Unimpeached Bush and Cheney are "clearing, holding and building" . . .

[pat_k]

. . .their way to a Unitary Authoritarian Executive with unbounded power.

They are playing for keeps, which is WHY they are breaking the Constitution in plain sight.

Bush and Cheney do something we have forbidden, claim it is not forbidden, and dare Members of Congress to stop them. When Members of Congress refuse to impeach -- the ONLY thing capable of stopping them -- Bush and Cheney "hold and build": **Hey America, told you it wasn't forbidden. Now, let us get on with clearing habeas (or whatever takes our fancy) out of our way.**

Members of Congress who are refusing to publicly demand impeachment are in full retreat, no ifs and or buts. Anything short of a demand for impeachment -- resolutions, legislation, finger-wagging investigations, hearings -- is surrender.

At any time, any Member can turn, stand their ground, and point the "impeachment gun" (the only "lethal" weapon in the Congressional arsenal) at Bush and Cheney. There are no prerequisites or complexities to navigate. All they need to do open their mouth, tell the public the truth, and sound the "call to arms" by demanding impeachment. Any Member of the House can pick a violation, write articles of impeachment on a piece of paper, and introduce it.

Impeachment is not about "getting" Bush and Cheney. It is about defending ourselves against invaders hell-bent on occupying our "territory." Bush and Cheney advance by corrupting the Constitution that has been amended and entrusted to us to protect and perfect as we seek to "form a more perfect union." They are taking over the framework through which we assign duties and delegate powers to our government officials. They violate the inviolate dictates and institutions through which we balance conflicting interests in accord with our common values. Above all, they are after the principle that government power can only be derived from the consent of the governed -- the SOLE moral principle on which our Constitution, and therefore the nation, rests.

The Congressional oath is not an oath to win; it is an oath to fight -- to support and defend. It is an individual oath. Each Member must choose for themselves: To Impeach, or Not Impeach. The choice is not some strategic game or academic exercise. It is a choice between fighting to preserve and build a True America or surrendering what we have built to Fascists.

It is that simple.

There really is no choice.

[blm]

1. Care to speculate WHO the Dems are behind the scenes advising against impeachment?

My guess is that there is just too much from the last 30 years that needs covering up for BushInc and the powerful Dems who have protected them over all this time.

[pat_k]

2. Impeachophobia is rampant. The roots are deep. . .

They go back decades: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=142357&mesg_id=142901">It's like Deja vu all over again

But are not unbeatable: http://january6th.org/saving-ourselves.html">Saving Ourselves from Ourselves

[Senator]

8. I think Most of them are Caught Up in the "Same Old Groupthink" ...

...that has brought us 2 stolen elections, a second "Vietnam," and War Criminal Nation status. So it's not some "power brokers" making a concerted effort to stop impeachment. They just continue to be deluded by their parochial, insular community -- the DC/Euphemedia Analstocracy.

In fact, you can literally track most of their "surprisingly strong statements" with the times they haven't been in session -- when they've had to deal with the rational world for some time. Sadly, these are more like transitory moods. Because when they get back to DC, they are soon re-indoctrinated with localized lunacy.

Good examples are the mentioning of the Clinton impeachment and the statements by Harry Reid and Patty Murray to the effect of "Oh no, we'll get cheney!" Both of these "propaganda memes" are nonsensical on their face.

Obviously, we already "have cheney" -- do they imagine that the bushkid himself is a bulwark against something worse? And even thinking about Clinton is patently oxymoronic, as the circumstances of then and now are diametrically opposite**.

Yet they continue to accept and parrot this nonsense because "that's what people are saying." This is how effective propaganda functions, it allows the dupe to dismiss the matter out of hand -- inducing a useful ignorance.

But that doesn't mean we can merely "teach our way out" (as so many on the ineffectual left cling to as the panacea for all ills). Sure, cornering the groupthinker on their ignorance and illogic is useful in the right context, but we also must continue to engage in "violence" as well.

Marches and other public acts are a form of non-physical violence. And we must display anger at their failure in any other form we can. Mock and ridicule, like the Daily Show and the cartoonists do. Make every email, fax, and phone call unpleasant for the betway-bound listener/reader/groupthinker.

Because in the end they're just people. They do respond to other people. It's what gets them deluded in the first place. They don't want to be accurately labeled as fools, ignoramuses, and failures to democracy and the American People. They really want us to keep beating them up the side of the head with a cluestick.

They really want us screaming "Only Impeachment" until they finally "get it."

They really do.


======
**Clinton was a popular, twice-elected president -- impeached for less-than-trivial reasons -- by a party in danger of being seen as extremists. Bushcheney is an unpopular, never-elected, never-legitimate regime -- being impeached for torture/war crimes, spying on Americans, and terrorizing the nation into war -- by a party that might be in danger of being seen as conscious or vertebrate.

[robinlynne]

3. I agree PatK. And I was one of the people saying "wait for the hearings".

The eharings are not cutting it. I am thrilled about them, make no mistake. But we are still letting them get away with murder. It's very much one step forward, two steps back at this point.

[pat_k]

6. Welcome!

Every convert to the "Impeach Now" club is a victory.

The more of us there are out here, the harder it will be for impeachophobics both inside and outside the beltway to rationalize their "condition."

I remain hopeful. There are signs that a little reality is leaking into the insular world of the beltway. They're still running around sticking their fingers in the holes like the little Dutch boy, but it seems to me that there is a growing note of hysteria behind the "in the know" declarations that impeachment is outside the realm of possibility.

[Marnieworld]

4. I agree with every word

I wish more Democratic Senators and Congresspeople, and Presidential Candidates boldly stated this very obvious fact like you just did. What will it take?

Not breaking FISA. They did this in plain sight.

[pat_k]

9. What will it take? Well. . .

. . .this is probably more than you bargained for, but here's my shot at an answer.

Right now, our biggest barrier to impeachment is not the opposition; it is the pervasive impeachophobia within our own ranks. And that impeachophobia is being fed by wrong-headed assumptions and rationalizations that have kept the Democratic establishment from standing up and "fighting the good fights" for decades.

Until those rationalizations are knocked down, our demands for impeachment will just slide off like water off a ducks back. Motivating people to call or email or fax is important because they demonstrate numbers, but, while numbers are necessary, they are not sufficient. There is a reason that Corporations spend millions on lobbyists. There is no substitute for face-to-face dialog, where you can elicit and directly contradict their rationalization for inaction.

So, in addition to the usual -- calls, faxes, emails -- making impeachment a reality is going to require more citizen lobbyists -- people willing to get in their faces, question them, challenge them, stop them and ask them to explain (just hearing themselves babbling nonsense to a skeptic can work wonders).

Confronting our leaders and their staffers up close and personal is critical, but it doesn't take large numbers. It can be incredibly rewarding, but it is not what most of us will be doing, or need to do. Many more of us will be "out here" in the trenches, working on each other, knocking down wrong-headed assumptions and rationalization in our own ranks. This may be the most critical task -- you get enough people out here and you start hearing our "memes" reflected back by the establishment

Lobbying for impeachment "out here" is like a game of "Whack a Mole." You knock down one rationalization and up pops another, but at least you know that you are not the only person whacking away. The beltway Dems are much harder nuts to crack. It's still a game of "Whack a Mole" but you are whacking away at rationalizations that are rarely challenged, and are constantly being reinforced, in the bizzaro world of the beltway.

Fortunately, reality is on our side. Even the most intractable rationalizations are showing signs of cracking.

• The Libby trial should be a final deathblow for the "we'll get Pres. Cheney" rationalization. It has always been assinine, but now even more so. (At the moment there are more calls to impeach Cheney than to impeach Bush).


• The Dems are already losing points because their impotent gestures have done nothing but confirm the public's perception that Democrats are weak.


• It may not be long before reality knocks down the belief that "investigations" are "sure to" expose some smoking gun that's bigger than the smoking cannons we've already got. (Exposure has never stopped the bushcheney steamroller before, it isn't about to now. Getting caught doesn't matter to them. They just keep doing what they are doing, or take what they've already taken and head off to subvert our will on some new front.)


• People who defend Pelosi's "off the table" edict with the "have to get things done" mantra are realizing that there is no magic solution to "rule by signing statement." Passing more laws for them to veto, nullify with signing statements, or just outright violate is not "getting things done," -- and that reality trumps any perception of activity. Those who don't wake up to this reality are going to be mystified when they get no "credit" for "working so hard."


• Those who are realizing that their refusal to impeach has doomed them to impotent gesture are comforting themselves with the notion that forcing the White House and the Republicans in the Senate to steamroll them is actually productive. They are "forcing them to go on the record." Of course, forcing people to "go on the record" for things they are already "on the record" for accomplishes nothing. That reality doesn't seem to be hitting them, but perhaps it eventually will.

So, what will it take? Who knows? But every time we challenge some immobilizing belief we are bringing reality of impeachment a little closer. We never see all the ripples that can radiate from a single act. When Members of Congress start saying "enough is enough, impeach them or bust!" we'll know we had a hand in making it happen, even if we just talked to a relative, or a neighbor, or "talked" to unseen others in forums like this.

We don't need a movement, we just need to move!

__________________

Related

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=337814">Collective denial and shared delusion are that powerful.

[Senator]

5. k&r

[OneBlueSky]

10. what we have in BushCo is a rogue executive . . .

that is running roughshod over the Constitution, U.S. law and treaties, and international law -- openly, blatantly, with full intent and no thought whatsoever of remorse . . . everyone with half a brain -- including the Congress (well, most of them) -- can see it, clearly and unambiguously . . .

AND NO ONE IS DOING ANYTHING TO STOP THEM!!! . . .

let me repeat that . . .

NO ONE IS DOING ANYTHING TO STOP THEM!!! . . .

the time for Congress to act is LONG overdue . . . the longer they wait, the more people will die in an ILLEGAL war . . . the more our rights will be trampled on . . . the more the environment will be devastated . . . the more people will fall into joblessness and poverty . . . the more people will go without healthcare . . . the more innocent people will be arbitrarily arrested without even knowing the charges against them . . . and on, and on, and on . . .

I JUST WANT SOMEONE TO DO SOMETHING TO STOP THEM!!! . . . AND NOW!!! . . .

(pardon the rant . . . I'm just pissed . . . )

[Senator]

11. keep ranting ... stay pissed

Find new ways to get that message across. And repeat the old ways.

---

[2008]

7. k&r (nt)

[formercia]

12. The Democrats don't want to own it

By getting rid of Bush and Cheney, solving the mess will be their responsibility. It won't be solved by 2008 and they're afraid they would be blamed and thus possibly lose the election.

[Senator]

16. By failing to impeach, they (and we) are "owning" torture

Because as gov't officials -- and in fact as the majority they ARE the US Gov't -- they are treaty-bound to report and/or take action to stop ongoing violations of the Geneva Conventions. Their current willful failure to do so is a war crime in itself.

Without impeachment, we all "own" these horrors -- rather than being the victims of a never-elected, never-legitimate regime.

To even consider political fortunes in this context is depraved.

But even by their own craven calculation, the risk to the party in 2008 is far greater from reinforcing the stereotype of weakness and lack of principle than from anything the Republican'ts will inevitably whine about.

--

[formercia]

20. I agree with your assesment

When you think of the horrors of War and the loss of life, wavering at the fear of the loss of a political career is cowardly.

When good men do nothing....

[porphyrian]

13. Fuck yeah. - n/t

[mmonk]

14. K&R

for truth and the true patriots in this country that demand our system be protected.

[shimmergal]

15. Whoa, ladies and gentlemen--

Impeachment would be fine IF we could be reasonably sure the Senate would vote to convict. But, the only two times American presidents have been impeached, this HASN'T HAPPENED. If Bush/
cheney beat an impeachment rap the same way, don't you think they'd be even more cocky and outrageous?

So, what to do. Yes, there is another remedy. Probably even more unlikely, but I suggest we start some smart lawyers looking into the possibility of, once the 2008 election is over, pursuing the case that all legislation enacted with Bush's signature is null and void, as he was not legitimately elected. Same for his executive orders (not to mention those weird signing statements.) At least it would clear the record and get rid of some of his worst abuses.

If I thought it would be effecftive, sure I'd be for impeachment. Unfortunately, I don't think we're there yet. It will take a massive swell on anger on the part of the public. Do you-all who're working for impeachment think you can succeed in activating this? It's never happened in American history before.

[Senator]

18. Giddyup! It Is Our Only Moral, Patriotic Option

First, what may or may not happen in the Senate is irrelevant to the decision to impeach. For members of the House, it is "above their Constitutional pay grade." The charging and judgement functions were separated for good reason. So any consideration of Senate result is in fact a partisan-political calculation -- weighing that risk/benefit against acting to defend the Constitution, as the oath of office demands.

The same is true on a more general level. Even without Senate conviction/removal, impeachment would at least be a mark of objection for the American People. An indelible marker put down for future abuses and abusers, as is its purpose. It is a moral imperative in and of itself.

But even under the proposed Ziskey Theory of Action* (the "we need 67 votes" or no go), I would still like to believe that, once put on the spot, less than 30 GOP Senators would stand up for history to approve and defend torture and war crimes. Your mileage may vary.

Second, you (and they) are fearing fear itself. There isn't something "more cocky and outrageous" than Urinary Authoritarian Executve Theory**. As with Nixon, the minions have already testfied that there are no limits on it. It is in fact overt fascism/monarchism/new-euphemism.

And that's not the only reason that yes, "we're there yet." The "massive swell" in the public has already occurred. Currently 58% of the public just want the bushcheney regime "to be over." That's up from 51% who wanted impeachment to be "a priority" with the new Dem majority. And among that 40-someting that do not yet support it, a considerable number are self-identified Dems presumedly following the cue of their DC "leadership."

And this is the public on its own. In the face of full resistance/denial from the DC/Euphemedia Analstocracy. As the circumstances of this impeachment would be "Reverse Clinton"*** those numbers would certainly go up nearly overnight should it become "allowed."

As for your other remedial suggestions, they are also necessary -- but no substitute for impeachment. But the fear-based "alternatives" the DC Dems are pursuing like rats in a maze -- like the Cut the Funding Hoax -- they are just pipedreams in the face of "Rule By Signing Statement."

Only Impeachment ... gets the American People off the hook for that which they never gave their consent. It is the only way to even begin to Redeem Our National Soul -- in the eyes of the world, for ouselves, and for future generations of Americans.

It's the only thing that makes any sense on any level - moral, logical, political, historical, electoral -- you name it. (That is, if one's not mired in the Beltway Bedlam Blather Bubble.)

It is our ONLY meaningful option.

==============
* "Never hit anyone in anger -- unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." -- Russell Ziskey

** Urinary Executive or Urinary Authoritarian Executive (slang, DCspeak) n., (en)title -- the "newly-discovered," or "inherent" (i.e., faith-based) Constitutional Authority for an appointed ruler (as opposed to elected leader) to piss down the back of the American People and tell them it's raining. See also, Trickle-Down Economics

*** The overt propaganda to do so notwithstanding, it is oxymoronic to consider the Clinton impeachment as comparable or instructive now. It's not just apples and oranges, the circumstances are diametrically opposite. Clinton was a popular, twice-elected president -- impeached for less-than-trivial reasons -- by a party in danger of being seen as extremists. Bushcheney is an unpopular, never-elected, never-legitimate regime -- being impeached for torture/war crimes, spying on Americans, and terrorizing the nation into war -- by a party that might be in danger of being seen as conscious or vertebrate.

--

[L. Coyote]

17. Mar. 10 Daily Impeachment News: post high crimes

This discussion linked from:

Mar. 10 Daily Impeachment News: post high crimes and misdemeanor news here
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x383208

This thread is an idea being tested.
If the DU Community wants to have a daily thread like this, it will be obvious by your PARTICIPATION.

POST DU discussion links, articles, start the thread in the morning with a link to the previous thread and an article, kick only if buried, etc.
I'm not able to continue this daily beginning in a few days.

VOTE for the daily thread by keeping it alive.

Add a post there now!

[stonebone]

19. kick

[Quantess]

21. About time for another K&R

[Karenina]

22. Torches and pitchforks. n/t