A girl wonders: Is Crist my dad?

[DoYouEverWonder]

A 17-year-old girl wants to know if the governor is her biological father. Crist: No way.

January 25, 2007

The parents who adopted a girl 17 years ago have reached out to Gov. Charlie Crist about the possibility that he is their daughter's biological father.

Marshall and Cecilia Tucker of St. Petersburg acknowledge that they don't know for certain Crist is the father, and the governor says it's impossible.

But since a paternity dispute involving Crist came to light during the gubernatorial primary last fall, the family and their daughter have suspected Crist might be the father.

The Tuckers said they want nothing from the governor. But driven by a fear of getting snared in a political controversy beyond their control, the Tuckers made many discreet overtures to Crist.

http://www.sptimes.com/2007/01/25/Tampabay/A_girl_wonders__Is_Cr.shtml

A simple DNA test would settle the matter.

[Jeanette in FL]

1. What an interesting article

Crist's minions tried to put this to rest during the campaign. In a desperate attempt to discredit the woman in question, Ms. Townsend: (from the article)

In decrying Townsend's paternity allegation when it came to light last September, Crist's supporters cited, among other things, a 1989 police report that showed a doctor had required Townsend to undergo an involuntary psychiatric evaluation because she was suspected of taking a sleeping pill overdose.

Townsend acknowledged that she suffered from depression at the time, partly related to the divorce, but said that psychiatric tests showed she was not mentally ill.

This will interesting to follow and Crist could put an end to it immediately by taking the DNA test to prove that he is not the father as he claims. By not taking the DNA test will provide fuel for the controversy to continue momentum.

Can't they get his DNA from a cup he drinks from? Maybe I watch to many crime shows.

[DoYouEverWonder]

2. It does appear that Townsend is the mother

Crist needs to cough up some DNA and settle this matter.

[yellowcanine]

6. I disagree he should give his DNA without more evidence he is the father.

All we have now is the birth mother claiming he was the father. Does she have any other evidence?

[Midlodemocrat]

7. Doubtful that any evidence exists. Sex is usually private.

Her word should be good enough. If he isn't the father, he can put it to rest with a simple blood test. I would think if he weren't the father, he would want it over with as quickly as possible. His stalling speaks volumes to me.

[yellowcanine]

10. Her word should be good enough?? Why? Without a scintilla of collaborating evidence, no.

People have sex in private, yes. But people who have sex are usually seen together by someone before or after the deed. Or there may be some written evidence that the two knew each other. There are many possibilities. But just someone's word? No, that is not good enough. Were the two dating? Or were they seen talking at a bar and leaving together? Did Crist ever admit to having sex or even hanging out with the woman? There has got to be more than just someone's word. Women and men lie all the time about sex, for all kinds of reasons.

[Midlodemocrat]

12. Yes, they do. But how many married people do you know of

who had an affair and no one knew about it until their marriages blew apart? I can't tell you how shocked I have been at times upon hearing that Mr. A. and Mrs. B. left their respective spouses to be together.

I just don't think someone would make an accusation like that. It's not as though she is going to get child support or any other financial gain. If she were, she would have probably attempted to blackmail him rather than make it public.

[yellowcanine]

17. False paternity claims are made all the time. Yes people have keep affairs secret but people get

found out also. In fact, I would venture to say that getting found out is one of the strongest deterrents to having an affair that exists. To accept your premise that the claim is all that is necessary would expose men who are public figures to all kinds of paternity claims ginned up by their political ememies. I say again, remember Clinton's "black son"?? Should Clinton have had to cough up a DNA test to "disprove" that one? No.

[Midlodemocrat]

20. Yes, I know. But, usually the claimant has something to gain

like child support, etc.

And I have watched enough of those crazy "Are you the father" shows to know that you are correct about false claims.

This one strikes me as odd because the girl in question has been adopted, so there is no issue of child support or financial gain.

I could certainly be wrong, but it just strikes me that way.

[yellowcanine]

27. Or the mother could be covering up an embarrassing event.

For example, having sex with her estranged husband whom she was divorcing at the time. Or having sex with a married man whose name she doesn't wish to reveal. The record apparently shows that she was having emotional problems related to a divorce so it would not be unusual at all for a false claim of paternity to be made for a surprise pregnancy at such a time.

[pf99]

3. Next on Maury

Charlie Crist you are the father

[rocktivity]

4. Get the DNA test,Crist--the sooner the better

You, like Bill Cosby, could have disposed of this matter years ago!

:headbang:
rocknation

[yellowcanine]

5. I don't know that Crist should be pressured to give a DNA test. It opens up a huge can of worms if

public figures can be pressured into giving DNA tests based on very little evidence. Unless the birth mother of the child can come up with a little more concrete evidence that she and Crist were intimate at the time that the child was conceived or the child bears a very strong physical resemblence to Crist, this is a nonstarter. Remember Bill Clinton's black son? These allegations are too easily made and it is not appropriate for a man to have to cough up a DNA test every time just based on an allegation with no other evidence. If there are some other witnesses that yes, this guy was hanging out with the mother in 1988 - they were seen together, living together, whatever, then press for the DNA test. But otherwise, no, I don't blame Crist at all for refusing the test. I would also under the same circumstances.

[DoYouEverWonder]

15. Very little evidence?

Then maybe Crist shouldn't have signed those documents giving up his claim to the child to begin with?

If there was nothing to deny, why sign anything at all?

[mondo joe]

29. Why sign? To document the whole thing. A paper trail is a wonderful thing.

From the story:

When Townsend, who was going through a bitter divorce at the time, accused Crist of being the father, he steadfastly denied it. Yet he signed legal papers waiving parental rights, which helped pave the way for Townsend to place the child for adoption.

"Parenthood by myself is not possible as I never consummated the act necessary for parenthood," Crist stated in an affidavit signed in May 1989. The next month, Crist, then 32, signed paperwork consenting to the girl's adoption and stating, "I deny paternity of this child and claim no parental rights in relation to the child."

[yellowcanine]

34. Why not sign? If it facilitated the process. He had nothing to lose. His signing

a document on which he also denies being the father is hardly proof that he might be the father. What kind of twisted reasoning is that?

[DoYouEverWonder]

39. If he had nothing to do with the woman and her child

then he could have requested DNA testing back then in order to clear his name.

I had a friend back in the 80's who got into a situation where it was unclear who the father might be. Everyone got tested and lived sort of happily ever after.

[yellowcanine]

44. Again, what one could do or even should do, is not something they should necessarily

be legally required to do or even be pressured to do. There is a fundamental right of privacy here. It can only be given up voluntarily or if there is a compelling public interest in forcing someone to give it up. For example, if there is probable cause that Crist is the father, he can be ordered by a judge to submit to a test if the judge is convinced by the EVIDENCE that it is in the public interest to do so. If the woman really wanted to force the issue, she could still take it to a judge and take her chances. That is our system. Trial by newsmedia and blogosphere isn't.

[RB TexLa]

43. See post 41

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=35555&mesg_id=36859

[bluedog]

8. mother is a Nut Case September 4, 2006

...............The Crist campaign gave reporters copies of St. Petersburg police incident reports, showing Townsend was committed for involuntary psychiatric examination under the Baker Act in March 1989 and took an overdose of sleeping pills in 1993.

"That period in my life was so dark and so awful and I almost didn't make it through," Townsend said. "I was very depressed."

Court and Florida Bar records show she also has made various allegations of child abuse, rape, and domestic violence involving spouses, and child abuse allegations at one church where she worked. None of the allegations were substantiated.

Townsend, by several accounts, put her emotional troubles behind her and became a respected appellate attorney. She is active with the Christian Coalition and speaks to conservative groups about the U.S. Constitution. She is a Gallagher supporter.


http://www.sptimes.com/2006/09/04/State/Crist_confronts...

[soup]

13. Corrected link.

Bluedog, your link brings up the page to reply to your post instead of the article cited. If you are monitoring this thread, there's still time to edit. Here's the corrected link:

http://www.sptimes.com/2006/09/04/State/Crist_confronts_pater.shtml

on edit: thank you

[DoYouEverWonder]

14. That has nothing to do with whether or not she really had a child

which she did and the child was put up for adoption and Crist acknowledged has been with her around the time she got pregnant but denied that they ever had sex.

[yellowcanine]

24. Crist acknowledged he was with her at the time? Do you have any more details on that?

And did she have any other boyfriends at the same time? What about her ex-husband? Wasn't she going through a divorce? Has her ex-husband been ruled out as the father? The emotional problems are relevant because it could relate to whether she was likely to make a false paternity claim or not.

[DoYouEverWonder]

33. I'll have to dig around for the links

(I'm supposed to be getting some work done) but it was a big campaign issue over the years. There was speculation that Crist let this story get out, in order to dampen the allegations that he was gay.

[soup]

21. Find it interesting that the Crist campaign supplied the reports.

"The Crist campaign gave reporters copies of St. Petersburg police incident reports, showing Townsend was committed for involuntary psychiatric examination under the Baker Act in March 1989 and took an overdose of sleeping pills in 1993."

an attempt to discredit the mother?

[yellowcanine]

30. Of course they are going to try to discredit the mother if they think she is lying.

Wouldn't you?

[soup]

36. Good point, hadn't thought of that.

But, on the other hand, providing documentation of someone's emotional problems doesn't necessarily make that person a liar as well. It seems a bit sleazy and underhanded to me.

[wuushew]

9. Does the right to privacy include the hair we naturally shed?

do we have dominion over the detritus we leave in public places? I would recommended talking to the janitor that vacuums the gubernatorial carpet.

[yellowcanine]

11. There would not be a valid "chain of custody". A test based on hair collected that way would be

inadmissible in court. And yes, it would probably be illegal as well, as any person has a reasonable expection that someone is not going to sweep up their hair and run a DNA test on it.

[SoCalDem]

16. Sheez.. take the DNA test. If he IS the dad, let him pay back child support

If he's not, what's he got to lose?

[RB TexLa]

18. more nuts in Florida claiming that he is the father of children

and asking, you took a DNA test for that one but won't for mine?

From what I've heard about this story she doesn't have much claim that he is the father of the child.

[mondo joe]

23. Why would he pay back child support anyway? She was adopted.

He wouldn't be liable for anything.

[RB TexLa]

26. Exactly, he wouldn't even go on the birth certificate, she really has no legal

standing to demand such a test.

[SoCalDem]

35. Oops. I forgot about the adoption part

:red-face:

[Dorian Gray]

42. I'm not a fan of Crist...

but since the child was adopted, he would owe no child support.

[mondo joe]

19. Personally, I'd take the test. But I see no reason to pressure someone else to do so.

He's not liable for child support, and he's not looking for custody.

The child was adopted by another couple. They are her parents.

Testing in this case is simply to satisfy curiosity.

[treestar]

22. When you become governor, just give a general DNA sample

and have it on file - like other criminals, etc.

:rofl:

Seriously, slightly off topic, you have to do a background check for everything from becoming a lawyer to getting a liquor license. Has no one thought of that for people elected to office?

[RB TexLa]

25. It's called opposition research, I've seen the files when they come from the company

by the box load.

[treestar]

28. But how can the opposition get the fingerprints, etc?

For instance, to become a member of the bar, you have to give them their fingerprints so they can run them with the FBI - if you don't give them your fingerprints, you can't become a member of the bar.

So objectively giving the fingerprints to the government, i.e., the people, in that way does not seem out of place as a requirement before someone is sworn in to office.

[mondo joe]

31. If you were to do such a thing I'd prefer it to be a requirement to campaigning,

not to being sworn in.

[RB TexLa]

32. A campaign normally gets that type of information from a sheriff who supports

the campaign, or people at the FBI, or SEC or other agency that has a copy of one's fingerprints.

[soup]

38. Here's an article on the opposition research

relating to Crist and Gallagher. Interesting read:

For GOP mantle, dirt flew furiously

A story taking aim at Charlie Crist's character began to emerge before the primary ... but not fast enough for those who were divulging it. Now, take a look behind the story.

By ADAM C. SMITH, Times Political Editor
Published September 17, 2006

The secret plot among a handful of Republicans to blow up their own party's primary for governor just before election day was born out of frustration.

Attorney General Charlie Crist was running away with it, light years ahead in the polls and leading comfortably in fundraising, too. Rival Tom Gallagher, the state's chief financial officer and a veteran of Florida politics, had mounted a disappointing challenge.
>snip<

Crist and Gallagher had spent about $100,000 each on opposition research, a polite term for hiring a company to dig up dirt on your opponent. Crist seemed to get the better of it. Gallagher suffered through a year of unpleasant revelations about possible conflicts of interest in his financial life and scandalous details from his first marriage and divorce, all pushed aggressively by Crist allies.

But the digging on Crist had turned up nothing. So a band of Gallagher supporters, using an independent committee called "Coalition to Protect the American Dream," paid $75,000 to launch an aggressive and less conventional approach to dirt-digging. They hired Steve Andrews, an old Gallagher friend and millionaire Tallahassee lawyer with deep ties to Crist's home turf, Pinellas County.
>more at link:
http://www.sptimes.com/2006/09/17/State/For_GOP_mantle__dirt_.shtml

[RB TexLa]

45. Yes, interesting

I've noticed through campaigns it often is very wholesome types that bring you the best dirt. They usually have the best evidence to back up their alligations too.

[soup]

37. Miami Herald provides copies of the documents

Crist signed, if anyone is interested:
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/16543593.htm

[RB TexLa]

41. The consent for adoption isn't that rare for someone who is not the father

Most adoptions occur with the legal status of the biological father being "unknown." If this premise is used and there are any questions arising about anyone being the father, they are usually asked to sign such stating they are not the father, give up all possible rights, and consent to the adoption. It is to prevent usually not them but their family from challenging the adoption later, after the child as been established with their family. I hate to use this comparison, but it is much like a title search on property, in order to prevent any future claims, no matter the merit these documents are used.



Obviously I don't know if Charlie Crist is the biological father of this child, and think it is a horrible thing to have hashed out in public.

[Dorian Gray]

40. It would...

but I would say that unless there is something conclusive about the allegations (a real reason to suspect he's the bio dad), then there's little reason to do so. Unless the adoption was an open adoption and they knew who the bio mom was, I don't understand how they could suspect who the bio father may be.

[tomreedtoon]

46. He is "Jesus" Crist. It was a virgin birth!

He is so holy that the Florida Democratic Party put up only token resistance to him, running somebody who refused to advertise in half the state until a week before the election. Why, it took great restraint for the Florida Democrats not to just go out of business before the almighty might of Crist!

If you really believe anything will come of this sex scandal, I've got some wonderful land in south Florida I'd like to sell you.

[yellowcanine]

47. Based on the meager information I have seen here nothing should come of it.

It is interesting that you have characterized this as a "scandal" when so far there is no real evidence that Mr. Crist did anything wrong. I believe that if Democrats are going to be rightly outraged when Republicans do smear jobs on Democrats (such as Fox News and Obama recently) then we should not be promoting Republican "scandals" that have all the appearances of a smear job.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

48. It was widely rumored before the election that Crist is a gay man.

Not that he couldn't biologically father a child, but he does sound pretty adamant in his denial about never performing the act with this lady.:shrug:

[Sailor for Warner]

49. Charlie Crist is a charming man

Anyone who knows him, even in passing can attest to this.
I wouldnt be suprised if he has a few rugrats running around.

[Bucky]

50. This would be less a problem if they could only find a way to make DNA tests a pleasant experience.

Frankly, tho, I'm at a loss to think of how they could do that.