The Winter solstice is calculated to within a second and is more important

[Ichingcarpenter]

Than Christmas to me now. I start getting sunlight back in my condo after the solstice
and I need the natural warmth

I hope you all start watching the seasons more closely these days.

Yule time, is a great time for lights but in the real sense
it is a northern latitude celebration first and foremost that
had nothing to do with Jesus, whom I like philosophically
but the coming back of light from the sun and rebirth. (Jesus wasn't born at this time)

Think about it........... Winter Solstice can be calculated to the second and has been done for thousands of years before Jesus was born. I think that is really cool
if you pay attention to the world and skies around you.

Happy Holidays The giving to each other, back before Christianity, for that season
was just as true. The Catholic Church took the Pagan celebration
to consolidate power.

This time of year is a good thing. The Darkness is hopefully ending



Now for some evil Santas........ I like the 50's Santa taking a dump on a business but
couldn't place it .... so see it in the link it has the 10 worst Santas.









http://www.toptenz.net/scary-santa-claus.php

[BrklynLiberal]

1. Wasn't Stonehenge supposed to be involved in some of the astronomical

calculations back in the good old days?

Duration of Daylight/Darkness Table for One Year
posted by a DUer whose name I cannot remember..

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/Dur_OneYear.php

[Ichingcarpenter]

3. The power of the earth's seasons on the Northern Latidutes cannot be denied

If you have lived in the Northern Latitudes you appreciate that and pay attention.

Italy ........ such as Rome...... doesn't have that problem.

[tomp]

29. italy is roughly midway in the latitudes of human habitation.

montreal and washington, dc are encompassed by the same latitudes. how far north does one have to be before the solstice/seasons makes a difference?

[Jim Lane]

23. Yes, although the details are in dispute

Features at Stonehenge do identify the sunrise at the summer solstice and sunset at the winter solstice. Experts are in disagreement about some other claimed astronomical correlations. See the Wikipedia article on for details.

[BrklynLiberal]

33. Thanks.

[Jack Sprat]

2. Nice of you to bring the Solstice up in conversation.

Sunlight is sure more pleasant for the spirit. Darkness really can make me feel bleak. I will certainly welcome the turnaround, so you can get warm and I can cheer up.

[Ichingcarpenter]

7. Well even Father Frost

was the first Santa before he was Christian.

Even the tree you put in your living room is there for a reason.
it had nothing to do with Jesus let alone shopping at Wal-mart at 5 AM.

It is a good season for all, but has more to do with the earth and sun

[sarcasmo]

4. Thanks for speaking of the Solstice. I was going to bring it up on the 21st but you beat me to it.

[knowbody0]

5. for years I so waited for the sun to return

until I met someone who showed me the beauty of the stillness in the dark season. and now it always seems too short.

[canetoad]

6. I always look forward to the days getting longer

and here in Oz we have the summer solstice just around the corner and I always feel a little bereft that there is a little less light each day.

On the other hand, I have several dozen little plants down in the yard, soaking up the Aussie sun, and we know what happens to them after summer solstice:)

[alfredo]

10. They go to seed and the budgies eat them?

[Ichingcarpenter]

11. They go naked and have amber fluid after big noting themselves

I know some Kiwis but not many Auzzies myself

[alfredo]

15. I always thought you harvested when they start turning amber.

If you don't know, I ain't gonna tell ya.

[Ichingcarpenter]

17. Kentucky slang never was the one that I couldn't understand

Australian yes. Kentucky no.

BTW we have a valley named after my family
who came out with Boone.

I was talking to the Cane boy....LOL

[alfredo]

31. Eastern Ky is full of disaffected Brits, Scots, and Irish. We made the

Welsh stay in the Carolinas. We have our standards. You ask them where in Wales did they come, and it takes a week to say the town's name. Then they break into song. Who needs that?


BTW, the amber reference is to the second largest cash crop in Ky: pot.

[MrMickeysMom]

8. I'm more in tune with the Winter Solstice than Christmas

I just wish more people in my burgh were not so fixed on the so called war on Christmas. I'll look forward to the 21st!

The realization that I must enter through the dark to the light is something I celebrate silently as I watch the sun set each day.

[Ichingcarpenter]

9. I've taught my kids to look at the sky at night

as my father did for me to tell me why we are now in the Sagittarius sky frame.

Nothing wrong with this season that science can't help.

[MrMickeysMom]

12. Excellent exercise...

I wish I had devoted time to that study. I became more interested in the mythology end of things, even have lots of study on astrology, but when it comes to the seasons, I only depend on the stargazing fellow on PBS to explain it for me, who ends his nightly report with, "keep looking up!"

[Ichingcarpenter]

13. My dad was a pilot that had to learn navigation from the stars and planets

in WWII. He taught me and then I sailed and learned the same. The Star systems change with the seasons, month by month. I'm afraid it will be lost soon, I have to point out to my condo
neighbors which are stars and planets now. Not many pay attention to the world around them
anymore when they can get their reality from TV.

[InvisibleTouch]

14. "Greetings greetings, fellow stargazers"...

...Do you mean that guy? I haven't seen his show in forever. Used to stay up late to catch it, years ago. Neat to hear that he's still doing it!

[MrMickeysMom]

16. That's him, alright...

I'm pretty sure he's still doing it, and that same cosmic music still plays with the eerie whistle in the background. :-)

[uppityperson]

18. The precise moment of the 2008 solstice will be Sun., Dec. 21, 7:04 AM EST (12:04 AM UT).

search also shows me 2008-12-21 12:02

and http://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/december-solstice.html
The December solstice will occur at 12:04 (or 12.04pm) Coordinated Universal Time (UTC) on December 21, 2008.

[Ichingcarpenter]

19. Well, I thought everything was East Coast time in the US and the world?

Thanks for informing the thread!........I mean that.

[uppityperson]

20. I just cut and pasted. Now, I think that time works only if you are right on timeline.

Being off be even a bit will make it different. I am sooooo looking forward to the sun coming back. For warmth, for light, for it all. We've a south facing house which gets much warmer on sunny days, and on longer sun days, also. Usually the dark time is just ok, this yr I am really tired of it already.

In 6 wks we will have more daylight than now. I've been telling myself 2 months, but now it is 6 wks.

[Jim Lane]

21. Solstice question (arising from your link)

The states that, "for an observer in the northern hemisphere, the December solstice marks the day of the year with the least hours of daylight for those living north of the Tropic of Cancer."

Why the limitation to the area north of the Tropic of Cancer? I thought that the day of the December solstice would have the least daylight time for anyone anywhere in the Northern Hemisphere, including the area north of the Equator but south of the Tropic of Cancer.

[eShirl]

24. I am surprised to learn that UT is different from GMT

...but that's what I get from assuming -- I make an ass out of me. :D

Thanks for posting.

[muriel_volestrangler]

25. In practice, they are the same for everyday use

It's only when you get into arcane astronomical measurements there's a difference. Plus it kept the French happy by being able to use their word order for the abbreviation (UTC), rather than the Anglocentric GMT. :evilgrin:

[hfojvt]

22. that makes no sense though

you start getting sunlight back into your condo, but what difference does the exact second make in that? Plus it seems that your sunlight is gonna be the same 5 days before solstice as it will be 5 days after solstice. Solstice means we have rounded the corner, but there are still lots of cold, short, icy days to go. Followed by a wet muddy time and spring allergies and then we are into tornado season.

Man, this planet sucks.

[druidity33]

26. stop taking those

bitter pills. Dontcha know they make you all argumentative and snuffly!

:shrug:

[asteroid2003QQ47]

28. The planet is great, it's the naked ape that sucks! n/t

[Eurobabe]

27. FWIW, I am counting the days too!

The sun starts its downward arc about 2pm here now. By 4:15 it is almost dark. :puke: Mentally, it is a huge boost to know that as of 12/21, we will begin to add about 3-4 minutes to each day.

And ski season has started. :bounce:

[razors edge]

30. Don't forget the caganers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caganer


(S)catalonia's Fecal Christmas Festivities

By Josh Ward

Some of the world's most curious Christmas traditions can be found in Catalonia, where the idea of holiday cheer seems to involve some of life's more basic bodily functions.

Here are two factoids that one wouldn't necessarily expect to find in the same Wikipedia entry: "the infant Jesus is God in human form" and "everyone defecates."

But if you navigate to the entry attempting an explanation of the fecal-centric Catalonian tradition known as el caganer, that is exactly what you'll find. Indeed, the tradition is a much-loved element of the Christmas celebration in Catalonia, despite its somewhat obscure beginnings.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/0,1518,592677,00.html

[TexasObserver]

32. That's why SUN worship is far more sane than worshipping assorted imaginary gods.

As George Carlin pointed out, PBUH.

The story of Jesus is about the sun. It's a tale of the "death" and "rebirth" of the sun every year, and is based upon ancient tales that show up in numerous hero legends.

Astro theology was based upon the science of the movements of celestial masses, and stories were created to allow such science to be passed on to successive generations at night. The night sky was a field of lights to learn, but to give those lights identity for remembering, tales were woven to help children and adults commit to memory the locations of such night lights.

The religious beliefs of ancient humans were much more rational than modern humans, who really don't understand that in the beginning, it was the SUN, not the son, and it walked on water the way the sun does every morning when it first appears in the morning across a body of water. The sun "dies" in the winter, and is reborn again a few days after, as the globe emerges from winter solstice.

[carlyhippy]

34. Im counting the days, I can't wait for the longer days again

Carly

[roody]

35. Winter Solstice

Return of the light.
Tomorrow the days grow longer.
Tomorrow the cold grows stronger.
Tonight, the longest night.