Would impeachment of Gonzo hurt Dems w/ Hispanics ?

[jaysunb]

Of course I know it shouldn't matter, but all know it does...but I'm wondering if the Dems are again, " keeping their powder dry, " hoping that a rock will fall on his head and the Repubs won't be able to use his impeachment as a weapon later on.

Just wondering, cause this guy could easily be a goner. :evilfrown:

[EFerrari]

1. It does matter and no, it wouldn't. He's a disgrace. n/t

[Bobbieo]

5. Are Hispanic Democrats Hispanics first , and Democrats second???

[EFerrari]

30. I don't know about other people, but I am.

lol

[Lost-in-FL]

47. ...

[MrSlayer]

2. Not unless the Hispanic community believes crimes are ok.

Gonzo certainly isn't a credit to them.

[jaysunb]

10. Of course you're right,

because we blacks don't exactly consider Clarence, Condi or Colin representative either. ( there are plenty others, but these three come to mind right away.)

[EFerrari]

34. No matter who we are, we have our 30%ers it seems.

30% of Hispanics would probably get pissed if we impeach this vendido, no doubt. My friends and I, we'd be dancing.

:)

[jaysunb]

71. Most of my Hispanic friends & neighbors would be too,

--dancing...that is.:)

[Rusty MacHenry]

3. Why would it?

Because all Hispanics are all joined at the hip so because we get rid of one Hispanic in office they'll all turn on us? Nah. I think the Hispanics will find out that Gonzales is an evil, dangerous person that wants to take away our basic freedoms so they'll be cool with it if Dems try to impeach him.

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[tinfoilinfor2005]

16. Boy, are you living under the wrong administration!

These guys are actively working to eliminate the black communities in the country, let alone pay any reparations. Good luck with that, at least for the next two years!

Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[BeyondGeography]

6. If so, Richardson's always available for the ticket

He'd be my choice for VP anyway if Obama gets the nom. Lots to recommend him, not least the ability to help us win NM.

I know he has said he's not interested in the #2 spot, but I have a difficult time imagining him turning it down.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

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[jaysunb]

11. Yo Paprika...

I was going to welcome you, but you may not be around long talking like that. :evilfrown:

[BeyondGeography]

14. They usually get the post count into double figures

before they commit suicide like that.

[Paprika Jones]

18. Are you trying to silence a proud African American woman?..

The power structure tries to keep me down each and every day.
I will not accept or recognize your attempt to do so.

[Ms. Clio]

19. lol

you've been waiting since July to do this?

[Paprika Jones]

25. I have been incarcerated by the power structure......

And have just know sipped the taste of freedom once again. I
was silenced because of my ability to recognize the tactics of
the white power structure and they could not allow that.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

27. Now. The word is Now, not Know. Be careful with your spelling

or you might be taken for a troll freeper. Freepers can't spell and this is usually a dead give-away. Just being helpful. :)

[jaysunb]

28. I'm a proud African American man that does not support HRC

but I'd never disparge her or call her a lesbian. You don't know that nor would anyone with any pride or self respect use a persons sexual orientation as a reason to oppose them.

Quite frankly, I don't think you're a woman or a Sister. :evilfrown:

[mitchtv]

32. Please , Paprika

Try and stay on topic. It's about that Oreo MoFo, Gonzales.

[AlCzervik]

42. damn i missed her! She had the patented freeper font as well.

[Ms. Clio]

12. huh?

who is a lesbian?

[tinfoilinfor2005]

20. Ellen is running for president?

Ok, I'll vote for her. :)

[EFerrari]

35. Me, too.

lol

[MonkeyFunk]

21. Suze Orman

is running for President? Far out!

[MissB]

24. .

:spray:

[Starbucks Anarchist]

23. Huh?

[Horse with no Name]

76. .....

:puke:

[Dinger]

7. Who Cares? It's The Right Thing To Do

In my opinion, his crimes trump politics. Impeachment is but one way to deal with this satan, whatever his ethnicity is.

[tblue]

8. That's what the Republics will say, but I think Latinos are smarter than that

Just like if C*ndo was fired, the black community would not care one iota, or attribute it to her race. In fact, we'd be glad. She is persona non grata anyway.

[EFerrari]

36. During Torquemada's confirmation hearing, I got lucky and WJ

took my call. I told them that as a Latina, I was HORRIFIED that this Bush crony with a history of abusiveness was being confirmed and that tbe Republicans kept repeating "latino, latino, latino" to distract from his track record.

[tblue]

127. Muy bueno! You go, sistah! Heck, why don't we all call and say that?

[Ms. Clio]

13. no, not in the slightest n/t

[Cleita]

15. Ask yourself if impeaching Condi Rice will hurt Dems w/AAs.

I don't think so. It won't with Hispanics either. Honestly, we do know what is going on and keep up with the politics. Even the most recent immigrant tries to be informed, which is more than I can say about the kool-aid drinking RW Americans.

[jaysunb]

37. I definitely agree w/ you, but

w/ 92% of all AA's voting Dem, as opposed to a very shaky 60% of Latinos, I think the question is fair.

[Cleita]

43. Fair enough, but think about the fact that the Latinos who

do vote are pretty much divided between conservative and liberal as much as any other demographic, but they don't vote by ethnicity. Trust me, I know.

[rebel with a cause]

96. Latinos are divided in other ways also.

One of the biggest complaints that Latinos have about "Americans" is that they lump all Latinos into one big group. Well, lets make it clear that Puerto Ricans do not identify with Mexicans, Mexicans don't identify with Dominicans, Dominicans don't identify with Colombians, Colombians don't identify with Venezuelans, and so on. I take it that Gonzalez is probably of only one of these groups, and so would be identified as such in the Latino community. At least this is the way I have always found it to be.

[EFerrari]

45. Not shaky at all! That whole "shaky" thing was just a Rovian fiction

for 2004 -- just like those mythical "values voters" that no one can locate that supposedly elected Junior. It's a lie.

[sam sarrha]

17. only with the drug dealers

[EFerrari]

33. LOL. That's probably right.

[Akoto]

22. Frankly, if it does (which I doubt), I don't care.

Gonzales is responsible for much of the damage inflicted upon our laws and rights. I'd rather that he were lawfully removed from office, before he can do any more harm. Some things ARE worth losing political leverage for.

[UTUSN]

26. Absolutely NOT!!! He's the houseboy 2.0 version of Clarence.!!1

Thank ZEUS for SHUMER, who has always BEEN THERE---who, when we Dems were in the MINORITY (no pun), sounded the clarion, saying, "it doesn't MATTER if you're a minority------what MATTERS is if you are a WINGNUT (or a HOUSEBOY----O.K., he didn't say this last thing)!!!!1

The Hispanic (or whatever minority) paradigm has always been DEM. These WINGNUT A-HOLES, like Ruben NAVARRETTE, who claim that they are "cafeteria" are just helping WINGNUTS. They do NOT help their home-minority group (whether Hispanic, Black, Gay), as some DUer once said, they are ONLY FOR THEMSELVES!!1

[mitchtv]

29. Tio Taco?

I think not , at least not in this half Chicano family

[AlCzervik]

31. you're selling hispanics pretty short there.

[jaysunb]

That's certainly not my intention...

but see my post up thread

[BayCityProgressive]

39. Do hispanics vote based only on color?

I know I am not offended when a white politician gets in trouble.

[Robson]

38. It should be American FIRST, Democrat Second and Hispanic a distant third.

Anyone in this country that puts their supposed homeland "Ethnicity" anywhere close to their allegiance to the country doesn't deserve to live here. They should move back "home" if they believe that to be a big issue to them.

Gonzalez should be fired regardless of his origins.

[EFerrari]

46. So, do you want me deported, Robson?

I feel very connected to my Latino family. It's probably the strongest connection I'll ever have. And it comes first for me and always will.

On the other hand, my culture taught me to value community highly and that's why I work in the community, including on Democratic campaigns.

But, maybe I should move "home" -- to Oakland, California?

:eyes:

[Robson]

53. America is your homeland

Immigrants came to this country legally. The first generation kept their culture, but they made an attempt to learn the language and become naturalized Americans. Their children and their children's children are Americans with Polish, Italian, Irish, Mexican, French, Russian, Jewish, etc surnames. They aren't Italians, or Hispanics, they are Americans. I can tell you how it worked.

That diversity that has been blended and homogenized is what makes this country great and the opposite is what makes some countries divided and balkanized with constant turmoil.

You want to live here, then this becomes your homeland.

[EFerrari]

60. I am not "blended". I am a Latina. We have a distinct culture

and a set of values which this country benefits from every damn day. We strengthen families and communities because that is our ethic. We are, in addition, very accepting of diversity -- another virtue that mainstream American culture desperately needs.

And no, I'm not a nationalist. The word "homeland" makes me nauseous.

Do I want to live here? What are you suggesting, exactly?

[Ms. Clio]

61. No, they became Italian-Americans, or Mexican-Americans

and this country is most definitely not "blended and homogenized." That is not the history of immigration in this country at all.

[EFerrari]

63. I never thought of this until tonight, but this joint has benefitted

from values that immigrated here, values the Winthrops didn't hold. It would be interesting to track those. :)

[Ms. Clio]

74. yeah, it's much more than the story of the "English-speaking peoples"

For example, states with community property laws that are based on earlier Spanish laws instead of British common law are one example of how those values have been beneficial.

[EFerrari]

80. And then there's always French Toast.

lol

:hi:

[Ms. Clio]

81. french toast is the foundation of western civilization

seriesly!

:hi:

[Robson]

66. Hyphenated names means itchin' for a problem

My friends are of varying ethnicities but not one would ever even consider him/herself a hyphenated name. They might say they have Irish blood or Yugoslavian or German, but that's as far as it goes.

I would hope that the premise of the OP that "Hispanics" might resent it if Democrats cast AG Gonzales to the wolves is not based upon reality.

If our new generation of immigrants believes that they have a special culture that must be maintained at all cost, and that legitimate legal action against someone who is coincidentally of their ethnicity is worthy of changing politics, then this country is really in serious trouble. Those who feel so strongly about their culture might wish to move back from whence they came to keep themselves pure.

[EFerrari]

69. I feel strongly about my culture and no, I'm not moving to Oakland.

:rofl:

[Lost-in-FL]

77. Varying ethnicities?

You mean not American?

And we don't have a special culture, as a matter of fact, most are treated as Second class citizens. So at the end it doesn't matter if you behave like Uncle Sam, you are still not AMERICAN enough. But that my friend, is a whole other subject.

[Ms. Clio]

78. I think you are setting up and clumsily knocking down strawmen

and try telling these guys that they need to go back to Italy, while you're at it:

The National Italian American Foundation (NIAF) is a non-profit organization serving as a major advocate in Washington, DC for nearly 25 million Italian Americans, raising the prominence of all things Italian in American culture and society, and making "Italian American" part of the national conversation.

http://www.niaf.org/

[Lost-in-FL]

84. Nevermind

oops,,,

[rebel with a cause]

104. I hate to disagree with you but I do because

if you are a white immigrant it is easy for you to assimilate. If you are not white, then assimilation becomes much harder if not impossible. Because of this, the non-white immigrant has learned to hold on to their culture, take pride in it, and to treasure their difference. When the whites called them spics, wet backs, tacos and other names, the Latinos held onto their family and the values that they brought to this country and found comfort and pride in what made them Latino. Now when it is convenient whites tell them they should leave that all behind and be Americans, yet they still see them as different. The same goes for people of African and Asian descent. We set them apart, yet expect them to leave all their culture/identity behind and pretend to be one of us when what it really means is for them to act like us and pretend whites have never/do not do these things to them.

By the way Hispanic is a government word used in the census, Latino is more the word for the people.

[Lost-in-FL]

107. ...

:yourock: :applause: :applause:

[rebel with a cause]

110. Thanks,

I was waiting for the flames. :7

[EFerrari]

113. Second that.

:yourock:

[rebel with a cause]

117. I thank you

and my Latino children thank you. ;-)

[EFerrari]

118. Dichosa. Lucky!

:)

[Robson]

131. You make a good point

This is way off base from the original post so I hesitate to contiune.

You make a good point on color. But I believe 95% of perceived assimilation (or lack of) comes down to language and dialect not color. You can say it isn't fair, but life isn't fair and most Americans judge people based upon their ability to speak English.

If one speaks in English with an American dialect I would say that most of us wouldn't even notice their color or think about their ethnicity. People are seen as Americans and that goes for Asians too, which are often overlooked in this culture discussion. Note for yourself how you look at news personalities of different ethnic backgrounds. You probably don't even notice whether they are black, brown, asian, white because they speak English with a middle American dialect.

A culture with a common language works so much better and with far less discrimination than pockets of communities which still speak their native language or English with an ethnic accent. I also see maintaining one's unique ethnic culture in the form of heritage as good. Speak in ghetto, or Spanish and that will impact your employment and how others view you. It also keeps people from totally assimilating.

And don't get me wrong I'm not a big fan of rah rah nationalism. But I'd like to see our corporate world more nationalistic than greed motivated but that's another story too.

[Lost-in-FL]

133. It is not that simple...

Unfortunately things aren't that simple. A friend of mine was told not to board a plane because he looked Arab, he's parents are Puerto Ricans and he only speaks "American". His parents wanted him to be the "all you can be" American kid, more American than apple pie. He never spoke a word in Spanish. I guess it didn't matter then that he "spoke in English with an American dialect". After that incident, he decided to learn Spanish. The fact that "it is not fair but..." doesn't make it right. We cannot just cross our arms and accept that.

People shouldn't be discriminated against for "having an accent" or looking different. Having an accent is not fighting assimilation. Trying to preserve the culture of your parents isn't fighting assimilation. I will teach my kids the language of their grandparents (Spanish on my side, French on my husbands side) and that is in NO way fighting assimilation. That will be a cultural and economical advantage in a World that is more economically diverse.

I have a subtle accent and I am an American citizen by birth and a Veteran. At work I happen to be a junior supervisor because of my qualifications and years of experience. When people come to my area looking for the "supervisor", they look passed me. They ask the first Anglo who comes across even when that person is just a student.

I remember that when I passed one of my tests for certification, my boss sent me a very condescending letter (or at least that is how I it seemed). She thought I wouldn't be able to pass the test cause other Anglos had a hard time passing (I passed the first time). The congratulatory letter was so ludicrous that it was actually cute. I showed it to my co-workers and you could see the horror in their faces, it was quite funny.

I could continue on an on but I am not trying making it worse than it is but to show you what its like to carry an accent and/or looking "ethnic". What can I do? I can't get rid of the accent.

I work in a hospital, I hear other doctors talking in derogatory terms of other doctors who happen to have an accent, they even question their professionalism just because of their differences. It is pretty disgusting how they make names like Mohamed or Osama against their own partners. They can get away with crap like this because the hospital is short of doctors. Also, I have heard of people asking our department supervisor to have an "American" doctor or technician do their examinations. I remember someone walking out of the room after they realized the person taking care of them was "non-white". I have noticed that things are getting worse post 9/11 and the Immigration issue.

At the end it doesn't matter how AMERICAN you feel at heart, people will always let you know who you are. It doesn't matter if you sound like the Marlboro Man but look like Pedro. So, if you ever wonder why people wave their "flags" and act "UnAmerican" :eyes: its because that is the only way they feel "at home" in their adopted country.

BTW, I will stop speaking my mother's language when Giada De Laurentiis pronounce "prosciuto" in English!!!

[Robson]

134. Human nature

To respond: "The fact that "it is not fair but..." doesn't make it right. We cannot just cross our arms and accept that."

But we can not change human nature as much as we may dislike certain aspects. We deal with it and work around it if we want to succeed. It's like saying it's not fair that the sun sets in the west because it warms up my house in the evening. I can't change the direction of earth's rotation so we should have realigned the house.

People can lose accents if they want to and try hard enough. Now if they wish to keep their accents because of their cultural roots then they need to accept the consequences from others. We can bitch and complain and march about the injustices of human nature, but in the end they will still be there and instead we should work to fix what we can fix.

Here's an interesting web site.
http://www.conknet.com/~mmagnus/TOEFL/index.html

[Lost-in-FL]

135. Since you know all the answers...

What would you do about African Americans and darker skin Hispanics?

[rebel with a cause]

139. He would tell them to bleach their skin so they could fit in better.

;-) Perhaps I am being unfair to this poster, but their unwillingness to understand that prejudice is the problem of the person and society that has it and not with the person targeted by it is irritating. A Latino name alone is enough to cause some people to target and limit a person in the work place. They would probably say that you should change your name. That is what my family suggested to me when we faced racism in housing and such. I had a real estate agent and bank refuse me services because of the name. I am a white, southern/mid-western accented woman with a Latino last name. The prejudice shown to me has been limited, but I have seen my ex and my children go through a lot because they are not "white". My children are no darker than my mother was, but because she was part American Indian, and that is romanticized here, she did not face as much prejudice. (rednecks tend to see themselves as cowboys) My children are some of the most respectable people there are, and they treat everyone with respect. To have to watch while that respect is not returned because of what they are, is enough to sometime makes me hate with a passion. Thank heavens I raised them not to do that.

[rebel with a cause]

136. Again I will respond to your post.

Like the poster you responded to says, the accent is there but it is not the problem. I am white, my ex is Latino, and thus my children are Latino. I raised my children, they are of my culture but they look like their fathers people. My daughter is often confused for Asian and my son for middle eastern, but they also are taken for Latino which they are. My children never spoke Spanish and their accent is plain old mid-western but that has not stopped people from treating them like dirt because they see them as outsiders and LESS than "white". When they were small, neighbors would stop them and ask them if they spoke English, neighbors who had lived on the same block that we had lived on for years and who knew my family of origin.

My daughter rode the bus to kindergarten and was called the N word at five by older kids. In fact, my children were called all the words that Latinos have been called plus all those that are used against African Americans growing up, and there were no way they could be more assimilated into the ways of our society.

Oh, guess what, they still get discriminated against. My son has a degree in his field. He works for a company at a position he is over qualified for and makes very little money. He works hard at his job and even does work for other departments with no extra pay, just for the hours he works. He has applied for the higher positions that he is qualified for at this company, and has watched while they hire people from the outside who are less qualified and untrained for the positions. This is bad enough, but he has also been denied the right for an interview all three times which violates the company's policy. This has happened three times now, and guess what....the people they hired were all white, in fact they are blond and blue eyed. Does he want to sue them? Yes he does. Will a lawyer take his case? He has already been told they will not because this company is too powerful and they are afraid to do anything to them.

Yeah, life is unfair and when you are white living in a white world you can look down on people that you judge to not be trying hard enough, but you have no idea of what you are talking about. The old saying that you have to walk in another's shoes applies here. But I will give you a way to find out without becoming non white. Follow a Latino/African American around for a week or two and watch how people treat them (Asians are not done as badly most of the time). Watch while women clutch their pulses tighter when a Latino/Black man walks by, or even grab their children. I have seen them even do this when my daughter walked by them in a store, and the only thing that was different about her from any of her friends was her color.

No there is nothing my children and people like them can do about the prejudice, but there is also nothing they can do to change themselves that would make it any better. It is the other people that have to change, and people like you enable them not to.

[Lost-in-FL]

49. I am Puerto Rican first

you got a problem with that?? Deport me!! Oh wait... PR is a colony of the US, so it is still US territory... right? :eyes:

[EFerrari]

54. It's really hard trying to "go home" when you're, um, already there.

:rofl:

[Lost-in-FL]

58. This might help

But don't know, it might hurt my skin.

[EFerrari]

62. LOL! I hope that I can stay here in SAN FRANCISCO

because I'd be out of my element at "home".



:rofl:

[Lost-in-FL]

64. I didn't know...

Montezuma was white? Are you sure he is Montezuma and not Cortez? And he had a beard? I think this is another topic... :hide: :yoiks:

[EFerrari]

65. LOL!

The English came to the Americas and drew the indigenous people as IRISH! Because everyone knew in those days, that IRISH was the universal Other!

So, you see that over and over in the early representations.

[Lost-in-FL]

67. SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!! Callate niña!!!

:yoiks:



















Here, this might be more accurate. You would think it was cheaper to get them Aztecs to do the job. :dilemma:

[EFerrari]

73. Look, Robson wants me to move back to Oakland

and I just can't afford it. I like San Francisco and moving is a hassle. Make it stop.

:rofl:

[Zhade]

40. Should holding criminals accountable for crimes be based on political expediency?

NT!

[EFerrari]

48. I think it's a legitimate question if you are doing a political calculation.

[NV Whino]

41. No

[mmonk]

44. Nope. He's not some sort of representation of hispanics.

He's a torture and incarcerate people without trial czar.

[EFerrari]

50. I don't think you can retain your ethnicity once you've sold your soul.

:shrug:

[mmonk]

52. Kind of like bush and Cheney

don't represent me as a caucasian. They only represent themselves and the neocons.

[gr8dane_daddy]

51. Not with this Mexican American

Even we can recognize a pendejo when we see one.

[EFerrari]

56. Are you kidding, most of the time, we smell them first.

lol

:hi:

[AZBlue]

55. I'm all for playing the political game, this time, no way.

He's so crooked no group would be proud to have him "representing" them!

[Lost-in-FL]

57. It shouldn't matter that he is hispanic

He is a criminal first. The worse thing is to know that another Hispanic is a Republican. That is an abomination (at least to me, I don't know how other Democrats feel about it).

[jaysunb]

79. same way I feel about any black " republican "

:evilfrown:

[madville]

59. I doubt it would matter much

9 out of 10 Americans would give a blank stare if asked who the AG is. Even if it did matter for 15 minutes our ADD would kick in and we would forget about it after Brittany gets out of rehab for the fourth time.

[Kazak]

68. Let's find out...

;)

[philosophie_en_rose]

70. Does criticizing Alan Keyes hurt Dems with African Americans?

No.

[Horse with no Name]

72. Why do you assume they would care?

Impeaching George Bush won't hurt Dem's with whites so why the double standard? Are you assuming that Hispanics don't care if someone is corrupt as long as they are Latino? If that is what you are saying...you need to study a little on the history of Mexico and in particular what is going on now.

[EFerrari]

83. I think in a way, it does matter. Latinos have been the object

of so much hatred lately, who would be surprised if the "community" circled the wagons?

But Torquemada has been so horrible, he's pretty much excommunicated except by the wingnuts which are a small sector although they get much of the press. :shrug:

[Horse with no Name]

86. Somehow I don't think so

However, since I am not Latino, I cannot speak to this. My friends that are think he is deplorable, but who knows?
I was very disturbed to see Henry Cisneros throw his support behind Torquemada. That was a jaw-dropper.

[EFerrari]

88. Put another way, a community that feels itself to be under attack

deplores this unspeakable felon -- as far as I can tell from the info I have access to.

And that speaks to the values of that community, how they are handling the pressure and yet holding onto their values, imho.

Cisneros, yeah. That was stunning.

[Lost-in-FL]

87. Not for that...

He is a criminal first and because "Latinos have been the object of much hatred" they won't play around with Gonzalez. We don't need any more bad publicity.

[EFerrari]

97. That's a good point. I guess I was just thinking that a certain amount

of defensiveness is, well, just there. And how it might play out.

And I've no doubt that as a whole, if such a thing can be posited, Torquemada is and will be shunned because he is sink scum.

[Colobo]

75. Not at all, because

Most Hispanics don't even know who the heck González is anyway.

[EFerrari]

85. Thanks. Maybe you could be so kind as to educate us.

lol

[Colobo]

89. Yo soy hispano, y vivo entre hispanos

La mayoría con los hispanos con quienes trabajo y vivo (incluídos mis familiares) no saben ni quien Alberto González, ni Dennis Kucinich, ni Chris Dodd, ni todas las figuras políticas que no reciben tanta atención.

[EFerrari]

93. And how is that different from the lack of awareness among

any other group?

The Latinos I know do know who Torquemada is and they detest him because they know he would sell his mother in a heartbeat.

[Colobo]

95. LOL, Torquemada...

That's a good one. The thing is that, in general, we live in a nation in which most people are completely uninformed about what's really happening around them. Latinos are no exception, and for instance, Alberto González's impeachment would not mean much to most of them.

I don't want to sound elitist or anything, but it's a sad reality.

[EFerrari]

101. I agree with you. Most people are just trying to live. n/t

[Lost-in-FL]

99. ... and you are in a red state

That makes a big difference. The GOP will make it seem as the Dems against the Hispanics. But then, so much has happened in 6 years that I don't think Hispanics would swallow the pill this time. Most of the Hispanics I know are Democrats or not interested in politics. They might not know who Gonzo is but would vote on anything with a "D" at the end, even when that name is not "Hispanic".

[Colobo]

100. That's true, except for the strong

enclaves of Cuban Republicans here in Tampa Bay and Miami...

[Lost-in-FL]

102. The "rich-elitisist" Cubans...

and the older generation of Cubans (those who hate Communism) are normally Republicans. Also, Fundie Christians. I think the younger Cubans are turning Democratic, at least in Miami for what I hear.

[Colobo]

106. Yes and no

Three good friends of mine, who were born and raised in Cuba (they are all in their 20s) are vocal Democrats. In fact, they were Democrats way before I became one (or accepted being one, because I never believed in Republicanism/Conservatism).

Now, as you said, those who are 40 and up and have this weird "Democratic Party = Castro" connection in their heads, and those who were born here but grew up hearing that lie (in other words, the majority of Cubans here) are staunch Republicans. I remember an 90 yr old Cuban lady who called the Republican Comittee in South Tampa (I volunteered there in 04, I needed the $$$) who called asking desperately for someone who could drive her to the polls to vote for Bush. She didn't speak English, and nobody in the damn place did, so they called me to talk with the lady... you wouldn't believe the passion with she spoke about Bush for minutes. She wouldn't shut up. Our driver was also an old Cuban guy, a contractor, who couldn't believe I was "un negro puertorriqueño" working for Bush...

Shit, bro... if I could only erase that part of my life...

[EFerrari]

111. You are right that there is a generational difference.

And the older generation is losing its influence among that demographic. The kids are going Dem.

[Lost-in-FL]

112. Te estamos velando...

you better not switch back to them freeper kind. The worse thing is to know a Puertorriqueño that is Republicano. That to me is an abomination.

[Colobo]

114. 'Ta bien, acepto la responsabilidad

:)

[Lost-in-FL]

115. ...

;-)

[EFerrari]

103. That's where our 30%ers launder the money from the nutcases

to the South.

But, that's a very small number of "us" in reality. Most of us are working people who are best represented by Democrats and who think Gonzalez is a criminal.

[Lost-in-FL]

105. I don't see the "Viva Bush" stickers anymore

around here. I have not seen one in ages. I hope that's saying something positive about the Hispanic community in Central Fl.


And who the f__ came up with such stupid sticker anyways. "Viva Bush"... shit. :puke: :puke:

[EFerrari]

109. Probably Kathy Harris.

lol

[Colobo]

116. I had one of those in my car, and even saw them in Puerto Rico

I went down there in for Xmas in 04, and I saw a car with a bunch of stickers from Bush's 04 campaign (and others from the PNP's campaign). I was like "WTF?"

[Lost-in-FL]

119. Ok Katzen... put your hand in the monitor

Lets "exorcise" you from them bad "Freeper spirits" (there's not good freeper spirits, what am I talking about?). At the count of three... Three, two, one... "En el nombre del padre, del hijo..."

[EFerrari]

120. I'm lighting one candle for Katzen and one for me.

Because these people are enough to make you lose not only religion but hope and trust, too.

I can't believe, I CANNOT BELIEVE, that John Ashcroft was BETTER than this guy. :wow:

[Lost-in-FL]

121. "John Ashcroft was BETTER than this guy"

That is a very creepy statement...

Ok, "tres ave marias" and "un padre nuestro" :yoiks:

[EFerrari]

124. It's creepy as hell. Ashcroft turned PA into a toxic waste dump

and facilitated the Patriot Act but Torquemada gave Junior a rationale for TORTURE. :scared:

Berto has been one of the sharks that Junior has counted on to dress up his felonies all this time. He's brilliant and ambitious and rotten as hell. Ashcroft only wishes he could be all of that.

Maybe in the next week or so, we'll see this creep go down.

[Colobo]

123. LOL!!!

You're hilarious! :)

Relax, I'm free from the freeper bondage. It was a Benny Hinn-esque experience, but here I am...

[Selatius]

82. No. I doubt Hispanics are that superficial to vote based on skin color.

If Gonzales is removed, we'd only lose the far right radicals in the Hispanic community, and they probably wouldn't even vote for the Dems anyway. It would be just another excuse for these radicals not to vote Democratic.

[EFerrari]

90. We can't lose what BushCo has already bought.

:shrug:

[Selatius]

91. Yeah, I said the same, except in a more awkward manner. n/t

[EFerrari]

94. Not awkward at all and a good reminder of what we're dealing with. nt

[Bluebear]

92. Would impeachment of Bush hurt Dems w/ Caucasians?

Lordy I hope not!

[EFerrari]

108. The thing is, that's an asymmetrical comparison.

And I may be very wrong but, that's how it seems to me.

Because Latino culture isn't mainstream white culture (if there is such a thing) only coffee colored and it tends to be clannish and so, the OP's question seems to me a legit one.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

98. I think most would want Gonzales gone

[jaysunb]

126. I agree, and hope you're right....

along w/ many other thoughtful posters. :thumbsup:

[saltpoint]

122. Just my take, but I think it's not an ethnic issue between Hispanics and

Democrats but an ethical issue between Gonzales and the Constitution.

This is a guy who advocated in a formal and forceful way that torture be considered permissable, and laid that document on the desk of the President of the United States.

We can frame that argument any time we want to, and we should, and sooner rather than later.

[Pachamama]

125. Would impeachment of Bush & Cheney hurt Dems w/ Whites?

Same answer as above question...

I think the impeachment of treasonous bastards to our constitution is a color-blind issue....except if your counting the Red, White and Blue....

:patriot:

Let's hope they (Bush, Cheney and Gonzo) are all impeached and removed from office in the next year.

[tblue]

128. It could very well cost us the STUPID vote

[EFerrari]

137. We normally don't get that one any way.

:shrug:

[tblue]

144. Ain't that the truth nt

[SoCalDem]

129. Did Clinton's impeachment hurt "white people"? n/t

[sam sarrha]

130. the Fascist Reich Wing congress/senate hurt everyone but the rich

[UTUSN]

132. " could easily be a goner" - not until the wingnuts turn on him & they won't

because he's carrying out what they like----torture, curtailment of civil rights, etc. The wingnuts turned on MIERS because she was too namby pamby for them. & Beto is supposedly who ran to Shrub to tell him to cut her loose as errand boy for the wingnuts. He's THEIRS, so while I wish it were true that he would "easily be a goner" I doubt it.

[judaspriestess]

138. HELL NO

This dude is desperate to be Caucasian and a total sellout. His Latino took off a long time ago.

[rebel with a cause]

140. Are you saying that he is

"one of the good ones"? ;-)

[judaspriestess]

142. well to the repuke party

he is a great one, he is just trapped in a brown persons body.

[rebel with a cause]

143. to be "one of the good ones" you need to be

someone of dark skin or a non-christian religion. It is when a "white person/group" will say "he is one of the good ones". Meaning "he is more like us, and (usually) does not like people like himself". Or it can mean "he does what we tell him, and he lives up to what we expect of him". It can mean several different things but it always means that he considered to not be like others of his "race" or religion. I guess if you are "white" you could be considered "one of the good ones" by other groups if you treated them fairly. :shrug:

[jaysunb]

147. you win the prize !!

Condi,Colin, Clarence et al fall into this sick world.....

[Xenotime]

141. This will push more immigrants to vote republican...

[EFerrari]

145. WTF? Can you explain that conclusion given that Latinos

vote with Democrats? :shrug:

[NDP]

146. Only if they are idiots who don't know anything about Gonzales except for how he looks

[ellisonz]

148. No, absolutely not.

If Gonzalez is impeached and convicted (that's the key part, it's foolish to do the former without a reasonable expectation of success in the later) it will be clear to all that it was done on the merits of the arguments alone. PACs and 527's be damned!