Tonight was a bad night for equality

[dbackjon]

I know I will get flamed, but I don't care. I am fucking pissed at being thrown under the bus, again.

Millions of Floridans and Californian Democrats voted for hate and Bigotry, while our leadership first encouraged, then too late tried to stop the hate.


I am glad that Obama won. I hate that I got run over in the process.

[FVZA_Colonel]

1. This is fucking terrible.

I don't know what I can say that could make up for this, except that I am sorry.

[Eryemil]

32. The hypocrisy of black/latino voters is astounding

Y yo soy Latino...

[dubeskin]

2. Prop 8 in California hasn't passed yet

And there's a lot more time left. Just wait it out. I've got good feelings about it.

[proud patriot]

12. No on 8 we can defeat this

[enki23]

3. we won't stop

even if we lose today, it won't be forever.

[Oregone]

4. I totally agree. Hence, I remain a cynic

Maybe things will change. Ill wait and see. This is a civil rights issue as far as I am concerned.

[Behind the Aegis]

5. Horrifying

Here are the current results: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/polls/#CAI01p1 (Cali)

However, in FL, 47% of democrats voted for this bullshit! :puke: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/polls/#FLI01p1

[orleans]

10. ironic ain't it? the gay community (in general) voted to support obama

and in these exit polls 70% of blacks and 51% of latinos in california voted for gay people to go fuck off. nice. :sarcasm:

that is really shit.

[Behind the Aegis]

11. It is very disappointing, but sadly, not at all surprising.

One glass ceiling was destroyed and another reinforced. :(

[RetiredTrotskyite]

25. It's Not At All Surprising....

We support these candidates over and over and over, and we get screwed, because they know that there is no viable alternatives.

[Behind the Aegis]

27. It is not just the candidates, but the voters.

However, I am rather pleased I will get to say "President Obama," and not "President McCain."

[SharonAnn]

6. "The arc of history is long, but it bends toward justice." MLK (?)

[readmoreoften]

15. Sometimes. Sometimes not. Or at least for some history is longer than others.

Seriously, for the Kurds, the Bahai, the working class and the poor, and LGBT people... the arc is so long it's looking like a straight line to me. But, yeah, I think by 2850 AD we'll probably have full equality for both Kurdish and LGBT cyborgs. (Poor cyborgs will still be disenfranchised most likely.)

[readmoreoften]

7. A bittersweet night indeed. We've been robbed of the full joy of victory.

We shall overcome. Someday.

[Wabbajack_]

8. Honestly I don't want ANY bigots in my party

they can rot.

[puerco-bellies]

9. Do not despair, if we fail to defeat Prop 8

We will overturn it via The United States Supreme Court.

[readmoreoften]

13. I doubt it. Regardless, the fact that over 50% of Americans think we're sick and evil is depressing.

They won saying that we would invade schools. They won on a "protect the children" platform and that sickens me.

[puerco-bellies]

16. Think of what they said of my people, Native Americans..

Blacks, Latinos, and now the Gay and Lesbian community. Jim Crow personified would still win in some southern states, but they can never do that again. Dare to hope, the times, they are a'changing.

[readmoreoften]

22. There is still no justice for Native Americans. This is just a step towards justice for Black folks.

My partner's Cherokee blood is strong. Two-spirit Native Americans have been robbed of their place within their heritage as well as robbed of their culture, land, and LGBT inclusion.

I am full of hope for America, but I am full of caution for LGBT people. I don't think it necessarily gets better for us. From what I've read, violent crimes against us are on the rise. Things seem to change for us when we make a strong stand, when we demand inclusion and dignity.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

21. Full faith and credit clause will trump a proposition.

Ninth Circuit court which includes CA has already legalized gay marriage.

It will get to the Supremes.

[Ms. Toad]

58. It would be nice, but

the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals has not legalized gay marriage.

The Ninth Circuit ruled that the state, as an employer, could control the on the job speech of its employees regarding on controversial issues (including same gender marriage). The case was a free speech v. right of the employer to control the work environment.

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. This is not over yet...

and there are precedents in California Legal History that will make this go all the way to the courts

It is also similar to the one in Florida... so either goes to the USSC and is overturned, then it becomes a federal issue

And I will continue to continue to fight for EQUALITY of ALL PEOPLE

[Chovexani]

17. I've never felt such highs and lows in one night.

Immense pride and immense shame in this country all at the same time.

[Behind the Aegis]

18. Don't forget Arkansas and Arizona.

Arizona Proposition 102: Ban on Gay Marriage: passed: 56% (97% reporting)

Arkansas Initiative 1: Ban on Gay Couples Adopting Children: passed: 57% (94% reporting)

[dbackjon]

19. Not forgetting those

But in those states, the percentage of yes votes was roughly equal to McCain votes, (Arkansas actually went for McCain in a slightly higher %)

Not so in CA and FL, where millions of Obama voters also voted for Hate.

[Throckmorton]

20. Move to Connecticut

We voted down our proposed Constitutional Convention, which was a thinly veiled effort to repeal Gay Marrage here. All the right wingers were in full on attack mode, and we pasted their asses.

[Naturyl]

23. Sometimes, we have to see the bigger picture.

How do you think I, as a poor person, feel? Obama's entire campaign has featured NOT ONE WORD about poverty. On a personal level, that sucks, because the message is loud and clear - my concerns and needs are simply not on the agenda.

Even so, Obama was very much the right choice for the country. Sometimes we have to see beyond ourselves and realize that even while we are being thrown under the bus, our own desires are outweighed by the overall progress of the society as a whole.

That being said, I believe in equality for everyone (on both the social and economic level) and it is unfortunate that some of us remain marginalized.

[readmoreoften]

29. There is no moving towards equality and moving away from equality simultaneously.

What makes you think that there aren't a whole hell of a lot of POOR GAY PEOPLE out there? Being LGBT is a POVERTY issue and losing health insurance and basically being held hostage in ghettos doesn't help. How did the proposition taking foster kids out of LGBT homes help poor people?

I am poor and I fight for other poor people. Maybe you should "see beyond yourself" and understand how these propositions cause poverty and suffering in REAL PEOPLE, including straight people and poor people and black people and latino people, and that INJUSTICE ANYWHERE IS INJUSTICE EVERYWHERE.

Gay people aren't a subcategory of rich white people, you know.

If Prop 8 FAILED and Barack Obama lost, I'd be crying for my African-American brothers and sisters even though I personally experienced a victory. Why are we always the people who have to shut the fuck up?

[BoneDaddy]

40. It has less to do with "shut the fuck up" and more to do with

understanding that you are not going to get what you want at them moment, that America is still very much backwards and all the screaming, yelling and attacking black and latino people won't change the situation, it will just mean we will always have more work to do.


Time has allowed a black person to be president of the United States in a relatively short amount of time (a generation) after they got the right to even vote in this country. I work in a high school where we have a strong Gay/Straight Alliance,where girlfriends can show their love in the hallways and no one freaks out. Where gay boys can play football and not be harassed. That is a helluva lot of positive movement.

I do not like it either but times are changing and patience is hard to achieve. Hang in there.

[Zhade]

24. I'm livid.

NT!

[illuminaughty]

26. I don't get it.

We remain an intolerant society in so many ways. I was looking at numbers in Calf. and Fla. and just the vote for Pres. blows me away. Wasn't a wide enough win in Calif for Obama even. What happened to the liberal state?

The numbers were getting closer on the Prop. as of 3am central. Here's hoping.

[ContinentalOp]

39. What are you saying? Obama got almost double McCain's numbers in CA.

And after all, this is the "liberal" state that brought the world Ronald Reagan among others.

[illuminaughty]

56. Sorry, I posted early a.m. before seeing final totals

I guess I expect too much from Ca. I live in Kansas but was a TWA brat and I spent much of my youth in Encino. In a family of 5 my father was the only one who didn't move to Calif. That I've never understood.

I'm in denial about the conservative aspect of the State, even though some of my family there are rabid conservatives. I attribute much of my liberal views to spending the 60's there. Compared to Kansas, it's friggin' Denmark. And I was sorry to see prop 8 pass.

[CreekDog]

28. you are wrong to suggest you got run over by what elected Obama

you got run over by almost all those who would have elected McCain.

[EFerrari]

30. No. In very difficult economic times, people tend to conservatism.

Obama ran as more sober on the economy, he got votes.

A lot of things that required people to extend themselves in any way went down tonight.

[readmoreoften]

35. That's true. All of the propositions and local initiatives were abysmal around here.

Good point. What scares me is I see these people as clinging to anti-gay rhetoric even harder now.

[EFerrari]

37. It works both ways, though. Every time we have to make this case in pulbic

we get better at it. The ad, for example, that overtly used a comparison to the other civil rights movement was very effective but it started running too late.

[blackbooks]

54. It;s all they have left. n/t

[CreekDog]

36. turnout wasn't high enough in California

otherwise i think Prop 8 would have lost.

[EFerrari]

38. Obama's constituency wasn't anti-8 enough. I don't know if that

could have been predicted.

[JVS]

43. It seems that most ballot initiatives where conservatives won were about GLBT issues.

Take a look here.

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/ballot.measures/

Other than the ending of affirmative action in one state and possibly AZ's proposition about employers of illegal immigrants (info too murky to call either left or right), propositions other than gay marriage and adoption went for the liberals. Abortion, medical marijuana, stem cell research, doctor assisted suicide, even retention of MA's income tax all went the liberal way. If your prognosis about the economy is what decided voters' behavior, why are they so liberal when it is unrelated to gay people? There's something more at work here.

[EFerrari]

45. I don't believe that happened in California.

For example, they returned JR ROTC to our schools but voted down projects that required funding. Maybe my idea doesn't generalize. :(

No on H8 is not conceding right now. Several million ballots haven't been counted yet.

[JVS]

46. Well in CA an abortion limit proposition lost in the same %'s that prop 8 won.

[EFerrari]

47. That's true -- but that prop didn't require funding or even effort

from anyone. It didn't require a change on anyone's part -- that's sort of what I was getting at. We more or less voted "no" on change -- of spending, effort, etc.

[readmoreoften]

31. Personally, I think we also got run over by vote fraud.

[SoCalDem]

33. We have to do away with "initiatives" and "propositions"

These subvert the legislatures, and are 99.99999% proffered by rich people who want their pet projects pushed to the front of the line, by clever wording and bazillions of dollars in ads..

Back when the recall was going on and they were gathering signatures, people with clipboards were getting signatures by asking people if they supported improving curriculums in schools ( an Ahhhhnold positition).. Unless people pressed them (like I did) they never even knew they had signed up to recall Davis...

We get all kinds of looney groups out here pushing to get thier issues on the ballots, and sometimes voting NO , actually approves something.. people do not take the time to read through the whole thing, and even if they did, they would not understand it..

We need to make these types of things go through the legislature where they belong...make the legislators responsible for their votes..

The un-doing of the ban, will probably end up on the next ballot..

[EFerrari]

41. My friend Tom got elected to the Assembly yesterday

but he can't get married. :(

[crispini]

50. One simple rule would fix I&R

You can't pay anyone to collect signatures on a petition.

That right there would fix this problem.

[Behind the Aegis]

34. Bigotry lives in the hearts of many, including democrats and liberals.

I hope when I wake up, and the votes are all counted, the proposition in CA will have lost, but after the display from some tonight, I don't hold out much hope. I was so excited by the election of our new president, but I am having a difficult time smiling. One wall falls, and another seems to get more bricks.

[alarimer]

42. Yes it was. A clear example of tyranny of the majority.

This legislation by popular referendum needs to die now. The majority of voters in several states are clearly assholes and morons.

[Neecy]

44. History made and unmade last night

I cried when Obama won. I worked my ass off for him since January, when we fought for a win in the Missouri primary. It's the end of Bush-Cheney, an end to torture and looting and criminality etc. And after the last two presidential elections it just felt so goddamn good to win.

Watching the clips of MLK and Selma last night made me proud we've come so far. It's a great victory not only for African-Americans but for all of us.

Then the returns started coming in for Prop 8 and I saw my own historical clips playing in my head. Coming of age in the era of Anita Bryant and Harvey Milk's murder and his murderer getting off almost scott free. Moving along I saw the debate over Don't Ask Don't Tell where the country was told we'd destroy the military. Then I saw the DOMA debates, where we'd destroy the American family. It's been a rough series of clips in *my* history, until I saw the first marriages taking place in Massachusetts and I thought, wow, in my lifetime we've gone from Anita Bryant to this. And I cried with joy.

That was taken away last night in my native state. I feel completely uninvested now, Obama win or not. I'm not a full citizen. I'm right back where I fucking started. No, we can't.

[PatSeg]

48. California needs to stop with the damn

propositions on the ballot. There are so many of them each election that the average voter cannot keep up with them.

As for Prop 8, the proponents barraged voters with direct mail, TV advertising, and phone calls, often claiming it was about everything BUT gay marriage. One piece of mail I received was extremely disturbing as it featured a picture of Obama on the front and on the back there were pictures of numerous prominent black religious leaders. The impression it gave voters was Obama was FOR prop 8.

There have been people standing on street corners and overpasses with signs advocating prop 8 often referring to "education" not "marriage". Kids were often seen carrying these signs.

They have spent an obscene amount of money on this proposition. This is no way to change laws or the constitution. That is what we hire congressional representatives to do. The only proposition I want to see on a ballot in the future is one to end propositions!

[PatSeg]

53. Here is the direct mail piece with Obama on it

[tjwash]

49. Now you see why I went off on uninformed voters the other day.

I hate the way people don't study a damn thing, and then head to the polls and make up their minds based on 30 second commercial sound bites.

[jgraz]

51. The Christians thought they were persecuted before? They ain't seen nothin yet.

I was willing to live and let live. And then these motherfuckers came after my friends and my family.

Step One: push AG Jerry Brown to remove CA Tax Exempt Status from the Catholic and Mormon churches.

Step Two: pressure the Obama Justice Dept (nice phrase there) and the IRS to remove Federal Tax Exempt status from the Mormons and the Catholics.

Step Three: Pursue whatever local, state or federal legislation necessary to remove all public support for religion and religious activities.


NO SPECIAL RIGHTS FOR BIGOTS.

[SoCalDemocrat]

52. Yes on 8 was well financed - we focused too much on the Presidency

We have ourselves to blame for not focusing on the Senate and important local issues such as this one.

[GreenFiles]

55. Anything and Everything LDS must be taxed.

..Heavily.

[upi402]

57. Not for nuthin'... I'm not gay and not in CA but

I got active opposing prop 8 gay-haters.
:hug: