7 Year Old Handcuffed, Arrested & Booked For - Sitting on a Dirt Bike on the Side Walk

[ariesgem]

BALTIMORE -- The mother of a 7-year-old Baltimore boy worries he will never be the same after he was arrested, handcuffed and booked for sitting on a dirt bike.

Gerard Mungo was arrested Tuesday in east Baltimore. His mother, Likisa Dinkins, said Gerard was sitting on the dirt bike with the motor off while waiting for his father to pick him up.

She said an officer grabbed him by the collar and pulled him off the machine. Police confiscated it and took Gerard to Eastern District headquarters -- where he was photographed and fingerprinted, then released to his parents.

snip.....

link to video - http://www.wbaltv.com/news/11259978/detail.html?rss=bal&psp=news#

[opihimoimoi]

1. The Bully Macho Cop Gone Wild....So brave, so courageous...to arrest a 7 year old...sad

[indepat]

15. Amurika, Amurika, W shed his grace on thee

[papau]

17. Is this BWB - biking while black - a crime? Or was it no helmet and motorized

vehicle riding by a 7 year old is not allowed?

But even if the latter, the arrest is stupid.

[notadmblnd]

44. He should probably consider himself lucky that he wasn't tasered for his hideous crime.

:sarcasm:

[opihimoimoi]

46. No Shit.....the poor kidw will have nightmares for a long time...prolly need counseling

Bad cops gone wild? More like a stupid cop w/o a brain

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

63. We need to respect the police, but also hate them at the same time

This duality is important because the police are basically an amoral institution. In the countries conquered by Nazi Germany during World War II, the police became arms of the Nazi occupiers. They basically followed orders, however immoral those orders might have been. If the orders were to round up civilians for the Nazis to shoot in the public square, they basically followed orders. If it meant rounding up so-called "terrorists" (resisters) to send them off to a slave labor camp, they basically followed orders. During the days of slavery down South, the law enforcement in the South always sided with slave owners and returned runaway slaves to their owners, even if it meant severe punishment and death. In the days of the Great Depression, when workers tried to organize, demonstrate, and picket for livable pay, the police came along and knocked heads together and killed protestors. In 1970 in Augusta, Georgia, the police arrested 16 year old Charles Oatman and murdered and tortured him in his prison cell, covering his body with cigarette burns. The next day, a demonstration in the city by an angry group of black men resulted in the shooting by the police of six demonstrators, several shot repeatedly at close range with non-police issued weapons that the police officers brought with them to keep anyone from tracing the bullets.

We need to respect the police to the extent they are themselves obeying the law. We need them. They have a dangerous job and it often takes courage on their part. But we can't ever give up our own sense of morality and write the police a blank check and support anything the police does. After all, if they were following Nazi orders, then'd be rounding people up in the street for execution. They are amoral, that is, without morality and it is up to us to constantly be vigilant of everything they do. That's why we need to respect them, but always hate them because they can turn on the people and on human rights like turning on and off a light switch.

[bread_and_roses]

2. I'm waiting for all the defenders of arresting children to come out

Everytime something like this happens, even here a group "upholds the law" by supporting police for treating very small children. Can't have the first-graders running amok, don't you know.

[WinkyDink]

19. Seven years old is SECOND-grade, man! ! *snark*

[SeattleGirl]

3. Jeebus, now what? Biking while black?

This is so ridiculous. If the kid was sitting on dirt bike that was not turned on, why the hell else would they have arrested him? This shit just pisses me off to no end!!!

[anitar1]

8. After I saw his picture--I knew why he was arrested.

Oh, yes, and in Baltimore.Gotta keep those folks down.

[TX-RAT]

104. other reports

Other news agencies say he was riding the bike on the side walk.

[NorthernSpy]

110. no, Officer Fuck-Up said that -- probably to save his own ass...

As I've pointed out, the child's mother counters that story by saying that she was in possession of the keys at the time her little boy was sitting on the bike.

http://www.examiner.com/a-622111~7_year_old_s_arrest_draws_outrage.html

[tblue]

4. Poor kid must be traumatized. Think he'll grow up admiring and trusting the police?

If I were his mom, I'd sue.

[nicknameless]

5. This other article says he was riding the bike on the sidewalk.

Still ...

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8NTDAFO0&show_article=1

BALTIMORE (AP) - Police arrested a 7-year-old boy, handcuffed him and hauled him down to the station house on a charge of riding a motorized dirt bike on a sidewalk.
...

The arrest came after an officer saw Gerard riding his dirt bike on the sidewalk in east Baltimore on Tuesday, police spokesman Matt Jablow said. Hamm, citing the internal probe, declined to discuss how the rest of the incident unfolded.
...

[ariesgem]

6. also from this article...

snip................

The Police Department's zero-tolerance arrest policy—begun under former Mayor Martin O'Malley, who is now Maryland's governor—has drawn complaints that such arrests occur most often in poor, black neighborhoods. Gerard is black.

Hamm said the officer had the option of talking with a parent or confiscating the bike. He said that although the city is concerned about nuisance dirt bikes, the arrest "was not consistent with my philosophy of trying to solve problems in the neighborhoods."

The mayor, who appeared Friday with Hamm, said she also planned to look into the case.

"It is clear to me that the arrest was wrong, that the officers on the scene should not have arrested the child, and on behalf of the City of Baltimore I apologize to the boy and his parents," Dixon said.

[nicknameless]

7. While I don't like the idea of a 7 year old riding a motor bike, especially on the sidewalk,

there's no reason to be arresting him.
At least the police are conducting an internal investigation.

[Error]

22. What that doesn't say, though

is that most of the cops in Baltimore are black. So most of the time it is black cops enforcing this no tolerance law which makes it less racially charged as an issue.

[demobabe]

101. Bet you it wasn't a black cop that arrested that kid... n/t

[Deja Q]

13. Thanks for the link.

"They started yelling at him, 'Do you know what you did wrong, son?'" Dinkins said. "He was so scared he ran upstairs."

I bet he would be scared. But it's a valid question and helps decipher who is ultimately at fault (I'm still going to say the parents).

But to arrest the child still seems... the wrong thing to do. I think the cop should have taken the child home, have a stern lecture with the parents or arrest them for child endangerment, and confiscate the bike.

That pic of Gerald suggests he's a nice little boy. I hope it wasn't a premeditated pose on the cameraman's part. (The media in general I loathe because they go after one's emotional "sensibilities" rather than logical ones. Add in television programming that pulls the same garbage, to get us to cry on cue, and you bet I'm going to find ways to see through it.)

The Police Department's zero-tolerance arrest policy—begun under former Mayor Martin O'Malley, who is now Maryland's governor—has drawn complaints that such arrests occur most often in poor, black neighborhoods. Gerard is black.

Zero-tolerance? What happened to "parents or guardians taking responsibility for their childrens' mistakes"? Again, Gerald isn't at fault. His parents are. Why is Gerald arrested and not his parents? Gerald is a child and most children that age are not willful or malicious. The probability he was inciting reckless harm is highly unlikely.

[kestrel91316]

73. NO ONE should have been arrested for this. Not even the parents.

CERTAINLY NOT THE CHILD.

Major overreaction to something that required only a verbal admonishment of the child and a serious talk with the parents (with a written warning about operating dirt bikes on sidewalks).

[nicknameless]

83. I agree that it appears to be a case of bad parenting.

A 7-yr-old RIDING a motor bike -- on a sidewalk -- is potentially very dangerous.

Obviously, the mother was home. Why was she allowing him to do it?
Kids need discipline and guidance. Why on earth did the cops not charge the parents instead?

[malaise]

9. This is sick n/t

[cgrindley]

10. Good

1. it's illegal
2. it's incredibly unsafe
3. those stupid things utterly destroy all quality of life in neighborhood

Arrest his parents too for negligence. If he is traumatized by the event, good. Maybe he'll grow up to respect community rights.

[Deja Q]

12. I rather agree.

However, his parents are at fault for allowing a child (their child!) to drive a motor vehicle of this type, which is reckless. 7 years old... he is innocent; his parents are the one who need to pay the penalty.

And if Gerald equates the police's actions (and any dialogue not said in the article) about WHY it was done, maybe there is a point.

After all, when I was a child, I made a joke about not having any bombs to the airport screener. I almost got sent to jail. I was scared straight and while others disagree, I am looking back and saying it WAS appropriate for him to have barked out like that.

[cgrindley]

21. Children under 12

in my state are not allowed to ride in the front seat of car. Children under 70 pounds are not allowed to ride in anything other than a booster seat.

But a kid of age 7 being in control of a motor vehicle on the public roads? That's so intensely asinine.

Obviously, the kid wasn't really under arrest. He is well below the age of any form of legal competency. The mother is lucky that the local department of Children and Families didn't become involved. She could have lost her child for being so stupid.

Doesn't anyone ever remember their parents getting the local cops to give them a good talking to? A stern cop warning? It sure as shit kept me away from the front end loaders and half built houses in the soulless ever-expanding suburbs where I grew up.

[in_cog_ni_to]

37. He wasn't RIDING the dirt bike. He was just sitting on it with the MOTOR OFF.

was sitting on the dirt bike with the motor off while waiting for his father to pick him up.

What's illegal about sitting on a dirt bike? NOTHING.

[Forkboy]

50. Well,he obviously was thinking about riding it,wasn't he?

That's good enough.Arrest the little fucker and his parents too.Hell,even Aunts and Uncles should be brought in for questioning,at the very least.Maybe then he'll learn some respect for the community.

Glad we got to this one early.Next they'll be dancing!!!!!

[in_cog_ni_to]

51. Yep. In fact, I think ALL 7 year old are going to grow up to be hoodlums. They should all be hauled

away now BEFORE they become a danger to society.:eyes: Preemptive safety procedure.

[Forkboy]

54. What I really think is that people should be born into police custody.

and they have to stay until they prove they'll be good.You're exactly right,we need to be pre-emptive and fix these kids before they're broken.

[cgrindley]

58. Actually

If you are in control of a motor vehicle on public property, on a public roadway or sidewalk, it doesn't matter if the damn thing is off. It's still a problem, especially if you are 7.

[Name removed]

67. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NorthernSpy]

102. The child was "in control of a motor vehicle"? He didn't even have the friggin key!

http://www.examiner.com/a-622111~7_year_old_s_arrest_draws_outrage.html

[TX-RAT]

105. the officer witnessed him riding the bike on the sidewalk

[NorthernSpy]

108. yeah, that's HIS tale: the boy's mother says she had the key in her possession...

http://www.examiner.com/a-622111~7_year_old_s_arrest_draws_outrage.html


Note to police departments everywhere: don't hire any more retards like this asshole who manacled that little kid. They just don't work out too well.

[ends_dont_justify]

117. ...

Yeah, god damn him for...having fun and sitting on a dirtbike while waiting for his father? I feel safer at night knowing children are being manhandled by cops?

:wtf:

[Deja Q]

11. Something isn't right...

A police spokesman said dirt bikes are illegal and pose a threat to pedestrians and drivers.

I wonder who sold it and if it's in the same state. I feel sorry for Gerald (arrested for that, surely the policeman could have taken a better approach?!), but having just done a 2 second google search, Maryland has quite a few new and used dirtbike vendors.

I think there's a bigger problem in Maryland. It's wrong to use something legally purchased?! Or are dirt bikes illegal for those under 16? (the article does say pedestrians and drivers, but so do people riding bicycles if they're irresponsible - Gerald was just sitting there. Before the article started, was he being dangerous toward pedestrians or drivers?)

Unless he really was aiming to cause trouble (and that I doubt), I don't think arresting the kid was the right thing to do. Nor would he know the device is illegal... so again, who the frig is selling them?

And Maryland has dirt bike trails. That's cool. But if it's illegal to use the dirt bikes, how does one get to the trails within a legal radius of them and is it illegal to USE the trails?

Ultimately, no 7 year old should be riding a motorized vehicle. THAT is dangerous, especially for the rider.

[madrchsod]

14. this would`t happened to a white kid

those little bikes are dangerous but arresting a 7 year old? that record stays with him for a long, long time. john waters is right.....

[cgrindley]

59. Of course he or she would have been arrested

it is illegal for a 7 year old to operate a motor vehicle on a public road or sidewalk. Period.

This argument is foolish. Of course the police were correct to detain this child and confiscate the motor vehicle. I cannot believe that any of you are actually arguing that it's okay for...


a

7 year old

child

to

operate

a

motor vehicle

[gollygee]

61. That doesn't mean the kid should be arrested

do we blame the child for someone else giving him a motor vehicle? A 7-year-old can't be expected to understand that his parents gave him this really cool toy he shouldn't have and therefore he shouldn't touch it.

[cgrindley]

62. Confiscate the bike

and set DCF on the parents. Force them to go to parenting classes. Give the kid a stern warning. Obviously he cannot actually be "arrested" as he is not legally competent, being only 7. Perhaps the idiot reporter confused being "taken into custody" with "being arrested".

[tinfoilinfor2005]

86. But HANDCUFFS and FINGERPRINTS???

Are they daft? Don't they have any common sense?

I didn't even know that you could handcuff a seven year old. Their little wrists aren't any bigger around than a Kielbasa sausage. Give me a break.

[ContraBass Black]

90. According to this article, he wasn't operating it, he was only in posession.

[truebrit71]

113. Who is more foolish? The fool that agrees arresting and fingerprinting a 7 yr-old is right..

Whilst ignoring the fact that

he

wasn't

operating

a

motor vehicle

he

was

SITTING

ON

A

MOTOR VEHICLE

WITH

NO

KEY

IN

THE

IGNITION.


Now, tell me again, how, exactly, does one operate a motor vehicle that does not have the ignition turned on?

[ends_dont_justify]

118. Does a 7 year old know better?

You act like all 7 year olds should be tried on terror counts!

God, please, NEVER become a lawyer. But it doesn't matter, welcome to my ignore list, paid-poster for god knows which legal firm :)

[mahmoud al_hazen]

16. It's entirely typical that America arrests and imprisons

its racial and ethnic minorities for the mere fact that they exist.

[gollygee]

18. He's too young to be riding a dirt bike.

Therefore, they should have taken the dirt bike away and talked to his parents to find out why the hell he had something so dangerous.

He's too young to be expected to understand why he's too young for a really cool dirtbike. Or where to ride one if he were old enough. Kids that age ride their bicycles on the sidewalk, so I can understand why he'd think that's the place to ride something else. 7-year-old boys would ride absolutely anything they were given if it looked cool enough.

[notadmblnd]

45. I'm certain there is no law in Michigan regarding the age a child can ride a dirt bike

however, there is a law that dirt bikes can not be ridden on sidewalks. Yup, you guessed it. I'm one of those negligent parents that provided their child his first dirt bike when he was 6. His first machine was a 50cc Honda with a limiter(?) on it that only allowed the bike's speed to about 20mph. In my opinion at the time, he could pedal his bike faster that that bike could run. He was provided with all the gear that goes with it, chest/back protector, elbow and knee pads, riding boots and helmet. We learned about the sidewalk law by a much less hostile officer, it was the first time and the last time he had to be told to keep it on private property. He also attended a riders safety course shortly after that with his father. My son is almost 14 now and has successfully managed an 80cc and currently rides a 100cc. He has never had an injury as a result of riding any of his dirt bikes, believe it or not, playing football caused his most severe injury to date... a broken thumb. he won;t play football anymore... he says it hurts too much. Riding dirt bikes is his passion, he would like to do it professionally one day. He's currently bugging me to purchase a 125 because he thinks he's too tall for his old one.

So tell me what's a mother to do? Lock him in a padded room and refuse to allow him to take risks until he's grown? Maybe I shouldn't indulge his interests and just let him hang out on a street corner with other gangster wannabes and wait for the cops to call and he tell me he been arrested for selling drugs?

[gollygee]

47. You had a 6-year-old who could pedal a bike faster than 20 mph?

wow.

[notadmblnd]

48. yeah, easy...

in fact I'd bet you could do it. I'm 48 and I know I can pedal down the street at 20mph.

On edit: I will admit though, I'd probably have a hard time walking the next few days.

[Art_from_Ark]

115. Even in my teenage prime, and with the benefit of cross-country

bicycle touring, I had difficulty maintaining a speed of 20mph for any length of time without the assistance of a downward slope and/or tailwind.

[CRF450]

116. Thank you for clarifying that for the other posters!

I dont know why I didn't see your post untill just now.

That 100cc bike, is that an XR/CRF100? Being 14 he must be almost the same height as me, 5'5". If thats true then the bike is too small. One problem with dirtbikes is the age requirment. They have it all out of wack of which bike is right an early teen. I'v been 14 year olds ride a full size way better than me. Its best to just ignore those and find one that fits his size taste. I ride a CRF450, and those are 50+hp bikes, thats ALOT of power for a 225 pound machine! Theirs two different types of 125's you can get though. Theirs the 125 2 strokes which are motorcross bikes, that would probably be too powerful for him coming up from a 100cc play bike as they are powerful for their size and they do have a touchy powerband. And then theirs the 125 play bikes like the Yamaha TTR125. Problem with those is that there not much of a step up from the xr/crf100's. Have you looked at the CRF230 or the TTR230's?

Like I'v said before, 6 year olds and a little younger are very capable of riding a 50cc beginner bikes. And after that it doesn't take very long for them to need a bigger bike!

Oh, and 20mph is easy to reach on a bicycle!

[CRF450]

92. Come on people!

I ride dirtbikes as hobby and I'v seen 5 year olds ride one with out any trouble under parental supervision! I go to many race events where kids that age can race in 50cc classes and such. Thats about how young all those professionals you see on tv start out at! What is with the ignorance in here against motor vehicles??

[no_hypocrisy]

20. That trumps the story of the 10-year old with the french fries on the DC Metro system.

Who are the police gonna arrest next?

[Skidmore]

23. Why arrest the 7 year old then and not the parents who are responsible

for his supervision? You people who are so willing jump all over this kid and what he should be doing just amaze me. Where were the adults in this situation, freaking cop included? All idiots.

[madeline_con]

53. So, you want the parents arrested because ...

the kid was waiting outside for his dad?

For all you know, they were looking at him from the window.

[TX-RAT]

107. interesting

The officer witnessed the child riding the bike on the sidewalk, I'm guessing the mother was aware of it also. Some might say arrest her for endangerment to a child?

One question i might ask is how many times has this taken place.

[bread_and_roses]

24. Some approve arresting a 7yr old; some want his parents ARRESTED

Some of you are nuts, in my opinion. Since when is ARRESTING a seven year old appropriate? Since when is ARRESTING parents who may have been momentarly inattentive or even showed poor judgement appropriate? Would not this be a "ticket" sort of offense? Did you get booked the last time you got a traffic ticket?

Good goddess, let's book people who spit on the sidewalk too, why not? Or litter? We can all take turns being the prisoners and the guards. We get paid the days we're guards, get fed the days we're prisoners. See, no more unemployment.

[Occulus]

31. Actually, I'm glad hypno and cg let their views be known

It allowed me to put them both on ignore with a clear conscience.

I just love threads like this in general- makes the ignorant Futzamuck Doodahs of DU easy-peasy to spot and permenantly filter out.

[Forkboy]

49. I won't put them on ignore,but it was real easy to guess what poster would say what

I think I knew their position before they did.

[ret5hd]

78. Hell, that's what i use my "Buddy" list for...

It always amuses me when i read something like that and say to myself "Oh hell, that person's just made it to my buddy list!!!" and then i click on the "add to buddy list" icon and it says "Add to buddy list error-this person is already on your buddy list." And then my easily amused self laughs to myself and says, "see, i told you so!"

[Serendipitous]

33. I think a taser would have been justified

:sarcasm:

See my comments below - the sooner we TREAT them like hardened criminals, the more contempt and defiance we breed towards authority and the law.

This is ridiculous.

[LeftyMom]

42. I didn't see any advocacy for arresting children.

Ignore list for the win! Click the x on half a dozen people and DU is a much less irritating place.

[ret5hd]

79. Or amusing (see my post above)

[WernhamHogg]

25. Ridiculous

When I was about this kids age, I was fooling around with the phone when my babysitter wasn't paying attention and I dialed 911 (I believe it was an accident, I can't really remember now, but regardless it was a very dumb thing to do). When someone answered, I hung up. A minute later, I got a call back in which I was reamed by the 911 operator. I NEVER played around with the phone after that (and I was even a bit nervous about actually having to call 911 when I was an adult and had to report that I just witnessed a guy getting hit by a car).

Stupid move by the police to arrest the kid, especially if he had never been warned by the police before to stay away from a motor bike. There had to be another option.

[qanda]

26. Seven sounds young, but it's not what it used to be

These kids are growing up to be little terrors because they are allowed to get away with so much due to their young age. I don't doubt for one second that the boy was riding on that dirt bike because it just doesn't sound right that a police officer had nothing better to do that day than arrest a little boy for sitting on a bike. Parents need to take responsibility for their children's bad behavior and stop trying to make excuses for them. I'm sure the little boy was scared that day, but if the parents handle it right they can be sure that he will never repeat the same mistake again.

[gollygee]

27. He probably was riding a dirt bike on the sidewalk

in my neighborhood anyway 7-year-olds ride their regular bicycles on the sidewalk. If I were stupid enough to give my daughter a dirt bike, I suppose she'd ride it on the sidewalk too, because that's where she rides her push bike.

The misbehavior is giving a 7-year-old a dirt bike.

[CRF450]

94. The misbehavior is...

Letting the 7 year old ride a dirbike in a neighborhood like that! Like I said in my earlier post, I'v seen 5 year olds ride a dirtbike without any problem UNDER parental supervision! Labling a motor vehicle as dangerous is stupid and ignorant. I ride dirtbikes as a hobbie, and someday when I have kids, they'll be introduced to it. It'll be like a family sport in a way. Off roading does have it dangers and risks, but I'm very willing to take those chances, so far I havent been hurt seriously. Theirs not much else I could be doing for fun.

[Serendipitous]

28. AND the sooner we treat them like hardened criminals, they sooner they become

just that.

[qanda]

29. That's not what I'm saying at all

I grew up in one of the worst neighborhoods in Pittsburgh. A few years ago we had a kid about this boys size break into our house while we were asleep. If it wasn't for my sister who woke up and saw him squeezing through the bottom of our basement door, I don't know what would have happened. I certainly don't applaud this little boy being arrested. A good talking to by the police probably would have served him better, but it would be interesting to hear what neighbors of this child have to say about it.

Our neighborhoods have been overrun by bratty kids that are allowed to get away with far too much because they are so young. They grow up and become even worse because their parents don't discipline them properly.

[Serendipitous]

30. But, do you see how equating that with a child on a bike on the sidewalk

can potentially assist in leading a child to a life of crime?

Treating him in the manner that they did will cause him to hate and fear the police, likely leading to an attitude of further defiance.

I totally "get" what you are saying about kids starting a criminal career much younger, but clearly this situation was in NO way comperable to breaking and entering. And, treating him as though it was will only propogate the situation and create an environment that further pushes children towards criminal behavior.

[qanda]

32. If this child was indeed riding a dirt bike up and down a sidewalk

Then he was committing a crime in Baltimore. I now live outside of Baltimore, but go there often enough to know how dangerous these bikes are. I can imagine that it probably wasn't his first time riding on it either because you don't just jump on those bikes and know how to operate them. That's why I would be interested in what neighbors have to say about it, particularly the elderly neighbors, who are often the unfortunate victims of these dirt bikes.

I don't think the police did the right thing and even the police chief and mayor have said as much, but I'm not as willing as some to completely excuse this child and his parents for breaking the law.

[gollygee]

34. He's only 7 years old

7-year-olds aren't able to do risk assessments and understand that they might hurt people. How can it possibly be the fault of a young child? No one should be giving a young child a dirtbike. That's the answer to that problem. It's like a 4-year-old playing with matches and starting a fire. Do you arrest the 4-year-old for arson? That wouldn't make sense. 7-year-old boys love things with motors. If a 7-year-old boy is given a dirt bike, he will ride it. And if he's used to playing on the sidewalk because his parents tell him to stay out of the street, he'll ride it on the sidewalk. That isn't because he's *bad* - it's because he's a kid who doesn't know any better. That's why parents exist - it's our job to say, "it might look cool, but it isn't safe, so no."

[qanda]

38. I guess we are essentially saying the same thing

That many of these children are products of bad parenting and in our neighborhoods, particularly poor and black, the only recourse we have is the police correcting kid's bad behavior. It shouldn't be that way, but what happens when parents won't do their job (apparently the mother was right there)-- the police have to step in and protect citizens from people's little brats.

[Serendipitous]

39. If you think that this officer's specific actions were justified and "the only recourse"

that's just sad.

Of course they should have stepped in... but was ARRESTING, CUFFING, FINGERPRINTING and hauling his "bratty ass" to HQ the BEST way? I think not.

[qanda]

41. Gracious!

I don't know how many times I have to say that I don't think the little boy should have been arrested. I think it would have been much more effective for the police to talk to him. But, oh well.

[gollygee]

40. I don't think anyone should be arrested, and I don't call kids I don't know "brats"

The dirtbike should have been taken away from the kid, and someone needs to talk to the parents about what is appropriate for that age child. Sometimes parents can overestimate their kids' abilities, or underestimate the dangers of something. I've seen parents I know do similar kids of things.
But it isn't the fault of kids that young.

[bread_and_roses]

55. The "brat" language is a dead give-away - what a child-hating culture

we are. Children are demonitized simply for acting like children. And the extreme authoriarian streak from our English/German influences, the total intolerance for young children EVER inconveniencing adults in any way. I've seen adults in a McDonalds glaring at an adult with a table of children who's conversation/laughter was too "noisy," or one with a fretting baby.

It's intersting to me that so many people evidence far more outrage over the "bad" behaviour of small children than they do over the fact that we underfund every program for children, have an appalling rate of child poverty, have a worse child mortality rate than any other industrial country, and allow whole neighborhoods to descend into Third World conditions for generations. That's evidently not as worthy of outrage as a seven year old boy sitting on a dirtbike on the sidewalk, or a six year old girl acting out in a classroom.

[qanda]

57. I have young children. My daughter is eight...

I am not by any means trying to demonize anyone. I am speaking from experience. I remember when we didn't need the police to help discipline our children because parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, neighbors and teachers all took part in helping to raise children. Now, not only do some parents not want to discipline their children, they don't anyone else saying anything to them. How are children going to know how to behave if they are not taught? It becomes frustrating because as much as we dislike the authoritarian influence that you speak of, some members of our community are at their wits end with kids that have run amok with no discipline. Perhaps this isn't the case with this one child, but trust me when I tell you that it is a problem in our communities and it needs to be addressed.

[bread_and_roses]

82. Ah, yes, "the good old days." Well, I'm a mother and in my 50's

and I assure you that for millions the past was not quite so rosy as Andy Griffith America.

Besides, people have been bemoaning "modern youth" and the virtues of "the good old days" since the dawn of time.

As for now, humans are products of the culture they live in. When we as a society start taking care of children, and start providing the support that families need, then we can talk. Until then, I'll continue to save my outrage for the state of the hungry, homeless children in the US. For the children with no health care. For the children in classrooms with no computers and sometimes no paper. For children who's parents are never home because they are working all the time just to keep a roof and food. *And for children harmed by the persistent racism and its' manifestations in our criminal justice system, like arresting 7 yr old boys or six year old girls for "crimes" like sitting on a dirtbike while black.

Or, we could evolve some arrangement besides the nuclear family - a colossal and inevitable failure, IMHO - that works better for raising children.

*on immediate edit

[qanda]

84. ....

My upbringing was far from an Andy Griffith American story. My father left my mother when I was two and she single-handedly raised five daughters in one of the poorest neighborhoods in the city. The community I'm talking about are the neighbors that would let my mother know if we were doing something we weren't supposed to be doing, the teachers that weren't afraid to correct us when we got out of line and the relatives that helped keep us out of trouble.

Perhaps I'm missing something, but I don't understand your point.

[NorthernSpy]

124. you sure do leap to conclusions...

I am not by any means trying to demonize anyone. I am speaking from experience. I remember when we didn't need the police to help discipline our children because parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, neighbors and teachers all took part in helping to raise children.

We've seen nothing that suggests that this little boy was actually "misbehaving" at all, much less "running amok". All we know is that he was sitting on the seat of a parked dirtbike while waiting for his father. The cops who put this seven-year-old child in handcuffs and dragged him to the police station claim that he had been riding the bike. The child's mother disputes this, saying that she had the key in her possession.

Now, not only do some parents not want to discipline their children, they don't anyone else saying anything to them.

Cuffing and arresting a little kid merely for sitting on a stationary dirtbike is not discipline: it's abuse, pure and simple. No wonder the parents object to that! Anyone with the slightest tendency toward decency and common sense objects to what the police did.

How are children going to know how to behave if they are not taught? It becomes frustrating because as much as we dislike the authoritarian influence that you speak of, some members of our community are at their wits end with kids that have run amok with no discipline. Perhaps this isn't the case with this one child, but trust me when I tell you that it is a problem in our communities and it needs to be addressed.

The thing is, "this one child" is the person we're actually talking about in this discussion. He's an individual, not a category.

And if some people were better supplied with wits to begin with, they mightn't have run out of them quite so fast.

[qanda]

125. The conversation actually progressed from talk of this one boy

As convesations often do. Your comment about people in my community (the black community) not being supplied with wits is totally uncalled for.

I'd address each of your points, but I already did in previous posts so perhaps you should go back and read what I actually said instead of jumping to your own conclusions about what I'm trying to say.

[NorthernSpy]

126. no, that was just you going off on a tangent...

... in an attempt to rationalize your favorable reaction to what the police did to this poor little kid.

Your comment about people in my community (the black community) not being supplied with wits is totally uncalled for.

LOL! Nice try, and thanks for playing. I remarked that if "some people" were better supplied with wits, they mightn't reach wits end so quickly. I certainly did not say anything about "the black community" in general, or even just your own local black community in general. Why you would necessarily leap to your particular conclusion -- well, only you would know the answer to that.

Me, I'm just heaping scorn on stupid people who lack decency and sense.

[ends_dont_justify]

119. People covet youth -- they hate what they can't have

It's sad but it's true. They aim to destroy innocence...this is the exact reason I have dedicated my life to the welfare of animals and children. There are so few innocent things left...innocence matters far more to me than people's opinions, it's too bad more people don't realize what's more important.

I agree with your post 100% though, keep spreading insightful knowledge...atleast some people will get it.

[Serendipitous]

35. See, I don't recall saying that I was willing to completely excuse

the child. Nope, no way.

But, what they did breeds contempt and defiance. In my opinion, this cop's actions help to CREATE the lil' criminals you describe above.

[Eric J in MN]

36. If you just assume that the reporter is wrong about all the facts,

...then you never have to be outraged about police doing something wrong.

It must be the reporter.

[nicknameless]

91. The article, that I linked in post #5, stated that he was RIDING it on the sidewalk.

[notadmblnd]

43. the article doesn't say he was charged with anything

If he wasn't charged, then there was no reason to photograph and fingerprint the child. I agree with his mother, I imagine this will affect him by developing a distrust of the police.

I'm not certain IRT the law in Maryland, but dirt bikes are not illegal for children to ride in Michigan. It is illegal to drive them on sidewalks (my son got caught riding one on a sidewalk when he first got one, but the police just let us know). But even if he were riding it, why the arrest and not just a ticket?

[madeline_con]

52. Can you say, "Sue the f*ck out of the cops" ?

Whew! Thank goodness the got that hardened criminal off the sidewalk!!

[cgrindley]

60. It's a motor vehicle

what happened broke a number of laws. Clearly. Obviously.

[Colobo]

65. And arresting a 7 yr old for sitting on a dirt bike while waiting for his dad

is completely justified. :sarcasm:

[cgrindley]

70. Yes and no sarcasm is needed

Maryland motor vehicle law (just google it):

1. no one under 12 may operate a motor vehicle on public land

2. no one may operate a motor vehicle on a sidewalk

3. no one may operate a motor vehicle on a road without a licence

4. all motor vehicles, even low speed motor vehicles, must be properly licenced and insured on public roads

5. no one under the legal driving age but over 12 may operate a motor vehicle anywhere on public land without the direct supervision of an adult

and so on...

I'd figure that this little incident broke a dozen or more motor vehicle laws... and that's not even getting started on the more serious matter of child endangerment.

Taking this sort of incident lightly is foolish.

[Colobo]

75. THE KID IS NOT GUILTY!!! HE IS ONLY 7!!!

He probably doesn't yet know how to wipe his ass correctly... talk with his parents!!! Arrest them if you want, but don't arrest the kid!!!

[cgrindley]

76. Of course he isn't guilty

he is legally incompetent.

[Forkboy]

88. Completely assinine thinking on every level

1-The motor wasn't on.No one is "Operating" anything.By your logic a child sitting a car waiting for his parent could be arrested for "operating" the car,even though the motor is off.

2-See above.

3-See above.

4-See above.

5-See above.

and so on...

A child sitting on a dirt bike,a dirt bike that's not running,is child endangerment? But booking him is ok? With this kind of concern for the "serious matter of child endangerment" I'm fearful for the children in your community.

Taking your sort of post seriously is the only thing foolish.

[cgrindley]

96. If you are astride

a motorcycle (which is what a god damn dirt bike is), you are operating it. It doesn't matter if the fool thing is on or off.


PROTIP: let's try it out. I dare you to get real drunk and sit in your driver's seat. Keep the car in your driveway. Make sure that the car is NOT on. Keep the keys in your pocket. Now, call the cops, and let's see what they have to say about the situation.

[NorthernSpy]

109. the boy's mother says that she had the keys at the time...

The mere fact that boy was sitting on the bike does not necessarily indicate that he was "in control of a motor vehicle".

Me, I have no animus against this child. Which is why I'm not tempted to distort facts in order to justify the horrendous treatment he suffered.

[cgrindley]

111. Yes it does

Sitting astride the motor vehicle does so indicate that he was "in control" of it.

[Solon]

122. How was he in control if the damned thing wasn't on?

And, if this case is so clear cut to you, why hasn't the boy or his parent's been charged with anything yet?

[NorthernSpy]

123. Wrong. OUI convictions have been reversed on precisely these grounds.

You are in "control" of the car as a motor vehicle -- beyond being in control of it as a mere piece of property -- if you have attempted some action that would give you control over its operation as a motor vehicle. Generally, "control" in this sense starts when you put the key in the ignition (or try to).

[Art_from_Ark]

114. Holy Toledo!

When I was 8 years old, I sat astride my girlfriend's uncle's motorcycle. I had no idea I was OPERATING the damn thing! Wow! (slapping head). Too bad there weren't any cops around! I should have been arrested, taken down to the station and fingerprinted for such a gross violation of the law!

[Solon]

121. Actually, in a case like that, the cops can't do anything...

Till you actually attempt to leave the driveway with the car, your driveway is on your property, and as long as you keep your vehicle on that property, especially if its not running, then you wouldn't be operating any vehicle under the influence ON PUBLIC ROADS.

Now, there are also gray areas, according to Maryland law, you CAN operate motor vehicles ON THE SIDEWALK, but ONLY if that sidewalk in question was at the end of your driveway. This is just conjecture, but if the kid was sitting on a motorbike, at the end of the driveway, then he wasn't breaking ANY law.

[kath]

56. Hey! He's black! What a surprise!

NOT.

[Colobo]

66. I'm willing to bet a white kid doesn't get arrested

[Colobo]

64. Why in the world would cops arrest a 7 yr. old who is waiting for his dad?

He was sitting on the dirt bike waiting for his dad. The only thing police had to do was to talk with the kid and stay with him until his dad came around, and then talk to him about the dirt bike.

[gollygee]

68. Exactly!

I don't blame the police for wanting to talk to the parents. But arresting a little kid?

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

69. They probably arrested him because they could

There's probably some ordinance against even sitting on a dirt bike in city limits. If the ordinance said they could use deadly force against him, I do believe there are some police who would feel free to go ahead and apply the law to the very limits that they can without even questioning their application of the law. Some officers would use their discretion and give the kid and his father a warning never to do it again and ask the father to explain it firmly to his son. But I think those police officers who actually have concern for the community are becoming more and more rare, given that many of them no longer even live in the communities they police,.

[cgrindley]

71. But but but

the whole situation broke about a dozen traffic laws at the very least. The police certainly did the right thing.

[kestrel91316]

72. Nah. He was arrested for the crime of BEING BLACK. They

probably assumed the dirt bike HAD TO BE stolen, 'cause all blacks are thieves, you know.

And I wonder why I have such a bad attitude about police as I get older...........

[BlooInBloo]

74. Brown skin? Check. Something marginally not kosher? Check, Book him O'Malley!

[Odin2005]

77. Why did I intuitively know that this poor kid was black?

If it was a white kids doing this the cops wouldn't of gave a shit.

Oh, and what's a 7-year-old doing with a dirt-bike?

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

80. If they were Las Vegas police and a casino owner's son had the dirt bike

do you think for a minute the bought-and-paid-for-by-the-casinos police force of Las Vegas would dare lay a hand on the kid? The police have discretion to look the other way only when they want to have it. When Dick Cheney shoots a man in the face, the local police give him enough time overnight to sober up before asking him a couple of nonintrusive questions. In the case of a black kid, or a poor white kid for that matter, whose fathers have no pull, the police will apply the law to the letter and to the fullest extent as written, even when no real harm was done and a warning would have been sufficient.

[fortyfeetunder]

81. Yeah, lijke had that been 7 YO Jenna or Barbara Bush

They'd probably wave and say "Have a nice day"....

[ret5hd]

85. hell, they woulda filled their gas tanks and bought 'em a slushie.

[upi402]

87. That's not a dirtbike. And we HAVE to get over dirtbikes anyway

Dirtbikes have knobby tires. That's more like an old school minibike or a tiny quasi-crotch rocket.

I can't imagine the unreasonable antipathy we have against ALL sportsmen will help win their votes.
Dirtbikes, fishing and hunting chase these guys squarely into the arms of the rightists. We need workers to vote like workers. When the American house fire is out we can worry about weeding the garden... or not.


my.02

[Laurier]

89. WTF?

That's insane. Completely, utterly insane.

Edit to clarify - of course, a 7 year old shouldn't have been on a dirtbike, but to ARREST him and HANDCUFF him and FINGERPRINT him? That's absolutely nuts.

[liberal1973]

95. I agree

Completely, utterly insane.

[CRF450]

93. Come on people!

I ride dirtbikes as hobby and I'v seen 5 year olds ride one with out any trouble under parental supervision! I go to many race events where kids that age can race in 50cc classes and such. Thats about how young all those professionals you see on tv start out at! What is with the ignorance in here against motor vehicles??

[JerseygirlCT]

97. They most certainly don't belong on the sidewalks

But that said, sitting or riding one by a 7 yo is not cause for arrest, either.

It's certainly cause to go find the parents and give them all a stern warning. But that's where that stops.

[CRF450]

99. I know that, and laws within city limits

Arent very friendly towards off road vehicles. And look at all the posts in here about dirtbikes being dangerous. Please... life in general is dangerous, theirs all kinds of stuff that can happen to you on a daily bases, but doesn't. No wonder the democratic party cant get any votes from people that love outdoors sports.

[JerseygirlCT]

100. Good reason for those laws though

If you choose to ride, that's your choice. But your choice shouldn't put pedestrians in danger. Regular bikes belong on the street, too -- for the same reason.

If everyone was concerned about the general good, we'd all get along fine.

[ends_dont_justify]

120. If everyone was concerned for the general good * wouldn't be in office

We as a nation have too long worried about these petty little things and wanted to punish them biasedly -- and our nation is in ruins. All due to the tiny little things like this absorbing our day.

And yes....the child should have been taken into custody. Graciously, forgivingly, and without handcuffs. Questioned on where his mommy and daddy is...as the officer patiently waited for his father, who SHOULD have been cuffed and brought in.

The kid only made the mistake of being born to the wrong family. For shame on all the people blaming him.

[Tsiyu]

98. Nobody could stop 911 despite the warnings

We can't find Osama.

Cheney shoots a guy in the face and he's a hero.

Bush kills millions and he's free as a bird.

But we arrest our seven-year-olds so it LOOKS like we are really tough on crime....???????????

Give me big fat freakin' break.

Our society has gone berserk.

[WI_DEM]

103. more racial profiling? this time of a 7-year old black kid!!

[NorthernSpy]

106. just another swell day in this demented police state of ours...

Clapping little boys in irons for utterly trivial reasons? Gawd, how the hell did things get this bad in the Land of the Freee?

[shance]

112. We need to know who these police officers are. They need to be known publicly.

Who were these racist, vicious, child abusers?

No pun intended?

The white male racism towards everyone else and assaults toward the innocent and less powerful MUST STOP.