War pawns ask: "Will I ever be the person I once liked?"

[ConsAreLiars]

A PBS doc (Soldiers of Conscience) included a soldier asking this, and much more. Watch it if you can. Killing another human is, for most humans (not the "elite" who simply issue the orders), the worst evil possible. And the immediacy of that evil is more apparent and harder to avoid for those who are a part of the invading forces. Not the defenders, who can claim some bit of honor in such acts. Those who, at a gut level, know they murdered for no noble cause suffer more than most can imagine. Some go suicidal. Some say nothing and just try to survive. Some turn into belligerent deniers and hatemongers. But they are all victims of the same unjust war that claimed the lives of those they killed.

Pity them. Pity those they killed. Pity us for failing to failing to keep the Monsters from making war.

[wildbilln864]

1. k&r! nt

:cry:

[Smith_3]

2. So how about laying down arms and refusing to obey orders?

:shrug:

[ConsAreLiars]

5. I don't believe in blaming the victims of a war they did not cause.

I'm pretty sure none were assigned Zinn's "People's History of the US" in High School, and doubt you read it either. Your 'holier than thou" posturing seems a bit shallow, at best. Among the most decent and admired people I have known were Vietnam vets. They knew what they had done, but went on, some just trying to return to some semblance of normalcy, others became passionate antiwar activists. Your smug ignorance really misses the point completely.

[Smith_3]

6. Vietnam vets were drafted. And no, I didn't read that book you mention. n t

[Smith_3]

10. Question: Do you think soldiers who went AWOL during the Iraq war should be punished?

:shrug:

[aquart]

7. I'm sure you would, dear. I'm sure you would.

And I'm convinced there wouldn't be a dry eye when you explained why you were willing to let your fellow soldiers die because you couldn't shoot someone who was shooting at them.

It's all so simple when you're clean and dry.

[Smith_3]

9. Its simple with a little foresight.

You only have to watch a few movies to anticipate what situations might arise if you sign up. Especially with an administration like this. That's why I chose not to. The situation you describe is only the endpoint of a long series of decisions that a person made.

[TahitiNut]

13. "Watch a few movies"??

:rofl: :rofl:

You really don't have a fucking clue! Not one. It's astonishing that anyone could say something so totally inane.

Wow. Your life expectancy in a combat zone under fire would probably be about 30 seconds, son. Hell... you might not have even made it out of basic training alive.

We had some folks not quite as disconnected as you in Nam ... may they rest in peace.

[Loudmxr]

3. Unfortunately we will have to deal with their anguish for many years to come.

Lets make sure all of our vets get the health care and treatment they need.!! :patriot:

[aquart]

8. Their anguish and their anger.

And they know how to shoot.

If Congress can't be convinced to help for any decent reason, let them remember that.

[Swamp Rat]

4. MANY end up homeless in the USA, living in the streets and alleys.

Except for the elite, like John McCain, almost all of our veterans do not get the full medical treatment or financial recompense for their service.

SHAME on George W. Bush!

[no_hypocrisy]

11. I've seen this poison literally destroy a man from the inside out.

Drafted, didn't volunteer. 1967. Vietnam. Special Unit. Purpose: to assassinate. Not merely to "protect" the squad or platoon. Along the lines of "Apocalypse Now". Secret missions.

War over. Numerous breakdowns. Tried to return to civilian life with job, wife, family, house, etc., but never kept a job or developed a career.

Alcoholism. Lost wife, house, family, job. Homeless. Family literally scraped him off the street, tried to intervene. Failure. Poor health. 120 pounds, 5'9". Now 61. Can remember events 40 years ago, can't remember yesterday.

Unconscious, but no restful sleep. Nightmares. Even when awake. Rage. Not at this administration. At Clinton. He "disgraced" the White House b/c he got a BJ.

Loves guns and "America". Has no problem with assassination of president elect.

Qualifies for veterans home, but no room at the inn. Family in quandry re. whether to continue paying his rent when his savings are exhausted. Can't work -- disabled but won't file for benefits as he sees it as "welfare" and that's . . . bad.

One war, one life that continues w/o meaning.

[ConsAreLiars]

12. Yes.

Many are destroyed completely. Many more are "merely" dehumanized. McVeigh was one extreme. More just turn to hate of the "other" and blind jingoism in order to keep up the pretense that what they participated in was somehow justifiable, and mask their symptoms with rhetoric. They are victims as well.