Do all Evangelicals hate gays or just the republican ones?

[Philosoraptor]

I have several born again Evangelicals in my extended family, my brother is the republican version, my parents are the only two Democratic Liberal Evangelicals I know of.

Even my parents, bless em', can't support gay marriage, but I do know that they have had many gay friends, even living with them for periods.

Are most modern day Evangelicals republican? Are they mostly anti-gay, or virulently homophobic? Do ALL Evangelicals hate the idea of two people of the same sex getting married legally?

I know there are more than a few Evangelicals here at DU, and I know they aren't going to confess to hating homosexuals or homosexuality here, but I'm just curious, is it just the republican Evangelicals that hate gays, or is it more rampant than that?

[Phred42]

1. THAT - is a damned GOOD Question

[MineralMan]

2. The problem lies in defining "evangelical."

There are lots of definitions of the term. You have the Evangelical Lutheran Church, with many ministers who support gay marriage. The fundamentalcase "Evangelicals" univerally contend that those Lutherans are not evangelicals, and may even not be christians.

Very difficult question.

[Veritas_et_Aequitas]

11. Well put. nt

[Celeborn Skywalker]

15. ECLA

is evangelical in the traditional sense of the word, but since the earlier part of the last century evangelicalism has been used for people who stress personal holiness and salvation along with a mandate to spread the Gospel. The moderan Evangelical Lutheran Church would not be included in that description, although the Missouri Synod Lutherans might be.

Evangelicals are mainly now rightwingers, but there are some liberal Evangelicals. Believe it or not, there are actually some relatively liberal Fundamentalists but they are few and far between.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

3. Here's a definition: Rick Warren is Republican, not just evangelical nt

[TygrBright]

4. I know evangelicals who support civil marriage for gays...

...but who oppose having their ministers forced by law to solemnize such marriages under church auspices.

The sick, evil, bigoted barstids.

sadly,
Bright

[JerseygirlCT]

30. Well, I think there are a fair number of clergy who would just as soon

be out of the marrying business, period. They'd prefer that marriages be strictly in the civil realm, and then they and their churches can decide whether to bless the union.

Standing in as a representative of the state brings up problems for them.

No minister or clergyperson of any stripe should ever be required to perform a marriage against their beliefs. And saying that they would have to do so is often a talking point of those opposed to marriage equality. It's a scare point not even remotely based in fact.

[Mari333]

5. imho , if someone does not support gay marriage

no matter how many gay friends they have, they are still bigots.

[mrcheerful]

10. What about those of us that doesn't support marriage at all?

Not to be a smart ass, I just think marriage is a bad idea, how can I say that the person I love today I will love in a week or 50 years after nature gets ahold of that persons body? Good lord, I hate seeing myself naked now a days, I sure wouldn't wish that on anyone else, though SO says I have a sexy butt, yet notice she leaves out the rest, lol.

[Mari333]

13. you yourself not wanting marriage is different then supporting

others who wish to have the same rights that legalized marriage brings to them.
for instance, you might not want to vote, but if you found out that any group of citizens were being denied the right to vote, you would support their right to be allowed to vote, even if you yourself chose not to.

[TechBear_Seattle]

6. The matter isn't quite that clear-cut

Evangelicalism is an attitude towards being a Christian rather than a body of doctrine. Basically, evangelicals emphasize the need for personal conversion (ie being "born again") and a motivation for helping others attain their own personal conversion. By and large, most evangelicals are theologically conservative; not surprising as the movement grew out of "third-wave" Protestantism which strongly emphasized Biblical inerrancy and authority. That is not to say that all evangelicals are theologically conservative, as there are a number of evangelical denominations that see a more open, inclusive Gospel: the Metropolitan Community Church and the United Church of Christ are two examples that come readily to mind. Conservative evangelicals generally consider homosexuality to be a moral issue and so a matter of sin, while liberal evangelicals generally consider homosexuality to be a biological issue and thus little different than skin color or gender.

Those who are theologically conservative, evangelical or not, have tended towards the Republican Party over the last 40 years. Those who are theologically more liberal, evangelical or not, have tended towards the Democratic Party over the last 40 years. Because most evangelicals are theologically conservative, most evangelicals have tended towards the Republican Party.

[supernova]

7. Sad irony

is the the institution which grew up around a hippy freeloader who preached universal love and peace between all, has become THE haven for narrow minds and judgmental sorts.

The fundamentalist churches encourage the hate because it perpetuates their well-being.

[ellacott]

9. Many of them do it because they honestly believe that what the Bible says

Many times people will label all Christians as Fundie or evangelical. I don't see it as they are inherently conservative. The conservative party has used this group and they fell for it. The group that the right has captured are slowly beginning to see that they were used.

[Mari333]

14. oddly enough, the bible mentions nothing about gay marriage. n/t

[ellacott]

18. But they feel it says something about homosexuality

[Mari333]

21. yes, the leviticus part...and it doesnt mention lesbians

and then of course, they ignore all the other laws in leviticus.
i call them shop n stop christians. they pick out whatever passage that will promote their own hatred of the day.

[ellacott]

25. This minister I know calls it buffet christians

:)

[supernova]

17. Actually recent brain research

says that, to a degree we are hard-wired for either more open-ended thinking or more closed-ended thinking. In our culture, that works out to "liberal" (open-ended) and "conservative" (closed-thinking. The need to have an absolute answer and inability to tolerate ambiguity.)

http://www.latimes.com/news/science/la-sci-politics10sep10,0,5982337.story?coll=la-home-center

This suggests that people gravitate to different groups, depending on what their brains are like. The fundamentalist church, with its instance that the bible is literally true and could not possibly be wrong or misconstrued, speaks to this need for certainty.

Is every religious person fundamentalist? No. Is every every evangelical a fundamentalist. No. But all most all fundamentalist evangelicals are conservative politically.

Now for Rick Warren's audience, LynneSin says elsewhere here in GD that these are people who don't think too deeply. And I think she's right. I think the people who are waking up, as you say, are the evangelicals who are *not* fundamentalist. They just don't have the wherewithal to want to think deeply about a lot of subjects, including theology and sexuality. It just confuses them. They'd rather go listen to someone like Rick Warren spell it all out for them once a week, even if what he says is horribly hurtful, erroneous, and ill-informed. They are the ones who are open to competent information and perhaps can be persuaded to evolve.

These are people who care more about poverty, the environment, healthcare, -- all solidly Democratic topics -- than they do about going on and on about abortion and "teh gays."

[ellacott]

20. You make very good points

But many of those conservative christians are part of the Reagan democrats that we lost in the 80's.

It is true that many don't want to(or can't) think on their own. Some of them can be changed.

I've seen it for myself.

[supernova]

23. It's the only thing

that I'm clinging to as to *why* Barack invited him, instead of somebody more uplifting like Tony Campolo or Jim Wallis.

[ellacott]

24. Me too

[mrcheerful]

8. In my experience it's not just gays that give them displeasure, its sex

between unmarried people. Though since the 60's they have been forced to accept unwed grand children, remember before the 60's if Jane found herself "in the family way" she was forced to leave home/school/town she lived in to go stay with a relative that no one in the family had ever met. Then 9 to 10 months later Jane would be back home and everyone pretended that it was just a visit. Or Jane had an unplanned marriage to a gay she dated a time or two or had just met the week before. Not to mention that at one time families decided for Jane who she was to marry.

Meanwhile back at the unknown relatives home, their was a adoption or a call to the orphanage and another baby was on it's own without a clue on who their parents were. They want to go back to the good old days way of dealing with teens/sex and by products of, they know they will never stop teens from sex, but its all show, we made an effort to do gods will type crap.

Gays have a double whammy, 1 they don't procreate good little future fundies. 2 gay sex to a fundie is worse then having sex with a woman on her period, fundies want to take all pleasure away from the sex act, Remember the good old days, women who enjoyed the sex act were freaks of nature and few found it a pleasurable act, it was dirty, disgusting and humiliating. So if a man can have sex with another man, then it shows the man as weak, dirty, disgusting and humiliates women.

After all, if a man rejects a woman to have sex with another man, then it's because women aren't good enough for them, which is a slap in the face to their fine upstanding moral convictions. Which they put on and take off like they do their pants.

Hey its a simple problem that man kind has had 2000 years to make complex. The simple problem? Let people sleep with who they want and mind your own business. I'm 52 my, SO is 34, we been living together for 5 years and my religious non fundie family is having fits because we refuse to marry. Why anyone wants to marry is beyond my understanding, but I'm not going to force my anti marriage views on anyone else, not my place.

[OHdem10]

12. The Media has a way of protecting the Fundamentalists by

calling them all Evangelicals. Fundamentalists believe in the literal
interpretation of the Bible and 2. the Bible does not err.

This group, more out of fear and ignorance than Hate, are the most absolutist and opposed to "gay lifestyle"

Boadbrushing Evangelicals is not fair.

[MineralMan]

16. Evangelical fundamentalists want just one thing....

They want everyone to be an evangelical fundie. They want all alternatives to that to be gone, since they are quite certain they are exactly correct in everything. Of course, there are many sects of fundamentists, each of which believes it is exactly correct.

Where it comes to marriage, these neanderthalers seem to think only their version of marriage will do. They fought interracial marriage and lost. Now, they're fighting gay and lesbian marriages. They will lost that one, too, even if not immediately.

The bottom line is that these fundamentalcases want you to obey what rules they believe should be obeyed. They will never, ever be happy until they control everything according to their debased principles.

Such people are dangerous to a nation like ours. They must be opposed.

My views on marriage? Any two or more adults who wish to be married should be able to marry. It's none of anyone else's business. It's that simple.

[LanternWaste]

19. My best friend on DU...

I'm what is considered an evangelical by contemporary defintions.


My best friend in Austin is not straight-- and I spend my vacations with her each year.
My best friend on DU is not straight. I doubt either one would say that I hate them. But then again, I can only speak for myself as I merely belong to a church rather being part and parcel of some monolithic special interest group.



"Are most modern day Evangelicals republican"
Most of my fellow parishioners are progressive libs and we had an Obama victory party at my pastor's house-- just over three quarters of the church were there (non-church related of course, so no one need get upset about my pastor preaching politics from the pulpit-- he preached it from his glider-rocker in his living room, but we did at one point or another that night...)

[Greyhound]

22. Fundamentalists, of any stripe, are ignorant by definition. Monuments to Homo Sapien's

extraordinary proclivity for self-delusion and hypocrisy.

[etherealtruth]

26. The United Church of Christ is an Evangelical Church

I have no doubt they support rights for every human being. I'm not a member .... but, I worked for them in the 1990's and I can vouch for the fact that they are a truly liberal denomination.

[JerseygirlCT]

29. Yes.

Many of the more liberal churches consider themselves evangelical in some way.

There has been a very strong overlay between evangelicals and fundamentalists and between that group and political conservatism, even radicalism. But that doesn't mean that evangelism is necessarily tied to fundamentalism or to political conservatism.

Evangelism has existed since the beginning of Christianity. The Fundamentalist movement is most definitely a newcomer in the world of Christianity.

[Swamp Rat]

27. There are plenty of democrats and independents who are bigoted towards same sex orientation,

including 'regular' christians.

[JerseygirlCT]

28. Most evangelicals are probably conservative and

comfortable with some degree of prejudice against gays.

But not all. It's more like a theological position that in many circumstances happens to correlate with conservative political positions. But there's no particularly theological reason that has to be so.

An evangelist, in broadest terms, is someone who spreads the gospel. Just how that gospel is interpreted is not a necessary part of being evangelistic.