Monday morning to get your temper under control and report for work/exit interview. If you spoke like this in complaining about your new supervisor to his/her boss, it would explain why they were worried as to what you'd do if they gave you notice BEFORE closing your account. As you can tell from many people who took the time to respond to you - nearly everyone goes through this at some time. Time to suck it up, maximize your unemployment/COBRA benefits, act like a grown-up, and move on.

By the way, you keep ranting about the woman in personnel who's been there 30 years and whom you hold responsible for closing your account. SHE didn't decide to fire you - that was your boss, and probably with the approval of his boss. She does what she's told and follows company policy - that's how she lasted 30 years.

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LoZoccolo]

48. You know what? I gave you advice about why you should calm down...

...but if this is how you treat people, or how you treated this manager when you were co-workers, there might be a lesson to learn somewhere in here.

[LoZoccolo]

47. I would really assume nothing that you can't absolutely prove.

Right now you cannot absolutely prove you were fired, or that any of those people you say turned off your account were responsible for it. There is no reason for you to assume anything else. It will not help you get anything that you want to make those assumptions. There is no reward for speculation at this point; it will buy you nothing.

[Paulie]

60. HR's job is not to help YOU, but protect the COMPANY

Always remember that.

I'm in IT, was outsourced, and lots of jobs are being "leveraged" and moved to Mexico and India... I'm always looking for a new job before they decide I make too much and whack me. I don't trust my employer to look at things from MY perspective, like supporting my family.

BUT, I also agree, you should go into the office on monday. If you have been terminated, you need that in writing. Just smile, don't let them see the pain, that will drive them BAT SHIT CRAZY!!! Collect the termination notice, and get unemployment as soon as possible. Then look for something closer to home. I have a 72 mile round trip commute in Chicagoland traffic, I understand it's a PITA.

IT isn't like it was in the 1990's. Been doing this for 19 years, it's depressing.

BUT, You'll make it.

[Straight Shooter]

44. Take a lot of deep breaths and concentrate on 5 years down the road.

You can have a fit of temper in privacy, and that's all well and fine, but do go back to work on Monday, 53 miles or not. Do your best to keep any negative attitude in check. Act. Don't react. Do get your personnel file. Trust me, it's vital. Don't be dismissive of that suggestion. You don't give a crap now. You will later, if they tamper with it.

5 years from now, what they've done to you will be over with. Your anger will probably be gone. But the consequences of what you do and don't do during the next critical few days may very well define your immediate future and your long-term future.

You have a right to be angry. But please don't let the anger hurt your future. Don't let them take anything else away from you any more than they already have.

I got accused of padding an expense account, which is the sort of accusation that makes a person like me want to go straight through the roof with anger and outrage. But I resigned before they could fire me, because I knew I would never fit in with a corporation that played that kind of a dirty trick. Sometimes there's just nothing you can do about nasty people except to be better than they are.

Keep thinking, "5 years from now, how do I want to look back on how I handled this situation?"

Good luck.

[undeterred]

46. Companies never reveal personnel files.

I haven't been invited to any work/exit interview. They had all day today to invite me and they have my work, cell, and home phone numbers as well as my work and home locations. I have absolutely no reason to think I would be allowed on company property.

[Straight Shooter]

49. Companies most certainly do reveal personnel files.

If you are ever involved in any sort of employment litigation in your future, your personnel file will be subpoenaed. Trust me, this is fact. You also don't know what sorts of new laws will be passed in the future in which your personnel file becomes part of a database.

That's why I'm saying, be forward thinking, at least 5 years.

I don't know why you wouldn't be allowed on their property. Don't you have a desk to clear out, maybe some personal effects? If they don't allow you on their property, though, go gracefully. Follow up with a letter and request a copy of your personnel file, and an official reason for being fired. Take charge of the situation, as best you can.

By the way, get your employees handbook or manual. It will tell you if you are entitled to an exit interview. If you do have an interview, make notes of exact quotes, read it back to the person conducting the interview and ask them if that's what they said. Let them know they're dealing with someone who is in control of his own situation. If they ask why you're doing this, just tell them you want to keep an accurate record, in case it ever comes up in the future for any reason. Politely, of course. :)

[undeterred]

53. I've actually been taking stuff home for the last few weeks

in anticipation that this would happen. All I have left are 3 hardcover books and my heart would not break if I never saw them again.

I do mostly contract work, this job was an exception. Frankly, I'm wondering if I wasn't better off as a contractor, where its easy to stay out of company politics.

A year from now I doubt this company will even have its doors open. I will have a new job much sooner than that.

I don't ever want to see this place or these people again.

[Straight Shooter]

64. Well, if it makes you feel better, in my own situation ...

... the company that forged my expense records is out of business now, and I have been self-employed ever since I left them. I think that was about 20 years ago.

I covered my a** before I left, though. Please be advised to do the same. That's all I can tell you.

You already are beginning to sound like you're feeling better about the situation, at least in how you're expressing yourself. Remember that living well is the best revenge. :)

[MissB]

55. Excellent advice

and I hope the OP takes it.

[michreject]

87. I got this off of your other thread

I just sent him a blank email with the subject line

Coward.

If you weren't fired before, I would say you are now.

[Ms. Toad]

90. Unless you want them to have reason to disallow unemployment

You need to show up on Monday - even if just to establish that they terminated, you rather you just stopped showing up.

If you just don't show up on Monday, they will most likely take the position that you still had a job on Monday and that you were terminated sometime thereafter for cause. Although they do not need cause to terminate you under Wisconsin law (it is an at will employment state), they do need cause to deny your unemployment compensation.

Unemployment may not be great "wages" but it is a nice gap filler if nothing else is coming in. I'm sorry this happened to you, and I can understand not wanting to see these folks again (our family has been through it three times). But as tough as it will be to show up on Monday you ought to consider doing it out of self preservation.

[XOKCowboy]

57. I'd sit home and sulk...

Oops it looks like that's what you've already decided to do.

You asked for suggestions in your OP. Many, many very concerned people offered you some very important suggestions. I hope for your sake that you wake up tomorrow with a little more open mind and reread those suggestions.

Good luck and I hope you make it through this.

[spacelady]

54. Horrible situation, through no fault of your own, your job was

apparently "eliminated". That happened to my husband last week - an environmental/health/safety engineer at a refinery - on his final month of chemotherapy for colon cancer.....business decisions you know. Two other people were let go at the same time, so ADA discrimination is kinda weakened. Just par for the course. I feel your pain and pain for all who are cut adrift in this bizarro world.

[undeterred]

59. Same manager, another story

A woman came in as a contract to hire through the same agency I did- I was hired. She was promised to be hired if she did a good job and was only given positive feedback for 14 months. After 14 months instead of hiring her, the job was posted on the internet, and she never even got an interview for it. She applied for it, asked for it, and never even got an explanation. Finally her contracted was ended and she went elsewhere. The position has still not been filled, and a really good person who wanted the job and tried for it for 14 months is out of a job. Does this make any sense?

In my case, the only thing I heard from the manager was his concern that I use too many "sticky notes". Give me a break. He had nothing of substance to say because he has no idea what my job is.

Sticky notes are expensive, I guess.

[spacelady]

68. Sounds like that lady did her work well, but the company was not

interested in competence and loyalty, just a body to do the job for less compensation. Our parents had jobs that lasted for an entire career if they wanted to stick it out and do a good job - those opportunities seem to have dissolved in this modern day. A job that lasts more than 5 years - anybody got one? I'd like to hear from you!

[roamer65]

72. I've been with the same company for almost 12 years.

Before that, I was with that employer for 5 years.

[spacelady]

75. That is great to hear, you must like what you do.

[patrice]

56. Ever since the first big waves of lay-offs after the dotcom bubble burst

that's the way it's been done. It's happened to me and my husband.

Employers don't trust anyone anymore; they're afraid you will find out you're losing your job and you'll engage in some cyber revenge.

I know it feels pretty bad. I LOVED my last job. . . . Took me more than a month to put myself back together.

Here's a :hug:

[Pavulon]

58. As others have said

terminations always involve notification. Someone has to notify you of your status.

Now you could be terminated when you go to work. However it would be worth the trip in is there is a chance your vpn account expired or to discuss placement or severance policy.

If you were terminated that is a pretty piss poor way to do it. Generally involves a meeting where you go in and when you come out your access is revoked.

My best wishes in your job hunt.

[AZBlue]

65. I'm so sorry.

I hope you find something soon that makes more money, is more interesting and gives you better co-workers and superiors.

[The Straight Story]

66. What kind of IT you into? do you do any coding? might have some remote work

possible if you are interested (not from me, but I am dealing with three companies now and I can't take on anymore work).

[roamer65]

67. Go into work and make them fire you

Be calm and cool. Make them have to do the dirty deed in person. Also, it is important to get your personnel file. To fire you they do have to document the reasons in your personnel file, and they will have had to document where they discussed corrective action with you. Otherwise they could be open to a lawsuit. I would bet if you go in, they'll lay you off rather than fire you if they want you gone. Lay off = unemployment benefits.

At will employment means they can lay you off anytime they want, but it does not mean they can fire without documented, justifyable reasons.

[spacelady]

69. I totally agree - no matter how distasteful DO go in to work

as if you belong there, because status of termination is crucial to unemployment benefits. You are mad & hurt, but don't let them get away with saying you were fired instead of laid off - BIG DIFFERENCE.

[LeftyMom]

74. I agree. Definitely go in

If you don't they're going to say the problem with your access was a glitch and you did a voluntary quit when you no call/no showed, so they can deny your unemployment.

Also, if you play dumb somebody who doesn't want to has to do things the hard way. Never, ever resist a chance to make somebody who deserves it squirm.

[Trajan]

70. What if they DIDNT 'turn off' your account, and they were turned off by mistake ?

Just a thought ....

Nevertheless; most states have that awful, catchall: 'At Will Employment' thingy ... and it sucks ....

It has given nearly carte blanche to companies to do whatever they feel like whenever they feel like it ....

I hope you get something out of this ....

[monmouth]

76. Report to work on Monday, if you want or hope to collect unemployment

they will say you "abandoned your position." I worked for an outfit that helps companies do this kind of crap and not have to pay unemployment benefits. You could always say, and you really don't know, if you've had computer problems, for some reason or other your computer "locked." Don't abandon the job, it will give them ammunition. I'm very sorry....

[mb7588a]

77. call your state senator or rep. nt.

[orleans]

81. i also say go in monday and let them be up front with you and

tell you to go.

and just remember the guy who recently collected $12 million from home depot (i think) to assure he wouldn't return to work for their store.

[LaPera]

83. When they say come back your credit score is 390....

don't think I'll be buying that microwave today...and my food is fucking cold...Where the fuck is my JD Kathy?

[Obamarama]

91. Whatever you do, you should report back to work Monday, and here's why:

I don't know HR law, but I do know they HAVE to TELL you you're terminated. They HAVE to offer you COBRA. There's probably a small list of other things they HAVE to do.

If you just assume you were canned and don't go back in,they could say you abandoned your job, which could affect unemployment benefits. Make them tell you to your face.