You ain't seen nothin' yet: This winter's energy costs and the plight of the poor.

[Faygo Kid]

Attended a meeting today discussing the extraordinary impact of energy costs on the poor - and the not so poor, for that matter. Heating oil in the Northeast strained every budget last year, at $2.50 a gallon. Right now - with more to come - it's at least $4.50 a gallon. Natural gas and other commodities are soaring as well. Southern and Western states are unable to adequately help those needing cooling this summer, but wait until this winter. It will be an utter disaster. It may shock you to learn that there are those who can't afford $2,000-$3,000 to heat their homes this winter. Many are elderly, inner city or the rural poor.

Sen. Bernie Sanders is bringing a bill to the floor next week to expand the LIHEAP program (Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program). He is asking for an additional $2.5 billion (less than the cost of one week in Iraq). He has 27 cosponsors, but not enough senators will vote to override the inevitable presidential veto.

Brace yourself for horror stories the likes of which we have not yet seen concerning this issue. Those who can will likely use their credit cards to buy fuel, spiraling further downward financially. Others will take out questionable reverse mortgages. Those who can do neither will make for stories in your local paper.

Here's one small representative article. You'll see many more as we move into fall: http://www.sunjournal.com/story/273886-3/MaineNews/Demand_on_rise_for_heating_assistance/

I tremble for my country when I think of the venality of Bush and his cronies. Helluva meeting.

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. We haven't applied to LIHEAP in a few years. Might do it this year, though.

[fight4my3sons]

2. We had help from LIHEAP, Citgo program, and

Salvation Army last year. We are saving every dime this year just for the upcoming winter. We are selling things that we don't need and are moving to be closer to my husband's new job so that we don't have to spend as much in gas money. We are terrified of what is to come. We sold our woodstove and purchased a pellet, but now our new landlord is saying that he doesn't know if we can put it in because of problems with insurance coverage.

[elocs]

3. It makes me glad that I have gotten off heating oil.

Of course, that decision was hastened when my full oil tank flopped over on 9/11/2001. A hell of a mess and cleanup, but I've been on electric ever since. The good thing is that I can budget my payments, even though my monthly payment just went up 30%, and they cannot shut off my power during the winter.

[DesertFlower]

5. we live in the southwest in an

all electric house. our electric bill has gone up quite a bit. last month it was $331. we're on an equalizer plan too so we actually paid $257, but we were just informed that next month the equalizer payment will be $271.

our trash pickup has jumped from $31.00 to $68.00 (for 3 months) in 5 years because of the price of gas.

[elocs]

11. I live in an all electric home also and my payments were $96 a month and went up to $126.

Where I live the city provides garbage pickup, so I don't pay a monthly fee for it. Even paying only $96 a month last winter I still didn't have a cleanup month, but one where I think I only had to pay about $76. Hopefully this winter will be the same.

[DesertFlower]

18. we live outside city limits so we don't have services.

our house is 2800 sq. ft. but we also have a well and a septic system that run on the electric. so i guess it's not too bad. we keep the thermostat on 77 in the summer and 73 in the winter. our rates are higher in the summer when everyone is running the AC. most of last month was 110 or higher.

[DesertFlower]

4. i pay extra every month on my electric

bill to help those who need assistance. i guess that would fall under LIHEAP. been doing it for almost 20 years now.

[galileoreloaded]

6. AZ is very hot,

but the heat will rarely kill you like cold will. Lots of water in a hammock in the shade, don't overexert after 1:00 PM, hell I can even sleep in 115 Deg. in a hammock. Cold kills very quickly. If you ever read Guns, Germs and Steel, most early people we fleeing the mini ice age and spread south. I guess that happens every 10000 years or so. Still feel for the people though.

[pitohui]

8. heat kills people over 60 in a matter of hours

don't underestimate heat -- hundreds died in a week in chicago in 1995, maybe THOUSANDS, but at least 600 were acknowledged to be killed by the heat, and that's in a northern city

most all of them were people over 60, an age where your body loses the ability to tolerate heat

heat kills you as dead as cold kills you, but there are political motives to say "well they were getting up there any way"

but so many died that week in chicago that the morgues overflowed and it became impossible to cover up the number of dead

[Faygo Kid]

9. That was discussed. The worst is yet to come this summer, too.

You are right about Chicago, and that was Clinton.

Imagine what we face this summer in a Bush administration.

[DesertFlower]

22. i'm almost 67. is that why

the heat bothers me so much?

[nightrain]

40. the elderly and the very young are most at risk for dehydration when

it's hot.

[DesertFlower]

44. i drink lots of water. i always have a bottle with me. nt

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

10. The cold can be very painful, in addition to lethal as you say

I've gone without heat in my house over the last two winters, but that's along the California coast where it seldom drops below the mid 40s in winter. And even that is uncomfortable, especially at night. When I was a kid I spent three winters in Wisconson where one year it dropped to 36 below zero during a snow storm. I don't see how anyone could survive that without heat.

Maybe there should be a national drive to at least provide heavy thermal underwear for the poor. I'd be willing to chip in, if it would help.

[DesertFlower]

21. i really feel the heat.

i only go out when i have to. got a remote starter for my car. it doesn't completely cool it, but at least it's not 200 degrees when i get in it.

the heat doesn't bother my husband.

[unblock]

7. i just got my oil bill: $1,280.24 for 256.1 gallons of heating oil @ $4.999/gal

!!!!!!

[underseasurveyor]

13. WHAA!!!!

:wow:

[DesertFlower]

23. how long will that last? nt

[unblock]

26. well it's been 3 months, but of course that's mostly been hot weather

so that's just for showers and dishwasher.

i just can't WAIT until we need to turn the furnace on! :cry:

we'll be wearing double sweaters this winter, i think!

[DesertFlower]

28. holy shit.

[bbinacan]

12. Why are people still using

heating oil in this day and age? It seems to be most prevalent in the NE. Why not natural gas?

[Faygo Kid]

14. A lot of people can't afford to convert. There are many rural poor.

They can't eat cake, either.

[wishlist]

25. Nat gas not an option and oil was cheapest for many until last couple years.

On my road in mountains of W North Carolina, there is no natural gas pipeline and everyone has oil furnaces. One neighbor got a propane tank but finds it very expensive and the tank takes a lot of room. Another neighbor on a nearby street had an underground tank with hundreds of gallons of oil. When she converted to natural gas since her development got a nat gas line, she couldn't sell back her oil and had to donate it to charity to empty out old oil tank. Oil company she bought the oil from would only take it if she paid them!

I have had oil for thirty years and it was very inexpensive. Under Clinton and Carter and the first Bush, I paid less than a dollar a gallon, much less than natural gas or electric. Only recently has it become so expensive.

[Bonobo]

34. Know how much it will cost me to convert!?

Fuggedaboudit

[Warpy]

35. Have you bothered to check the price of natural gas?

It's doubled since last year, too.

[bluestateguy]

15. Conservatives: "Let 'em all freeze to death to eliminate the poverty problem"

You know that that is privately what a lot of them think.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

20. "If they would rather die, they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population"

[KoKo]

16. Wait until Bush Co and CNBC/GE, Morning Joe and the rest tell you you are "Trash Talking"

when you have to burn your furniture to keep warm.

I'm sure some Cable like Fox, CNN, MSNBC will have some folks on talking about "heating costs so high they have to burn their Granny's old Hickory Rocker, but Mika and Joe and Pat and Willie and Andrea and Wolf and the rest will all "laugh and chortle" about how "silly these folks were" ...because if only they had allowed "Offshore Drilling" they wouldn't be in this "RIDICULOUS SITUATION!"

It's the way the media looks down on the folks they report to. They laugh at us...because we aren't as fortunate in our "Career Choices" as those who now "Anchor" our "Mainstream Media." Bad on US and GOOD ON THEM for being who they are...YEAH? :shrug:

[undergroundpanther]

17. I know.

I am poor,and I am dreading it.
I dunno what to do. This house has no fireplace.
I am going to be miserable.I have an electric heater tho.It's cheesy but it has saved my ass.
But dammit I am dreading winter,I have made some quilts, stuff to prepare..But shit it sucks having 5 quilts on you sleeping in 3 layers of clothes with gloves on, a hat on, three cats under the covers with you laying against you and your nose is freezing off,and every time you shift cold air gets in.5 layers of quilts comforters and blankets is very heavy.
I was short on oil one year for a few weeks It was not fun.
Strategic placements of candles can deflect chilly air away from you.So it isn't as bad.But obviously you can't sleep with them burning.It just sucks.

[DesertFlower]

24. OMG. i lived in new york for most of my life.

we lived in an apartment building and it seemed it was always the coldest days of the year that the furnace would break. many times i drove to the health club at 6 am to take a shower. we could warm the place somewhat with electric heaters, but cold water -- that was a bitch.

they were cheap with the heat too. i used to leave a lamp on for my cat to sleep under when i went to work.

[undergroundpanther]

33. My kitty Sparkle

The one with the wings on my posts,
He lives under the lamps here. He is so small and he's on the thin side so he's always cold.He is part singapura and oriental,so I don't think he'll ever get big or put on alot of weight no matter how much he eats. However when I hold him, I always tuck his cold little back feet into my armpit and cover him with my arms than he is one purring up a storm, warm happy kitty blissed out and drooling with joy.Not much drool ,but when he is happy he drools just a little bit,its cute.

[DesertFlower]

43. we love our furry friends, don't we?

my cat, joey was happy when we moved to arizona. when we got settled we went to the humane society and adopted a 1 year old male cat to keep him company. about 2 years later, i found our sara on the street. there all gone now, and we just have 1. we're getting older and we worry who would take him if anything happened to us. he's very spoiled. of course, they all were.

i sincerely hope things get better for you.

[Faygo Kid]

29. Take care and let us know how you are doing.

Keep an eye out for LIHEAP aid, and make sure to apply. Most people don't. I'm sure you can go to the Maryland website and find out what you need to do. Now is the time. Careful with those candles.

[undergroundpanther]

36. will do

And yeah I am careful with candles, I have secure metal holders that are mounted in strategic places,on the wall.I use no drip ones for this,and multi wicks.Nothing flammable is near them and I can reach them no problem and put them out easy.

My cat Vinny will meow up a storm if I leave a candle burning and I leave the room longer than ten minutes. He is the kitty fire marshall of the house. He caught my last electric heater right before it shorted out .He got my attention meowing loudly and he stood by the cord,he looked at it,and twords the plug..and I knew by his actions there was something wrong. So.I ran to unplug it,and it shorted out right before I had grabbed the plug.
It was unplugged after it blew I was slow on the draw .
Vinnie warned me ..
Vinnie knows when electrical problems arise before they do, he is very aware of fire and appliances. My cats KNOW when shit is gonna blow before it does and I pay attention when they warn me.

[starroute]

38. Insulate everywhere you possibly can

Taking care of the drafts not only saves on heating costs, it also helps you feel more comfortable even when the thermostat is turned down.

Rope caulk is great and pretty cheap. We roll it out fairly thin and put a line of it along the bottom of the windows where they meet the sill, and a little ways up the sides, and it really keeps down the drafts.

If you have any windows without storm panes, those kits with plastic that you spread over the window and tape in place can help.

If you have outlets or light switches on external walls where drafts come through, you can get kits with foam that goes behind the switchplates and plugs to close off any unused outlets.

There are sand-filled "snakes" that you can put along the base of external doors -- those aren't easy to find, but they can be ordered online.

If you have old-fashioned hot water radiators like we do, you can get foil-covered styrofoam panels to go behind them and reflect the heat that would otherwise be lost through the wall. Those don't seem to be made in the US, but you can order them from Canada.

(I heard years ago of similar devices to mount outside a sunny window and reflect more heat into your room, but I don't know if they ever worked well enough to be commercially available.)

You can save a little by insulating your basement hot water pipes -- there are foam tubes in 3 or 4 foot lengths that just slip around them and stick together.

If you can afford to invest a little more, there are insulating drapes and blinds that are supposed to keep a lot of the heat in at night. I haven't tried those yet myself but I may do so.

A good layer of insulation in the attic and attention to any place you may be losing heat in the basement is strongly recommended. Having insulation blown into the walls may also help. There are webpages telling how to check out your house for vulnerable places.

If you need a space heater, my understanding is that the oil-filled ones which look like miniature radiators are more efficient for heating large rooms than the little blowers -- but the blowers are better if you just want to sit in one place and send some heat your own way.

Heck, sleeping in a sleeping bag is probably much cozier than trying to stay warm under the blankets. The ones they sell for kids' sleepovers are a lot cheaper than the kind meant for outdoors use and would probably do the job.

[greenman3610]

19. yes increase assistance, but

also, change the utility regulations across the country to give
electric Utilities the incentive to meet demand through efficiency,
upgrading and weatherizing houses and buildings -
this would immediately begin to create thousands of
entry level and skilled jobs, exactly in the communities that
need them most.

[bread_and_roses]

27. Nationalize the utilities. People will be dying for their profits, otherwise (n/t)

[Rosa Luxemburg]

30. I've been trying to get solar power but I can't afford the outlay

I know a lot of people have been out collecting wood.

[TayTay]

31. There is another shoe to drop on this as well, dealers are disappearing

A lot of oil heat vendors never recovered from last year and the staggering amount of people who couldn't pay their bills. The http://sbc.senate.gov/hearings/20080625.cfm">Senate Small Business Committee held a hearing on this in late June. There are small Mom and Pop companies that have hundreds of thousands of dollars in accounts receivable. If they don't have the money, then they can't pay for their oil deliveries.

People will be choosing between food and heat this winter.

[dysfunctional press]

32. communal living will start with the winters. maybe even this one.

especially in some areas, it may make sense for people with the ability, circumstances and temperment to do so to consider throwing together in one house, while leaving the other(s) boarded up until spring.

some people might even decide it "works" for them, and keep it going year round.

[Faygo Kid]

37. A favorite song: "I've got my love to keep me warm." Let Ella tell it.

Not a bad idea: http://youtube.com/watch?v=qfEHhG1T8C8

[pitohui]

41. it will work for the predators, not so much for the rest

as you can see, i've already done the roommate thing

the sociopath "wins," the decent person who cares about others does all the cleaning, the decent person who cares about their credit rating pays all the bills

is that what we want, a darwinistic society where the person who is the most evil takes all the cake?

[dysfunctional press]

45. i guess that you're gonna be on your own then...

the rest of us will try to be just fine.

i've done the roommate thing too- several different times along the way...and i've never experienced any of the 'predatory' behaviour you describe.

maybe you need to do a better job of picking friends...? :shrug:

[lastliberalintexas]

39. Unfotrunately, it really isn't just limited to Bush, or even republicans

There are a lot of unempathetic people in this country, and they come in all political stripes even if they mostly fall on the right.

I hope Bernie is successful.

[NickB79]

42. Last winter, we didn't turn on the heat in our apt. for the entire winter. In Minnesota!

Before the weather got really bad, my girlfriend and I decided we would attempt to get through the winter using as little heating as possible. Our apartment complex had installed meters in each apartment last summer, and we were informed to expect $40+/mo. extra in heating charges. We could afford it, but it was more of a moral challenge than a financial one to us, to see how little we truly needed to get by, to waste less, to reduce our carbon footprint.

So, I put weather stripping on our windows and patio door, turned the heater to 0, and placed weather wrap over the A/C unit. I ran the humidifier for my houseplants, and we wore socks and sweatpants. We ate at home to save money, with the added benefit of the excess heat from the oven heating the apartment. At night, we pulled extra comforters out of the closet. The temps outside began to drop lower and lower, but the apartment never went below 60F, even when it was -20F outside. We lived on the ground floor, over a heated garage, and our apartment faced into the courtyard which served to block much of the wind. We did cheat a bit and use an oil-filled electric space heater in Jan-Feb, but this added less than $10/mo to our electrical bill. Bear in mind that our apt. is only one-bedroom, 750 sq. ft.

My biggest concern was that my large collection of houseplants would suffer. Amazingly, they seemed healthier than ever! I suspect the use of the humidifier and the lack of cold drafts more than made up for the cool temps.

By spring, the company that handled heating for the apartment complex actually sent a technician out to inspect our meter to make sure it was running properly! It was, and he just left a bit confused about why they hadn't received any readings from it yet.

[leftyclimber]

46. I think we're going to be layering a lot this winter.

We make approximately $100 too much to qualify for LIHEAP in WV, and the qualifications are extremely stringent. There are a lot of people in this state who need the help, but don't qualify (or who are too proud to accept the assistance).

We put that blow-dry on plastic on the windows and keep a towel against the apartment door, and try to cook in the oven a lot to warm things up. But we also have a lot of technical winter outerwear, from when times were better, and can weather it out, especially because we usually only have a couple of weeks of consistently below-freezing weather anyway. It won't be pleasant, but we'll manage.

I really worry about the people who have "real" winter, and who don't have "real" winter clothes. In southern WV, where the winter weather is rougher, and even here in north-central, where the weather is somewhat milder, there are a lot of house and trailer fire fatalities here every winter because people are trying to do what they can to keep warm.

When I lived in southern Ontario I locked myself out of the house one day and came very close to dying of hypothermia. That was my own stupidity. People shouldn't have to experience that inside their own homes.