iWaste: Ten thousand songs in your pocket. Ten thousand years in a landfill.

[babylonsister]

http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2007/03/iwaste.html

Commentary: Ten thousand songs in your pocket. Ten thousand years in a landfill.

By Giles Slade

March/April 2007 Issue


Good for you. The lesson of how vhs made Betamax obsolete in the '80s is still part of your folk memory, so you didn't buy a Blu-ray or hd dvd player last December. As a video refusenik, unsure which format would win the dvd wars, you demonstrated a sophisticated appreciation of product obsolescence and decided not to buy a new device until you knew it would play movies for years to come. Or perhaps you're still smarting from being burned again and again by audio obsolescence: Albums went to eight-tracks, and then to cassettes, before CDs were introduced. With each change, audiophiles repurchased the classics.

These days, the champion of audio obsolescence is Apple, which successfully combined its iPod with a unique digital format (aac). By embracing a non-MP3 format, Apple locked you into its world. Now, when your iPod breaks, you have a library of music that you can't use on other players. You have to buy another iPod. Enjoy your music for as long as your iPods lasts. Apple says that will be for years; for us nitpickers that means about 13 months.

Yes, the secret is out. After 13 months of heavy use, the lithium-ion battery of the iPod can lose more than half of its functionality. You'll find that even though you recharge more often, your iPod can fade out by the end of a long day. Simply put, even though an iPod can cost you $350, these digital music players are designed to be disposable.

Then why not get a new battery? Good idea. But Apple deliberately seals the battery inside the iPod. Replacement costs $65 (a new 1-gig iPod shuffle costs $79), takes several weeks, and worst of all—because the new battery comes in a refurbished and wiped-clean iPod—you'll lose all your songs.

Or you can say, "Screw Apple," opt for an aftermarket battery kit, and repair your own machine. It's easy, cheaper, and more fun than having Apple fix it. The kit from Sonnet Inc. (sonnettech.com) is especially useful. For $19.95 it includes a special iPod opening tool, but best of all it comes with a dvd showing exactly what to do. If you're not into do-it-yourself, you could send your iPod to any one of the outfits such as Small Dog Electronics (smalldog.com) that repair or resell these digital throwaways.

But battery decline is only one way that Apple encourages speedy obsolescence. Another is by introducing spiffy new models shortly after you've acquired the latest thing. December's iPod looks a little duller since the introduction of the iPhone, doesn't it? The screen is probably already scratched. Time, then, to let you know about the three models of next-generation iPods that, scuttlebutt says, will be available this year. As Steve Jobs said, "If you...want the latest and greatest...you have to buy a new iPod at least once a year." Yes, this is from the same man who wants you to know that "Apple has a really strong environmental policy."

more...

[Kolesar]

1. Better than snowmobiling

This consumerist world...everyday another travail...sigh

[kiahzero]

2. This is just a guy hawking a book.

Giles Slade is the author of Made to Break: Technology and Obsolescence in America.

From the "quality" of this editorial, I'd say it's not a very good book either.

[babylonsister]

3. But he has a point; your battery dies in your iPod, what do you do

with it? Time to buy another? Brilliant marketing, makes them lots of money, but there are consequences.

[kiahzero]

6. Depends on how old the iPod is.

Right now I have a 60GB iPod Video that's about a year old. If the battery died on it, I'd pay the $70 to replace the battery rather than the $350 to replace the whole thing. Similarly, my Mom's laptop battery just died. Yes, the replacement battery is expensive ($160), but a new laptop would be four times the cost at $600+.

There's some R&D being done to develop new battery types that don't wear down as quickly, but for right now, Lithium Ion is the superior technology, so I can't really fault Apple for using them. From the editorial, it seems like the author would rather there not be MP3 players, PCs, or other new technologies because they'll eventually get surpassed by newer technologies. That's a profoundly silly argument.

[Canuckistanian]

54. His argument is that Apple DELIBERATELY introduces obsolescence

The battery is just one problem. The inability of iPods to play MP3s is a major liability, IMO.

I bought a cheap iPod knockoff for about $60 that does everything the nano does AND it can play MPG, WAV, WMA and ASF audio files. Plus, it plays AMV video files (converter app included), does picures, FM radio, recording, a text reader and a game.

AND it's easy to open and replace it's battery.

I don't miss having an iPod at all. And I'll bet mine will be around for a lot longer.

[kiahzero]

58. iPods can't play MP3s?

That's odd, because I have 2000 MP3s on mine, and it seems to play them just fine. Maybe you should listen to the multitudes of people here telling you that the author is full of shit.

[Canuckistanian]

65. Sorry, my mistake.

I was under the impression that iPods didn't do MP3s.

Please disregard previous post about compatibility.

[Fierce]

61. Lots of industries and companies do.

Apple is certainly not the only one.

[quiet.american]

18. Guess I was lucky in that the Apple store just handed me a new one.

I didn't even have a receipt because I'd won the first one in an office party raffle. But when it shut down for good, I took it into the Apple store, they handed me a new one and sent me on my way.

[Xithras]

69. How about replacing it? It's not that hard

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-10165_7-5643378-1.html

It's a bit more involved than snapping off a battery cover, but it's a very straightforward process.

For what it's worth, cell phones are a much larger welectronic waste issue than iPods will ever hope to be.

[Codeine]

72. What do you do?

Pop the sucker open and slap a new battery in; it's about ten times easier than you'd think it would be.

[Atman]

89. The myth of Apple products being non-upgradable/fixable persists

I remember my candy iMac 400DV. Great computer. It ran for years; I only replaced it with a 20" G5 about 18 months ago. When the hard drive went on the old iMac, I went to comp USA and bought an 80gb drive for cheap. I had the case open in about 2 minutes, snapped in the new drive and was up and running in no time. I also put in a gig of ram.

People just have this bizarre misconception about Apple...I'm surprised there aren't people still saying "Yeah, but they'll be going out of business any day now!"

.

[Zhade]

81. Convert the songs to mp3. Duh.

Despite Apple's fervent wish, there are in fact ways to do this.

[Clark2008]

86. My husband's iPod is more than a year old - closing in on two

years old and there's not a thing wrong with it.

:shrug:

[Atman]

90. Mine is nearly three years old

It is used almost every day. I take it snowboarding with me every time I go out. It has been subjected to subzero weather for hours on end, I've fallen on it, I've dug it out of pocket covered in snow. I have never used the CD player in my car, I take the iPod with me every time I drive.

It still runs perfectly. The click-wheel is a bit dirty, and the case seems antique compared to my son's slick, skinny video iPod. But it runs and runs and runs.

.

[AZBlue]

87. And how about the fact that iPods in general don't last long (aside from battery issues).

Based upon the problems I've seen with them, I always assumed Apple made them to be disposable and only last 12-24 months. Kind of like cell phones these days too!

[kiahzero]

96. That'd be interesting if it were a fact, but it's not. (n/t)

[Tesha]

122. Hmmm... Your second-hand observations differ from my direct experiences.

While it is true that hard-drive-based iPods do have
a nasty tendency to break when dropped on concrete
floors, Apple is actually pretty good about replacing
them for a reasonable fee as long as the case doesn't
show obvious impact damage.

And *ASIDE* from the hard drives breaking when dropped
on the floor, reliability of the particular iPods I'm
familiar with has been good; our 30 GB iPod got handed-
on down to the kid when we bought our 40 GB Gen-3 a
few years ago and our 8 GB Nano still has that "new
iPod smell". My son-in-law's 4 GB Gen-1 Nano is fine
too.

I keep trying to talk Mr. Tesha into buying a new
60 GB iPod Video to replace his old Gen-3, but he
says it's still working fine (and it is) and he's
holding out until at least the next generation.

Tesha

[AZBlue]

125. Oh, you have good iPod karma!

:)

[ISUGRADIA]

4. Not totally accurate which make me question his thesis

"By embracing a non-MP3 format, Apple locked you into its world. Now, when your iPod breaks, you have a library of music that you can't use on other players. Now, when your iPod breaks, you have a library of music that you can't use on other players. You have to buy another iPod. "

I only have MP3s on my Ipod. There is nothing to stop anyone from putting MP3s only on one's I-Pod.

[electron_blue]

7. Yeah, and the latest Ipod's are made so you can change the batts yourself.

I wonder what else the op has wrong.

[babylonsister]

11. I got one for my b'day, a nano. DH was told about the battery pooping

out, so he bought the 2-year warranty.:shrug:

[kiahzero]

8. I think I have about 5 AACs on mine.

Out of 12GB of music.

I think he's getting confused between ITMS and iPod. Then again, he appears to be an idiot, so that's not surprising.

[genie_weenie]

34. One can also burn discs using iTunes in an MP3 format

if I'm not mistaken...

[Tesha]

76. The author's making an allusion to Apple's "Protected AAC" format

The author's making an allusion to Apple's "Protected AAC" format.

If you buy music from the iTunes music store, the author is one-
third-right: You can only play that music on an iPod or Apple's
iTunes application (which, of course, is distributed for *FREE*
and runs on any recent Windows or Macintosh PC). And, oh yeah,
you can burn audio CDs from those protected AACs.

But if you use MP3s, there are no restrictions. Neither are there
any restrictions if you rip your own CDs into unprotected AACs.
Or Apple Lossless files.

The article is wrong in many other details as well.

Tesha

[ISUGRADIA]

78. That's true

I use another program to save music as MP3 files then add the folders to iTunes. Then much more flexibility as you mention.

[Zhade]

82. No, the author's still wrong. AAC files CAN be converted.

Just Google it up - it's not hard to find. :)

[Tesha]

91. I was speaking solely about the capabilities provided by Apple

I was speaking solely about the capabilities provided by
Apple (and the author is way wrong even there).

I had/have no doubt that others have cracked the DRM
"protections" provided by the Protected AAC format,
but given the fact that Apple already allows pretty
easy use of the format and most of my files are
unprotected AACs anyway, the "cracks" are only of
academic interest to me.

Tesha

[kiahzero]

97. You can get them out of PAAC with iTunes. (n/t)

[Tesha]

98. Not as MP3 or other no-DRM files you can't.

> You can get them out of PAAC with iTunes.

Not as MP3 or other no-DRM files you can't.

You can get them out in the form of a Digital
Audio CD, which you could then re-rip, but
you'll now be down one more level in the "lossy
compression" games (unless you re-rip with a
lossless CODEC).

Tesha

[kiahzero]

100. You don't lose anything additional from the re-ripping.

You'll lose that even if you could convert directly from AAC -> MP3.

[Tesha]

104. I'm sorry, but you're wrong.

Each time you convert from a lossy format, you
lose information.

That's why it's called "lossy" compression.

You're right that you can convert technically-
similar formats (e.g., MP3 and AAC) back and forth
with minimal loss, but decoding from the lossy
format to the raw format and back again *DEFINITELY*
entails more loss.

That's precisely why the DRM gods don't get bent
out of shape about this "loophole".

Tesha

[kiahzero]

110. You lose the same going lossyA -> lossyB as you do lossyA -> raw -> lossyB. (n/t)

[Tesha]

113. It depends on the algorithms and what they decide to lose. (NT)

[kiahzero]

118. True enough.

However, in the specific case of AAC -> MP3, I don't think there's actually a difference between going straight to MP3 and going to a raw format first.

[Eric J in MN]

124. You can also convert songs downloaded from iTunes to MP3s....

...by burning a CD, and then ripping from the CD.

[OnyxCollie]

5. I bought my iPod three years ago.

I changed the battery myself last summer. Cost me $15 at CompUSA.

This guy's pimpin' a book, eh? When I worked at Borders, paperback books that didn't sell were stripped of their covers and tossed into the dumpster. Glad to see this guy's concerned about the environment. :sarcasm:

[kiahzero]

9. LOL (n/t)

[WinkyDink]

12. O/T, but why weren't those books sent back as remainders to the publisher(s)?

[OnyxCollie]

15. Cost too much to send 'em back. Just strip the covers for credit.

Every week we would toss out three or four boxes of books. Once in a while, we would have to shoo some people out of the dumpster. No environmentalists, just people who didn't have the balls to steal directly from the store itself.

Speaking of theft, carrying my music on an iPod relieves me of dragging around bags of CD's to listen to in the car. Ever have your car broken into? I have, and I'd prefer to have my music in my pocket than in some thief's hands.

[kiahzero]

17. I know this is offtopic, but...

How is that stealing from the store? You didn't want the books anymore, and threw them into the trash.

[OnyxCollie]

20. City ordinances in the area the store was located prohibited garbage picking.

Perhaps not stealing, per se, but definitely against the law.

[kiahzero]

22. OK (n/t)

[leeroysphitz]

30. If the books are GARBAGE why do you label it theft?

I call it recycling...

[OnyxCollie]

36. The books never stopped being the property of Borders.

Borders policy was to destroy the books. The books were put in a dumpster from a private company contracted by Borders to destroy the books. At no point did these books enter the public domain. There was no "Free To A Good Home" sign. As I previously stated, city ordinances prohibited garbage-picking. Look, I'm not trying to pick a fight. I understand your position. However, if these people wanted the books they could have purchased them. My hours were cut because sales goals were not met. Would you want someone getting something for "free" while your hours were cut?

Ever work in a restaurant or grocery store? Outdated food is either destroyed or sent back. Eating outdated food will likely get you fired.

[kiahzero]

47. Clearly, the books were overpriced

Their value was somewhere between the price they didn't sell at, and the price ($0) that they did.

:evilgrin:

[OnyxCollie]

79. Damn staight!

Having worked in book/record stores for over a decade, I found it appalling how much "product" ended up in bargain bins/landfills.

Anyone purchase/listen to the Oscar de la Hoya CD? Anyone? Didn't think so...

[WinkyDink]

10. Don't have an iPod, won't ever get one. Can't stand ear-phones or -buds.

I don't need music 24/7.

[misanthrope]

126. So don't use the ear buds...

...They exacerbate my tinnitus so I'm no fan either.

However, I use my iPod all the time, either playing it through my computer (and the speakers and sub-woofer attached) or through the FM transmitter in my car and over the automobile stereo.

[AlCzervik]

13. i have the original mini thats now 3 1/2 years old and it's still runnning on the same battery

full disclosure--my husband works for apple.

[gollygee]

14. I've had my ipod for a few years and it's fine

*shrug*

If it breaks, I can get another ipod, hook it up to my computer, and synch. Voila, no songs lost.

[winston61]

25. that's just the point-

multiply your ipod times a million going to the landfill. Just because you throw it away, does not mean it vaporises. At least give it away and let someone else put a battery in it.

[gollygee]

37. Apple has a recycle program

so I'd use that. Where did I say it would end up in a landfill?

[winston61]

16. It's not just ipods

Everything for sale to consumers is crap. Nothing is designed or built to last or to be repaired. I call it the WalMartization of America. Retailers are hawking extended warranties so nothing has to be worth a hoot anymore. If it breaks, so what? Take the warranty back to Best Buy or Wally World and get some more worthless crap. Send the old worthless crap to the landfill. You can try to resist buying the warranties but when you buy something and it WILL break, try to get it repaired. You can't. Are you old enough to remember when a television was considered a durable good? Not any more. When you buy something now it is not question of IF it will break, but WHEN. Ive seen mass market lawn equipment labeled with the warning not to expect more the 50 hours of service. When is the last time you saw a TV repair shop? My boss bought a Homelite leaf blower. It broke. Guess what? Homelite has no repair or parts pipeline. They told us to throw it away and get a new one. More crap for the consumer and more landfill garbage. The sad part is we've got a generation raised up to expect nothing in the way of quality. They expect products to be crap and they know it will break and they will have to get a new one. And they are OK with that. America. And Jesus wept.

[kiahzero]

19. ... right.

"My 80386 doesn't work anymore! Why won't anyone repair it?"

:eyes:

[winston61]

26. it's the same problem with Computers.

they are designed to be replaced. Technology exists so that a cpu could be made to last. But where is the profit in selling something that lasts?

[kiahzero]

27. They do make them last where it's useful to do so.

My choice of the 80386 was ironic, since the chip (over 20 years old now) is still used in aircraft autopilot systems. Similarly, ancient (for the computing world) "big iron" mainframe systems are still up and running, because there's no need to replace them.

However, there is absolutely no point in maintaining a computer that long for home use, nor is there a point in building it to last beyond its useful period. Tech consumers do want their purchases to "last," but lasting has a significantly different meaning in fields where the state of the art is advancing by leaps and bounds on a regular basis. As an example, look at hard drives. Some companies, such as Western Digital, were heavily criticized for their hard drives being cheaply made and failing early after a year or two.

[nolabels]

127. OMG, the 80386 is twenty years old?

The 80386 was in the first P.C. i ever owned, man those were the days :crazy:


Btw, all this plug and play stuff is so much more fun :thumbsup:

[The Cleaner]

21. APPLE OFFERS 10% DISCOUNT ON NEW IPODS WHEN YOU RECYCLE YOUR OLD ONE

Although I despise the fact you are locked in to their proprietary non-MP3 format and cannot change the battery..and the HELL if I'm buying a new $350 IPOD every year...(I don't even own an IPOD, don't plan to feed such hideous consumerism)...

A free iPod recycling program, conducted through Apple’s retail stores, offers environmentally friendly disposal and a 10% discount on the purchase of a new iPod.

http://www.apple.com/environment/recycling/

[kiahzero]

41. Well...

If you did have an iPod, you would know you aren't locked into a proprietary non-MP3 format, you can change the battery, and you don't have to buy a new iPod yearly.

[The Cleaner]

46. Oh brother, I was getting my info from the OP.

"By embracing a non-MP3 format, Apple locked you into its world. Now, when your iPod breaks, you have a library of music that you can't use on other players."

Steve jobs SUGGESTED STRONGLY people get a new IPOD every year.

:eyes:

You're nitpicking dude...

[kiahzero]

49. It's hardly a nitpick

Jobs said that you would have to get a new one every year if you wanted the latest and greatest. Since Apple updates all their products on a yearly basis, if you are, for some reason, obsessed with having the newest, shiniest toy, it is a fact that you will have to buy a new one every year.

As for the so-called lock-in, it doesn't exist unless you buy your music on ITMS, and you can unlock your music with iTunes, some time, and a modicum of intelligence (or a little more skill and a few free third-party programs).

[The Cleaner]

99. Even if you could "unlock" it, it sounds like a difficult process

that is not accessible to the average person. That's why they say "lock." Sure if you know exactly where to go and exactly what steps to take you could unlock it, but to the average person they don't have the wherewithal or time to go searching around for all that. Why doesn't Apple just make it MP3? That's the whole point dude.

As for Jobs' comment, I have no argument with what you say. It's just abhorrent to me personally because it feeds this annoying, anti-environmental consumerism in our throw-away society. Also abhorrent is this damn braggy selfish nonsense that "I've got mine and the hell with everyone else," not to mention keeping up with the Joneses which is just plain silliness. Having to purchase IPODS and such every year just to make oneself look wealthy and admirable is disgusting IMHO.

Now go bother someone else with your instigations.
:eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes:

[kiahzero]

101. More eyerolls = more better?

Apple doesn't make it MP3 because the music companies insisted on having DRM for making their music available online.

It's trivially easy to get around the DRM, to the point where I wonder whether Apple intended it to be so easy - burn it to a CD-RW, then rip the tracks back off. It'll take a total of about 10 minutes per CD.

[The Cleaner]

106. I have no choice but to eyeroll your comments.

Go take it up with the author of the article on the OP then.

Bye bye

[mondo joe]

103. More made-up shit.

The unlock - which NO ONE NEEDS TO DO - is insanely simple. But again, NO ONE NEEDS TO DO IT unless they CHOOSE to purchase that way.

And the idea that people buy iPods to "look wealthy" is plain crazy.

[The Cleaner]

108. Oh please.

The idea that Steve Jobs is promoting this kind of materialism and consumerism, not to mention anti-environmentalism as one year old IPODs go in the landfills, is abhorrent to me. Also abhorrent is people re-buying trendy stuff every year or so just to one-up on their friends, coworkers, etc.

"Look at me! I'm awesome! I'm wealthy and prestigious! I buy a $350 IPOD every year because I can and the hell with everyone else, or using that money to help others!"
:puke:

(resisting more eyerolls)

[mondo joe]

116. How much of CD wrappers (not to mention CDs) end up in land fills vs

iPods - especially since Apple incentivizes recycling?

PS: iPods come in a variety of price points, and no one thinks you need to be wealthy to own one.

[Tesha]

128. Apple doesn't make it MP3 because...

Apple doesn't make it MP3 because:

1. AAC is a better format. It offers equal fidelity for
about 3/4 the number of bits compared to MP3.

2. Protected AAC contains the Digital Rights Management
that the music *OWNERS* insisted on before they would
allow the Apple iTunes Music Store to sell their songs.

BTW, Steve Jobs is *ON RECORD* as opposing DRM and
has called for the music owners to allow the sale
of their material without DRM protections.

Tesha

[Tesha]

77. Why would you expect to need a new iPod every year? (NT)

[NashVegas]

23. "Planned Obsolescence"

Is a phrase I first heard about 10-13 years ago, in regards to Microsoft computers. With OS X, Apple embraced it as well.

I've had a DVD player that got used maybe twice a month die on me, at under two years of age. And it wasn't a cheapie when I bought it. Not top-of-the-line but not cheap, either.

Last autumn I was forced to buy a new TV, and went ahead & got a HD LCD flat screen. The sales clerk offered to sell me an extended, 4-year warranty. I told him, "buddy, if this thing breaks down anytime within 10 years, it's a piece of shit and you're going to hear from me."

[msongs]

28. you chose to buy a new tv you were not forced. life is possible without a tv...:-) nt

[NashVegas]

40. Life Yes, But Then I Like My Paycheck

And without that window into pop culture, I'd be disadvantaged.

If I had to choose between losing my TV and my computer/internet, the TV would win. If for no other reason than I can engage in other physical activities (exercise, cooking, what have you) and still be using the tube. Kind of hard to type while you're in upward-facing dog.

[ben_meyers]

35. The Waste Makers

by Vance Packard from the 50's was all about planned obsolescence. Also see The Hidden Persuaders by Packard about media manipulation.

[kiahzero]

42. How did OSX "embrace planned obsolescence?" (n/t)

[NashVegas]

66. Hard and Software

In addition to the obvious (necessary processor speed/type) there's the business of necessary upgrades for certain programs. For example, I can't run the latest version of QT without the $129 OS upgrade.

[kiahzero]

73. It looks like they're actually making kernel-level changes.

Granted, that's from a limited amount of reading I've done since you pointed this out, so if you have more information on it, I'd love to read it. However, with that being said, it looks like they are making changes to the OS that will allow more functionality in Quicktime, so it's not really accurate to call that planned obsolescence.

[Zhade]

83. Trust me, if the clerk's still there in ten years, he won't give a SHIT what your complaint is.

NT!

[Vanje]

24. Giles! I want your obsolete Ipod!

really. I want one.
i'll pay the postage.

[ContraBass Black]

29. Did Apple commit a uniqie moral failing by not inventing a magical new lithium-ion battery

That lasts for ever, or are all the manufacturers of portable media players and cell phones fundamentally and unapologetically evil?



And shame on them for introducing new models when someone has already bought the old ones! The car manufacturers , desktop computer manufacturers, and digital camera manufacturers too! Environment hating hogs, they are!

[The_Casual_Observer]

31. ipod = waste of money.

Stale music in a compressed format, extra steps to "download" "podcasts". I've got better stuff too do.

[winston61]

45. Amen to that,

How many more ways can we create to take people's money and give them nothing in return?

[kiahzero]

50. Maybe for you.

Mine was money well spent. :shrug:

[mondo joe]

56. Waste is in the eye of the beholder. My iPod was a great investment.

I find it particularly helpful when running.

[achtung_circus]

63. It's only stale music

if you choose to load stale music.

[gravity]

32. Ipods are really small

They aren't going to take up much space in landfills. Its less damaging than throwing out a single CD jewel case. The average person throws away much more junk than this on a daily basis.

Also this article gets angry at Apple updating and improving their models every year which is just stupid.

[Name removed]

Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ContraBass Black]

39. Correction: Guy combines several properties of Li-powered portable devices

With Apple's excessive DRM, declares them proof of Apple's sinister design of planned obsolescence and willful disregard of environmental consequence. DU rolls eyes, points out fallacies, makes jokes.

[Pab Sungenis]

33. You also don't "lose" any songs.

Your songs, videos, podcasts, games, etc. are tied to your library on your computer, not the pod.

I had a 4th generation pod, and when its hard drive died I upgraded to the 5th generation because they added video. Unless the 6th generation has a much larger and wider screen, I'm not upgrading, I'll get this one refurbed.

My 4th gen didn't go to waste, either. I gave it to a hobbyist who's refurbbing it himself.

[mondo joe]

38. Inane. Point 1: you don't lose the songs, unless you delete them from your computer.

Point two: who the hell buys technology and expects it to last forever?

This isn't an armoire - it's a device that will be surpassed in a few months.

[SoCalDem]

43. WE still HAVE our 8-tracks & the stereo to play them

:rofl:

The landfill problem is NOT our fault :)

[Richard Steele]

51. We keep ours right next to our vinyl, some of which is 60 years old.

And play them both on a 37 year old Weltron M2005, which
sits next to a CD/Cassette player that's almost 20.

I was raised to bring stuff HOME from the landfill, knowhutImean?

[SoCalDem]

52. We also still have lawnchairs that we "rescued" from someone's trash

All they needed was re-webbing:)

[july302001]

44. Author has a point

You guys are tearing up this guy. I realize he's selling a book (made of dead trees), but he's got a point.

What if the Chairman of Apple were a gung-ho right-winger instead of a socially liberal entrepreneur?

Then, the author would probably be lauded and the manufacturer would probably be pilloried.

I don't own an iPod or any kind of digital music player.

I do own a 1-year old digital camera that I intend to use for a while longer. I'm typing this on a PC that I bought used.

There's an electronics recycling place in a nearby town. That's where I take old computer gear. Old iPods should go back for recycling or to an electronics recycler. Although small, they do contain toxic components, as do almost all electronics.

[kiahzero]

48. Which is why Apple offers an iPod recycling program.

I know the owner of Dell is a right-winger, but I don't excoriate Dell for its laptops or music players any more or less than I do Apple.

[Zhade]

84. Most of his points are dead WRONG.

NT!

[cgrindley]

53. article = retarded and incorrect

My ipod has been going strong for 3 years--at least 3 hours per day on the train to NYC and back.

I digitized my CD collection. There are *only* mp3's on my ipod. ipod plays mp3's.

[Richard Steele]

55. Yes indeed. I don't care to own an iPod myself, but I loaded my sweetie's full of MP3s for her.

When he makes that blatantly FALSE claim that iPods
don't play MP3s, he removes all doubt that he's just
writing a thinly-veiled anti-Apple hit piece.

After a riduculous claim like that, there's little point
in wasting time debunking the rest of it.

There are many valid issues to discuss re: the wastefulness
of our consumer culture, but this partisan hack is not the
person to discuss them with.

[trumad]

59. No MP3's? LOL

My kids will get a kick out of that one....

[FreeState]

60. Mine is almost 4 years old and used over 3 hours a day

on the original battery and it is all MP3's as well.

[blues90]

57. I am still behind the times

My computer is 11 years old running 98SE . We still use a VHS and cassette audio and I have a few CD's and one player and an XM radio . And an old cell phone .

[KoKo]

64. How are you able to function on DU with 98SE? How do you handle

JavaScript and Video? :shrug:

I'm asking because I keep everything...believing in Use as "Use it Up...Wear it Out...and Make Do" but I had to upgrade my computer because processing, video cards and the rest made it impossible for me to function to get my LIBERAL NEWS!

I only got on Computers in 1996...so maybe I missed the HELP that would have allowed my old "64-K Memory with Win'95" to still function today...but I do know that I couldn't post on DU with that Computer or the one I just had to "mothball" that had over 1 gigabyte and an Internet Savvy Sound Card for Win ME and I bought in 2000.

How do YOU DO IT! I would like to know...because I couldn't find any way to deal with the frustrations of downloads and upgrades that swamped my capacity? :shrug:

[blogslut]

93. I often surf DU

On an IBM 500x laptop with a 133MGHZ CPU, Windows 95 and a dialup connection. :)

[michaelwb]

95. That's nothing

I surf the web with the same etch-a-sketch I used as a child. ;)

Virus and spyware free since 1969!

[Richard Steele]

109. Wow. You're hardcore, dude!

[Jonathan50]

62. The Vista landfill layer.

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2007/01/uk_green_party.php

"Future archaeologists will be able to identify a 'Vista Upgrade Layer' when they go through our landfill sites."

The Green Party in the UK has raised some real issues about the release of Vista today. Their big issue is that no provision has been made by Microsoft or the computer manufacturers to deal with the inevitable hardware upgrade cycle. They call it defective by design- "Beneath the gloss they have hidden traps that take away important consumer rights, force expensive and environmentally damaging hardware upgrades." Evidently video and sound cards may have to be upgraded to deal with "digital rights management" and play Blue-Ray and HD disks. Vista will also be power hungry, as it requires more processing time to encrypt and decrypt 'premium' content, and looks around the computer every few milliseconds to check that nothing is trying to distribute de-coded 'premium' video or sound.

More:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

67. Good Lord.

Vista will also be power hungry, as it requires more processing time to encrypt and decrypt 'premium' content

Vista is shit, but this is the most goddamn retarded argument against it that I've ever heard.

[kiahzero]

70. Yeah, pretty much.

There are plenty of legitimate reasons to hate Vista; there's no need to make up illegitimate ones to supplement them.

[Initech]

68. This is why I don't do e-music services.

The one thing I absolutely hate about iTunes is the fact that you have to have certain things for it to be able to work. I just say fuck it, and buy the CDs as I have been doing for years. It's perfectly understandable as to why a lot of the bands I listen to aren't on iTunes.

[Zhade]

85. You don't do them based on incorrect arguments that are easily debunked?

Then you're missing out!

[gollygee]

71. I wonder if anyone has ever caculated how much waste *isn't* created

due to how many albums have been downloaded off itunes instead of being bought on CDs, which come with packaging, much of which at some point ends up in a landfill.

[ContraBass Black]

75. Or the cds that eventually end up in landfills themselves.

[Tesha]

74. The "facts" in this article are so wrong it is pathetic. (NT)

[Zhade]

80. That argument would work, if there weren't ways to convert the files to mp3.

Since there are, the argument is based on a flawed (and ignorant) premise.

[Atman]

88. Most people who don't own iPods seem to think you must use Apple's aac

You don't have to buy one single fucking song from Apple. Not a one. I've heard so many people say they won't own an iPod because they don't want to have to purchase music from Apple. That is just plain WRONG. And even if you do, you can rip 'em out to a CD. Unfortunately, as with most things in our consumer pop culture, when a company hits a homerun the detractors, the also-rans and the left-behinds come out of the wordwork to decry that which they don't understand.

My iPod has 3204 pieces of music on it, enough for over nine days of non-repeat music. Of those 3204 tracks, only 277 are from Apple's store. And of those 277, I can convert every one of them to a CD playable in any CD player. This author is just totally full of crap.

.

[JCMach1]

92. Yes, Virginia iPods suck!

Plenty of alternatives out there with better options...

[GreenZoneLT]

94. Why would you lose your songs?

Your songs are all in your iTunes library on your PC, so you can always reload your iPod if it gets wiped clean. Can't see how it's a problem.

Imagine that. Apple is in the business of selling you new gadgets. Duh. You don't have to buy them.

[mikeytherat]

102. OMG! I have the mythical, Golden iPod! It has AACs, MP3s and WAV files

on it. It must be some sort of Super-iPod!

Please don't tell anyone - Apple might want it back!

mikey_the_rat

[ryanmuegge]

105. oh, christ! He dared to criticize the Holy Apple Corporation.

Let the DU flaming begin.

[kiahzero]

107. Yeah, the complete lack of accuracy has nothing to do with it. (n/t)

[ryanmuegge]

111. Apple DOES try to con you into spending 70 bucks (give or take) to replace the battery

That's just a fact. I don't see what's so inaccurate about that. Lithium ion batteries do lose their charge capacity in time. This is a technological fact.

And people who bought the first-generation Nano probably do have to deal with scratched surfaces and screens (of course, an LCD protector seems like a common sense necessity on an investment like that).

What's so inaccurate about the article?

[kiahzero]

112. How is it a con?

As for what's inaccurate about the article, please read the thread.

[ryanmuegge]

115. I have read it and see nothing but Apple-praising bumper sticker rhetoric

...nothing substantively debunking what the article said in a factual manner.

Ok, it isn't actually a "con," per se. It's pretty obvious, though, that they seal off access to the batteries for a reason: to get you to buy another iPod. Thus, they are made to be disposable...which seems to be the whole point of the article.

[kiahzero]

119. You can replace the batteries yourself, you can have a third-party do it.

They seal the batteries because they don't want end-users screwing with it willy-nilly, just like power supplies and CRTs.

[Tesha]

121. Go read my reply #76 as well as the others...

Go read my reply #76 as well as the others by other DUers
that point out that the error in his basic claim (that the
music playable on iPods can't be played anywhere else).

It's also been pointed out multiple times that iPod batteries
not only don't die after a year but are replaceable when they
eventually *DO* die, even if it takes some tools/guts/money to
do it.

We haven't raised "bumper sticker rhetoric", we've raised
basic, factual inaccuracies in the article.

Tesha

[mondo joe]

117. No, he dared to be completely factually wrong. NT

[dysfunctional press]

114. i don't know too many "audiophiles" who bought 8-tracks or cassettes.

and a lot of the true audiophiles haven't switched to cd's yet either.

[Buzz Clik]

120. iPOD? I don't think so.

I bought one the first hard-drive based MP3 players (Creative Nomad), and it's still playing like a fiend. Multi-gigs of pure heaven. It's exactly the same size as CD player, so I couldn't strap it on my arm while I jog, nor did it come in multiple flavors or in that lovely hospital sterile white. Just solid sound and solid technology. Still cranking, five years later.

(I'm not starry eyed about Creative, however. They abandoned supporting my treasure last year. I can no longer load the lastest version of the software -- I'm stuck with the original disk for new computers.)

[Blue_Tires]

123. TTT n/t