Saddleback membership criteria: If you're gay, you cannot be a church member

[ruggerson]

"Because membership in a church is an outgrowth of accepting the Lordship and leadership of Jesus in one’s life, someone unwilling to repent of their homosexual lifestyle would not be accepted at a member at Saddleback Church. That does not mean they cannot attend church – we hope they do! God’s Word has the power to change our lives."

http://www.saddlebackfamily.com/membership/group_finder/faqs_smallgroup.asp?id=7509#q_49

And this is the man chosen to open the pageant celebrating our new President.

[davidinalameda]

1. homosexual lifestyle?

oh my

[Warpy]

3. Yeah, going to work, mowing the lawn on Saturday morning

all that libertine stuff.

It's what they do in my neighborhood, anyway.

[davidinalameda]

31. i don't have a lawn

but I have lots of laundry to do this weekend

[yardwork]

26. I think they mean gay sex.

[JerseygirlCT]

38. Wonder if they routinely check on the sex lives of their

straight members...

[Muttocracy]

2. attend but not be a member... separate but equal...

do the bylaws mention pedophiles? can't bear to hit that site myself.

[libnnc]

4. But Ricky gave teh gayz some doughnuts one time!

So that should make it all golden!

:crazy:

[marylanddem]

10. Donuts - and water! A great combo.

[lapfog_1]

24. and some of his BEST friends are gay!

See, he's no bigot!

:sarcasm:

[marylanddem]

5. the more I learn about this asshole Warren, the angrier

I am at Obama for sticking him in our face & telling us to suck it up. Fuck both of them.

[EFerrari]

6. Me, too and yes, twice.

:grr:

What was he THINKING?

[QC]

13. What was he THINKING?

That this is an excellent opportunity for some triangulating.

[jonnyblitz]

7. Obama has some awesome friends !!1

:puke: :puke:

[slipslidingaway]

8. K&R n/t

[ColbertWatcher]

9. Sounds like Landover Baptist--they don't even allow the unsaved on their website.

Check out their webpage (obviously I can check it out because I'm saved, otherwise, well, you know).

http://www.landoverbaptist.org/beliefs.html

[Fearless]

34. If it saves people perhaps it would be better put to use as a suicide hotline

Or a marriage councilor service or something.

:rofl:

[QC]

11. There you go again, with youe special interest and pet issues!

Why can't you be pragmatic and post-ideological, like the kool kiddies?

[Clintonista2]

12. Oh look it's Ruggerson the PUMA

:sarcasm:

Seriously, I'd love to see the Warren apologists respond to this one.

[QC]

14. YUO AR A PUMA TO!!1!!1!

[Clintonista2]

16. Why do you hate America? You and your pet issues. GET OVER IT!!!!!

[QC]

19. I am so tired of those pet issue special interests.

I mean, I come here to bask in the warm glow of The Anointed One, and maybe look at pictures of him in his swimsuit, and you people insist on harshing my buzz!

Do you think this is come kind of politics discussion board or something.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

39. Yes, I'd like to hear what the Warren apologists have to say.

[Clintonista2]

45. What was Warren being honored for by Clinton?

Why is it that the nastiest DUers seem to be the biggest homophobes? It's not a coincidence methinks.

[RobertoRoberti]

15. "You weren't listening" to Obama on Civil Rights

As Obama likes to say, "you weren't listening." We are always being reminded that Obama taught constitutional law. But is there anything in his voting record that suggests a profound respect for our rights? He voted for the PATRIOT Act, the FISA law, "tort reform," etc. And he always said he did not believe in equal treatment for gays-- because no matter what else you say, if you think gay couples should be regarded differently by the law, you DO NOT support equal treatment. Those of us who just held our noses and voted for him-- thinking, perhaps mistakenly, that the destructive power of McCain-Palin would be far worse--are not surprised by any of his Cabinet picks or inaugural choices.

Remember, any Congressman or Senator who claims to care about rights ought to be judged by this standard: what did they do to defend us against Bush? In Obama's case, it's hard to think of any example at all from his brief Senate career.

[Maat]

47. I voted for Obama while holding my nose, also.

But I didn't expect to be disappointed this much so fast, I confess.

[Bluebear]

17. Look, Rick Warren is only singing ONE SONG!!!1

I mean saying one prayer!!! We must REACH OUT to ALL with whom we disagree in order to build bridges!!!!!!!!!!1 :crazy:

[Clintonista2]

21. LOL! Sigged.

[Bluebear]

22. I love it!

[deaniac21]

50. lol

:spray:

[Maven]

18. We need to include them, even though they exclude us.

I'm fucking tired of this and I need to go to bed.

[Fearless]

20. This is not new people... I seem to recall the Catholic Church having a similar position...

[readmoreoften]

25. Incorrect.

In the Catholic Church you can be gay, you just aren't supposed to "act on it sexually" but if you do you can go to confession. You can be in a 'non-sexual' gay relationship that doesn't 'act out'.

[Fearless]

30. Is there a difference when it comes down to it

Between, "no gays" and "no people who act gay"? I seem to think that they are quite similar. One says that we can't accept any of you people. The other says that we'll accept you people, but only if you act like us people. To me that's close enough to the same thing to thoroughly disabuse me of any allegiance to said groups.

[readmoreoften]

32. It's a little different. Teensy, because it recognizes that it isn't a choice.

[Fearless]

33. I would agree on that...

Progress? Yes. But like with the Catholic Church historically, it is dreadfully slow at changing.

[rug]

23. That statement alone should establish if he would be accepted at a Democratic Inauguration,

let alone be selected to ask a million people to bow their heads in prayer.

[yardwork]

27. But I can always pretend to be straight and lie about my life, right?

That's what lots of DUers have been telling me today. I can just pretend to be straight, lie about who I am, and that way I can still belong to Saddleback Church! Simple. It's not like this is a real issue or anything.

[Clintonista2]

29. What a coincidence

Poster #28 just said that.

[pnwmom]

28. Sure you can. You just have to be willing

to lie about it.

[Bluebear]

35. kick

[sarcasmo]

36. That is one sick Man and one sick church.

[krabigirl]

42. I live nearby...it makes me sick. it's all about the $$$$$$.

[sarcasmo]

46. When you read the list of things they expect the word tithe sure does get mentioned a bunch.

It's all about the money.

[rbixby]

37. Arent Christianity and homosexuality

incompatible? It seems to me that they are. I think the bible says that its an abomination or something along those lines.


I think I remember from my days as a Christian, a lot of talk about that. I just kind of figured that if you were homosexual, then you shouldn't try to be Christian. Maybe I'm wrong, but it always seemed like that to me. I'm not homosexual, but the church's intolerance for it was one of the big reasons for me leaving.

[JerseygirlCT]

40. No, not at all

It's just been often accepted as such because one reading of scripture (Leviticus and Paul's writings - nothing Jesus had to say) have been interpreted in such a way as to support pre-existing biases against gay folk.

Any of those "clobber" passages are understood quite differently by other biblical scholars - and more to the point, by other churches.

[rbixby]

43. I guess the thing is....

My issue is that people are entitled to their beliefs, if you're anti-gay, then so be it, that's your choice. I just think that what a lot of those people fail to understand is that equal rights means giving equal rights to everyone, whether it be affording the legal protections of marriage or whatever. If your particular faith says that being gay is bad, then either you're not gay or you're not part of the faith. I guess my point in this is that being a member of one of these churches that's very anti-gay is fine, but at the same time, the members need to remember that equal rights apply to everyone, not just people who they find morally agreeable.

[JerseygirlCT]

44. Oh, you'll find no argument from me there!

Also important for all to remember that regardless of what their particular church teaches, civil rights are not the purveiw of their church.

Also, I have hope that as younger generations come along, the reasonable position and interpretation will gain a bigger foothold. I can hope, right?

[krabigirl]

41. Sounds like a lot of preachers and priests. Makes me sick. Enough with this crap!

[Fire Walk With Me]

48. Brokeback, Saddleback, what's the difference?

:shrug:

[TexasObserver]

49. I don't understand why anyone tries to defend bigoted religious leaders.

[entanglement]

51. Expecting a medieval church to be inclusive of gays is like expecting a country club à la Madoff

to be inclusive of working-class people. Equally improbable.

[moondust]

52. delete