Help me with this...I can't see a way out.

[Raven]

We don't seem to have the votes to override a Presidential veto. We don't even have the votes in the Democratic party to get out of Iraq.

It may take months to get anything useful accomplished in the USA scandal and then, we may only get Rove, and he's a political consultant for Christ's sake, he can consult with Bush from jail.

If we were successful in getting Bush out, we'd still have Cheney. If we got Cheney out we'd still have Bush and God knows who Bush would appoint to replace him. There is no way, in my mind, that we could get them both out.

There is plenty of $$$ for this war and plenty of already half dead kids to recycle into Iraq.

We just didn't get enough people elected to the House and the Senate to turn this around this time.

Our reps are acting like they actually accomplished something...I have an email from Carol Shea Porter the anti war rep we got elected this time, she says "we did all we could do...at least it's something". I have a "thank you" email from John Kerry crowing about the 48 votes in the Senate...

Who do these people think they're fooling. We have failed, they have failed.

All I can see is a lot of grunt work between now and 2008 to get a real change in the WH and in the House and the Senate and I'm not sure we have that much time left before the damage is permanent.

What bright spot have I missed here?

[A HERETIC I AM]

1. The power of the American people to be truly disgusted.

Nov. '08 is a long way off.

[ComerPerro]

2. I've been saying for a while that getting Rove will do nothing

for the exact reasons you cited here. You are exactly right. If he is forced out or has to resign or is fired, then what difference does it make? He can still shape policy, even from prison.

What I am afraid of is that we won't be able to get anything done with Bush in the WH and Repigs obstructing us in the Senate. So we will see, in 2008, a Republican winning because he is the anti-Bush (a true conservative, so to speak, like they exist), and a lot of Dems voted out for "doing nothing".

[Warpy]

3. They can't get much through, either

No GOP horror show of a bill will pass the House. Even if the more conservative Senate pushes something through, it'll fail in the House.

Meanwhile, the investigations will go on. There is so much to investigate out there that only the brain dead will be able to vote GOP in 2008.

That's the hope we have to cling to until 2008.

Gridlock.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

4. Luckily, I don't think Bush could just 'appoint' whoever he'd want to fill the VP.

[SteppingRazor]

Yes, there is no chance of removing Bush, but...

nor was there ever. Short of new and undeniable evidence linking Bush directly to prosecutable felonies, he is not going anywhere. However, I don't think the 2006 election was ever really about that. It was about halting the damage before it gets any worse. Now that we control Congress, we can prevent further erosion of civil rights, further wars, further greedhead tax cuts for the wealthy, etc.

2008 is certainly far more important. But then, presidential election years always have been. We can pad our leads in the House and the Senate and put one of ours in the White House. After that, real change can get done. But for now, we should be happy that we're managing to plug the holes in the dyke. Repairing it will take more power than we have now.

[BeFree]

5. Bright spot here...

Because of the efforts of so many Election Integrity folks, we were able to get a majority of dems elected in 2006. With everyone on board to see, that in 2008, the election is as fair as possible, we will see dems in complete control.

In 2004, you may recall, Kerry won the election, and there is no telling how many congressional seats were also stolen. Now, while some are sure to complain about this bright spot and say that America voted for the publicans time and again, I say PROVE IT!

[bobbolink]

6. Read some of H2O Man's threads on this.

This is like Single Payer health care... we'll get it when we demand it.

If we don't care enough to demand it, we need to stop griping.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. We have the gavel

and the investigations are going full force

I know people expected these idiots permanently check mated but... it does not work that way

it takes time... and yes we have made progress, quite a bit of progress.

In two months they have put more work in than the last 12 years, and far more oversight than the last six

By the way, Nam did not stop on a dime either

The efforts started in 1970 and did not complete until '73

The impeachment efforts against Nixon (He wasn't technically impeached by the way since he did quit before the articles were introduced) started in oversight hearings that were not called impeachment hearings either.

All I can advise, and I know it is hard to accept it, is patience...

And yes, we are about to step into a clear constitutional crisis...

[ClassWarrior]

8. If Bush/Cheney** goes, Cheney/Bush** will go too.

And Rove won't have security clearance in jail.

Sorry, not giving up. :shrug:

NGU.

[sandnsea]

9. 13 to 48, that's progress

I think that's the point of Senator Kerry's email. Don't think that he is finished. He won't stop until those kids are home.

You painted the problem clearly though. We don't have the votes. That means we've got to figure out how to activate the red states. We have to find the people IN those states who are trying to get the anti-war message out, and help them connect to each other and get them the money to get the message out.

[Raven]

13. You are right...up here, we have to go

after Sununu. You're right, it's more drudgery over the next 18 months...house parties, phone calling, lit tables, canvassing...I guess I'm just tired and I keep saying to myself "is it over yet?"

[sandnsea]

16. Quite a few

There's no excuse for Pryor of Arkansas. There's Collins & Snowe in Maine. Voinovich. Specter. If we could move Nebraska, maybe that would move Hagel & Nelson, which might move some others. Smith is scared of re-election. Time to make some others scared too.

[bowens43]

10. A bright spot is that

the Republicans , finding them selves in a hole, continue to dig furiously.

2008 is going to be very, very good to our party.

[Bluestar]

11. The bright spot is that

We are able to check this insane administration for the next two years. Possibly the investigations that we now conduct can get rid of both Bush and Cheney at the same time. Also, the Republican party is imploding before our eyes. Maybe they can be rendered useless--something that should have happened in the 1970's.

Granted, ideally we could be using this time to change all the laws and misdeeds that the Bush administration has foisted upon us, but this is better than we were last year at this time when we were in a hopeless situation with the Bush cabal in unchecked power. Also, the pressure exerted upon Bush with a Dem Congress is making him change a few policies--i.e. we are now in talks with Iran and Syria and before he refused to do this.

At any rate, the American people can now see first hand the corruption and malfeasance that this administration has forced onto our country.

Rome wasn't built in a day--neither is Caligula's court going to be overturned in a day. In a dictatorship, the dictator can be brought down overnight. Our system takes longer and it was designed that way. We have to count our blessings and have more patience.

[jobycom]

12. Time, hard work, and understanding the value of incremental victories.

We will never, ever, ever, at any point in our future, have a magic wand that will give us everything, or even most things, that we want. That's where you start. We now have some tools to work with, though, so we start out going for small victories. And we have a few. We've raised people's awareness of the situation in IRaq. We've used our position to debate a non-binding position statement saying we disagree with the troop surge. We've gotten the media to cover our side, and that's a huge victory we could not have accomplished before this year. We have made little corrections in Congressional methods to weaken the Republican ability to dictate law.

Further, we have taken control of committees and begun investigations which have put the Republicans on the defensive. Bush would not be on his heels over his AG if not for these investigations. No one in Congress would care what we think or know if we had not won in November. We have them in a defensive position, and that lets people see what they are up to. That lets people listen to their excuses and judge for themselves.

These investigations will lead to something. Maybe not impeachment, maybe not immediate withdrawal, maybe not even any meaningful indictments. But as of now, BushCo realizes it has to watch what it does, it has to at least try to hide its lies. That's progress. We've taken away their blank checks, even if we haven't taken away their full access to the checking account.

Little, incremental victories, like the non-binding resolution debate to make people aware of Iraq, like the investigations to put BushCo on its heals, like all this talk of impeachment--even if it never happens--makes people pay attention to our side, and it sways people (as the polls show), and it puts us in a better position to bargain, to get more little victories, to even win a few Republicans to our side on some issues.

We've got a lot more than we had last year. A Hell of a lot more. And we keep moving forward. Now isn't the time to give up and claim we lost. Now is the time to press our advantage, to turn it into a victory. Winning an election doesn't give us what we want, it just gives us more tools to get some of what we want. That's our work now. Continuing to change minds and find facts and move forward. Maybe we'll get lucky and uncover a true smoking gun and make it all easier. More than likely, though, we just need to keep working.

We haven't failed at anything. We haven't even finished stocking up for the fight. This is just the beginning of a new America, and anyone who tries to bring you down or convince you we have no chance should be slapped with a reality fish. We are a lot further along than we have been since 2001, and we have a great number of opportunities in front of us if we just keep working hard at it.

[ClassWarrior]

14. Wish I could nominate a post on a thread.

You speak wisdom.

NGU.

[Raven]

15. Second that. n/t

[MissMarple]

17. Tom Toles has a bit of perspective on the challenges the Dems face.

http://www.gocomics.com/tomtoles/2007/03/11/

I don't know how to post a cartoon. If anyone else can, please do.

[RaleighNCDUer]

18. Bright spot? They are no longer setting the agenda.

Even if we can't accomplish much to undo the damage done, we can put brakes on what is going on. stories that the public has been shielded from for years are being brought into the open, and more and more citizens are finding out what crooks those bastards are.