Femicidal maniac kills 6 family members

[Ellen Forradalom]

I wish the NY Times would call him a 'misogynist femicidal maniac' instead of 'a man in a Santa Claus outfit.' Only the outfit and timing makes this incident 'bizarre.' Violent retribution for ending a relationship is all too common.

A 45-year-old man in a Santa Claus outfit opened fire on a gathering of his in-laws and then methodically set their house ablaze, killing at least six people and injuring several others, the authorities said on Thursday.

In addition, three people who were at the party in the suburb of Covina — including the couple who owned the home and the former wife of the suspect — were missing, the police said....

Witnesses said Mr. Pardo, armed with cans of accelerant, went to the house looking for his former wife, Sylvia, with whom he had been entangled in a bitter divorce.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/26/us/26Santa.html?partner=permalink&exprod=permalink

[malaise]

1. In truth what we have here is mass murderer

He could have just killed himself. Good fugging grief.

[Ellen Forradalom]

4. He could've

What's instructive is that he felt entitled to murder the family because he was pissed at his ex. The most extreme manifestation of an all too common attitude.

[Warpy]

7. "If I can't own you, nobody will!"

They've also been known to kill their kids, as well.

[hlthe2b]

44. But suicide is a sin!

:sarcasm:

[Sanctified]

2. WTF, Femicidal? n/t

[Ellen Forradalom]

3. A person looking to murder a woman

who decided to take out her family and himself.

[Sanctified]

8. He was not targeting just any woman, or women as a group.

He was targeting an ex-spouse, the guy would have done the same thing if his ex was a man. This is a case of domestic violence, not femicide.

[Captain Hilts]

11. Over half of women murdered are murdered by ex's. nt

[Sanctified]

13. Were they murdered for being women or for being an Ex Spouse?

[Captain Hilts]

15. Both. Men aren't murdered by ex's. nt

[Sanctified]

16. Wow, just Wow.

I don't even know what to say, to that ridiculous comment.

[Captain Hilts]

55. Don't "say" anything read these...

http://www.nytimes.com/specials/women/warchive/970331_1651.html

From that narrower pool, researchers learned that nearly half of the women were killed by current or former husbands or boyfriends, a much higher proportion than expected. Nationally, the figure is 40 percent, compared with 6 percent of men who were killed by wives or girlfriends.

The portrait derived from the homicide files is telling in its details of how the women lived and graphic in the specifics of how they died. More than half the women killed in the city during those years died in private homes, usually their own. In the majority of the cases in which the killer was identified, the murderers were people they knew.

When they were killed by their husbands, one-third of the time the women appeared to be trying to end the relationships. In one-quarter of the cases where husbands or boyfriends were the killers, children were also killed or injured, or they watched the murders or found their mothers' bodies.

And, unlike men, who are killed most often by guns, women "are very likely to be punched and hit and burned and thrown out of windows," said the leader of the study, Dr. Susan A. Wilt, the director of epidemiology and surveillance for the Health Department's injury and prevention program.

[cabluedem]

74. What can one say to someone who has pre-concieved notions, not facts, that are untrue? nt

[blogslut]

21. Oh, come on

Granted, more men kill women when a relationship goes south but to say that men aren't killed by their female ex's is just not true.

[Control-Z]

52. The difference being,

men kill women for reasons they think are within their right of ownership. Women, on the other hand, are usually fighting for their lives, trying to escape abuse, and/or in self defense of a hellish existence.

For Christ's sake, the way men try to defend their perceived right to control and abuse women is unbelievable.

edit: typo

[blogslut]

59. If I were a man...which I am not

And I am not talking about women who kill in self-defense. I'm talking about the fact that there are, indeed, mean selfish women who do very bad things. Anyone who refuses to recognize this is deluding themselves.

[Control-Z]

64. Of course there are ('mean selfish women

who do very bad things') but the ratio of woman to man/family crime is staggeringly low in comparison to men. I can't remember the last time I heard about a woman on a shooting spree that wasn't motivated by her partner's abuse. Actually I can't remember a woman ever behaving this way. I'm sure there have been, I just don't remember. As few and as far between as they've been you'd think they would stand out in my mind.

[blogslut]

66. Well, you are correct about the weapons of choice

One doesn't hear much about women going on shooting rampages. And frankly, one doesn't hear much about women who single out grown men as victims. What one does hear a lot, are incidences where women kill their children.

Look, I am not trying to discount the very real existence of male violence against women. I was merely trying to point out how untrue the statement, made by the poster above, was.

[Hannah Bell]

73. Women never try to "control or abuse men", I suppose.

Trying to make events like this fit some pseudo-feminist mold serves no useful purpose.

Women kill less - generally. But they're no slouches in the power & control dept. Over men, other women, children, & resources.


I'm a woman, btw. Reformed, rueful.

[bettyellen]

61. it's just 1/10 as frequent

[SharonAnn]

24. Occasionally, they are. But you're right, not "usually".

[LoZoccolo]

25. lol wut? n/t

[dysfunctional press]

26. you forgot the sarcasm icon.

either that or you just posted something really stupid.

[Captain Hilts]

56. Here's what the Department of Justice says about this...

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/press/femvied.pr

Women were attacked about six
times more often by offenders with whom they had
an intimate relationship than were male violence
victims during 1992 and 1993, the Department of
Justice announced today.

The victims' friends or acquaintances committed
more than half of the rapes and sexual assaults,
intimates committed 26 percent, and strangers were
responsible for about one in five.

Women of all races, as well as Hispanic and
non-Hispanic women, were about equally vulnerable
to attacks by intimates. However, women in
families with incomes below $10,000 per year
were more likely than other women to be violently
attacked by an intimate.

Women from 19 to 29 years old were more likely
than women of other ages to be victimized by an
intimate. Also, the rate of intimate-offender
attacks on women separated from their husbands
was about three times higher than that of divorced
women and about 25 times higher than that of
married women.

And, in Canada: "In total, 52% of all female victims and 8% of all male victims in 2001 were killed by an individual with whom they had an intimate relationship at one time, either through marriage or dating" (Statistics Canada 2002)."

[dysfunctional press]

89. nothing there says that women do NOT kill their ex's...

as was your insipid claim.

[TahitiNut]

38. It's a shame Martha Freeman didn't know that -- or the jury that convicted her.

:eyes:

It's a shame Mary Winkler didn't know that, either. Real pity. Tsk, tsk. Maybe someone should have told Kate Knight, too. Sharon Collins never got the word, either. Somehow, Shellye Stark never got the news. Fancy that. Nor did poor little Natalie Rael! Such a pity.

:eyes:

[edbermac]

40. Or Betty Broderick or Jean Harris for that matter.

Or Phil Hartman's wife. :sarcasm:

[Captain Hilts]

46. Sorry gentlemen, over HALF women murdered are killed by ex's. Men are killed more randomly.

Sorry, them's the facts.

[Recursion]

54. Men are killed by strangers; women aren't

Men in general are much, much, much more likely to be the victims of violence than women.

[bettyellen]

76. Men in general are much, much, much more likely to be the PERPETRATORS of violence than women.

[Recursion]

78. Both statements are true

Are you saying the men who are the victims of violence deserve it?

[bettyellen]

80. i never said anything of the kind- just trying to put your statement in proper context- it seems a

bit dishonest to go on about their victimhood without disclosing that men are in effect, their own worst enemies.
it's sad there's not a lot of researh done as to why men are perpetrating all this violence.

[Recursion]

82. OK; I had thought that was what I was saying too

There is an epidemic of male-on-male violence in this country. I would also love to see male-on-female violence (and all other combinations) stop too, but I'm not sure that going after anything but the root male-on-male problem is going to help.

[bettyellen]

86. yeah it's an epidemic and i agree it needs attention

[Karenina]

87. There's an epidemic of male-on-male violence all over the world...

which now threatens our Mother Earth. We may be a bit late for grassroots efforts at this point.

[cabluedem]

47. "Snapped" on TV is all about wifes killing husbands. One lady shot her mate in the ..

closet and walked. Another cut her hubby into three pieces and threw him into a bay packed in suitcases. Women can and do murder men!

[Captain Hilts]

51. A collection of anecdotes don't make data. % of men murdered by ex's is SMALL. nt

[Recursion]

57. So is the % of women murdered period

The vast, vast majority of victims and perpetrators of murder are men. I'm saying this because there seem to be some brick walls being hit here: people are hesitant about the idea of "femicide" because women are so much less likely than men to meet a violent death.

[bettyellen]

62. because men are much much more prone to violence, period.. good point!

[cabluedem]

75. Men are killed by strangers, often because they are away from home making money, & taking risks. nt

[bettyellen]

77. i know-it's facinating that men have created this the endless cycle or culture of violence

where they are their own worst enemy. and then they glorify it.... i think there's a whiff of that in your post. taking risks? the risjk is from other men, right? ironic and sad.

[cabluedem]

84. You have valid points but not all men like the world as it is, however they have to

go out into the world to make a living, and yes those risks often involve violence from other men. Having said that, who does the heavy lifting when the life's of other people, including women, are at stake in this sometimes very harsh world?

[bettyellen]

93. the same people wh make the world so harsh like that- men!

yeah we have men to protect us from men- wow- thanks a fuckload guys1.

[cabluedem]

71. I didnt mean to imply that women kill as often as men but they do kill and recieve lighter jailtime.

[Recursion]

79. Easiest way to get a death sentence...

...is to kill a white woman. Most difficult way to get a death sentence is to kill a black man.

Then again, this board had a thread about a woman being charged for biting her husband's penis, which largely ignored the other half of the article about how she did that because she didn't want to have sex and he wouldn't stop trying.

Sentencing is f**ked in all sorts of ways.

[cabluedem]

88. Mandatory sentencing is a disgrace, particularly for non-violent drug laws.

[Captain Hilts]

5. Does this warrant using 'fuck'?

[Sanctified]

9. Yep.

[Captain Hilts]

10. Not learned any new words since 7th grade?

[Sanctified]

14. Domestic Violence does not equal Femicide.

The guy killed other people than just women including men, the guy was a homicidal maniac.

[blueraven95]

23. the definition of femicide:

from dictionary.com:

"1. the act of killing a woman.
2. a person who kills a woman."


you could say he also committed homicide (upon some quick research there does not appear to be a separate word for someone who has killed a man).

So yes, in this case, this man did commit femicide. You might dispute the misogynist label, but I find it very hard to reject the femicide one. Personally I would say that anyone who decides to take out their ex and the ex's family because of a break up has some huge unresolved issues with the opposite sex (or in the case of a homosexual couple, the same sex), in this case making him a misogynist, in my opinion.

edit for clearer wording.

[-..__...]

20. Sounds like a feminine hygiene product.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

27. Femicidal Means Nothing More Than Killing A Woman. If A Woman Is Murdered, It Is Femicide.

It's homicide too of course. It's a murder like any other murder, but is simply a descriptive term for when the victim is a female. Doesn't really mean much to use really. Either way, male or female, someone was murdered. In this case 6 people, both male and female.

[TahitiNut]

29. "In this case 6 people, both male and female." Yup - except the body count is now 9.

But I guess the male(s) killed don't matter to some. :shrug: Bizarre.

[cabluedem]

72. I guess so. We are cannon fodder after womans liberation excluded women from the draft register. nt

[Sanctified]

33. Femicide is similar in meaning to Genocide

Or the systematic killing of Women.

[LisaL]

65. Since this guy is accused of killing both men and women,

the term doesn't fit him.

[Sanctified]

69. I agree 100%. n/t

[dysfunctional press]

39. if she's a gay woman, does it become lesbicide?

:shrug:

or if she was a double-amputee, perhaps it was parapeligicide?

when does the chain of descriptiveness end?

[Jamastiene]

90. Do you have objections to "infanticide" and "matricide" too?

Or do you just have objections when it comes to women and gay people and people who are handicapped?

[jobycom]

6. Nah, sexism is harmless, doncha know?

Just boorish men groping secretaries. No harm done.

[Trajan]

12. Reminiscent of Fox News using 'Homicidal Bomber'

for Suicide Bombers ...

I agree with the above post: If the Ex were male, it would be the same terror, the same impulse, the same cause and same end ...

There is no evidence that this awful person killed because the victim was a women, other than he was spurned by that victim ....

[Liberal_in_LA]

17. death toll rises to 9

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-santa-shooting26-2008dec26,0,6505439.story

Man in Santa suit kills at least nine at Covina party, police say


Covina Police Chief Kim Raney tells media members about the 8-year-old girl who was shot in the face at a Christmas party as she opened the front door to a man dressed in a Santa suit.

[JackRiddler]

18. I agree with you - it's about the motivation: femicide.

We have a culture and an individual conditioning that hates women, this is as obvious as it is "outrageous" to say openly. Now watch as those in denial - some of them women - come to point out the relative rights of women in the same culture, as though these rights were not gained only through centuries of struggle by women (for the most part). To understand the femicidal reality is not to say that women are entirely powerless, or that femicide is all there is. This nuance eludes those who can't stand to have that reality made manifest. Thank you for making this important statement.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

37. You'll also have the ones who claim:

"But many more MEN get murdered!!" As if that makes a hill of beans of difference when we are talking about why men target women with violence. Really, I can be appalled at the amount of murderous violence that men show towards men in general, while also being concerned about certain men directing hatred and intimidation toward women. It's not that I don't think women are strong. I do. It's just that I'm practical enough to realize that the law doesn't protect the rights of women the way it should.

[hfojvt]

70. actually the law seemed to be on her side

First, he was required to pay $1,785 a month in spousal support even though she was living with her parents and he was still making house payments on a house he apparently owned before they were married. Second, in the settlement he was required to pay $10,000. He was two months behind in the spousal support too, which may have been added to the $10,000. His legal fees have not been reported. I imagine that there were months of stress where he didn't know how much he was gonna lose or be required to pay. He lost a dog that he apparently cared very much for. Did the stress of the divorce proceedings have something to do with him losing his job? If he still had that job, or another decent job, would he have done what he did?

Anyway, it's sad and horrible what he did. It doesn't make it any better to turn it into a men vs. women issue.

[cbc5g]

19. It is femicide...reminds me of the ex stalker bf from maryland that killed people

over the holidays a few years back (Kazynsky?). They seek ultimate control over women and when they are left with no control, they go nuts with guns. They are hugely sociopathic.

I doubt this sort of behavior is rooted in the actual relationship between the man and the woman. The behavior is essentially sociopathic and narcissistic. Individuals like this see others as just extensions or objects in their lives and of no inherent value. It's all about them, so "she" doesn't get to just "move on." The world doesn't conform to his vision of reality, so let it burn. Notice he didn't just attack his wife; he attacked the world.

I think the sad reality is there are some guys who because of very dysfunctional upbringing equate self worth with ownership and control of a women.

[BrklynLiberal]

22. In November, a man drove cross-country from CA to NJ to shoot his estranged wife.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=6319057

Joseph M. Pallipurath went halfway around the world to India to find a wife last year. Now the California man is accused of going across the country to New Jersey to kill her.
<snip>
James was killed, and her cousin, Silvy Perincheril, was in "extremely critical" condition, police said. Dennis John Mallosseril, who witnesses said had tried to intervene, was shot in the head and died later Sunday in a hospital.

[whistler162]

28. ROLLSEYES!!!!

Nice way to lessen a mass murderer!

[blueraven95]

30. I don't understand...

how did the OP, in any way, lessen a mass murderer? By pointing out that he committed mass murder, some of whom where women, because of his hatred of one woman and arguably because of latent misogyny?

It seems to me that the only point you are making is that you value womens' lives less than men.

[Sanctified]

31. I digress...

The OP is elevating the death of the woman over the others instead of noting that all deaths were equally horrendous no matter what sex the victim was.

[blueraven95]

35. I see

but I don't think I agree.

My take on the OP was that she was speaking more about the motive of the killer and the media's efforts to, in some ways, sanitize the crimes in a way that doesn't challenge their audience - so we, as that audience ask "how could someone do that?" rather than "how has our society created conditions that may have led to this horrendous crime and how can we change those factors in our society to hopefully prevent more deaths from similar circumstances, because even one more death is one too many?" I believe that all too often we separate ourselves from these horrendous violent acts so that we don't have to examine our own comfortable lives and the media helps us do it in every way it can - particularly when said crimes revolve around females. I could be wrong, but I think this was the OP's point, but I hope I will be corrected if I am wrong.

And I also should apologize for suggesting you might be reacting to the OP out of misogyny. I was wrong and I am sorry.

[Control-Z]

68. When someone's family is threatened,

is it the family the perpetrator is angry with? Under most circumstances, is he threatening to hurt the family because he disagrees with them? Or is his anger/threat/action aimed at the person to whom he makes the threat? Seriously, the motive is everything when a man threatens/hurts a woman's family. Some actually spare the woman to create ever more suffering on her part. It's all about hurting her. Retaliating for something he deems important to his sick being. It doesn't even have to be, and usually is not, any great crime on her part. It can be as benign as being ignored or left by her.

The suffering he causes others is part of his punishment for her actions. He takes it out on her loved ones to hurt her more than she alone would be hurt. How you can see it any other way is baffling to me. I'm not saying the other family members aren't equally dead, just that his reasons for killing them have little to do with them.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

32. Well I guess it's the same reason they repeatedly call rapes "sex crimes".

Can't suggest that manly men aren't entitled to certain things, can we?

[kentuck]

34. I guess marriage didn't agree with him??

huh?

[Triana]

49. He was likely a raging batterer.

NOTHING agrees with them.

[uppityperson]

36. I'll say this for my asshole ex, at least he didn't dress in a santa suit and shoot up the place,

then burn it down. Granted he cost me thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars and took yrs off my life in stress and made our kid hate him. But he didn't dress in a Santa suit and shoot up our family gathering.

[etherealtruth]

85. You inspire me ... I am adopting your positive attitude

... I am reasonably sure my "ex" never dressed up in a Santa suit and shoot anything ... yeah, reasonably sure.

;)

edited to add: I think many people are unaware how dangerous it can be to leave a spouse ... even those that have displayed no previous violence.

[uppityperson]

92. Cynicism is catching, beware. And yes, leaving a spouse or partner can be very dangerous.

Some cannot take the losing part, or the loss of control, or jealously do not want to share ("if I can't have you, no one can"). Advising someone to "just leave" may work but may not, and having a plan to keep yourself and yours safe is always important.

[leftofthedial]

41. some people just can't stand being left out of an opportunity for victimhood

[tabasco]

50. Hammer meet nail.

On the head.

[juno jones]

42. K & R (nt)

[Spectral Music]

43. I like your term. This type of act is becoming so commonplace that it's almost a ritual

with certain truly disturbed men.

[Deja Q]

45. Inlawcidal if you ask me

No wonder the wife dumped him; he's got anger issues. Or is a typical male, I have no idea either way anymore.

[Triana]

48. And some people are STILL hung up on what a "nice guy" he seemed to be...

...abusive types often have a very skilled Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde thing going on. His ex-wife undoubtedly knew what a monster he was and no doubt that is why they divorced after only one year. This type of sitch is a prime example of ye olde Jekyll/Hyde type abuser. Bytheway the death toll is now at NINE.


Said of the newly divorced California man who killed 7 or 8 people last night while dressed as Santa Clause:

"I'm just — this is shocking," a woman who knew him told the Times. "He was the nicest guy you could imagine. Always a pleasure to talk to, always a big smile."


I'm sure his ex-wife knew who he really was.

[TahitiNut]

53. When Ted Bundy was executed, a TV reporter interviewed some people "on the street" ...

... and one woman said "it's such a shame that such a nice-looking young man had to be executed."

I'll never forget that. :puke:
I'm totally against capital punishment ... even for "ugly-looking" people. :grr:

[Triana]

60. I think I remember that...

:wtf: does what they look like have to do with anything? If they're deranged murderers, they're deranged murderers.

Regardless of being for/against capital punishment - people are too hung up on appearances. Vagrants can be the most harmless people and some of he "nice-looking" ones (and "nice" ones) can be freakin murderers.

That kind of attitude - like the woman you reference - is partially how the loonies get away with their behavior for so long - until they finally kill someone.

"He was such a nice guy"; or "he was so nice-looking" - Pfft!

Nice guy, schmice guy - many a nice guy (or gal) has murdered someone in a fit of narcissistic rage - that has built up for years before that and gone unnoticed because they're so well able to hide it - with "appearances" ie: jekyll/hyde fashion. They rely on people's ignorance and gullability re: appearances.

Usually the one person closest to them (kids or spouse or family) knew about their dangerous personality - but to the public - it's a big surprise when they finally do their worst.

People need to wise up & get a clue.

[Odin2005]

58. Doesn't "femicidal" imply "misogynistic"?

Anyway, I can sum this sad, sick incident with a single phrase: "The guy was a bitter asshole".

[Ichingcarpenter]

63. Everyone else killed or wounded was collateral damage

He shot a child first at the door, in the face, then a man in the back next.

They were just collateral damage and not relevant

[LisaL]

67. He is accused of killing men and women.

What, dead men don't count?

[Spectral Music]

81. It's interesting that he went after the in-laws

Even OJ didn't do that.

[Recursion]

83. They weren't there NT

[Crabby Appleton]

91. Pardo killed 4 males & 5 females, plus himself.

Believed killed were Pardo's ex-wife, her parents, two of her brothers and their wives, a nephew and a sister.