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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:15 PM
Original message
Patrick Fitzgerald Will Work for Food
I. Patrick Fitzgerald Really Wants a Job in the New Administration

Patrick Fitzgerald is one slick customer. He does not want fame. He does not want glory. He does not want to be Obama’s new attorney general. He does not even want a permanent position investigating Democratic politicians in the new president’s home state of Illinois. All he is asking for is ninety days to bring the most reviled politician in America to justice.

Surely, President-elect Barack Obama can spare him that? I mean, what will it cost him?

http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/Fitzgerald-Wants-Blago-Indictment-Extension.html

U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald on Wednesday asked for more time to return an indictment against the governor, saying the time is needed to review evidence and interview more potential defendants in the corruption investigation.

Under law, federal prosecutors normally have 30 days to file an indictment against a defendant. That deadline would have been Jan. 7, and the 90-day extension Fitzgerald wants would give prosecutors until April 7 instead.

Snip

In Wednesday's motion, prosecutors ask for more time to review phone calls intercepted between late October and early December and say they need to interview more witnesses.

"Multiple witnesses have come forward in recent weeks to discuss their knowledge of criminal activity in relation to the ongoing investigation," according to the motion.

The document also hints at the possibility that more individuals could be charged.


Excuse me? I thought that Blago was arrested, because the feds had already reviewed phone calls intercepted between late October and early December. The media circus which Fitz staged----all that talk about Lincoln rolling in his grave---what did he base that on,if not on the wiretaps? Is Fitz trying to tell us that when he arrested Blago he did not have a case? Then why the perp walk? Why the public condemnation? Why tell us the man was guilty of the worst political crimes ever?

I want to go back to what Fitzgerald actually said in public about Blago. The New York Times has a handy summary.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/13/opinion/13coburn.html?_r=1

Against this backdrop, it is hard to feel comfortable with Mr. Fitzgerald’s remarks in announcing the charges that Mr. Blagojevich’s conduct amounted to a “political corruption crime spree” and “would make Lincoln roll over in his grave,” that “the breadth of corruption laid out in these charges is staggering,” that Mr. Blagojevich “put a ‘for sale’ sign on the naming of a United States senator” and that his conduct was “cynical” and “appalling” and has “taken us to a truly new low.”


American politics has always been dirty. I have not seen anything out of Illinois to compare to the crimes of the Nixon administration or the current Bush administration or other corrupt Republicans. For instance, did Blago slip LSD to his political opponents? Did he sell our national parks? Did he negotiate a hostages for votes deal? Did he let pedophiles prey on kids in a state facility under his watch? A lot of people at DU assumed that Fitz had the evidence to back those words up. Now, he tells us that he will have the evidence to back them up---in ninety days. He tells us that lots of witnesses have come forward to rat out Blago, now that he has been labeled the most corrupt politician in America by Patrick Fitzgerald---

People who use their minds sometimes, instead of just their hearts will see where I am going with this. The original indictment of Blagojevich and Patrick Fitzgerald’s over the top condemnation followed by the media trial and conviction were staged for a reason. Once the press convinced the public that Blago’s fall was inevitable, Fitz was able to encourage the governor’s political enemies to step forward to testify against him. Also, people who might not have been willing to get involved in a federal prosecution of a fellow Democrat suddenly decided that it was better to cover themselves by telling everything they knew in advance in order to avoid being named by someone else.

Fitz used the Gang of Four strategy straight out of Communist China.

The original indictment was only half an indictment. It was half a fishing expedition, and the press and even Democrats aided Fitzgerald by falling for his “worse corruptions in the history of mankind” spiel. Fitz made Blago the most hated politician in America---and now he is appealing to the American public to force Obama to let him keep his job on the grounds that the most hated politician in America must not be allowed to walk free---

And only Fitz can bring him to justice.

This is better than a Will Work for Food sign. This is like a If You Do Not Give Me Work, Jesus Will Damn You to Hell For All Eternity sign.

II. Why Other People May Want Fitz to Have a Job in the New Administration

The parallels between this case and Whitewater continue to grow. While Blago was initially charged with attempting to sell a Senate seat, there are hints that this case may widen to include other people and other charges. In the end, will there be any indictments in the case at all? Or, is this investigation being used for other reasons?

Karl Rove and the Republicans continue to resist the attorney general nomination of Eric Holder. Even before Patrick Fitzgerald announced that he was going to attempt to make this a never ending investigation, they were tossing around the idea that Holder had a conflict of interest regarding Blagojevich.

http://nalert.blogspot.com/2008/12/would-new-ag-eric-holder-exit-chicago.html

We know that Congressional Republicans plan to bring up Elian Gonzales and Marc Rich. Big deal. Blagojevich will be a bigger deal. If Fitz can announce that Eric Holder is one of the people of interest in his investigation, Karl Rove will be able to keep him out of the attorney general’s spot. It does not have to be true. Fitz lied about Blago being the most corrupt politician in the history of America. He could lie about Holder being a person of interest in his investigation. People who lie about one thing will lie about another.

The investigation also helps the GOP in their effort to turn this into a Republican senate seat. With Franken the likely winner in Minnesota, their party is going to lose its filibuster power (Collins and Snowe are unlikely to obstruct necessary social measures). One more conservative Republican could mean the difference between health care, jobs and social reforms----and none of the above. Note that Fitz announced that he needed ninety more days the day after Blago selected former Illinois Attorney General Roland Burris to fill Obama’s vacant senate seat. If Blagojevich stays in office while Fitz drags his heels, neither taking him to trial nor clearing him, he will be unable to appoint a Democrat to replace Obama. Eventually, Illinois will have to hold a special election. With Fitz in the middle of an ongoing fishing expedition in which any Democrat can become a target at any moment simply by expressing an interest in Obama’s seat, we will probably see no major Democrat run and the Republicans will snatch up the seat. Remember, no matter what you think about Fitzgerald himself, he has a staff, some of whom may be quite political.

Finally, this case could be an end in itself. Whitewater II. Fitz has job security. Under the next Republican administration, he becomes Attorney General or a judge. All he has to do is not look like Ken Starr as he plays the role of greek Fury, giving Barack Obama four years of grief.

III. Obama is NOT Painted Into a Corner

President-elect Barack Obama is the boss. He is smarter than Patrick Fitzgerald. He has not been painted into a corner.

Continue to denounce and reject the most "corrupt" politician in America. Continue to express confidence in Fitzgerald. Tell Holder to recuse himself from the Blago case. Start an investigation into politically motivated prosecutions by the Bush DOJ, beginning with Don Siegelman. Change the federal teams prosecuting all cases of political corruption----Democrats and Republicans---because of the pattern of political bias in the Bush DOJ to ensure that each defendant gets a fair trial. Sure, it will slow things down, but it will make sure that no Dems are being railroaded and no Republicans are being cake walked. Offer Fitzgerald a job prosecuting terrorism cases on the east coast. It is where he started out. He can prosecute Osama Bin Laden once Obama catches him as well as all the Gitmo cases that have to be moved to federal court. He will just love that.

Pay Fitzgerald in pizzas.
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Saturday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
1. That's what happens when you don't wait for the person...
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 04:33 PM by yadayadayada
to commit the crime. Fitzgerald isn't as smart as he thinks even now that he's had the media convict Blago with no trial.

ETA: Regards the rest of the scenario re: Fitz, it's too deep for me to comprehend.
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DailyGrind51 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. Let's wait for the grand jury to make its decision before we make our
own conclusions! Blago's own father-in-law and political mentor, Richard Mell, wrote him off long before this, and he knows him better than any of us.

http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/February-2008/Mr-Un-Popularity/
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. oh no we can`t do that cause we have`t a clue about our state...
how many years did it take fitz to take down ryan and 50 some convictions. the republican party here still has`t recovered.


oh well
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 08:58 AM
Response to Reply #8
60. Well, the real scandal is what's *legal*.
Edited on Fri Jan-02-09 08:59 AM by Orsino
We already have de facto bribery of public officials in campaign contributions. Anyone like Blagojevich who wallows in the gray areas is probably very corrupt, but getting even an indictment is a challenge.

Fitzgerald may or may not be weak, but the law sure as hell is.
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Saturday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Yes, let's wait for the grand jury and possible trial before we convict him.
And I'm sure every FIL in the world gets along well with their SIL. Blago is the only one who doesn't. :sarcasm:
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alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. His father-in-law is a bigger crook than he is!
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 05:42 PM by alcibiades_mystery
:rofl:

he wrote him off because Blago was playing a different grift and not kicking up to Mello. Gimme a break.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:27 PM
Response to Original message
2. I thought of the Siegelman case...
and how very easy it is to convict somebody through the media. That was one hell of a show that Fitz put on. He's already been found guilty. I wonder how guilty Governor Siegelman was, after those corruption charges were brought and before he went to trial. Makes me sick.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
37. Yes, it's another political case by the most corrupt Justice dept in history.
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The Wizard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
3. He also had Rove in his sights
and let him off the hook, and Rove committed a treasonous act for which he could be executed.
Now what was that about taking us to a new low?
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alfredo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
40. the stone wall held in the Rove case. Libby was the one person that could
put them all away. Clemency was given most likely because he threatened to tell all if allowed to serve his sentence. They didn't pardon because he would have been compelled to testify.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
4. Fitzgerald couldn't convict Charlie Manson of being ugly.
He's an idiot.
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alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. ROFL
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 05:42 PM by alcibiades_mystery
:thumbsup:

DUzy!!!
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. He's the most overrated US Attorney in the history of the country.
His handling of the entire Plame matter was nothing short of gross negligence, compounded by rampant cowardice. The way he walked away from pursuing Bush, Cheney, Rove and others was appalling.

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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #21
42. Victoria Toensing, is that you? n/t
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. He's the only person who actually indicted Osama bin Laden
Look it up.

In the meantime, you might want to ask the parents of the six dead kids who were killed as a result of the pay-for truck licensing investigation if they were relieved Governor Ryan will actually have to pay for his crimes.

Julie
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
6. do you actually follow what is happening in chicago?
i won`t bore you with the details and i`ll overlook your hatred for fitzgerald and say this. fitzgerald has one guy singing his heart out and rezko is ready to join the chorus and that`s why rezko sentencing has been postponed.
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onethatcares Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. remember when we waited for "Fitzmas"?
weren't we basically waiting for the same thing to happen, all those deep throat people that gave testimony and we saw where that ended up. Karl Rove is doing talk shows.

BTW, I'm working at the present time and I don't have time to follow all the details of everything going on, but I don't think a public indictment should have been made without first presenting the evidence to a grand jury.

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Saturday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Yes I remember Fitzmas. Excellent post. nt
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. fitzgerald told the appropriate house and senate committees
that he would turn over -all the information- from the grand jury. he was limited in the scope of his grand jury to pursue other indictments. he is not hampered by washington politics in this investigation in illinois.

it was unfortunate that his hand was forced by what he heard on those tapes. but the upside is rezko is willing to sing along with another guy(forgot his name)
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. He lied. Mukasey said Fitz's record of Cheney/Bush won't get turned over to Congress.
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1202427076527&rss=newswire

Said that if Bush/Cheney thought that they might be held accountable for their actions they would never have pretended to do along with the pretend investigation.

It was all a sham.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Why does that mean that Fitzgerald lied? It sounded to me like Mukasey made the
call on behalf of Bush/Cheney--not Fitzgerald.

Also, I'm not a lawyer, so maybe someone can clear this up for me. If Fitzgerald is getting more dirt and more witnesses and more evidence in the case by waiting, isn't that smarter and better for a conviction than going ahead right now with what he had before even if it was pretty strong stuff? Also, if Fitzgerald has other songbirds who are willing to sing, won't that put the spotlight on other players who are a corrupting influence in Illinois/Chicago politics? And isn't that a good enough reason to get an extension?

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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #12
29. Fitzpatrick is the biggest coward of this century.
Never has any prosecutor done so little with such a huge case.

He's pathetic.
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #12
35. really? mulasey said he would`t allow fitzgerald to turn over the records
so where`s the sham? why did`t the cowards in the senate and house force the issue?
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #35
43. Don't let the facts get in the way of a good hate-on
I'm fairly sure that Patrick Fitzgerald could cure cancer singlehandedly and the referenced poster would never admit he'd done a good thing.

Julie
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. but it was stated at the..
...press conference that the allegations Rezko made were not substantiated. I guess that is why he was urging anyone that had dealings with the Governor to come forward. It reminds me of this:

The 2004 trial
On May 27, 2004, Siegelman was served an indictment on federal charges, but the day after his trial began, prosecutors abruptly dropped all charges. The judge threw out much of the prosecution's evidence and stated that that no new charges could be refiled based on the disallowed evidence.

On October 26, 2005, Siegelman was indicted on new charges of bribery and mail fraud in connection with Richard M. Scrushy, founder and former CEO of HealthSouth. Two former Siegelman aides were charged in the indictment as well. Siegelman was accused of trading government favors for campaign donations when he was governor from 1999 to 2003 and lieutenant governor from 1995 to 1999.


http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/don_siegelman/
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #7
22. Yes, Fitz would have convicted Al Capone of jay walking and let it go.
He blew the case of the century, mainly because he was so cowardly.

He needs to be fired with all the other Bush hacks.
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earcandle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
50. I agree, but temember it was only a complaint, not an indictment.
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
16. Pssttt...the original complaint wasn't an indictment.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 06:22 PM by Jim Sagle
This has been pointed out to you before, and you've never corrected it. It hurts your case, or at least your presentation.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #16
24. You work for the Bush DOJ? Your argument hurts your credibility. Sounds like
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 09:14 PM by McCamy Taylor
you are presenting a case in a court of law. I am responding to the case Fitz presented to the court of public opinion. He arrested Blago. He had 30 days to indict him. Now he wants 90 more days to indict him. The correct procedure would have been to present the evidence to a Grand Jury and see if they wanted to indict him, but for some reason Fitz bypassed this step. Why? Either he was rushed for time or he did not think that the Grand Jury would indict with the evidence he had. Take your pick. In either case, Fitz did not play by the rules. He did not prosecute the crime, he prosecuted the individual. It was wrong when the SCOTUS ruled based on the parties of the case in Bush v. Gore and it is wrong when the DOJ indicts based on the IDs of the parties in the case. I am looking forward to seeing the current crop of political DOJ lawyers lose their law licenses en masse. The Bush DOJ is the biggest organized criminal racket this side of the Mafia. Fitz is the most over hyped crime fighter since Captain Amazing in Mystery Men
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Jim Sagle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. No, I don't work for w or his DOJ. And I agree with your overall case.
I'm simply stating that Fitz filed a complaint, not an indictment. And that's the truth. And now you've finally acknowledged it. That wasn't so hard, was it?
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #24
33. Oh, Fitz talks BIG, but he's weak.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 10:37 PM by TexasObserver
All that big talk about all that incriminating evidence, but he can't even do his job in the 30 days he has under the law.

He ought to be taken before the bar for trying his case in public, for his hideous conduct, and for his failure to back up his public statements with an indictment. He's a typical Republican hack.
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RB TexLa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:24 PM
Response to Original message
17. How do you tell a US Attorney is lying? Their lips are moving.
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. You've got quite the set, don't you?
Please. Go to Chicago and call Patrick Fitzgerald a liar to his face, or the hundreds of people who've worked with him and say that he doesn't lie.

I'm thinking it could be the most entertaining thing that'll happen in 2009.

Julie
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
23. Isn't Fitz the guy who gave Bush and Cheney the free pass ????
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. Fitz blew a case bigger than Watergate or Iran-Contra.
The best that can be said of his cheerleaders is they're woefully ignorant.
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. Hey, TexasObserver, I'm sure I've forgotten more about the Libby trial than you'll ever know
You might want to take yourself off to www.firedoglake.com and do a bit of reading. They've covered Patrick Fitzgerald's career exhaustively. The site is also run by a former federal prosecutor. Then again, I'm sure you know much more on all subjects than she does. :sarcasm: Here's a good example: Bush and Cheney were never going to be tried in that venue. The ONLY way they will be tried is to let Congress handle it because of the greymail issues. Patrick Fitzgerald left them breadcrumbs the size of baguettes; they ignored it.

Julie
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #27
31. I see the FITZ FAN CLUB is out in force.
Edited on Wed Dec-31-08 10:47 PM by TexasObserver
They all have one thing in common. None of them knows the first thing about the LAW, and what constitutes good prosecution practices.

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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #31
41. Really, Texas Observer?
Why don't you share with us what YOU know about the LAW, and "what constitutes good prosecution practices"?

While you're at it, why don't you skip over to www.firedoglake.com and engage either Christy Hardin Smith or Jane Hamsher on the subject? I'm sure they'd have a few thoughts for you as well. Then again, I'm fairly sure that'll happen when Hell freezes over. After all, it's waaaaay more fun to be a self-proclaimed expert, isn't it?

Julie
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Garbo 2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #27
63. And what happened to the Iran-Contra case? Did Walsh blow that too? nt
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. No. He prosecuted 14 GOP admin officials and convicted 11.
Edited on Fri Jan-02-09 02:11 PM by TexasObserver
Bush I pardoned them, but Walsh did his job by prosecuting and getting convictions.

Walsh did what he was supposed to do. Fitz didn't. He was a complete and utter failure, which is likely why he was chosen for the job.
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Garbo 2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #64
65. But Walsh's investigation did not go all the way. By his own account he wasn't done & the pardons
& stonewalling left him unable to go after others including the big fish.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #65
67. Walsh did all he could do. He nailed Cap Weinburger, Sec of Defense.
Walsh went after some of the top people and indicted them. The National Security Adviser, the Sec of Defense, an Under Secretary, and several others.

There is no comparision between the good job Walsh did and the pathetic, anemic, cowardly performance of Fitzpatrick.
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
26. Blago is far from the most corrupt politician in America.
A month ago, nobody outside IL had ever heard of him. We've got lots of people in Congress who are worse than he is. And he hasn't been convicted of anything.
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live love laugh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #26
34. ...And yet he has been the subject of national news for two weeks while Bush is not mentioned.
Why people don't see the disparity here is beyond me. I guess I will have to be content with knowing that I can see it.
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IsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #34
55. Got me hanging. But don't forget the troll factor either. This place is like Oz land sometimes.
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iconicgnom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
28. zzzzzzzzzzz....
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
32. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-31-08 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. he created "the blackwater" ?
what is "the blackwater"?
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #36
44. The Blagojevich scandal has the potential to become the "Blackwater"
of the Obama administration.

The oligarchs could use this the same way they used Blackwater against the Clintons. The charges in Blackwater, like here, were baseless, but were "smelly" and complicated enough--and there was enough actual or perceived wrongdoing by others to keep the issue alive long enough--to constantly nag at the administration. The oligarchy's media servants will constantly be on TV and writing Op Ed pieces asking what Obama knew or didn't know or what he did or didn't do or how his staff behaved or what his true relationship behind the scenes was with Blagojevich or how the "cesspool" of Chicago politics links them and tarnishes Obama's credibility. This is a scab they will pick for the next four or eight years. And it's all delivered courtesy of the guy who inoculated cheney and bush in the Plame affair.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. Whitewater?? or is it my memory that's failing?
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. your memory is good.
mine sucks. LOL Whitewater.
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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #32
57. "Middle-aged spinsters"?
You think a lot of women, don't you?

In the meantime, I know this will crush you, but I am married.
Julie
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tinrobot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
38. This whole thing stinks to high heaven.
If Fitzgerald had the goods, there would be an indictment by now.

Instead, we're either short one senator or putting a safe seat up to a popular vote. Either one gives the GOP an advantage.

Don't forget Fitzgerald is a Republican. This benefits his own party, not ours.
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Usrename Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
39. the most reviled politician in America
:rofl:


He's the kingpin, the mastermind behind the last eight years of government corruption.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 02:30 PM
Response to Original message
46. Seems to me that Fitzgerald did the country a favor by exposing Blag's attempt to
sell the seat. I'm not an attorney so I don't know the procedural elements of this but my opinion is that it's much better that we (the people of the United States) know NOW that the Governor of Illinois was going to sell a Senate seat to the highest bidder, rather than have it revealed AFTER that deal was signed, sealed and delivered and the Senator was seated.

I'm sure there is a hell of a lot more corruption going on out there, but starting with this Senate seat is a GREAT kickoff point to put the rest of the corrupt bastards on notice.

In the meantime, I'm willing to sit back and see how this unfolds. If McCamy is right about Fitzgerald I will admit that I was wrong. But someone please remind me 'cause my memory ain't as good as it used to be.

As far as the Libby case, Fitzgerald got his conviction. And, if my suspect memory serves me, he also established that Cheney was in on the Plame leak. Madrchsod's point about the Democrat-controlled house and Senate failing to force the issue seems legit to me.

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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #46
48. Normally you would wait until someone paid a bribe for the seat then nab both criminals
Edited on Thu Jan-01-09 02:57 PM by McCamy Taylor
and then you would have two criminals and an air tight case rather than one maybe criminal and no case that you have to ask for a 90 day extension on while you cross your fingers and pray that someone comes forward with some new evidence about some other matter.

If the feds were so sure that Blago was going to sell that seat, all they had to do was wait for a few weeks. Why did they jump the gun? There is a corrupt Democratic politician out there who would have paid money for a Senate seat who is walking free that Fitz did not protect us from. He did not do his job. Why not? Seems to me that they got worried that no one would pay for the seat, at which point the longer the wiretaps dragged on, the worse their case would get. I.e. it would fizzle, because some really good senate candidate would say "I want that seat but I am not paying" and Blago would come to his sense and say "OK, you can have it, because giving it to you will help my reputation". And then Fitz would have had nothing at all.

Which makes me wonder, was that seat ever really going to get sold at all? Or is all of Fitz's talk about the most corrupt politician in the history of America a bunch of hot air?

You know, Blago is going to go to trial (if this case ever gets that far) and say that he was just testing the candidates, to see what their ethics were like and that he never has any intention of taking any money. And depending upon what evidence is allowed in the courtroom, it might work, because Fitz pulled the plug on the investigation too soon.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. True. It's more evidence of Fitzpatrick being either incompetent, dirty or political.
I suspect he's incompetent and political, but not dirty.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #48
53. And, of course, the flip side of your argument is that waiting until the new Senator
was appointed, probably last week or this week, or maybe even next week, would have looked EVEN MORE like an attempt to point the dirty finger at the Democrats and Obama just days before the inauguration. What would have been characterized as a BushCo parting gift to Obama, and one that would probably have been much smellier and perhaps harder to clean up behind.

The other point, which just occurred to me, is that once negotiations/bidding for the Senate seat began and word got out through the upper-echelon Illinois Democratic grapevine, there is an even greater probability that some Obama staffer might have become a player in this drama and unwittingly brought Obama into the scandal; whereas, now his and his staff seem to be clear of this shitpile.

Bottom line: all of this is speculation until Blag's trial begins and we see if Fitzgerald jumped the gun or not.

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mistertrickster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
51. Dittos! I didn't see anybody in the current administration get frog marched
in front of cameras in the much more obvious case of the outing of Valerie Plame.

In fact, in retrospect, it seems like a very thorough investigation that was designed to go almost nowhere . . .
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earcandle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. Like Bush with the goat book
Edited on Thu Jan-01-09 03:40 PM by earcandle
his non verbal was not honest. 

like Paulson's non verbal is never honest.

non-verbal communication is so much louder than words.

I think it was staged because Blago could have become an
American hero
for throwing B of A business out of the state if they didn't
give those
workers their severance pay.

Yea... it is good to see them make mistakes and then get
exposed.  I hope
Blago and Burris win this one. 
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-01-09 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
54. Actually, I was going to say this pause reminded me of Ken Starr's . . .
Edited on Thu Jan-01-09 10:20 PM by defendandprotect
openly stating that he could find nothing on Clinton and was closing shop --

and then the new big push from the right-wingers to keep moving on until

he could create something.

And he finally did!


And, it's also causing me to rethink just how badly Fitz may have handled the

Scooter Libby/Outing of CIA's Plame ....

He may be trying to do penance here in going after the Illinois Guv --- ???

Not that I think Blago isn't an idiot, deranged and reckless . . .!!!


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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 07:07 AM
Response to Reply #54
58. Yes, Patrick Fitzpatrick = Ken Starr in this matter.
It is outrageous that Fitzpatrick pulled the stunt he did. First he has the early morning bust of the governor, something he never had the guts to do with Libby or the other traitors. Then he held a press conference where he selectively read alleged quotes from people other than the governor, as if those proved a crime. Then he piddles around until his time for getting an indictment is set to expire, and claims he needs more time.

He should be FIRED and replaced with someone who is competent, who is not a political tool for the Bush/Cheney faction, and who will view the evidence objectively.

He's a buffoon, at best.
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cstanleytech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 01:44 AM
Response to Original message
56. I dont think an extension should be granted, if Fitz was premature then
thats his own incompetence and that should be an excuse to extend his investigation, let someone else take over and get rid of him because at this point I just dont trust him.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #56
59. It should not be granted, and Fitz should be investigated for his misconduct.
US Attorneys are not supposed to try their cases in the media, and they're not supposed to arrest people they lack the evidence to indict. He did both. If he doesn't have enough evidence after three years of investigation and untold wire taps, he needs to join Ken Starr in the US ATTORNEY/SPECIAL PROSECUTOR HALL OF SHAME.
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Garbo 2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #59
66. And yet Blago's attorneys do not oppose the extension. n/t
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #66
68. Your comments are irrelevant. Fitz should never have filed charges if he wasn't ready to indict.
Edited on Fri Jan-02-09 10:41 PM by TexasObserver
The governors attorneys have their reasons for the positions they take, and they're irrelevant to the central issue, which is the chronic incompetence and petty politics of Fitzpatrick. They're also irrelevant to the legal point, which is that Fitz should never have filed charges if he wasn't ready to indict.

Face it, your boy Fitz is a major loser.





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D-Lee Donating Member (457 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
61. So far, McCamy Taylor has been right on projections on this one
Let's give credit where credit is due ...

Congrats!
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-02-09 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
62. why 90 days if he has the evidence...don't trust fitzgerald
they arrested him...they better have their evidence NOW
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