Has anyone heard of a government agency called "CITIGROUP"?

[babylonsister]

No, neither have I. So color me astounded when I got my slip back from the P.O., having sent two passports 'certified' to Philadelphia, PA, to get more pages added.
OK, perhaps they inhabit the office next door and did the right thing by picking up the mail. BUT! This agency is called, "National Passport Processing". Important personal documents from all over the country are sent there.
Why is CITIGROUP signing for them? :tinfoilhat:

[crim son]

1. I think it's because

our country is totally fucked. But I might be wrong.

[Jack Sprat]

2. Hey, you may find Halliburton processing

your tax returns soon. I think they have been collecting for the IRS since 03.

[alittlelark]

4. WHY do you say that?

info........

[babylonsister]

7. Because their fingers are in way too many pots:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x328133

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x328266

[alittlelark]

18. Creepy

I'm gonna go to bed now.. and ignore your post.



Better sleep that way...

[alittlelark]

3. I freaked out when my renewed passport was done by Citigroup.

I tried to explain to hubby why I was so freaked out. He didn't 'get it'. I just wanna know how to get rid of the chip. It is obvious that it is there... you can feel it!


I should have renewed last year.:grr:

[lvx35]

8. Its okay...

there's a "tinfoil hat" inside:
http://rfidkills.com/

edit: :sarcasm:

[alittlelark]

11. The ? is HOW to kill the chip....

I have a set of industrial magnets in the garage. Is that a better choice than the microwave?

[sweetheart]

41. a hammer and a flat-headed punch

'crush' the chip with a light hammer tap. Don't use a microwave, as it will
burn and discolour the passport.

[babylonsister]

9. So CITIGROUP is now doing passports! That's what I wanted to know. Next

question is why? :grr:

[alittlelark]

12. Privitization and banks cure all ills.....

PS. http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279

[madeline_con]

15. If you get rid of the chip, won't that be like taking the strip out

of your paper money, rendering it bogus?

[alittlelark]

24. Why would it become 'bogus'?

It has been issued by the Federal Reserve.

[crikkett]

44. it would fail the "is the strip of paper there" test and merchants

wouldn't take it. that's my guess.

[crikkett]

43. can you nuke it?

2 secs in the microwave might do the trick.
on edit: of course then you might not be allowed to leave the country.

[GainesT1958]

5. Next thing you know...

We'll start getting offers in the mail--in State Department official envelopes--offering us that new State Department Citi Visa with that enticing first-year 12% rate and no fees!:eyes:

B-)

[alittlelark]

21. There are already quite a few ...

The envelopes look 'official'. Most go into the fireplace unopened, but the ones we have opened all seem OFFICIAL, they know specifics -

Fannie Mae etc.. We have no debt aside from a few thousand on a 1.5 mil house. 2/3 of our mail wants us to borrow $$$$$.

See http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279

[The Straight Story]

6. Simply put - the technology

I work for a bank myself, and we are far ahead of the government on processing some things (we move faster as we don't have all the red tape).

CitiGroup may well be an example of this on processing passports. And it may be cheaper for them to do it via an outside source that bounces off of an inside source (ie - the govt ok's the passport and citi processes it).

A marriage of corporations for some things and govt for others isn't always bad, and can enhance some things.

[babylonsister]

10. Thanks for your explanation, but can you imagine why it's questionable? nt

[The Straight Story]

16. yes, I can imagine :)

keep in mind though that private companies/public corps can often move many times faster than government can when making changes.

Hell, the FBI and other such government groups cannot even get computers straight. Private sector companies have to be able to do such things and do them quickly.

I was involved in the largest ever migration of computer systems in the banking industry, from servers to mainframes, and we did it very well - though there were some hitches (mainly tracking old data). The CEO made some decisions, got people on board to make them happen, and we kicked it out. The biggest red tape we had were federal regulations.

Our government does some things very well, not so with other things. A good government management group pulls those good things together for the best solution for it's customers (us).

They are still messing around with air traffic control systems....and those things are pretty out of date.

does it worry me at all? Yeah - anytime a big corporation (like the one I work for) is doing work for the feds one should at the very least be concerned. But that does not mean it was all bad or a poor decision.

[babylonsister]

20. I used to work for the gummint so know what you speak of.

While appreciating the poor quality regarding the way the government got/gets things done, it does worry me, too. I don't know the answer, but what are we sacrificing by outsourcing certain government jobs? And especially now, who's benefitting by our doing so?

[Jack Sprat]

45. Those responsible for destroying democracy, for one.

A private company (Diebold, for instance) provides election equipment for public polls. They can manipulate the data to result in large under-counts in voting, even giving a candidate minus votes. The 13th congressional district of Florida is a prime example, where there are some 18,000 missing votes. All attempts to examine the technological voting devices or appeals for recount have so far been unsuccessful. This is one glaring example of allowing the private sector to administer government's duties. Democrat Christine Jennings lost to Republican Vern Buchanan by 326 votes. It is mysterious how the Democrats are always on the losing end of these voting irregularities, don't you think?

[Leopolds Ghost]

36. Straight Story, I have relatives in civil service... what you need to keep in mind is

The entire civil service is being disbanded and privatized. Many of the privatized contractors, who are employees of major US corporations, work in the same federal office buildings that once housed civil servants.

The reason has nothing to do with efficiency. It is threefold:

1. Corporate contractors with political ties (they all do) make a profit, i.e. skim off the top and make shitloads of money using their political connections to take home money that would otherwise go to public services or wages for civil servants. This is labeled "efficiency" because it creates "value for the private sector" even though services suffer and no money is saved.

2. It allows the federal government to break the back of the federal employee unions, and with it, the end of the union movement in the US. This is ongoing during the Clinton (pro-NAFTA, anti-union) administration, as well.

3. The amount of Keynesian spending to goose the economy can double or triple under a right-wing (neocon or neoliberal DLC type) regime, while services continue to decline and those neoliberal leaders will be lauded for actually trimming the fat because all the money is taken off the books and put into the hands of contractors. Bush, Clinton, Bush can be credited for vastly reducing the size of the "federal bureaucracy" by creating a many-headed monster in the DC suburbs that derives all its money from the federal government, spends about half of it on services the feds once provided, and is answerable to no one.

[The Straight Story]

39. I agree with you to a degree

There is a blatant attempt to break the unions, and I don't like it myself.

But I would also say let's look at how things get carried out: we want new roads, we get em - but often times it is the private companies (in the end) that wind up doing the work. The govt controls the money, they manage the budgets, and then farm that out. here in Ohio we see a lot of Kokosing people doing the work, managed by the people in government who hold the money.

Our government is not always in the business of doing the labor part of things, it excels in the management of the funds and the regulations surrounding it.

This is why so many defense contracts go to private corporations - they build a better fighter/bomb/etc - but the govt handles who gets the money, how the project is managed, etc.

it is a marriage of the two. And YES sometimes it is done poorly and should be handled inside the government. But not always.

It is a delicate balance, and how that is handled is something we need to examine.

I am on the side of the govt worker (hence my many posts from govexec.com) but I am also a realist and can see when it is best to have others do the work while civil servants oversee it (budget, project management, etc).

Once more - the military is a prime example. A marriage of corp and govt interests, overseen by the govt.

[alittlelark]

14. We PRIVITIZED OUR PASSPORTS !!!!!

I don't have words.

[The Straight Story]

17. Only part of them, and the industry is better suited to handle it

My company deals in petabytes on a daily basis, we have cutting edge technology, so in some ways it makes sense to leverage that instead of wasting tax payer dollars to buy something that already exist (ie, cheaper to rent some things than to buy them).

[alittlelark]

23. I have respected your posts in the past

BUT......PRIVITIZING our PASSPORTS!!!!!!


I mean, WTF!!!!



WHY do we even HAVE a Central Government?

[The Straight Story]

28. I believe it is only part of the passports that has been privatized

The security and authorization still goes through the government - and the banking industry is tightly regulated by the government. i am working on applications now for the bank - mainly because we have to have them in place due to federal regulations.

There is a lot of over site and if they are to 'outsource' something like this than the banking industry is the best way to go - the feds are all over us and we face huge fines for errors and mistakes.

I would say over half the jobs in my field in banking are directly due to federal regulations, so in a sense we are a branch of the government. Basically - management at the government level looks at who is best equipped to do the job, the most quickly, and then they manage those people/corporations.

Do I think it is the best way? No - I think the government should be more streamlined and work better so that they can handle quick change (ala 9/11 and patriot act). But the fact is the govt is slow to change, so when fast change is needed they look to outside companies to do the work (less red tape) and then manage the hell out of em.

I look to the coding I am working on now - it is driven by regulations and we have to have it done asap. I will have it working by this Monday, the production server will be in next week, and we will have changed how we do business in a 2 month time span.

So to me - it is not corporations simply getting govt business and partying over it, it is the govt using our company to achieve their vision and putting the onus on us to hire the right people, get the right equipment, and make it happen fast. And if we don't, we owe huge fines.

AGAIN - in principle I agree with you. But in real life the govt moves real slow on issues. Hell, my company is way ahead on things like equal rights for it's employees - unlike the govt military we don't do a don't ask/don't tell :) We celebrate diversity from transgenders to every other minority.

[alittlelark]

29. Again.... PRIVITIZATION OF PASSPORTS!!!!!!

Uh.... hello....



WHY do we have a 'Government' ???????????


WTF is the point if they do nothing for us aside from spewing $$$$$$$ to every XYZ Company that offers them a kickback in terms of donations?

[The Straight Story]

32. The government manages resources

citigroup is but one resource.

They are using them. Citigroup already has the people, the hardware (data centers, access points, etc), etc in place to serve the government. So they task them with it, regulate them, and get more bang for your buck.

they did not simply turn it ALL over to them. The govt controls them.

They toss X dollars into a bucket, tell em to make it work, then manage from a far.

Would I prefer they did it all internally? Yes!

But I can see, in this current day and age, why they don't.

Our govt is slow, behind the times, and cannot even integrate their own damn systems over a 5 year time line and millions of dollars.

[alittlelark]

34. I would prefer unionized State Dept. officials

to look over the info.

Random 'for profit' companies have NO room in my mind-set for SECURITY.

[IChing]

35. The government controls World Banks..........LOL

"So they task them with it, regulate them, and get more bang for your buck.

they did not simply turn it ALL over to them. The govt controls them




Man I smoking but not the shit your exhaling on this forum, wake up and smell who controls who.

I wished I lived back when Potter was my banker. ( get the wonderful life reference?)
that fantasy story is history if you think it is just US banks anymore....It is a world wide problem controlled no longer by nation states
they (the banks) are nation states.

[The Straight Story]

38. I am not disagreeing that there is a problem (and on a larger scale than you note)

but given the current govt folks in power I would say - yeah - the private industry is more efficient on some things.

As to who controls who - that is up for grabs in a lot of ways. We have a PAC within the bank that lobbies the govt on regulations, if we totally controlled them we would not need it. I have so many regulations to deal with daily that it makes my job hell at times. If the company I worked for controlled the govt I would not have to worry about any of that and we could cut our workforce dramatically.

The banks have HUGE influence, I know that and see it - but not so much that we have free reign on things.

[IChing]

40. Then they have won their war

in your mind .

The control of government by BIG business has won that propaganda war in your mind.

The original thread was about what my friend?

It was not about my dealings with my local retailer
but my national security to be privatized.....Get it?.....by Citibank, a Saudi company.


Go live in that world, but I will fight with my logic that we never have to live in yours.

[cap]

42. actually the government moves faster than some of the banks

especially in IT. My husband works for BONY on Wall Street. It takes them 3 years to get a customer cert environment. Believe me, there are times the government works faster than the private sector. They are so far behind the government in technology it aint funny. The government is a cheetah compared to BONY.

[IChing]

25. Bull shit..........my company can do it better and outsource it better than

Yours to make a profit for our investors.

and we only give $$$$$$ to this party or that party.

Privatize everything............and then sell out.

[alittlelark]

27. Ka - CHING

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$


Most of us 'get it'.

[The Straight Story]

30. Not saying it is always the best way - but it does have a place

We have restructured our company several times over the 5 years I have been there. Major tech refreshes, etc - and we are a leader in the tech field. We can, and have, done things better and more efficiently than the feds.

They are better at some things than we are. It is not an us against them, it is an us with them.

Where we draw the line is open to discussion. But I can assure you we can beat the government hands down on pace of change on some things. And part of the reason why is because the government controls us and forces us to.

How slow is the government to change? Well, take a look at gays in the military - or even at the military itself. Most the new weapons and developments are done by companies not owned by the government but regulated by them and used by them.

[lakeguy]

33. right, us with them...

i can't even count the times it's been me against them. and they just laugh and say f you, what are you gonna do about it.

no way in hell should a private company be placing tracking chips in passports. no way. the only people i want touchin that stuff is us, through the government.

[The Straight Story]

37. Us as in Bush and crew in power now? (nt)

[IChing]

13. Citibank is owned by Saudia Arabia

NEED WE SAY MORE and Citigroup?

Citigroup.

http://www.citigroup.com/citigroup/corporate/history/citibank.htm

http://www.defenddemocracy.org/research_topics/research_topics_show.htm?doc_id=241713&attrib_id=7575

[babylonsister]

19. It gets worse and worse. We be owned!

:cry:

[IChing]

22. If you look at the World Bank and why

Wolf was put there after his business in Iraq then it is

but there is hope
Major South American nations are putting their foot down on this debt
lie perpetuated by the Major Capitalist, the bankers.

Gee give me your money and i will charge you for keeping your money.
Any takers?

[babylonsister]

26. This is out there, but what would happen if China called their chits in,

now, wanted their debts by the US relieved? Up the proverbial creek w/o a paddle, or would that never happen? Seems like a surefire way to get our goat, though I readily admit I'm ignorant when it comes to this stuff, and it probably would never happen.

[IChing]

31. The political energies that rule this world can be economic or social

or they can combine for the common benefit for the society
with a righteous economic benefit for those that help find solutions
which is not predatory to the social advantage for all of mankind.

Otherwise there will be conflict.