Beware of Chuck Hagel!!!

[RiverStone]

Rumor has it he may announce on Monday he is running for President; maybe even as an Independent.

Granted, his position dissing the Iraq war has been both bold and very welcome considering the rethug company he keeps - kudo's to him for that!

Yet beyond his anti- Iraq war rhetoric, he very much a Bushnik!

Here is the evidence:

On Choice

Voted NO on $100M to reduce teen pregnancy by education & contraceptives. (Mar 2005)
Voted YES on criminal penalty for harming unborn fetus during other crime. (Mar 2004)
Voted YES on banning partial birth abortions except for maternal life. (Mar 2003)
Voted YES on maintaining ban on Military Base Abortions. (Jun 2000)
Voted YES on banning partial birth abortions. (Oct 1999)
Voted YES on banning human cloning. (Feb 1998)
Rated 0% by NARAL, indicating a pro-life voting record. (Dec 2003)

On the Environment

Voted NO on including oil & gas smokestacks in mercury regulations. (Sep 2005)
Voted YES on confirming Gale Norton as Secretary of Interior. (Jan 2001)
Voted YES on more funding for forest roads and fish habitat. (Sep 1999)
Voted YES on transportation demo projects. (Mar 1998)
Voted NO on reducing funds for road-building in National Forests. (Sep 1997)
Rated 0% by the LCV, indicating anti-environment votes. (Dec 2003)

On his Values

Sandhills PAC supports 17 Senate & 12 House candidates. (Dec 2006)
90% conservative voting record; 95% support of Pres. Bush. (Dec 2006)
Voted YES on confirming Samuel Alito as Supreme Court Justice. (Jan 2006)
Voted YES on confirming John Roberts for Chief Justice of the Supreme Court. (Sep 2005)
Religious affiliation: Episcopalian. (Nov 2000)

much more here:

http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Chuck_Hagel.htm


BEWARE CHUCK HAGEL! :thumbsdown:

[rpannier]

1. As I've said before and I'll say again...

1 issue does not a candidate make.

[RiverStone]

5. Oh, and he's also anti-union...

Forgot to add in original post, though need I say more?

Yes rpannier, Hagel has an A on his Iraq war stance - though mostly F's and a D or two on everything else we care about. Any DEM that ponders for a second that Hagel is a viable alternative is either not a DEM or not aware of his voting record.

More F's here:

Voted NO on raising the minimum wage to $7.25 rather than $6.25. (Mar 2005)
Voted YES on repealing Clinton's ergonomic rules on repetitive stress. (Mar 2001)
Voted YES on killing an increase in the minimum wage. (Nov 1999)
Voted YES on allowing workers to choose between overtime & comp-time. (May 1997)
Rated 8% by the AFL-CIO, indicating an anti-union voting record. (Dec 2003

http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Chuck_Hagel.htm

[Brundle_Fly]

38. explain Guiliani then

[TwilightGardener]

43. Yep, Giuliani's a one-trick pony....but

his trick is the only one that matters to those in the GOP who imagine that we are in WW3 with all of Islam--make no mistake, they believe this.

[Czolgosz]

44. It's unfair to call Rudy a one issue candidate. He's had multiple positions on several issues

On the assault-weapons ban

CLASSIC RUDY:

"Someone who now voted to roll back the assault-weapons ban would really be demonstrating that special-interest politics mean more to them than life-or-death issues."

NEW RUDY:

"I don't think is one of the most critical issues right now."

"The assault-weapons ban is something I supported in the past."



On abortions

CLASSIC RUDY:

"I have a daughter now, I would give my personal advice, my religious and moral views…I would help her with taking care of the baby. But if the ultimate choice of the woman -- my daughter or any other woman -- would be that in this particular circumstance, to have an abortion, I'd support that. I'd give my daughter the money for it."

"No, I have not supported that (the ban on late-term D & X abortions - so-called partial birth abortions), and I don’t see my position on that changing.”

NEW RUDY:

"I think abortion is something that, as a personal matter, I would advise somebody against."



PLEASE ADD YOUR OWN FAVORITE RUDY FLIP-FLOPS.

[TwilightGardener]

48. Personal favorite: Using the media to let his second wife know he wanted a divorce...

and then this week begging for privacy from the media regarding family matters.

[Czolgosz]

69. That was awfully creepy, It is no wonder his kids hate him, too.

[Perky]

65. Hagel as an independent would be great (three things)

1. He would be forced to drop the GOP senate Caucus which helps
2. He could break the back of thE REAGAN coalition of social fisccal and military conservatives.
3. He would split the GOP in significant ways in the South and we would wind up winning a plurality there and waltzing in Virgina and Ohio and Florida on election day.

Run Chuck run

[TwilightGardener]

66. I agree--he would really drive a wedge into the GOP...

But would the Dems lose enough votes to him to lose the general?

[BlooInBloo]

2. CNN reports (and it's plausible) that lots of "Democrats" would switch & vote for him....

... I wonder if they're all in Connecticut?

Jackass fuckwipes.

[AX10]

3. I'm from CT and I will never vote for Hagel.

[Colobo]

8. Hagel is an option

Only if we choose a weak candidate in the primaries...

[RiverStone]

11. An option? He voted with Shrub 95% of the time.

Are you saying Katzenkavalier that you would consider Hagel as an option?

Please clarify...



peace:)

[Colobo]

12. Not necessarily

What I mean is that if we choose a candidate that doesn't have a clear stance on the Iraq war and winds up sounding like your average Republican in the campaign trail, many centrists and yes, many Democrats, will consider Hagel. The guy is a Republican, no question about that, but his firm stance on the Iraq war and his willingess to criticize the Bush administration openly plays in his favor.

[BlooInBloo]

14. And which, pray tell, Democratic candidates are *worse* than a bush-95%-republican?

I'm all ears.

[Colobo]

41. I prefer to focus on the excellent candidates we have to offer

[shance]

18. And who controls CNN?

Isn't that enough said?

[Clark2008]

42. Not just Connecticut.

And it depends on who the Dem nominee is.

Hagel's pretty popular with moderate Dems.

[BlooInBloo]

50. There's the problem with America in a nutshell... Democrats are so stupid...

... that they think switching to vote republican for a 95%-bush-supporter is a GOOD thing.

And it's not confined to Connecticut. (sob)

[bbgrunt]

4. and the dems are letting him steal their issues by their cowardice.

I and I believe the vast majority of voters want candidates who can see with some moral clarity and that's why they were so enamored of gwb--until they realized he was a fake and a liar.

but someone who sees the imperative of impeachment would be hard to beat with a bunch of wimpy dems who waffle and keep clearing the table so as to not let it get dirty.

[dailykoff]

6. Bingo.

If Hagel gets in we've got a fight on our hands.

[Blue Belle]

13. Not to mention he has the voting machines...

:SIGH: :(

[Stevepol]

36. This is the biggest issue to me. He's only where is due to the machines.

The fact that he tried to get by w/o even mentioning his assn w/ AIS after he was elected to Congress the first time speaks volumes about the ideological and moral basis for governing (incoming members are required to reveal their business background and he was board chairman on the company that became ES&S). When I first started investigating this con game and scam called electronic voting, I felt that, if nothing was done to insure that the vote count was fair, Hagel would run for and be elected president after Bush.

[glitch]

45. He's been in the chute awhile now. I read he's a protege of Poppy's.

The beat goes on.

Edit: if Cheney resigns my bet's on Hagel to replace him. Then they'll orchestrate something to make him nice and shiny for 2008. Gotta create that backstory to make his election believable.

[RiverStone]

71. Good article here on Chuck's Voting machines...

Pretty scary stuff. How the hell did this fly under the radar - or at least enough to not invalidate his victories???

http://www.senatemajority.com/chuck_hagels_voting_machines

[RiverStone]

10. agree!

Hagel does not equivocate or sound wishy washy. Which, IMHO, would make him a formidable candidate.

I disagree with 90% of his record, though his plain speaking and blunt style resonates with the public as someone who walks his talk.

I like Hagel's style - I strongly dislike his record.


Russ Feingold needs to give DEM leadership assertiveness training! :applause:

[KittyWampus]

58. Riverstone, your post really elucidates what makes Hagel such a threat. I couldn't

quite put it into words, but you did so very succintly.

[mmonk]

7. I hope he runs and certainly don't fear him.

I want to see the repuke primary debates if he does.

[MagickMuffin]

9. That's the danger of hitching your cart to an elephant

you never know which direction it will charge. Just because some GOP speaks out against his party doesn't mean we should ignore everything else about them, as your post proves.

It always pissed me off when people would clamor over McCain. "Oh he's such a maverick", yeah right.

People be aware of who these people really are before you jump over the cliff. Alright I know most DUers would never do that, but it's meant as just a precaution.

[AshevilleGuy]

15. I know. He just seems so human-like... n/t

[glitch]

46. They made a lot of physical improvements in version 2.0

It doesn't have the mysterious pauses and gaps and jerky movements and actual falls like version 1.0. Plus they're using a more human-like language simulation software and a more natural laugh. They expect it to perform well in the debates.
This version will be good for more than brush-cutting.

[bdamomma]

62. watch out for "nice guys"

like that old tale of "he seems to be a nice guy" and another "you can have a beer with" and see where we are right now with that kind of perception of people.

[silverojo]

16. I knew this already

But K&R for your in-depth report.

:kick:

[shance]

17. I think even much bigger is his direction connection to Election Systems andSoftware

That's huge.

[Twist_U_Up]

21. Ding Ding Ding . Hagel is a schill on the down low.

check out his history of voteing machines. It is not good.(unless you where him)

[Sal Minella]

33. Yes. The votes that elected him were counted on machines from his company.

And he did a "Republican Remember" so his management history in a BBV company didn't appear on his CV.

[skipos]

19. Hagel thinks Ben Nelson (NE) votes like Kennedy to much.

He would get very few Democratic votes once they look at his voting record.

[TwilightGardener]

20. Nope, disagreed. Only

hard-core Dems are going to scour his voting record. I posted this in another thread, but Dems in my family really like him--they are looking for a hero, and they aren't going to research all of his Senate votes. They watched him make a stirring speech on the teevee, and he LOOKS presidential--that's enough for a lot of people, scarily enough. Do not underestimate him, and make sure to educate wayward Dems that he is to the right of Bush.

[RiverStone]

23. And it's the Dems in your family that worry me...

No offense to your family in particular of course - but those DEMS that hear Chuck's anti-war rants and see his plain spoken tough guy demeanor, adding to a "presidential look" -like you said- may make a simpleton choice. DEMS who chose NOT to be educated on Hagels voting record may vote for him.

Frankly, of all the rethugs out there - I think Hagel would be the most challenging rethug (or indie if he choses) that we could run against.

So wienerdoggie, ya know any pitbull DEMS on the Hill we could invite into the fight? We need more teeth to be really competitive. :shrug:

[TwilightGardener]

25. No offense taken (RE my family!)

Nope, don't know any pitbull Dems, but what concerns me is this constant reliance on the voting-machine issue as a big weakness. Here in Nebraska, no one either knows or cares about it, and I just don't think it will be useful as a weapon in a campaign. It's already been addressed by the Senate Ethics Committee a while back, I thought. Need to get some good oppo going on this guy beyond ES&S, or my sweetie Obama might eventually face a real fight, IF (big if) Hagel gets any traction.

[RiverStone]

28. Glad to hear no offense found - and if Hagel makes it official.

Please keep us posted if your "Hagel supporting DEM family members" eventually see the light (or are willing to dig a little deeper).

Again, IMHO - Hagel will leap past all the other rethugs within a month or so and be the leading contender. Of course, a paid political pundit I'm not. :shrug:

I'd love to see Wes Clark or Al Gore take him on - of course, there is this little obstacle called---deciding to run!



peace:)

[skipos]

27. So basically, Hagel will win underinformed single issue (anti-war) Dems?

There aren't a lot of those. Warmongers like Giuliani, McCain and Romney leading the pack for the GOP nomination... unapologetic IWR voter Hillary leading the Dems with IWR cosponser Edwards... warmonger Giuliani beating anti-war Obama in many swing state polls... I am not sensing that America is full of many single issue, anti-war voters.

[TwilightGardener]

30. Two words: Reagan Democrats

[RiverStone]

31. Ideally - I'd like to see a hawk...

Who is neither an IWR apologist (or worse an IWR UNapologist - err Hillary) go against Hagel or McCain or whomever.

Best qualified - IMHO either Wes Clark or Al Gore!!!

One thing - neither has decided to run! Damn....:think:

[TwilightGardener]

32. I am a bit hawkish for a Dem myself...

and I think that the Security-Terror issue is still going to play a big role in '08, even though most people have soured on the Iraq war (hence Ghouliani). For that reason, I think Clark would do well, and if he announced, I'd put him in my second place to Obama. Gore's OK, but I think he is not going to run. He is having too much fun (and getting too much respect, finally).

[FrenchieCat]

22. Hagel is what McCain claims to be.....somewhat of a maverick.....

but still a conservative....just a more reasonable one.

[BlooInBloo]

37. Votes with bush 95% of the time. What do you base your "maverick" on?

[FrenchieCat]

57. Maverick is a perception bestowed by the corporate media.....

and in terms of the most important issue currently, Hagel wins the "Maverick" prize.....according to the corporate media.

[Wetzelbill]

24. for me, Hagel isn't even a voting option

I would never ever vote for him in a general election, unless somehow Lieberman go the Dem nomination, although in that case I would probably just stay home. Hagel is a smart guy, pretty reasonable on many issues and he's been great in questioning the Iraq war, but, as you note quite well, he is definitely far to the Right on a lot of things.

[global1]

26. Cheney Has A Blood Clot Conveniently One Day Before Libby Gets Convicted......

Libby gets convicted.

All eyes turn to Cheney as he has brought a cloud over the WH.

Hagel throws his hat into the presidency for '08

Cheney resigns for health reasons.

Bush puts up Hagel for substitute VP.

Dems go along with it because of his stance on the war.

Hagel new VP.

Repugs set for '08 - may even have a chance to win the WH with Hagel.

Hagel's a one issue candidate (against the war).

Hagel votes the party line the other 95% of the time.

Hagel is a Trojan Horse wins the '08 presidency because many Dems switch party lines and vote for him because he has the courage to get the troops out of Iraq because the Dems were unsuccessful after taking back Congress in '06.

Rupugs take credit for bringing our troops back home.

Business as usual as Hagel goes back to the Repug play book and moves on the Repug agenda of destroying the middle class to the benefit of the rich and the corporations.

Phew!!! I'm a little dazed as I come out of my trance of looking into the crystal ball.

[TwilightGardener]

29. Brilliant! Except the part where BushCo LOATHES him...

[Eurobabe]

34. Not! Bush hates Hagel, he's a thorn in his side

Bush has eyes for Jebbie or Condi.

[havocmom]

40. yeah, but the power that runs bush wants to stay in power

They could have bush nominate Hagel for VP under the banner of 'reaching out' to the GOP that is turning against the war.

It would be very shrewd

bush does what he is told to do. He my pout and stomp his feet a bit, but he does what he is told.

edited for typo

[glitch]

47. Yeah but Poppy likes him, and Poppy has the real power on his side.

If pnacchio balks they'll pull his chain.

[TwilightGardener]

51. I am curious...what evidence

do you have that Poppy (GHWB) likes him? I know Hagel was on the short list for VP in 2000, but I would think that love affair is now officially over, what with bringing up the "I" word and all...

[glitch]

55. Read somewhere a couple of years ago that Hagel was a protege of Poppy's.

Don't actually know what their relationship is now, so it's good you questioned my post. I do think it would help Hagel a lot to appear to distance himself from all things Bush, and Poppy is smart enough to play that game with him.

These people are very good at keeping their eyes on the prize.

[bdamomma]

63. bush isn't going to put anyone in the position of VP who is

not loyal to him.

[glitch]

49. Your psychic abilities are awesome! nt

[Corgigal]

53. If Bush cared about the Republican party

that is what he would do. I see no evidence that he thinks about republican party members since he was elected (stolen) pres. He won't do it, he rather be mr tough and right guy. It's all about him. Grown man still acts like a teenager.

[Kat 333]

35. He is a slime ball ...

Hagel was a Major Player in this Unelected administration of thugs, thieves and murderers.


>Back when Hagel first ran there for the U.S. Senate in 1996, his company's computer-controlled voting machines showed he'd won stunning upsets in both the primaries and the general election. The Washington Post (1/13/1997) said Hagel's "Senate victory against an incumbent Democratic governor was the major Republican upset in the November election." <

>Six years later Hagel ran again, this time against Democrat Charlie Matulka in 2002, and won in a landslide. As his hagel.senate.gov website says, Hagel "was re-elected to his second term in the United States Senate on November 5, 2002 with 83% of the vote. That represents the biggest political victory in the history of Nebraska."
What Hagel's website fails to disclose is that about 80 percent of those votes were counted by computer-controlled voting machines put in place by the company affiliated with Hagel. Built by that company. Programmed by that company.<

http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0131-01.htm

[Blackhatjack]

39. No Question Hagel is a Repub, But He is Reading the Iraq War Correctly....

He knows how this is going to end .... badly.
He knows that Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld and the NeoCons are going to be rejected by the public.

He is placing himself in the breach, using his position on the Iraq War to reign in those who are deserting the Repub Party on the Iraq War issue.

[RiverStone]

52. So is almost every DEM and a half dozen rethugs..

Reading the Iraq War correctly. So though I'm pleased with any Neo-Con that see's the very obvious light on the subject; I'm concerned that Chuck will get extra mileage out of it because some see him as a rebel - NOT! Again per the original post, he is a flat out BushCo regime soldier who has basically marched in lockstep with Shrub for 6 years. So he speaks out against the Iraq madness - like millions of the world have done in protest since before the IWR in 02.

I like his style - I can't stand his positions (minus Iraq). Chuck would ride the wave of anti-war sentiment then work to establish an overt neo-con agenda.

[TwilightGardener]

54. No way would Chuck go neocon...

He knows it's the worst thing that has happened to his party.

[RiverStone]

56. It seems minus Iraq - his voting record suggests he already is?

95% Shrub votes supporter = pretty darn neo-con. Of course, maybe we differ on semantics.

What is your definition of a neo-con wienerdoggie?


peace:)

[TwilightGardener]

59. His voting record IS conservative,

but the term "neoocon" is generally used to define the philosophy of those within the Bush administration, some thinktanks (AEI), and media (Fox, Weekly Standard, Charles Krauthammer, etc.) who advocate something called PNAC--Plan for a New American Century. This is the genesis of the Bush administration's plan to capitalize on 9/11 and invade Iraq and Iran.

Their driving philosophy is this: America is the only superpower left, we have a kick-ass military, and we should capitalize on both of these factors to change the face of the Middle East in our favor (read: oil for us, none for other burgeoning superpowers like China and India). Look it up on Wikipedia, you will see a lot of familiar names as PNAC members: Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Feith, Wolfowitz--pretty much most of the Bush administration. This is the root of all evil.

Hagel is not one of them, to my knowledge--he is kicking it old-school--a classic/old-fashioned conservative, engaged in the world, free-trader, globalist, but not hell-bent on imperialism.

[RiverStone]

60. ok, now I see the difference

Thanks for the enlightenment weinerdoggie :) I had assumed that neocon was slang for someone that was really conservative. Well, they are - but as an aside to being a neocon.

Knowing yours and wiki's definition, I consider myself corrected.


p.s. So do you like dachshunds? Since your a weinerdoggie and all :shrug:

[TwilightGardener]

64. Yup, got me one of them wienerdogs! I borrowed his evil persona for this forum.

[bdamomma]

61. oh yea, he does not have a good record for voting in certain

bills, he may be against this war, but that seems to be about it.

[thethinker]

67. This is very bad news

I am not worried about losing democratic voters to Hagel. But, for sure, we will lose cross over republican voters and many independents. Those voters have had it with Bush and his circle. They feel betrayed, which they have been. They are sick of endless wars, out sourcing of jobs, immigration policies, etc. They will not vote for a pro war candidate.

If the democrats are stupid enough to run a spineless, "tough on terrorism" candidate, who does not take a strong stand against this war they will lose if Hagel is the republican candidate. Too many of the democratic candidates want to have it both ways on every issue. They don't take strong stands because they want to appear middle of the road. The people don't respect that.

Hagel is the one I don't think we can beat.

[huskerlaw]

68. Don't have to tell me twice

The man knows how to read a poll. That is all.

I'm from Nebraska, I've "known" this guy for years. The only...and I mean ONLY...issue that he breaks from the Republican party line on is Iraq. And there is no evidence that it's anything more than an ability to do math.

He's not a maverick.

He's not independent.

He IS a Republican shill.

[Junkdrawer]

70. For a good time, Google Hagel and "ES&S"...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Hagel+%22ES%26S%22...&btnG=Google+Search

...

In 1996, Hagel became the first elected Republican Nebraska senator in 24 years when he did surprisingly well in an election where the votes were verified by the company he served as chairman and maintained a financial investment. In both the 1996 and 2002 elections, Hagel’s ES&S counted an estimated 80% of his winning votes. Due to the contracting out of services, confidentiality agreements between the State of Nebraska and the company kept this matter out of the public eye. Hagel’s first election victory was described as a “stunning upset” by one Nebraska newspaper.

Hagel’s official biography states, “Prior to his election to the U.S. Senate, Hagel worked in the private sector as the President of McCarthy and Company, an investment banking firm based in Omaha, Nebraska and served as Chairman of the Board of American Information Systems.” During the first Bush presidency, Hagel served as Deputy Director and Chief Operating Officer of the 1990 Economic Summit of Industrialized Nations (G-7 Summit).

...


http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0225-05.htm