Congressman says he doesn't believe in God

[babylonsister]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/03/13/congressman-says-he-doesn_n_43293.html

Congressman says he doesn't believe in God
Democrat Pete Stark of California is the highest-ranking elected official in the U.S. to make such a public acknowledgement.

By Adam Schreck, Times Staff Writer
March 13, 2007

WASHINGTON — Cue the jokes about godless politicians and Bay Area liberals.

Secular groups Monday applauded a public acknowledgment by Rep. Pete Stark that he does not believe in a supreme being, making the Fremont Democrat the first member of Congress — and the highest-ranking elected official in the U.S. — to publicly acknowledge not believing in God.

The American Humanist Assn. plans to take out an ad in the Washington Post today congratulating the congressman for his public stance and highlighting the contributions of other prominent secular humanists, such as writers Barbara Ehrenreich and Kurt Vonnegut and actress Julia Sweeney.

Fred Edwords, a spokesman for the group, said non-theistic Americans often faced discrimination for their views.

"So often throughout American history, people who are non-theistic or don't believe in a supreme being can't get elected to public office or, if they inform the public of their view, they don't get reelected," he said. "We're trying to increase the acceptance of non-theists as every bit as American as everybody else."

Stark's declaration came in response to a search by the Secular Coalition for America to find the most prominent nonbelieving politician.

more...

[wildbilln864]

1. that's his right!

:hi:

[BayCityProgressive]

2. AWESOME

[babylonsister]

3. I think so, too. An honest politician-who'd a thunk it? And he knows

he'll probably get a lot of grief for it...:hi:

[Cerridwen]

4. Huh, oh!

I smell a "crucifixion" in the air.

More fun and games for the neo-religionist set.

[sutz12]

5. Kick....

:kick:

And :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Botany]

6. One word covers him

AMERICAN

You have the right to believe or not to believe in whatever you want.

[Straight Shooter]

7. Here's to you, Pete Stark.

:toast:

[proud2BlibKansan]

8. Good for him

Thomas Jefferson would be very proud.

[EST]

9. What amazing courage!

Isn't it equally amazing, we humans, guided by "god," guided by a higher whatever, honest we,
always seem to find the simple truth requiring greatest courage and honor.
While a huge, complicated, voracious nefarious monster of a lie
is the bastard son of cowards.

[mcscajun]

10. Link?

This is truly awesome.

[babylonsister]

15. Sorry. Here:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/03/13/congressman-says-he-doesn_n_43293.html

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

11. the key is to show religious folks

that those who don't believe in God still have morals and to explain why. There is a lot of misinformation out there that needs to be cleared up.

[MindPilot]

16. Yeah, Blacks have to show people they're smart and industrious

And Mexicans have to prove they're not all thieves; gays of course must prove that homosexuality is not pedophilia.

Need I go on? :eyes:

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

17. Then you don't get it

If you lived during the Civil Rights era, you know very well that African Americans DID have to prove themselves to be responsible--and they understood WHY they had to do it. And yes, homosexuals are STILL working on letting people know that they aren't all pedophiles.

Frankly, I don't know where non-believers stand as far as moral actions go. I have never heard any of them hear explain what they consider moral and why people should be moral. Usually I get from atheists here is disdain and bad manners.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

19. "Usually I get from atheists here is disdain and bad manners."

Ever think that it may you're the one with the problem?

[BlooInBloo]

21. damn you! beat me to it! lol!

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

22. Posters here have just shown why

I have a "problem"--again snideness and rudeness. I am stating a fact---and asked for some explanation on how atheists determine their moral compass. But instead of any explanation, I get the same old same old--I'M stupid because "I don't know" and somehow I'm supposed to "understand'. Well, I don't. When I started coming here, I was polite and even sympathetic to atheists posting here. But I've been insulted and talked down to with refusals to discuss things in a civil manner too many times. My negative feelings towards atheists came from the posters here.

And again I will say most people of faith have no clue what sort of moral compass atheists have--and if you think that simply saying "you should know" is going to solve the problem, you are dreaming.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. I think you've a problem with people different from yourself.

You certainly haven't got a problem with snideness and rudeness. In fact, you're pretty good at it.

"I am stating a fact---and asked for some explanation on how atheists determine their moral compass."

You're stating opinions, and revealing and embarassing ones at that. I'd ask how you determine your moral compass, but I don't think you have one.

"If you lived during the Civil Rights era, you know very well that African Americans DID have to prove themselves to be responsible--and they understood WHY they had to do it."

Well now, some people who lived through the Civil Rights feel this way. Of course, they're the same people that necessitated a Civil Rights movement in the first place. African Americans DIDN'T have yo prove anything, because it was clear to anybody who wasn't a racist that African Americans were being judge on their skin color, not their actions.

"And yes, homosexuals are STILL working on letting people know that they aren't all pedophiles."

God, this is some sick shit. If anybody's got a lot of work to do, it's you.

[Beelzebud]

25. As an atheist, I get my morals from being a human being.

I don't need a god to tell me it's wrong to murder someone, or to steal from someone.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

26. Thank you for answering

But, as an argument, why not murder or steal? Is it because of consequences of the act, or to maintain a stable society? Frankly, many religious people do it for the former; I am assuming your reason would be the latter.

[Beelzebud]

27. My reason would be both. I'd feel guilty for robbing or killing.

I don't need religion to tell me it's wrong to murder, lie, cheat, or steal. Truth is truth. If religion works for some, then so be it. For me, it's not needed.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

28. Which is fine

I know a lot of lowlifes who use religion as an excuse for their behavior--in a way, you could say that religion doesn't really have anything to do with morals, true morals, at least.

But just as homosexuals have to educate the general public (check out the video about the two men who have been a couple for 52 years), atheists have to do the same.

You've talked of the "biggies"-ie, murder and thievery--what about other issues, such as euthenasia? Death penalty? When does it become right to end a person's life? Should the decision be made for the good of society or should it be predicated upon the individual's decision?

[me b zola]

29. As someone who believes in God, I've had a different experience than you

It has never occurred to me to question where an Atheist gets their moral compass. I know that much of my moral compass came from my parents who taught me many things about life that had nothing to do with the bible nor religion even though they were devote catholics. The values that they passed on to me had more to do with the culture that my parents grew up in (deep poverty during the depression) than it did religion.

As for the snarkiness, well, I kind of get why that happens (not to you personally, but in general). Most members of minority groups (ethnic, gender, religious, political...) frankly get tired of answering questions that pre-suppose a stereotype about their group, especially if that question is posted on a progressive message board that is overflowing with information and people discussing issues. "How can we trust a woman to be CIC when she is PMSing?" "How can I trust that a Liberal/Progressive will be strong on national security?" Some people will answer those questions with reasoned thought, and others who are tired of the same old stereotypes will snark.

Frankly, I trust political matters more in the hands of Atheists than I do any "christian" who makes an effort to tell me all about their religious beliefs let alone wants to put their religious beliefs into policy.

[Der Blaue Engel]

30. Thank you for this

Saved me from the snark that was building. :)

[mondo joe]

33. How do you determine YOUR moral compass?

And if you say the bible, how do you and George Bush both do that?

[BlooInBloo]

20. "Usually I get from atheists here is disdain and bad manners." - LOL!

... I can't for the life of me understand why.

That's a lie - I can understand why perfectly well: The notion that the burden of proof is on the atheist to "demonstrate a moral foundation", or on black folks their responsibility is possibly the most risible and bigoted idea I've heard in the last month.

You fully deserve the response you described.

[MindPilot]

31. I did live through the civil rights era and I do get it

As a small child I recall getting a spanking from a store clerk for using the wrong drinking fountain. For the record, I'm white and I used the black one. The store was Sears, the place was Orlando.

As far as where non-believers stand morally (I prefer to use the word ethics since religionists have pretty much co-opted and corrupted the concept of "morality") all you need to know is, compared to the roughly 15%-30% of non-believers in the general population, the number of non-believers in prison is statistically insignificant.

[mondo joe]

32. Why? Why does anyone have to show their "morals"?

[demrabble]

12. Sad, Really.

It's sad, really.

It's sad that such a statement should be news.

It's sad that a statement disavowing belief in myths should be news.

No one would think it news if a congresscritter were to say, "I do not believe the world is flat".

And yet, when a member of Congress says, "I do not believe in god", that is considered news.

Wouldn't it be great to live in a society where non-belief in a god was accepted as much as non-belief in a flat world?

[LiberalEsto]

13. He's a Unitarian Universalist

The following were or are Unitarians, Universalists, or UUs:

Abigail Adams (1744-1818)
James Luther Adams (1901-1994)
John Adams (1735-1826)
John Quincy Adams (1767-1848)
Amos Bronson Alcott (1799-1888)
Louisa May Alcott (1832-1888)
Horatio Alger, Jr. (1832-1899)
Arthur J. Altmeyer (1891-1972)
Susan B. Anthony (1820-1906) (also a Quaker)
Arius (256-336) (the original 'small-u' unitarian)
E. Burdette Backus (1888-1955) (originally a Universalist)
Roger Nash Baldwin (1884-1981), founder of ACLU
Adin Ballou (1803-1890) (Universalist)
Hosea Ballou (1771-1852) (Universalist and unitarian)
P. T. Barnum (1810-1891) (Universalist)
Clara Barton (1821-1912) (Universalist)
Bela Bartok (1881-1945)
Alexander Graham Bell (1847-1922)
Henry Bergh (1811-1888), founder of the ASPCA
Tim Berners-Lee (b. 1955)
Ambrose Bierce (1842-1913 or 1914) (unconfirmed)
James Blanchard (b. 1942)
John Bowring (1792-1872)
Ray Bradbury (b. 1920)
Andre Braugher (b. 1962)
Antoinette Brown (1825-1921)
Olympia Brown (1835-1926) (Universalist)
Orestes Brownson (1803-1876) (Universalist)
Percival Brundage (1892-1979)
Luther Burbank (1849-1926)
Celia Burr Burleigh (1826-1875)
Robert Burns (1759-1796) (unitarian)
John C. Calhoun (1782-1850)
Alice Cary (1820-1871) (Universalist)
Phoebe Cary (1824-1871) (Universalist)
Joseph Chamberlain (1836-1914)
William Ellery Channing (1780-1842)
Lydia Child (1802-1880)
Frances Power Cobbe (1822-1904)
William Cohen (b.1940)
Samuel Taylor Coleridge (1772-1834)
Moncure Daniel Conway (1832-1907)
e e cummings (1894-1962)
Nathaniel Currier (1813-1888)
Charles Darwin (1809-1882)
George de Benneville (1703-1793) (Universalist)
Charles Dickens (1812-1870)
Robert Dillman (b. 1967)
Dorothea Dix (1802-1887)
Paul Douglas (1892-1976) (also a Quaker)
Charles William Eliot (1834-1926)
Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882) (Transcendentalist)
Sophia Fahs (1876-1978)
Fannie Farmer (1857-1915)
Millard Fillmore (1800-1874)
Eliza Follen
John Murray Forbes (1813-1898)
Robert Fulghum (b. 1937)
Buckminster Fuller (1895-1983)
Margaret Fuller (1810-1850) (Transcendentalist and Unitarian)
Elizabeth Gaskell (1810-1865)
William Godwin (1756-1836) (Sandemanian)
Horace Greeley (1811-1872) (Universalist)
Edvard Grieg (1843-1907)
Nina Grieg (1845-1935)
Frances Harper (1825-1911)
Thomas Lake Harris (1823-1906) (Universalist)
Charles Hartshorne (1897-2000)
Nathaniel Hawthorne (1804-1864) (Transcendentalist)
Samuel Hoar (1778-1856)
Edith Holden (1871-1920)
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr. (1841-1935)
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr. (1809-1894)
Mark Hopkins (1813-1878)
Julia Ward Howe (1819-1910)
Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826) (unitarian, once wrote that if there were a Unitarian church near him, he would become a member, but attended an Episcopalian church.)
Julian of Norwich (c.1342-c.1413) (proto-universalist)
Thomas Starr King (1824-1864)
Chuck Knipp (also a Quaker)
Ray Kurzweil (b. 1948)
Lewis Howard Latimer (1848-1928)
Margaret Laurence (1926-1987)
Viola Liuzzo (1925-1965)
Mary Livermore (1820-1905) (Universalist)
Henry Wadsworth Longfellow (1807-1882)
Amy Lowell (1874-1925)
James Russell Lowell (1819-1891)
Horace Mann (1796-1859)
Harriet Martineau (1802-1876)
James Martineau (1805-1900)
Herman Melville (1819-1891) (Transcendentalist)
Maria Mitchell (1818-1889)
Angela Moffett (b. 1968)
Samuel F. B. Morse (1791-1872)
John Murray (1741-1815) (Universalist)
Isaac Newton (1642-1727) (unitarian)
Florence Nightingale (1820-1910)
** KEITH OLBERMANN *** !!!(b. 1959)
Mary White Ovington (1865-1951)
Theodore Parker (1810-1860)
Linus Pauling (1901-1994)
Sylvia Plath (1932-1963)
Beatrix Potter (1866-1943)
Joseph Priestley (1733-1804)
Olive Higgins Prouty (1882-1974)
George Pullman (1831-1897) (Universalist)
Josiah Quincy (1744-1777) (Universalist)
Christopher Reeve (1952-2004)
James Relly (c.1722-1778)
Paul Revere (1735-1818)
Malvina Reynolds (1900-1978)
George Ripley (1802-1880)
Rammohun Roy (1772-1833) (also a Hindu)
Benjamin Rush (1745-1813) (universalist)
Albert Schweitzer (1875-1965) (he was a honorary member of the Church of the Larger Fellowship, though)
Charles E. Scripps (b. 1920)
Pete Seeger (b. 1919)
Rod Serling (1924-1975)
Michael Servetus (1511-1553)
Adlai Stevenson (1835-1914)
Lucy Stone (1818-1893)
Robert Stout (1844-1930)
Emily Stowe (1813-1903)
Gilbert Stuart (1755-1828)
William Howard Taft (1857-1930)
Henry David Thoreau (1817-1862) (Transcendentalist)
Amos G. Throop (1811-1894) (Universalist)
Clyde Tombaugh (1906-1997)
Mary Augusta Ward (1851-1920)
Daniel Webster (1782-1852)
Josiah Wedgwood (1730-1759)
Paul Dudley White (1886-1973)
Walt Whitman (1819-1892) (Transcendentalist)
Earl Morse Wilbur (1886-1956)
Mary Wollstonecraft (1759-1797)
Frank Lloyd Wright (1867-1959)
N.C. Wyeth (1882-1945)
Owen D. Young (1874-1962) (Universalist)
Whitney Young (1921-1971)

You do not have to believe in God to be a Unitarian Universalist. In my case I've been a UU for more than 20 years and I believe in Goddess.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

23. My mother is UU

and believes all paths lead to God.

[Clark2008]

14. And?

It's sad that this is news.

[BlooInBloo]

18. BlooInBloo says he doesn't believe in god....

... Sigh. It's NEVER as good when BlooInBloo says it. Hrmph.