MY SYMBOLFAMILY IS IN THE NEW YORK TIMES TODAY - FEATURE ARTICLE! Giving away Maui home for $100

[symbolman]

Well, didn't want to say anything to anyone until we were sure it was happening, but last week a New York Times cameraman did a photoshoot at our home and the article is NOW LIVE on the New York Times site! It's for the paper coming out tomorrow..

We decided to get Pro-Active as our home was not selling and so we created a website and a skill contest (THIS IS NOT A RAFFLE) so that someone would be awarded our home in MAUI for a mere $100 and a great Essay :)

A home in paradise for a $100, hard to beat that with a stick, eh?

The reporter neglected to add the website we created just for this article ( http://www.winmauihome.com ) but we're working on getting an update to the online version at least.

We're excited, and hope this is a way to solve our own personal housing crisis and help out others at the same time :)

Tell me what you think, did we do the website justice?

Hey! Rate this sucker UP! I wanna see a MUST READ on one of my threads, and if this won't work, an article in the NYTimes, then what does it take? :)

Mahalo and Aloha!

ON EDIT: Ooops! Here's the NYTimes link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/25/garden/25raffle.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

Sorry!

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

1. $105.

[symbolman]

2. Huh?

What's the five bucks for? Pen and paper? :)

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

3. The house.

:blush:

[roguevalley]

173. symbolman, godalmighty, you da bomb. I may have to buy a

paper. :evilgrin:

[symbolman]

222. You might be in the same fix WE are in here in the Islands

gonna have to wait a day for the paper to show up in the first place :)

That's what happens when you move to the outer reaches of the Bush Empire, eh?

[Schema Thing]

4. Words Schmerds. 160.00

cash.

[symbolman]

6. Oh YEAH, NOW we're talking

that and a cup of Starbucks coffee :)

[AspenRose]

5. WOW

So...is Maui a "healing place?"

[symbolman]

7. You better believe it

unless a shark takes off your leg, then you've got some REAL healing to do.. only happens to tourists though, never figured that one out, maybe they are so lacking in tan.. must be why the locals call them "Shark Bait" :)

[CatWoman]

8. look at how big SymbolBaby has become

what a sweetie pie!!

:hi:

:loveya:

[symbolman]

9. lol

he's got better pictures than that, really, thanks for sending him sweetie pie waves :)

[CatWoman]

11. you damned hippie, you

:rofl:

I remember that from your appearance on O'Reilly

:rofl:

[symbolman]

12. Yeah, took off the headband and got a haircut

trying to look "respectable", which is really hard for me :)

[symbolman]

88. Here's some pics of the family not so "posed" for you, my dear Catwoman :)

This is my Symboltot taken last year - he's making the "I Love You" sign, knows over 300 signs (besides speaking - not deaf or anything), and can count to 200 at the age of three.. a real kick in the ass, we're tempted to take him to LA and peddle him to the PullUps people, get him some college money :)



Symbolmom and Symboltot at the beach, love this photo..



Wanna Talk "Hippy"?! :) This was taken last Halloween, like I said, had a haircut since then (That's TOM PETTY's HAT, no kidding) :)



Got my Eye on you! People ask me if my sunglasses are "3 D" glasses, and I always tell them, while moving my hands around in front of me, "Oh Noooo.. THIS is 3 D, right here.." keeps them confused enough so I can make a clean get-away :) (Did I ever mention that I'm a trained Artiste? A license to be Weird, paid a lot for that, and had a damn good time, in college)



Okay, no more pics.. these were Just FOR YOU :)

Kiss the Kitties for us!

[CatWoman]

153. he is so GORGEOUS!!!

Wonder where he got that blond hair? :) I think he has Symbolmom's eyes.

Dude - the hippie looks "is" you!! :)

P.S. - I love that beach picture, too.

[symbolman]

172. Lol!

He's a little dish, as is my wife.. I think you're right about him having Symbolmom's eyes, all I got to add to the mix was the hair :)

Hey.. did that cat..just..wink at me? :)

You're such a sweetheart, I hope some day we all have a HUGE DU party, and we can all meet up!

A Luau!

[CatWoman]

176. MoPaul worked his mojo on my gif

:)

and I would absolutely love to party with you guys!!

:)

[symbolman]

221. Good old MoPaul

used many of his graphics in some of my most popular Flash attack ads..

A Party it IS then, gonna have to move this home first so we are FREE to hit the road.. but when we're out and about we'll PM YOU :)

[salin]

10. Link to the NYT article?

cool idea. Best of luck!

[symbolman]

13. Ooops! Sorry

got too excited.. I added it up top on edit, but here it is too:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/25/garden/25raffle.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

thanks for reminding me, sheesh, Sym Man.. :)

[HCE SuiGeneris]

14. Maybe I'm tired...

but I was unable to locate the amount of the entry fee on the website. Is it $100 for each submission?
TIA

[symbolman]

15. Yes

and an essay.. a good one, on what ALOHA means to you, and your family :)

[Vadem]

16. Wow, Mike! I've sent the link to all my e-mail list and I plan to ...

enter, also!

This is curious--so you will get your asking price for the house? How would that work if only 10 people or so entered the contest? How would you be guaranteed your asking price?

Thanks for letting us know how this works. Maybe we can use the same plan for selling our own houses! Will you be coming back to the States or just finding another house in beautiful Hawaii?

All the best to you and your family!!

:hi: :toast:

[symbolman]

18. We're looking to get 6,000 entries to cover the home

and if we get less than that the money goes back to the folks, or we may award the top three with a percentage of the entry fees each..

Yeah, some folks are saying that 2008 will be the year of the home raffle, but this is NOT a raffle, it's a SKILL CONTEST.

Hope other people can utilize this idea, I thought I came up with it about 6 months ago, but upon researching the idea I found a lot of people are doing it, but there are no guarantees.. got to get media exposure and work hard at it. We got lucky with a NYTimes reporter.

Dunno where we'll end up, just don't want to be in the street :)

Thanks!

[Hekate]

75. Gack! The Hawai'ian Islands ARE IN THE STATES. But is the Symbolfamily coming to the Mainland?

Sorry to yell like that; I grew up there, and was in elementary school when the Islands were admitted to the Union. It's kind of an important point since Our Candidate was born there himself several years later.

:hi:

Hekate

[symbolman]

105. Oh YEAH

You should have been here for the Primaries, never seen so many cars in my life all in one spot.. Had to walk for blocks to get to the school and took little SymbolTot with us, so he could see what Community was all about.. he LOVES Obama..

As far as where the Islands stood, I think it was about 79% for Obama, and I didn't see a single reference to Hillary anywhere, no shirts, no bumper stickers.. like she didn't exist..

He's OUR MAN here.. wish I would have been able to get to Oahu when he came, was hoping he'd swing by Maui, it's so small we could have scored a handshake :)

We'll probably do the states after here.. got family that's getting old back east, and my boy needs to know them before they croak..

You got to SEE this place become a state, what a trip, eh? :)

[Vadem]

211. No!! It is a such a foreign and exotic place.... LOL...

according to Cokie Roberts, when Obama went to see his grandmother and vacation in his home State! LOL.

You're absolutely right and I missed it! I should have said the "continental" States.


:spank: me!

:hi:

[Naturyl]

17. I'd enter but $100 is way out of my reach.

It's too bad, because I'm a pretty decent essayist.

Best of luck to all entrants.

[BlooInBloo]

19. Nice Mr. and Mrs Symbolfamily! And little symboltot!

Rood ruck!

:rofl:

[symbolman]

20. Thanks!

Trying to think outside of the Box, someone's got to do it - should be a win/win situation for everyone :)

[Rabrrrrrr]

21. Oh, man, I'd sell my left nut to move back to Hawaii!

Would there be any taxes to pay on this thing?

Is the house a contest win, or is it a straight out "opportunity to buy for $100" for the best essay?

[symbolman]

24. If we get a minimum of 6,000 entries

and your essay is chosen as the Best of them all by our panel of judges then You will be awarded a HUGE house (with a cottage in the back, TWO Houses) that's all YOURS.. whoever wins will have to pay taxes, BUT, they should easily be able to get a home loan for what may be only $150K.. and invest some, or sell it, or rent it all out and make $5,000K a month, take a little less and live in one of the FOUR living areas in the home.

It's a good house, we've enjoyed it, just want to move on, and it's a buyers market :)

[dana_b]

22. You are a peach!!

that's great that you're doing this although there will be a loooooot of reading to do! I hope you raise a bunch of $$ too.

[symbolman]

46. Appreciate the strokes, send it out to everyone you know

all help is appreciated.. you don't want to see that little boy on the street do you? (cue violin music here) :)

[yellerpup]

23. You look marvelous today, symbolman.

But, fair warning--you don't begin to age until you are covered in the NYT. Or, is that just for playwrights? Good luck!

[symbolman]

28. Yeah, I don't feel bad for hitting 55 this year

but the insides are 100 years old :)

Too much worry, even in paradise!

But just LOOK at my sweetie demobabe, got the whole flower in the hair thang going on :)

[yellerpup]

55. Great looking family!

So nice to be in love... Best wishes.

[symbolman]

106. Yep, you got that right

took me fifty years to find the right woman, and then have the right kid :)

I like that Love stuff, thanks for the compliments, my family appreciates it!

[The Straight Story]

25. I'll write an essay

not entering the contest though, but sounds like a fun thing to write :) will toss it out here later on for you (and a kick)

[supernova]

26. What an awesome contest Symbolman!

:bounce:

This idea is too clever!

I will probably enter. So are you expecting snail mail entry packets?

[symbolman]

27. Yep, there's a snail mail addy on the site

I hope it helps other who are having hard times with their homes, sort of a public service announcement, with the hope that we can cure our ills too :)

[malaise]

31. Ditto

great idea.

[supernova]

34. lol You already live on an island

for crying out loud.

:rofl:

[malaise]

51. LOL

and I'm not moving either :D

[Contrary1]

29. My gosh, Mrs. Symbolman and I could have passed for sisters

when I wore a younger gal's clothes.

Much luck to you.

[Matariki]

30. Do you own your home free and clear? Why are you doing this?

[symbolman]

35. Nope, do you?

It's simple really.. we get enough entries we hand the money to the bank, and the person who wins gets a Free house (other than the $100 and the taxes they must pay for the house - but a simple home loan will take care of that), and they can sell it at will, or rent it all out, all four living areas for $5,000 a month, or live in the home and take a little less, we live in the part where we have a view of the ocean..

We want to move, we're TIRED of Paradise, everything gets old eventually, and the Schools are the WORST here so we have to think of my son. :)

[Matariki]

66. No. I didn't mean any sort of challenge by the question. You know how the interweb is.

I was just trying to understand why you would be doing something so dramatic.

Are you charging an entry fee? Is that what you mean by handing the money to the bank?

Are you moving away from Hawaii? My boyfriends mom has lived there for many years too. She loves it, but is moving because of how expensive it is to live there.

[demobabe]

38. We've been trying to sell for about a year

We want to move into a more efficient, green house... tired of being beholden to the oil companies considering something like 85% of all electricity for the island comes from burning oil.

Scaling back, and also looking for a good place for "Symboltot" to go to school. Hawaii is notoriously bad for schools.

But the beaches and scenery, really can't be beat.

[Matariki]

67. Ah, makes sense.

You must be Ms. Symbolman? (or is he Mr. Demobabe?)

Good luck to you and your family. What a creative solution, btw.

[sniffa]

32. Can I get a job as a surveyor there?

If so, Aloha is I.

[symbolman]

37. Probably, dunno for sure

there are a lot of houses to survey, we had this one surveyed for previous escrows..

Look up Hawaii jobs on line, see what pops up :)

Aloha means many things, this country NEEDS some Aloha, and FAST!

[sniffa]

41. I think it would be great for my temperament

It would take me some time to adjust to a non-urban setting, and the non-New England weather, but it could be great. :D

[lonestarnot]

33. Woah. Where ya gona go?

[symbolman]

39. Gonna move in next door to YOU

and Party every damn day :)

I like to play Electric guitars REAL FUCKING LOUD :)

Then come over and borrow a cup of Democracy, lol..

[lonestarnot]

56. RIGHT THE FUCK ON! COME ON DOWN!

[symbolman]

59. But you don't know if I'm any good on the GitFiddle

Fair to middlin' :)

[lonestarnot]

61. I don't care! I'm sick of all the pugs that surround me. Cowards

every last one of them. You can play forks, spoons, the banjo, what have you, my dogs will tune you up! Bring the wife and kids and we'll wake the dead!

[arcadian]

36. Where on Maui?

We have a home on the Big island.

[symbolman]

48. Hey, should probably have a Hawaiian DU party

a Luau.. get some fire going, cook the pig.. hey, where's Opi?

Mahalo (PM me for that info, please), and

Maui No Ka Oi, tho I must admit I've had some seriously great times on other islands :)

[KamaAina]

182. Opi is presumably at Da Pond, as usual

to wit, on the shores of Kane'ohe Bay, windward O'ahu.

This post, as usual, originates from gritty Iwilei, once Honolulu's notorious red-light district and now a center for our burgeoning homeless community. (My home diggings are more in the center of town, near Waikiki.)

There may, possibly, be (or have been) one other DUer on Maui, but that's about it. Even O'ahu gatherings have been on hiatus since oasis split for L.A., leaving me on the opposite side of the island from Opi without a car (TheBus does not go down by him :grr: ) The paucity of Hawai'i DUers is the reason I took the name "KamaAina" (kama'aina = "local Hawai'i person", as distinguished from malihini: newcomer, visitor, foreigner) less than a year after I arrived here.

[DemoTex]

40. Mother of my dog! What a beautiful family!

We go back a long time Symbolman. Love 'ya like a brother.

Mac

[symbolman]

43. I love ya like a Brother too my man :)

So SAVE ME, spread the word, go all VIRAL on my ass :)

Much appreciated, my lil family thanks you too!

[Synnical]

42. So, ah, who are the judges? n/t

[symbolman]

44. Still being interviewed

but more likely it will be local talent, the exmayor on the Island, folks like that..

I could write to Janeane Garofalo, she's a friend of Takebackthemedia.com, bring her over to Maui.. Nawww.. she'd never go for it..

Or would she? :)

[NNN0LHI]

45. I know if I need to ask I probably can't afford it but how much are the taxes?

[demobabe]

49. You mean property taxes?

They're not too bad in Hawaii. Food and electricity are worse...

If you live in the house, you get an exemption of a certain amount (can't remember offhand), but I think we pay around $1,000 - $2,000 per year.

If you're talking about income taxes for winning, you'd have to calculate the value of the prize, and then you could take out a loan on the property... "consult your tax professional!"

:)

[Gregorian]

47. This is utter genius.

And I do predict that you're going to walk away with a hell of a lot more than you bargained for.

Awesome!

[symbolman]

50. Thanks my friend

The other thing we plan on doing, and it's on the website, is to HELP a LOT of Hawaiian Charities, some of which have helped US personally, other's that are just a great Idea, like the Habitat for Humanities, etc..

Spread the word, help us reach our figure, let's get all viral :)

We've got the Magic Word, the four letter Icon that everyone wants a Part of M A U I..

[SalmonChantedEvening]

52. How much for the shirt?

:selfswat: k. your turn. ;)

Seriously my friend, this is genius and it is beautiful. Kudos and Blessings :hug:

[symbolman]

57. Oh, I've got better shirts than that..

You can get Hawaiian shirts here made of silk for like $10! Just discovered a great place for finding them.. get a home for the price of Ten Hawaiian shirts, and a Killer Essay.. :)

Spread the word of this "genius", what a funny word, and I'll eat some local good in your honor, lemme tell ya, sometimes that takes a lot of courage.. "Are you going to eat that Optic Nerve?"

"Well, I hadn't thought about it really.. maybe I'll trade it for your 1000 year old egg.." :)

[druidity33]

53. The Spitfire Grill gambit!

I absolutely loved that movie and wondered if anyone had ever tried it. I hope it works out well for you. Keep us updated!

Cheers.

k&r

[Delphinus]

54. Good luck to you! n/t

[symbolman]

58. Thanks!

Appreciate the good wishes :)

[ClayZ]

60. Like the flowers to the bees, you are!

K and R

[bluesmail]

62. Although we've never met I've always respected your posts.

Good Luck. :hi:

[Toucano]

63. Question

Just for curiosity, is there a reason the contest is limited to U.S. residents?

Non-residents are allowed to own property in the U.S., aren't they?

Wouldn't it improve your odds of getting your target if you could advertise in the UK, Europe, and Asia? A hundred bucks is only about 58 pounds.

[symbolman]

97. Probably would increase the odds

but we're not sure about international exchanges, and then there's a potential for language problems, because it IS an Essay contest, may not be fair to non-English speaking folks... don't want to hire a bunch of translators :)

Thanks for bringing it up tho, good ideas there..

[Toucano]

104. Follow up question.

Thanks for indulging me.

You're saying there is no legal reason for the exclusion? It's just for the convenience of administrating the contest?

That's understandable, but I hope you do reconsider. There are a lot of Canadians who speak and write English well enough to participate without translators and it is the WORLD WIDE WEB. :)

[symbolman]

109. Ahh..

good point, sorry, I should have realized that, and LOTS of Canadians buy land here in Hawaii, so maybe there's not an issue as to them attaining ownership if a Canadian won.. I'll talk to my wife about that..

Appreciate you making that point.. no use cutting a whole country out of the running, thanks :)

[dysfunctional press]

64. who's judging the essay contest...?

how does someone doesn't know that the fix is already in for a friend that wants the house but can't afford it- so this is your way of letting them buy it for $100, and everybody else who enters is just helping out with the other $599,900...???

and- is there a deadline for entries?

[symbolman]

69. Well let's see...

maybe because I'd miss that cute little boy in the picture (above) while languishing in a federal prison?

Naww... that'd be too easy.

It's real simple, it is what it is, a CONTEST.. we won't even be CHOOSING the winning Essay, there'll be a hundred finalists for the Judges to choose from as well.

And secondly, thirdly? I ain't that kind of guy, neither is my wife that kind of person, and I'm fairly insulted that you'd make that kind of remark.

If you want any more info I think all the FAQ's should answer your questions..

[dysfunctional press]

86. if you honestly didn't think that anybody would have that type question about it...

you may be a little more disconnected from reality than you realize.

[demobabe]

72. There will be panel of 3 judges that pick the winner

Working on getting respected members of the community that have no interest in the outcome (or that we know) to pick the winner(s). The deadline is November 30, but may be extended if there are not enough entries.

:)

[galileoreloaded]

65. Buuuut, I have to pay the taxes on the difference of the appraised value vs. the 100.00 in

the next years return as ordinary income right???

[symbolman]

70. Yep

considering the home is appraised at more than $650K we figure most people can get a bank loan for the taxes, maybe even a little more and then they can invest or buy a Jeep to explore the Island..

The house appraised for over $800K a few years ago, and will probably go back up at some point, maybe be worth a million or so later..it IS Maui..

In the end it will be a great deal for someone. :)

[Catherine Vincent]

68. Is that your kid?

What a cutey!

[symbolman]

71. Awww, thanks, we think so too

he's a lot cuter than that, kind of a crappy pic of everyone but my wife, but thanks for saying so :)

[symbolman]

91. I posted some pics up thread in Catwoman's postings

sos you can see how cute he Really IS, at least to Us! :)

And I thank ya!

[Hissyspit]

73. Someone is doing the essay contest thing in Garner NC, too, right now, and I think

there was someone doing it in Shelby, NC, as well.

[symbolman]

74. Yeah, I thought I invented it, until I looked around..

on the internets.. We asked a person who'd successfully run one of these and he handed us over to a NY Times reporter, and so we decided to go for it..

No offense to NC intended, but I'd take Maui any day..but I'm running out of places to live, already lived in most of the ones I always considered cool, gonna have to head for France next I guess, might be a good place to watch the US meltdown if McSame Co steals the election :)

God help us all..

[Oregone]

139. Here was one I was aware of...started last year or before

http://www.win-this-home.com/

They were asking for 3000 registrants at $200 a pop.

Looks like after extending it, that it fell through and they are refunding anyone that files a claim in 100 days, and giving whatever unclaimed monies to charity.

When it came out there was an article about a bunch of others going on throughout the nation.

As things get rough, people look to unconventional ways to sell their homes.

Selling 1/4th shares is another method people are turning to, thats a tad more conventional, but for vacation homes only.

[Hekate]

76. Holy mahi-mahi, Symbolman! Your Maui photos are to die for.

Those colors go straight into my heart.

I'm forwarding this to one of our friends who used to post here.

Aloha nui loa to you all :hug:

Hekate

[symbolman]

78. Yeah, my wife really has the eye

a lot of those photos were shot around the house, the pineapple shot was in the backyard as was the gekko.. the other shots of the beaches ain't all that far away either.. I'll pass the compliments along to her :)

Aloha nui loa to you too!

Thanks for spreading the word, the more the merrier :)

[tavalon]

77. Symbolman, why are you doing this?

Are you leaving Maui?

[symbolman]

81. Probably.. The schools pretty much suck here, unless you can go private

and mah boy is getting older, I'd rather he go to a decent public school and get into a community that's behind that.. Looks like I can't go back to Alaska Since that Snowjob Bimbo has ruined some of the State..

We want to go completely green, get off the grid, solar/wind/water, whatever.. Want to build a geodome before I get too old to do it, raise animals for food, can some home grown veggies, etc..

Want to revert to what my grand parents did, only with some high tech where needed..

Call it an Experiment in Living :)

[KamaAina]

212. Going green, getting off the grid... sounds like Big Island to me

that's pretty much the status quo in the Puna district south of Hilo. The unofficial capital of Pahoa has possibly the highest (pun intended) concentration of hippies remaining anywhere, plus the nearby lava flow will probably miss it by a few miles. :-) There does seem to have been a noticeable drift of authentic hippie types from Maui to east Hawai'i island in recent years.

That leaves the school situation. As a local advocate for kids (and others) with special needs, believe me, I feel your pain. You might look in an area that has a charter school; most are, while not exactly Yale, better than your garden-variety DOE school. :puke: Many (about half statewide) feature a curriculum based on Hawaiian language and culture.

[symbolman]

220. Thanks for the info

yes, we'd thought of other islands and locations here, but another thing I'm worried about are the vermin :)

I've heard that on the big island there may actually be fire ants, and I've suffered from them in the Southern part of the US, they were awful..

So you work within the school system? May have to have a talk with you some time, maybe a DU luau? :)

Appreciate your posts..

[OakCliffDem]

79. Kick

[symbolman]

80. thanks!

appreciate the kick, for the morning crowd, hey folks a House in Maui for a $100? No catch, just write that essay and the judges will do the rest :)

[The Backlash Cometh]

82. Ya'll look like a cool looking liberal family.

[symbolman]

108. Thanks

Yeah, we lean liberal.. was it the Seuss head (sculpture) on the wall up there to the left of the picture that gave us away? :)

[TuxedoKat]

83. Good Luck

with your contest I hope it exceeds all of your expectations. I would enter if I thought I could write an interesting compelling entry. I'll have to give it some thought...

You have a lovely family. Good luck with resettling in the US. Be sure to pick an area that has alot of natural water. Upstate NY is nice where we are, but the taxes are too high.

[symbolman]

107. I heard it's beautiful up there

but I've had enough of SNOW.. lived in Alaska for about 12 years and got all the COLD and SNOW I'd ever want in one lifetime..

Thanks for the hope and compliment on family, we can sure use some hope as can everyone in this economy - I believe that everyone has a story in them, and always thought that Kurt Vonnegut Jr said it best, "Write what you Know.." a fav author.. :)

Natural water is the wave of the future, these corpo bastards are going to lock that up next, like they did the gasoline scene, eh?

Taxes aren't so bad here

[blm]

84. Happy that this is working out for you, sym-man...and it's a very KIND way to do it.

Love to symbolfamily.

[symbolman]

85. It looks like Socialism, RUN!

:)

I just hope it works out for everyone, a Win/Win all around.. our love back to You and Yours.. we're all gonna NEED to get the Love out and Dust it off.. if the economy turns totally sour, we'll all NEED EACH OTHER, eh?

SOme of us Remember how to Love, the newer generations may have a struggle there :)

[dysfunctional press]

87. someone may be GETTING it for $100- but YOU'RE not 'giving it away for $100'...

it sounds more like you're 'giving it away' for $600,000.

[wvbygod]

89. Who pays the $599,900 difference?

No house in Maui sells for $100.00 flat. What is the catch?

[dysfunctional press]

90. the 'entry fee' is $100. 6,000 entrants means $600,000.

it's a glorified raffle.

[symbolman]

92. So don't enter

and no it's Not a Raffle, it's a skill contest, with judges who will CHOOSE a winner. Why so negative?

There are plenty of channels on the TV of life.. switch to one that makes you happy. The house WAS worth over $800,000 a few years ago, and will probably be back up to that price and higher in a few years..

But thanks for kicking the thread anyway.. :)

[dysfunctional press]

93. i'm just pointing out the lie in your op. the house isn't being given away for $100.

and yes, it's basically a raffle.

[symbolman]

95. A lie?

Whatever. Too bad you seem to be having trouble comprehending the concept of a contest.

But I'm done talking with you, had enough with the insults.

Bye bye now.

[dysfunctional press]

96. a lie. you'll be collecting $600,000, not $100.

someone will end up GETTING it for $100(or more if they buy multiple entries), but nobody is 'giving it away for $100'.

[symbolman]

94. No catch

It depends on how many people enter. If there are 6,000 entries, then that money pays off the house, and it gets handed over to the winning essay as chosen by the panel of Judges from the 100 finalists we come up with after reading them all. The parameters are listed on the web site..

However the person who wins the Essay contest WILL be responsible for the taxes on the house. But they'll be far less than the over $600K the house was appraised at. It appraised at over $800K before that, about two years ago.

It has fallen out of escrow about 3 times now, not becaus there's anything wrong with the home, but because the loan officers are more stringent about loans and credit, the buyers must have Excellent credit now to buy a home.

[dysfunctional press]

99. a big part of the problem is that it would require a 'jumbo loan'...

mortgage loans over $425,000 are getting especially hard to come by- and in a lot of markets, like hawaii. that can be a big problem.

[demobabe]

161. It wouldn't require a "jumbo loan"

Not unless you're already making over a couple hundred thousand dollars a year or so.

Who is giving you YOUR tax advice? :eyes:

[dysfunctional press]

227. do you even know what a jumbo loan is...?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumbo_loan

:eyes: :eyes:

[wvbygod]

102. I get it now

For some reason I had eliminated a raffle from my mind...maybe because I lost the
halftime school raffle last night at the football game.

[Oregone]

115. So the 'winner' will have to then mortgage the house and pay $200 K in taxes immediately

And your tax burden on the sale will be entirely shifted on them, correct (you are free and clear)?

Ive seen these and kind of laughed a bit...the mortgage Id have to take if I won would be greater than my current mortgage!

[symbolman]

119. That's true

and that's the price you pay for living in this place.. we could have bought about four houses in Alabama for what we paid here, and while admittedly they have some Nice "Sugar" beaches down there, it's not quite the same.. different Sharks for one :)

I would advise anyone that would end up paying more than their current mortgage to NOT enter, and to NOT win :)

BUT. The winner of this house could rent the whole house out for about $5,000 Per Month if they so desired, and pay the mortgage off that way.. this house also has an "Ohana" on the property - "ohana" means "family" in Hawaiian.. but it also refers to a rentable space on a Hawaiian property. Many people here do just that, some partition their place, rent bedrooms, etc.. there are four living spaces in this house. We've lived upstairs where we have the ocean view, and rented out the rest for thousands of dollars which we applied to the mortgage. if the Mortgage was even Half of what we pay, there would be no problem with the home paying for itself AND leaving the owner with some Profit.. depending upon the electric and water bill..

Energy, like everything else here is Expensive.. when I tell tourists what we pay for electricity they can't believe it..

It comes with the territory, life is tough in Paradise :)

But the home would Easily pay for itself with such a reduced (relative term for you I Know) mortgage from paying for the tax.. some people can live with that.. we did for five years :)

[Oregone]

124. "I would advise anyone that would end up paying more than their current mortgage to NOT enter"

You should highlight that in bold....as I pointed out in another post. You also must consider that many people will not be able to give up their current mortgage, where their job is (and family and friends), so this is an additional expense.

But then again, you would probably not get your 6000 entries, and probably not get out of the house. :(

Your contest depends on a bit of rash decision making on the part of others who can easily come up with $100 bucks in an afternoon (when they aren't going to the casino later).

The people who could reasonably afford the additional loan, probably wouldn't need to take one. Then again, they probably aren't the type of people that shop for houses in Maui by browsing for local non-'raffles'.

I don't mean to be cynical (well, maybe I do as a fellow ocean view home seller), but your target demographic here may not be your typical fiscal responsible, willing-and-able-to-move/work-in-Maui type person...it might be someone who more or less may be biting off a bit more than they can chew.

[redqueen]

126. That's not cynical, it seems entirely reasonable to me. (nt)

[symbolman]

129. Bullshit

Do the Unicorns bite on the planet your live on?

I've answered your spurious and rather bizarre claims below. Stop systematically clogging up this thread with your silly innuendos and false claims. There are plenty of people that want to read about this, potentially to do it themselves. You are calling me out, and that's not allowed in the scope of the rules here.

Stop it. All these insults and innuendos do not change the fact that my site is Completely without guile and your intimating that I'll be cheating people somehow is sickening and repulsive.

[redqueen]

134. Asking for clarification is "calling out"?

Sorry, but if the winner is going to have to deal with huge financial obligations, it's kind of reasonable to expect that to be clearly stated.

IMHO anyway...

[symbolman]

138. It IS clearly stated

You guys seem to be working some kind of "tag team" here to create an argumentative atmosphere to shut my thread down.. this New York Times article is being Printed today, and is of interest to many people on the DU.

Stop it.

[Name removed]

146. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Oregone]

135. Im not calling you out. Im discussing the merits of this system.

It has nothing to do with you. These are becoming much more common.

Look at some of the arguments I am putting forth here, and now, imagine if this was the NORM. Imagine now, what if people entered contests instead of going to a bank to get pre-qualified. What if people only went to the bank to get mortgages on homes they already own to cover the taxes on the place (which is the taxable rate on the value of the home as if it were income).

Do you forsee any problems if this system was used nation wide?

What if masses of people were in homes they were not vetted to be able to afford? What if foreclosure rates skyrocketed? What if home values sunk to new lows? What if lending institutions that were lending on those needed taxes went dry because of the foreclosures? etc....

Look, this may work fine being that you are a single person trying this and you can walk away happy without thinking about it.

But, you are circumventing the bank-vetting process for the buyer AND evading capital gains taxes (while making them pay income tax on the home).

If this practice was the norm, this country would be in, well, about the shape it is in. Im just saying, savvy or not on your part, its not really a "sound" way that a "market" should behave.

Yes, these are unusual times. You are only a single person. But don't consider this to be 100% sterile or a non-dangerous approach to real-estate transactions (or any or type of market activity).

It may help to really point this out to the buyer (winner) in large bold red letters. Maybe it would help to provide articles about home ownership, amortization tables (which may make them pay back 250-300% of the income tax loan value after 30 years, which may be the actual value of the home). Maybe something about how to vet yourself to afford the home responsibly (loan no more than 3X your income). Just some thoughts. :)

[demobabe]

149. What, if a person wins a contest, they shouldn't pay taxes?

It's a contest. If you win anything of value, you pay the taxes.

What is so hard to understand about that? Ultimately, if someone cannot pay the taxes or get a loan, they can sell the home. I've had numerous cash offers on the house (below what I wanted to accept), and worst case scenario, someone would walk away with around a half-million or more. Then you can pay your taxes.

There are buyers for a "screaming deal" but not for market value.

[Oregone]

160. Of course they should...but not everyone knows that.

And to get hit with a 'surprise' this BIG is pretty staggering, as well as the amortized amount if they need to loan for it

And yeah, I know they can sell it (or maybe a bank will if they loan and foreclose on it)...I already posted that. Now, I know it is of no concern for the OP, but what impact does it have on the local market when a discount property is sold? Its another factor that will send home values plunging, especially if more widely used.

Look, clearly though, you ought to agree, its just not that simple. Its just not a simple $100 bucks and you're free and clear. Its not like winning a shirt or a TV.

[demobabe]

168. It's not going to have any effect on the local market

No matter how the title is recorded, it isn't going to have an impact on the local market.

When other properties are sold in the area, each one needs an appraisal. The appraiser will take comparable properties (3) to write the appraisal. If one is out of line for whatever reason, then they will disregard it and take different properties to do their comparable sales.

Of course, winning a half-million dollars or so isn't simple; this is why you get yourself a CPA. ;)

And if you're the winner, I'll be glad to help you find the resources you need to help you manage your winnings and avoid IRS issues.

[Oregone]

171. It think you are incorrect on this point

If there are 2 equal homes for sale at $600K and one pops up at $400 K, you do not think the others have to compete? Perhaps not if it sells quickly....

And if this was more common, and 2 equal homes are for sale at $600 K, and 2 pop up at $400 K (who now compete with each other).

Come on now...thats like saying foreclosure sales do not effect the local markets. They do. Anything being sold dramatically under value is going to impact the local market.

[demobabe]

174. Nope

We've got plenty of foreclosures here, and at worst, the sale of this home would be competing with those.

I suggest you investigate the market instead of trying to shoot this thread down however you can.

[Oregone]

179. ?

Look, the point is that any and every discounted property (foreclosures included) compete against normal homes for sale.

You are crazy to think appraisals and county assessments are not affected by discounted sales. Prices are plunging across this nation due to these types of sales, and normal homes are racing to stay competitive.

Countless times Ive pointed out this is a single home (a drop in the bucket). But I'm looking at this system in general, and what its impact would be if it grew even more common. If this were commonplace, and people either were reselling the home or foreclosing on the loans they needed, it would be a mess. As a common practice, its probably unsound. Now, individually, if it forced a single resale (which is almost like forcing a single foreclosure in a market), is there no impact of that because it is only a single home? Think about it hypothetically....if you only contribute partially, but a (seemingly) negligent amount to a problem, are you not part of the problem?

[demobabe]

184. Where the hell are you getting your information??

Look, I'm not going to explain this over and over to you. I can put you in contact with real estate professionals if you want to know more about how the market works here.

Quit trying to create needless confusion to destroy this thread. I see you're brand new here, so you probably don't know us...

[Oregone]

188. Look, it doesn't matter if I know or don't know you...whats that have to do with the discussion?

In fact, Id venture to say if no one knew you, there would be far more cynical replies.

I think I made a fine point here....this is a single home, so even if it resold at a discount rate, it would probably have a *negligible* impact on the local market (if it was flooded by other discount type properties that impact the market negatively). But, in such a hypothetical, is only contributing a *negligible* amount to the problem permissible, and thereby, not really part of the problem?

I'm clearly being abstract here because I am approaching this question/situation from a general standpoint (its not about you).

[demobabe]

190. No, you're beating a dead horse

You've gone beyond reasoned discussion and are actively trying to discourage people from entering.

Ever hear of the term "concern troll?"

First it's the taxes. When that gets dispelled, then it's the neighborhood. Then it's the appraised value. Then it's the effect on the market.

Would you like to add that people living here can get sunburn and that could cause skin cancer? How about it might flood? Anything else while you're at it?

Seriously, go find a fly to tear the wings off of or something and stop trying to make something that's already hard enough for me even harder.

It IS about me. You're trying to destroy me financially for some reason. What the HELL have I done to you?

[Oregone]

193. I'm trying to discourage people? Are you saying you posted to encourage people to enter?

Shouldn't you be soliciting in the DU Marketplace?

Look, I'm not discouraging anyone... I'm am discussing this. I'm not trying to do anything to you financially. I do not know you. I did not know, up to a few moments ago, that you were even (I'm assuming), the spouse and partial owner of this property. I just thought you were someone who wanted to discuss this.

Look...the tax issue isn't "dispelled". As I originally pointed out, the appraised value (which it may help to post a recent appraisal before someone signs up) is considered income by the IRS. What is dispelled about that? The winner needs to come up with the taxable amount.

Now, I am just looking at hypotheticals here, while approaching this general system. That hypothetical is: what if someone wins who cannot afford the home, or even the mortgage for the taxes, wins? What are the impacts? How does that effect the market? Does it contribute to the housing problem at all.

Another hypothetical was, what if this were the norm, rather than an exception? What overall impact would that have in housing? How would circumventing traditional bank vetting impact the overall buying process?

I think these are all fair topics to discuss in depth. Im sorry if Ive offended you personally. That was never my intention, you know.

[demobabe]

198. GO START YOUR OWN THREAD THEN

You've beat the crap out of this one. You have no intention of discussing anything here.

All you're doing is beating your point into the ground saying it

over

and over

and over.

Go away concern troll.

[Oregone]

203. If I do, will you post there?

Because you still didn't discuss/answer that question I asked (among others).

[Blue_Tires]

98. do fellow DUers get preference in the contest judging?

[symbolman]

101. Nope

as a matter of fact, we'll be stripping anything that will ID a person from the entries, making it impossible to know the sex,race, and geographical area of each entry so none of the judges are swayed by that kind of information..

Sorry - We won't know WHO wrote them :)

Folks just have to write a Killer essay.. each and every one of them.. there are parameters to follow as well for judging..

[coffeenap]

100. Would you be my, could you be my, won't you be my neighbor?

Good luck--great idea! There is a little universe of my son's friends who might just get into this--I will pass it to them--they are brilliant and so out of the box they don't know there is one! Perhaps one of them will be the lucky one.... Best wishes!

[symbolman]

103. Thanks!

That's what one of the parameters for Judging is, 40% Creativity, counts for a lot :)

His pals will be competing against each other, eh? That'll inspire them :)

[Oregone]

110. Question on taxes of this house

(BTW, Ive seen this other places, like Yachats, Oregon -- it didn't seem to work for them yet as far as I know and they allready dropped 20K plus on lawyer fees)

When people win stuff, normally that asset is considered as taxable income by the IRS (Oprah's car fiasco for example)....

So essentially, whoever wins the home will have to immediately put up 1/3 of the home's value that year to the IRS, correct? So essentially, whoever wins the home will have to immediately mortgage 30% of it just to cover the IRS's take, right?

Another question....what are your taxes on the sale? Since the contest money income is offset by the loss of an asset of equal value, are you therefore in the free and clear? Does this contest essentially work to not only sell your home, but shift the tax burden of the sale onto the buyer?

[symbolman]

117. I'll have my wife answer this one when she gets up

it's only 6am here in the Islands, and she is the person that knows about that stuff - I do know that yes, a person will need to pay the taxes on a home if they win one, and that we address that on the site, so that's upfront -- as for how much, I don't know..

Here's a link that we have on the site about that:

http://mikecandoit.com/?p=218

I'm sure my wife will be able to answer this..

[Oregone]

121. I think that is important to inform people about if that is the case

You see, people who think this may sound like a great idea might be able to afford $100 dollars, but buying a home is a serious decision and a serious responsibility, and they may not be able to afford a $200,000 mortgage.

Home buying isn't a good idea because its a good "investment" and its cheap at the time. Home buying is a good idea because it is a roof over your head (that should be stable and affordable). We are in a mess because we have pushed the investment line over this blind society, and now many have neither and investment or a roof over their head. We should be pushing ideas of affordable and sound housing to people.

Obviously, if you want 6000 people to enter, I would most certainly assert the majority probably are not in the position economically to take on this type of a loan (in addition to the loan they may all ready be paying where their actual source of employment is). Your contest essentially depends on people making rash and irresponsible decision to apply for a home they probably will not be able to afford.

When worse comes to worse, I would guess the person could most certainly turn around and sell the house, at a loss (a home that you, yourself couldn't even sell). Yes, they will walk away with some chunk of change (after selling at a price it will actually move at, and paying taxes). But of course, they will have to sell at a substandard price which impacts the local housing market negatively, which in your mind, is all fair for someone else to do (yet you are clearly unwilling to do the same, being that you are using a contest to get the same income you would otherwise of gotten from a sale at the price you want). It is also not unconceivable that a bank will certainly own this home in the near future if someone who truly cannot afford this is stuck with a mortgage on it. At this juncture in time, we can certainly say that the entire burden of this house then rests on this whole society (its probably a bank that will need assistance, and the housing market will be impacted). But all the while, while "we" pay for it, and "pay" for the bank to deal with it, you get to walk away happy to deposit your newly "earned" assets.

I really don't know how I feel about this entire scheme. I honestly do not feel you can game the market/system without consequences to anybody else. It may seem like a "get out of jail free" card, but in your place, a few others may have to step right in. Its not like you are giving away shirts here. This is a major asset with consequences and responsibility.

[symbolman]

125. There is no "scheme"..

and we don't walk away to deposit "newly earned assets".. the money collected PAYS OFF the home.. the person who WINS the home can do what they want with it, it's theirs.

I don't know where you came up with this "$200,000" dollar figure, unless you pulled it from a dark, dark place where most of us fear to tread.

And it's up to the person who enters to make that decision, and the fact that there WILL be a Tax burden is RIGHT UP FRONT and not hidden on the site. "SHIFT the BURDEN"? WE ALREADY PAID the Taxes on this Place.. if anything the Govt is double dipping on Both of us..

Sell the house at a LOSS and negatively impact the neighborhood? Oh dear, after WE have discounted it by a few HUNDRED THOUSAND already..

This site is TOTALLY Upfront about all of this, and your meanderings looks like a hatchet job to me.

If you don't want to enter, then don't. But don't try to destroy the credibility of the site and of myself and my wife with all this strange negativity and innuendos.

And I'm not going to sit here and argue with your concerted effort to diss what may be a real opportunity for people who are entering with their eyes WIDE OPEN and with all the info laid bare on the site.

"Game the System"? "Get out of Jail Card"?

Oh Please..

[Oregone]

130. "WE ALREADY PAID the Taxes on this Place"...Not really at all

You pay capital gains taxes when you sell the home (not when you buy or in the meantime). Since you are offsetting the loss of an asset with the income from the contest, you probably owe no capital gains taxes (normally you would), or any other probably.

Now the buyer would owe taxes on the asset as if it is earned income. You shifted the tax burden from yourself to them.

Its just Ive seen a lot of these things setup as ways to work around the slumping housing market. Its about collecting your money anyway you can now. But by doing so, you are creating consequences for the buyer.

Remember, when people normally buy a house, under normal circumstances, a bank stringently (or should) applies standards to make sure they can afford the house and will pay it off. This is a good vetting process because many people may not be aware of their own ability to do so. You are essentially circumventing that process to get your money, and in effect, allowing many unqualified people (and probably excited people) to be eligible to take on this debt. That has a real-world impact.

[symbolman]

133. There is NO Buyer

once again your are making misleading remarks aimed at destroying this thread, and trashing my integrity.

You are lying. Intimating that I am TRICKING "excitable" people?

I'm going to report you.

Stop it.

[Oregone]

136. Fine, the 'winner' then will have to pay income taxes on the asset (and you avoid capital gains tax)

Its really semantics though (I say 'buyer'). This is just an alternative type of real-estate transaction, which bypasses banks until after the ownership is obtain. It spreads the cost of the home out to many and the return to a single person (who will have to report it as income).

Essentially, another way to think about this is: all the 6000 people are really giving the "buyer" $600K to buy your house (without checking who it is). The "buyer" will then have to pay taxes on that $600K after the transaction. The only difference is that you dodge capital gains taxes because the way this is structured.

I never said you are "tricking" excitable people. But excitable people will enter without a full awareness of the tax consequences. The success of this contest (transaction) probably depends on excitable people. Thats an assertion, of course, but probably supportable.

Look, if you cannot confidently discuss/defend the merits of this system without reporting me, then why are you doing it?

[symbolman]

140. You keep peppering the thread with the SAME REMARKS

On the site it is APPARENT that they will have to pay the Taxes. yet you say I am TRICKING Excitable people, this is an insult and has NO BASIS IN FACT.

It is your opinion and you REPEAT it OVER AND OVER in many places and it has BEEN ADDRESSED.. it has ALWAYS been addressed on the site.

WILL YOU STOP?

THis is a Hatchet Job by you and it is Disgusting. You have no reason to KEEP saying these things because THEY ARE ADDRESSED on the SITE..

Your innuendoes are VILE.

STOP Saying the same things over and over and Peppering the thread. You've been ANSWERED AND IT IS AND HAS BEEN ON THE SITE - ALWAYS BEEN ON THE SITE.

No one is shifting any burden, IT IS APPARENT to anyone with EYES.

STOP.

[Oregone]

148. I never said "tricking"....you did.

The first time I typed it was after you.

Look, the only people "tricking" excitable people are themselves. What can I say...excitable people are, well, excitable.

But people always 'trick' themselves when things are too good to be true. Normally we rely on responsible banks to dispell such "trickery" (not lately), but I am simply pointing out this doesn't allow that option.

And yes, a tax burden is shifted. Whether that is apparent or hidden, intentional or unintentional, that is the real-world effect of this type of transaction. Cut and dry. Capital gains taxes of the seller are replaced by income taxes of the buyer (which could be greater than the potential capital gains taxes).

Look, Im not sure where you are getting that I am calling you a "bad" person who is "tricking" people. Im merely stating:

1. that people, who may not understand taxes, amortization, home ownership, etc, may not understand what they are getting into. This can have wide-reaching consequences on them and others (certainly when lenders are involved).
2. you clearly can avoid paying capital gains taxes this way

Im also making the following unsupported assertions:

1. the success of this contest depends partially on the excitable demographic who may or not be able to handle the financial implications of this asset.
2. wide spread practice of this type of real-estate transaction may lead to (in a normal setting) more volatile real-estate markets due to unvetted buyers obtaining unaffordable loans, or such buyers reselling the property at a loss and impacting the market negatively.


Im not sure where you thought I was personally attacking you. I think my quantities of replies have only gone up because I feel as if my inquiries/discussion was attacked, rather than maturely discussed.

[symbolman]

157. Are you familiar with the Term LIBEL?

You might want to look THAT Up.

Harrassment and LIBEL. Stalking.

It keeps adding up.

I've told you to stop at least 4 times now.

I will tell you once more.

STOP.

[Oregone]

165. To be honest with you, I don't think thats the way it works.

This is a public message forum. I am responding to a single thread with relevant questions. There is no personal defamation (my replies were hardly personal actually, as I am more generally looking at this process abstractly), and hence libel really isn't applicable.

Ive been quite civil in this regard.

[Scout]

167. don't you think the appropriate course of action would be to alert on the posts? n/t

[symbolman]

181. I did

You wax, you buff, and they just keep sliming back :)

I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one..

thanks for the reminder.. I'd just like to see some brush cleared, not watch the forrest burn.. :)

[demobabe]

164. You suppose an awful lot

A winner will have to pay taxes. Duh. That's the way it's always been and will always be.

I am not sure why you're posting these sky-is-falling posts over and over. You've crossed into bizarre territory.

You don't like the contest? Don't enter.

You enter and win? Then:

1. Pay the taxes.

2. Get a loan.

3. Sell the house, and buy something smaller wherever you like, or go party with the money (after you pay the taxes, of course).

Even if you did a 'fire sale' on the house, you're still going to walk away with hundreds of thousands of dollars, which I'm sure would be a terrible burden for you.

[Midlodemocrat]

142. Uh, no. Capital gains taxes aren't paid for up to two years after the sale

IF and only IF you don't buy something else in the meantime. They aren't due when the house is 'sold', which is what is happening to this house. It is being 'sold' to the winner for $100.

And, you would have to be an idiot to think that a $150,000 mortgage over 30 years is a bad deal for a house on Maui. Seriously.

[Matariki]

111. What's your plan if you only get 10 or 20 entries?

[symbolman]

113. If we don't reach the minimum

we'll return the entries.. it's a gamble for us, but there have been some successful cases of this kind of contest.. there was one in Baltimore, MD recently that was attempting to get 3900 entries and ended up bringing in over 5000 - the charity they were associated with received about 214,000 dollars for their promotion of the home - it was an organization that helped kids..

It depends on the amount of media they garnered to get their contest out there where large amounts of people could see it and enter. They were mentioned on CNN on Super Bowl Sunday, and that put them over the top.

I was in touch with the man who brought in that contest, and he was the one who referred us to the New York Times reporter - he also said to me that of the hundred people that approached him to help them with their contest that he thought that my wife and I had the creativity and tenacity to make this work. Real nice guy. Helping teen girls in trouble.

Our starting with the NYTimes is a very good sign that this will work for us, it's hard work, but I've been on Television before, the O'Reilly show on FOX, Scarborough's show twice (once for my MoveOn.org Entry "ARMY OF ONE" that was aired as a 30 second commercial all over the easters seaboard during the Dem primaries 3000 times), as well as CNN's Lou Dobbs..

I have to do the work to bring in entries, and I'm pretty inspired to do so :)

[aikoaiko]

112. SPAM: Are we allowed to advertise the things we're selling in GD, now?

I got a used baby carriage I'm selling for $50. Send me a message.

[symbolman]

114. I think people are interested in this

they might want to do it as well - many people, some here on the DU are in distress and may be facing foreclosure, and looking for a way out, this is one way to do it, when all of your options are gone due to a wacked economy...

Maybe I'm leading the way on this one, and it can HELP some DU'rs.. I've spent the last 7 years fighting the Bush Empire and made some significant strides..

Sorry that you think this is some kind of Ebay scenario, you may be missing the point.

The economy is crashing and this is just another creative option.

[Midlodemocrat]

116. Well, I certainly am.

I know the area of Maui that you referenced. We spent a wonderful week at the Grand Wailea in 2004. I would LOVE to have place on such a beautiful island.

Gotta start writing!

[symbolman]

122. Incredible hotel

Love that place.. I believe that's where Oprah brought all of her employees here to PLAY :)

She trucked in about three planeloads of people, just about Everyone that does Anything for her, from Cameramen to gofers..

They all went nuts, everything was paid for.. cool lady, and she has land here too I think..

Gentlemen, and Women SHARPEN your Pencils and Start your Engines :)

Dig deep inside, find your inner ALOHA :)

[redqueen]

118. It says multiple times in the NYT piece that it's a raffle.

Why are you saying above that it's not? What's the "skill" you're referring to?

[symbolman]

120. It says multiple times that OTHER Homes were and are Raffles

Not THIS ONE..

And the article says that another one is a Skill contest as well - people have to Color two dancers.. I think that's silly personally, but it's his contest.

The SKILL on our contest involves writing a Winning Essay, one that will be Chosen by a panel of Judges as better than all the others, according to the parameters set by us..

no one pulls a ticket out of a hat.. The winner of this contest EARNS the home.

If you go to the site and read it, you'll know.. it's all there. :)

[redqueen]

128. Well I can't afford a $200K mortgage anyway, so I can't enter. Oh well. (nt)

[symbolman]

131. How did you figure $200,000?

from someone that's an Expert in Hawiian Property?

I'm actually laughing over here now.. :)

[redqueen]

132. I thought you agreed with that number in post #119.

I can't afford a mortgage anyway, so I'm out no matter what.

Might be helpful to have included a note saying "It will be incumbent upon the winner to incur (list financial obligations of the winner here)" in the advertisement.

[symbolman]

137. If you read the site you'd know

but that just means that you're really not interested, and that's just fine with me..

Have a good day.

[redqueen]

150. All I found was this, from the FAQ page:

"Taxes, if any, ..."

Nothing about what kind of mortgage they could afford, or an estimate of the tax burden.

:shrug:


Regardless, I'm pretty sure I can't afford the taxes, "if any", so I still can't enter. Oh well.

[Oregone]

152. Thats a responsible approach

I wish we lived in a time where more people could recognize what they could and couldn't afford and not enter contests or buy assets.

On the other hand...isn't that what banks used to be for? To tell people they can't. :)

Seems like thats been the real issue this last decade...the banks are lending to every damn Man, woman and child they can get their damn hands on.

[redqueen]

155. Well they were encouraged to... the bigger the loans, the bigger the payout

if they ended up in default.

At least that's how Ben Stein made it sound in his piece.

[Oregone]

141. The amount owed to the IRS would be....

The tax rate on (the house appraisal) + (your income) - (yearly write-offs)

You see, it would be included as $600K (or whatever the appraisal comes out to be) to your annual income.

You would settle it when you file your annual tax return.

I estimated $200 K. I'm not sure how much taxes someone pays who makes $650K a year or so. Any idea?

So to come up with that dough, most people would have to mortgage the home (or sell their other, if they have 200K in equity and relocate and find a new job in Maui).

[symbolman]

144. This is Harrassment

Unabating Harrassment, and is not allowed by the Rules, you are saying the SAME THING OVER AND OVER all over this thread, when the Subject IS APPARENT and has HIGH VISIBILITY ON THE SITE.

STOP THIS.

[Oregone]

154. With all due respect, I was addressing redqueen's inquiry regarding the amount. nt

[Midlodemocrat]

156. Dude, cut it out.

Most people who would enter this contest for $100 know that they will have to pay taxes.

You're trying to make a problem where one doesn't exist. If the person who wins doesn't want to live there, they can rent part of it out like Symbolman said or choose not to rent it out.

If I won a property like that someone as beautiful as Maui, you can bet you sweet Aunt Fanny I'd head to the bank for a mortgage to pay the taxes.

It's a sweet, sweet deal for the winner.

Don't try to spin it otherwise.

[Oregone]

169. "Most people who would enter this contest for $100 know that they will have to pay taxes."

I honestly don't think that is true, but the both of us really do not know. I don't think it is common knowledge that people have to pay taxes on contest earnings.

Sweet "deal" or not, as I originally stated, I think our society needs to stop looking at real estate as a "deal" or "investment", and more as a roof over your head (that is affordable). Deals can get people into trouble, and if it just becomes a discount resale it hurts the market (which impacts everyone).

It'd be cool if on contests like this there is an opt-in check box, under the "I understand the terms and conditions", that states perhaps, "I understand the tax implications of this transaction as stated in section .....".

You know, just to clear the air.

[Midlodemocrat]

170. People who can afford to enter a contest at $100 a pop know

they have to pay taxes on earnings. It's a far cry from $1 tickets for a car raffle.

[Oregone]

175. Ahh...come on now. People blow that much all the time on lottery tickets

The point is to lower the price so much that the cost of entry becomes negligible to the dream of winning. $100 is a full tank of gas these days. :)

[Midlodemocrat]

177. You just made my point.

People buy lottery TICKETS, multiples.

To buy multiple tickets to something like this would involve hundreds if not thousands of dollars.

[Oregone]

183. I don't think I made your point at all....

People blow $100 dollars all the time....

Take your family out to eat somewhere nice.

Buy a tank of gas

Buy a bunch of lottery tickets

A long taxi ride

Take a day vacation to another town

A sight seeing tour on a bus

A rafting trip on rented rafts with friends

Enter a contest like this.....


You are trying to say that $100 dollars is such an amount that only a person who thinks deep and long about tax implications would put it forth for a contest.

I'm stating $100 dollars is spent here and there on everything these days, from necessities to commodities to just plain fun.

The ability to spend $100 isn't indicative of a person with financial responsibility and knowledge. Hell, the US is about to spend $700 billion...how responsible are they? :)

[demobabe]

196. People can be irresponsible with any contest

Win the lottery and not pay the taxes? Sure, you'll get in trouble.

Any big prize, and you need to get a CPA to plan your taxes and help with finances.

[Oregone]

202. Here is a strange thought...

Whenever I see a lottery advertisement (which I will never play), the first thing I do is divide it by half. Thats what you get when you take it up front and pay taxes generally, I think. People talk about it constantly. You know, its a number so its easy to just cut it in two. Its generally common knowledge I think, as I hear that everywhere (about what your really get).


But when you see a shiny car in a mall, you don't think to yourself, "what form on my 1040 will that go on", or you don't visualize just the front of the car hacked off from the rest. I guess its because you get the entire material thing (you just have to put up cash (you may not have) for the taxes instead of paying it from liquid winnings).


Maybe its just me, but I think when I see a material prize, cognitively, I perceive it much differently than a liquid amount. On the other hand, I normally always think to myself, hm, "What could I sell that for". Normally if I don't have something, Id rather sell it and have the cash anyway.

[demobabe]

205. Sure

There are a million ways to think about things...

And selling the prize is certainly something you can do.

[redqueen]

197. Actually you're wrong about that. Maybe I'm THE ONLY one here who needs it explained.

But your posts about how "most" people know this made it seem that way, regardless.

[demobabe]

200. If you need it explained

I can answer any questions you may have in PMs. :)

[redqueen]

201. No... thanks though...

I already found out that I'm not someone who should be entering this kind of contest, but thanks again anyhow. :)

[DS1]

123. Here's my 100 words or less entry

To me, Aloha simply means "Don't be a douchebag."




Do I have to mail that in?

[symbolman]

127. You Could write that on a hundred dollar bill

it would just about fit.. :)

[Midlodemocrat]

143. No. That's Mahalo.

:rofl:

[symbolman]

145. Lol!

Thanks for the laugh!

I would think that douchebag would be an Alaskan term for "Govenor" :)

[DS1]

147. Nice post, Haole

[symbolman]

151. "Haole...

The Other White Meat.." :)

I was never able to track that t-shirt down, always wanted one..

[Midlodemocrat]

158. Don't talk to him. He's disruptive.

:hide:


:rofl:


He knows I'm Muslim and just posts that stuff to be mean.


(No, I'm not)

[KamaAina]

224. It may not win you the house, but...

...it sure would make a hell of a bumper sticker and/or T-shirt!

"Aloha: Don't Be A Douchebag". :thumbsup:

[KamaAina]

159. Someone did a similar thing a couple of years with a bookstore

You'll never guess where it was. Not in a million years.


Ready...


...wait for it...


Wasilla, Alaska!

You just can't make this stuff up! That would've been the worst hundred bucks I ever spent... :scared:

[symbolman]

162. Man!

You could Censor Yourself and No ONe would be the Wiser :)

Is it still there? Has it been "De-Witched"?

"Look! A Witch!"

"Oh, just toss her on the Pile of Burning Books.. kill two birds with one stone.." :)

[Hekate]

163. Folks: This is such a cool idea from one of our old-timer DUers. There are 2 or 3 meanies....

... pissing on this thread for no discernible reason.

My advice to them is to STFU. Go find another thread more to your liking. Read the NYT article all the way through. Read the FAQs at the website. Do your own damn research into Hawaii's taxes and the IRS. In fact, do your own damn research, period, just like I hope you would do before contemplating a move to any other location on the planet. Every contest winner has to pay taxes in the USA. Duh!

A lot of people here, such as myself, like Symbolman and Demobabe and have supported them in their endeavors in the past: endeavors that got our own Symbolman tossed in the clink by the fascists on the Mainland at one point, IIRC. Symbolman has taken risks for all of us by trying to get news out that the MSM doesn't care if you see.

Symbolman and Demobabe aren't trying to hurt or take unfair advantage of anybody. It's a contest!

I'm not joining this contest! Big deal! I don't buy $100 raffle tickets! Other people do! It's a big world!

Crikey! Give it a rest!

Hekate

[Midlodemocrat]

166. Wish I could recommend this post.

:thumbsup:

[symbolman]

178. Thanks so much

I wish I could recommend this post too! Hekate, you ROCK, and I want to bear all your children.. oops, too late :)

I Do my best, for whatever it's worth, while others, people like you guys (and gals) just plain got it GOIN' ON :)

Thanks again! Been up all night trying to get some more media on this, or there won't be much of a contest.

I'm thinking Oprah.. eh? eh?

[redqueen]

195. I really hope you're not referring to me as a "meanie".

I was actually considering entering this contest, until I realized I was one of those few idiots who needed to have it explained that I'd be on the hook for taxes on the house.

[Runcible Spoon]

180. shouldn't you post this in DU Marketplace?

:shrug:
I don't think GD is an appropriate place for this kind of thing, even under the banner of "hey look I'm in the NYT!" It's still a for-profit venture, is it not?

[symbolman]

185. This is a learning experience on the subject of the housing slump

we really don't expect to profit from this, and we've got between three and a 150 charities lined up on the website.. other folks might want to see how this works so they can try it, if it will work for them..

We are sort of trailblazing and taking the hits on this, maybe show other folks what NOT to do..

The article is only out today, I imagine most people will be bored soon anyway, unless there are specific questions we can help with..

Again, don't think there's going to BE any profit..

[demobabe]

186. It's relevant because it's in the NYT

It is a feature article featuring DUers. That makes it relevant for discussion here.

[Runcible Spoon]

187. umm...but it's still a for profit venture, no?

nt

[demobabe]

189. It's a "try to keep my family from losing our asses venture"

Read all about the contest at the website, http://www.winmauihome.com, and you can understand the whys and hows of the contest and what kind of venture it is.

Believe me, if we could sell the house for what it is worth, that would be a lot easier than trying to run a contest, which is hard, full-time work.

Regardless, this is newsworthy enough to be discussed on the GD.

[Oregone]

191. Have you explored:

Owner-carry (legal only if original loan can be paid down), lease-option, reserved auction (Ive heard these can work well if marketed properly), partial ownership (people can more affordable purchase 1/8 shares, but the legal work is difficult to manage sometimes), etc. These are all unconventional methods which can work well in slumping times.

If anything, I guess the home will be marketed if the minimum entries are not met. I am only familiar with the details of one of these type of deals (which didn't meet the minimum entrants--I posted the site earlier), but am not aware if any have worked...are you?

[demobabe]

192. I've done everything.

Some of these contests have worked, yes. If you read the Times article, it has some examples.

It's really hard to do, but having major media coverage like the Times article helps.

[Oregone]

194. You never know....

But you might get a private offer now that you are advertising on a large scale.

What then? Do you have any exceptions in your rules? Would you just refund people so you could close in time?

I'm just curious. I know that another guy that did this spent a load on a lawyer before he even announced and had everything covered (I don't know if he did that).

[demobabe]

199. Clearly you haven't read the rules.

[Oregone]

204. To be fair, I didn't plan on entering.

I actually can't because I don't live in the US. So why read the rules in depth?

But its an honest question that other thread lurkers who may be interested in the contest may wonder about.

[demobabe]

206. kthxbai

[Hekate]

207. If you don't plan on entering, & can't anyway, why do you continue harassing the OP?

It really isn't an "honest" line of questioning on your part under the circumstances. Do the research by following the links if you really want to know all this stuff just out of curiosity.

Hekate

[Oregone]

208. "Do the research by following the links if you really want"

About 99% of what Ive been trying to talk about and discuss isn't on the link. This was just a random side question I threw out there about the specific contest (being that most my questions were non-specific, and rather about this method of selling a home, not their actually instance of doing so). There was nothing malicious or dishonest about it.

Getting exposure in a major publication can most certainly bring about an offer. Why read through rules of a contest I wont enter, when they could answer a simple question simply?

Its annoying that I'm not supposed to ask questions or make statements because of "who" they are (based on what other people have said). Its annoying to be attacked because people don't know "who" I am. Why can't people actually look at the basis of a question and respond rationally. I'm not sure why discussion has spawned such venomous and rabid responses that never fully addressed the basis of the discussion anyway.

[demobabe]

209. Most of it is answered at the link

And the rest has been answered on this thread.

And if anybody has any questions, they can contact us directly. They don't need you to ask repetitive questions for them.

Enough, concern troll.

[symbolman]

218. Let's ignore this person

they are obviously Sick and can't be helped with logic and reasoning.. thanks :)

[Hekate]

223. So done

I've been checking back to see if the mods had been by. Regardless, I figured that by the end of this I'd be putting this person on Iggy.

Cheers!

Hekate

[demobabe]

210. kick

:kick:

[demobabe]

213. kick

:)

[upi402]

214. kick

for the Symbolman.

I thought he was a Hollywood guy or something for some reason.

[Hekate]

215. Kick

:kick: I'd love to see Maui some time

Hekate

[symbolman]

219. I was, am, did the Hollywood thing :)

If you go to http://www.symbolman.com you can see the animation that was given an award in Hollywood, at the Egytian Theater.. I created a book that I really should get published, where I "wrote" with no words.. the entire story is told in international symbols, so anyone in the industrialized world can read and understand it -- the animation has been used by many universities at this point for teaching, I'm on the same page with fantastic renowned artists like Picasso, etc for the teaching aspect..

My animation beat out over 640 other animators world wide for the award.

I was also on the O'Reilly show once, Scarborough's show on MSNBC, and Lou Dobbs of CNN, but for activist reasons..

Maybe that's why you thought that :)

[Blue_Tires]

216. ttt

[symbolman]

217. Thanks everyone!

Except for the thread shitters, but I assume most of us are ignoring them now that it's become obvious that's what they are doing..

I appreciate the support!

[demobabe]

225. kick

:)

[upi402]

226. Kick? I was gona kick it

heyyyyYYYYY man!
:hippie:

[David Zephyr]

228. Kick this up!

I haven't been spending much time here lately - personal and business issues - but want to wish your good fortune and to tell you that you are one of the very best in our community here.