We "lost" New Orleans, we're close to losing Detroit, then there's CA & OH...

[elehhhhna]

How many cities (states, even) will Bush & Congress destroy through their "policies" --lol -- and prideful ignorance?

[Captain Hilts]

1. We lost the North because the North and coast hugely subsidize the South and Central states. nt

[CBGLuthier]

3. That's It. keep it up

If we don't have each other to hate whatever will we do?

[ColbertWatcher]

13. Hate? I don't think the South hates the North and the coasts, they're just dependent. n/t

[NaturalHigh]

6. Right, it's all our fault.

Maybe you could come up with a way to blame us for sick kittens as well.

[Captain Hilts]

7. Alaska gets back $1.84 for every $ they send to DC. NJ gets $.67, NH $.72...

[AZ Criminal JD]

8. Bullshit

The reason southern and western states "receive" federal money is because most of the land is owned by the federal government (Most of Alaska is owned by the feds since that is the example you are using). So the money the feds spend on maintaining those lands and the structures on them and personnel on them, including military, is counted as the states "receiving" federal funds. Sorry to burst your bubble although you still have one in your head.

[elehhhhna]

9. rude much? golly.

[AZ Criminal JD]

11. You call me rude?

Read post #1. Classic.

[elehhhhna]

15. You're welcome to debunk misinformation but that would require

posting facts, maybe a link, perhaps some backup so we know you aren't just angrily talking out your hat.

If what you say is true, I'd love to see some form of proof -- as I'm fairly well informed on a variety of issues but completely unaware of the claims you've made.

[AZ Criminal JD]

20. I will when the poster provides his or her facts

They provided no link, just assertions. And they did not say what the $1.84 is comprised of. They seem to be implying it is welfare payments of some sort since they used the word "subsidizes". So let's see them break that down. That will never happen, never does.

[elehhhhna]

22. lol. fine.

[Captain Hilts]

30. From the US Dept. of the Census

http://www.nemw.org/taxburd.htm

[AZ Criminal JD]

32. As I said a meaningless link

Your link does not give any information about the breakdown of the spending. Where is this money going to? You don't want money to go to the West and the South? Then get them to sell off all the federal land they own.

[DainBramaged]

23. I love it when some snarky-ass know it all asks for proof

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/266.html

By the way, Alabama gets $1.66 (ranked 7th) for every $1 in taxes. And do not give me that crap about military bases. NJ has Fort Dix and Picatinny arsenal, and the state is the size of 1/3 of Virginia.

When the new Senate takes over, the welfare being sent to the Red States is going to change, and maybe those folks will "get off the dole".


And NJ is 50th @ $.61.


New Mexico is #1 at $2.03. That too will end.

[Statistical]

24. Military bases are expensive so is the equipment that goes in them

Fort Dix. Seriously? I mobilized out of there (national guard). It is remnant of the cold war. 12th mountain is stationed there and that is about it. Giant 99% empty base. It is soo empty that NJ uses part of the land to house prisoners. No I'm not making it up.

Compare that to Virginia. Norfolk Naval base is the largest naval facility (civilian or military) anywhere in the world! Even the Soviet Union didn't have a naval facility that large at the height of the cold war.

Then where are a large number of the subs, ships, carriers built and refit at.... just down the Chesapeake Bay in Newport News shipyard.

So the # provided are skewed by things like "common defense". The naval facilities in Virginia don't protect Virginia only. I am not saying we should be spending that much on defense (likely Dept of Navy could see some serious cuts), however including those $$$ as if they are welfare is not exactly accurate.

So IF someone could find a set of # that excludes:
military spending
veteran spending (why should one state be "penalized" if they have more vets)
Social Security & Medicare spending
Any other "US a whole" programs

I would be interested to see if such a large discrepancy exists. Maybe we could look at just list of "pork" (earmarks) vs federal taxes.

[DainBramaged]

25. Yup, keep trying to explain away those numbers

How come there wasn't this problem until Booshe took over? How many military bases are there in Louisiana? Oh wait I have the number, three. Fort Polk Joint Readiness Training Center, Barksdale Air Force Base, New Orleans Naval Air Station - Joint Reserve Base. You trying to tell me those three little bases justify the citizens of Louisiana getting $1.78 a person? How about Alaska? How about New Mexico? Kentucky???


Your explanation doesn't fly, it's pork plain and simple. But thanks for once again standing up for the Red States!

[Statistical]

26. I don't know about all the states. I agree there is WAY to much pork.

I only know about VA. BTW VA has a Dem gov, picked up a Dem Senator, and voted for Obama.

At the very least I would say VA is purple now. :7

So I am just saying that not ALL states with "revenue" > $1.00 are equal.

The Dept of Navy budget in 2008 was $140B + $20B supplemental for "global war on terror".

What share of that did bases and shipbuilding in VA get? I don't have a clue. But my SWAG would be 20%-25% seeing as about 1/3 of entire US fleet is located in Norfolk and the surrounding naval bases.

Virginia is also home to the new F-22 Raptor Squadron at $11 billion ea.

So? I am just saying $30B - $40B in defense spending coming into the state MIGHT throw the numbers off slightly. Don't you think it is even possible? :hide:

Now some states like AK pork is a full time career. I am just saying it isn't exactly fair to look at TOTAL SPENDING and include things like DEFENSE spending + cost of VETERANS + SOCIAL SECURITY receipts (retirees are not equally distributed across the 50 states).

[Statistical]

27. I found it (well one estimate): $54B

DOD spending in Virginia for 2008 was $54 Billion.

http://www.virginiabusiness.com/index.php/news/article/virginia-weighs-its-dependence-on-defense-spending/1829/

That works out to about $7,100 per person in VA. That "might" throw any numbers off that don't account for that.

EDIT:

So I figured I could figure how much it is - DOD spending IF I knew how much VA receives.

So here goes:
http://www.nemw.org/fundsrank.htm (same figures you provided but expanded shows per capital $$ amount)

VA received $12,583 per person in federal spending.
VA received $1.51 in federal spending per $1.00 in federal taxes.

$12,583 / $1.51 = $8,333 in federal taxes

VA has 7.6 million residents and $54B in DOD spending = $7,105 per person.

SO $12,583 total spending per person - $7,105 DOD spending = $5,478 in non DOD spending per person.

$5,478 / $8,333 = $0.66 in non DOD federal spending per $1.00 in federal taxes.

I think the DOD budget needs to come down... a lot and VA would share in that decrease but right I think this shows how DOD or other "national projects" can affect the spending / taxes figure.

[Thothmes]

29. That is the way it should be.

those that make 100,000 dollars a year should pay taxes to aid those that make 15,000 a year. The California Economy produces much more wealth the Alabama. Therefore California has an obligation to assist Alabama in things like Medicaid,AFDC, education, Health and human services. Just like we should tax the rich to aid the poor.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Kalyke]

33. You realize, of course, that most Southerners don't know about this.

They don't have a clue; therefore, it rates as a big "na-da" when it comes time for folks to factor it into their voting habits.

In other words, people don't vote the way they do because of this statistic because most people don't have a clue that it even exists.

[AZ Criminal JD]

34. Southerns and Westerners do realize the federal government owns too much land

In those regions. We don't like it. That is where this meaningless statistic comes from. Let them sell off the land.

[ensho]

2. add W. Va. it just had its final trashing and is now a toxic State

with their beautiful mountains destroyed, streams forever ruined

human life full of cancers

[Lorien]

4. I'm still stunned that any human being could be OK with destroying a

MOUNTAIN, let alone everything else around it. The only thing those people worship is profit, because they surely can't consider themselves "good stewards of the earth" or "respectful of God's creation".

[global1]

5. You Know - Senator Byrd - Needs To Share Some Of The Blame For W.V.....nt

[elehhhhna]

10. googleearth it -- hideous. stripmined flat.

[undeterred]

12. What are you talking about, specifically?

[live love laugh]

14. About destitute deserted cities. Been to Detroit lately? nt

[undeterred]

16. Nope.

Only ran through the airport a few times, but it was years ago.

[lonestarnot]

17. And TN now going to have to go thirsty.

[Orsino]

18. I guess it's the rest of us that * has supposedly kept safe...

...with his trillion-dollar spending orgy?

[lonestarnot]

19. Rest of us? hmmmmmf, unemployed and homeless rest of us and he's still on fucking vacation!

[Phred42]

21. and Tennessee just got burried by TVA

[northernlights]

28. Pardon my ignorance, but why does DC

get $5.55 of every dollar paid? And why did they list them as n/a instead of a huge #1 ?!!1!

[AZ Criminal JD]

35. Because the federal government owns most of the land in DC

That is why these statistics mean nothing. The represent federal salaries and ownership costs of the land. It does not represent money or benefits going to residents.