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Faryn Balyncd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 11:42 AM
Original message
Mandatory Insurance Is Worse than Status Quo...(anything less than Single Payer is a step BACKWARDS)
Edited on Mon Jan-12-09 11:47 AM by charles t


Pertinent observations of Dr. Steffie Woolhandler and Dr. David Himmelstein, co-founded Physicians for a National Health Program, and primary care physicians at Cambridge Hospital, Cambridge, Massachusetts:






MANDATORY INSURANCE IS WORSE THAN NONE AT ALL

By Steffie Woolhandler and David U. Himmelstein

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/september/health_reform_failur.php
The Boston Globe



IN 1966 - just before Medicare and Medicaid were launched - 47 million Americans were uninsured. By 1975, the United States had reached an all time low of 21 million without coverage. Now, according to the Census Bureau’s latest figures, we’re back where we started, with 47 million uninsured in 2006 - up 2.2 million since 2005. But this time, most of the uninsured are neither poor nor elderly.

The middle class is being priced out of healthcare. Virtually all of this year’s increase was among families with incomes above $50,000; in fact, two-thirds of the newly uncovered were in the above-$75,000 group. And full-time workers accounted for 56 percent of the increase, with their children making up much of the rest.

The new Census numbers are particularly disheartening for anyone hoping for a Massachusetts miracle. In the Commonwealth, 651,000 residents are uninsured, 65 percent more than the figure used by state leaders in planning for health reform. Their numbers came from a telephone survey done in English and Spanish. But that misses people who lack a land-line phone - 43.9 percent of phoneless adults are uninsured, according to other studies.

It also skips over the 523,000 non-English speakers in Massachusetts whose native language isn’t Spanish (e.g. Portuguese, Chinese, or Haitian-Creole), another group with a high uninsurance rate. In contrast, the Census Bureau goes door-to-door for its survey and has translators for almost every language. It gets a more complete picture.

In sum, Massachusetts health reform planners have been wishing away a quarter of a million uninsured people. Recent Patrick administration claims that health reform is succeeding are based on cooked books. According to the state’s figures, almost half of the previously uninsured gained coverage under the health reform bill by July 1. But according to the Census Bureau, the new sign-ups amount to less than one-quarter of the uninsured. Moreover, it’s likely that much of that gain has already been wiped out by shrinking job-based coverage - a longstanding and nationwide trend.

Why has progress been so meager? Because most of the promised new coverage is of the “buy it yourself” variety, with scant help offered to the struggling middle class. According to the Census Bureau, only 28 percent of Massachusetts uninsured have incomes low enough to qualify for free coverage. Thirty-four percent more can get partial subsidies - but the premiums and co-payments remain a barrier for many in this near-poor group.

And 244,000 of Massachusetts uninsured get zero assistance - just a stiff fine if they don’t buy coverage. A couple in their late 50s faces a minimum premium of $8,638 annually, for a policy with no drug coverage at all and a $2,000 deductible per person before insurance even kicks in. Such skimpy yet costly coverage is, in many cases, worse than no coverage at all. Illness will still bring crippling medical bills - but the $8,638 annual premium will empty their bank accounts even before the bills start arriving. Little wonder that barely 2 percent of those required to buy such coverage have thus far signed up.

While the middle class sinks, the health reform law has buoyed our state’s wealthiest health institutions. Hospitals like Massachusetts General are reporting record profits and enjoying rate increases tucked into the reform package. Blue Cross and other insurers that lobbied hard for the law stand to gain billions from the reform, which shrinks their contribution to the state’s free care pool and will force hundreds of thousands to purchase their defective products. Meanwhile, new rules for the free care pool will drastically cut funding for the hundreds of thousands who remain uninsured, and for the safety-net hospitals and clinics that care for them. (Disclosure - we’ve practiced for the past 25 years at a public hospital that is currently undergoing massive budget cuts.)

Health reform built on private insurance isn’t working and can’t work; it costs too much and delivers too little. At present, bureaucracy consumes 31 percent of each healthcare dollar. The Connector - the new state agency created to broker coverage under the reform law - is adding another 4.5 percent to the already sky-high overhead charged by private insurers. Administrative costs at Blue Cross are nearly five times higher than Medicare’s and 11 times those in Canada’s single payer system. Single payer reform could save $7.7 billion annually on paperwork and insurance profits in Massachusetts, enough to cover all of the uninsured and to upgrade coverage for the rest of us.

Of course, single payer reform is anathema to the health insurance industry. But breaking their stranglehold on our health system and our politicians is the only way for health reform to get beyond square one.



Dr. Steffie Woolhandler and Dr. David Himmelstein co-founded Physicians for a National Health Program and are primary care doctors at Cambridge Hospital.


Physicians for a National Health Program
29 E Madison Suite 602, Chicago, IL 60602
Phone (312) 782-6006 | Fax: (312) 782-6007 | email: info {at} pnhp.org








Although Obama believes in the ideal of a Single Payer healthcare system, of what significance are the appointments individuals with historical ties to the insurance industry (Daschle and Emmanuel)?

Will the insurance industry succeed in passage, not of Single Payer Healthcare, but of a de facto Mandatory Insurance scheme ("welfare for insurance companies") a la Massachusetts?



If predatory insurance companies (the same companies responsible for our fairy-tale medical pricing & "discount" system which now charges individuals who have been DENIED INSURANCE so-called "normal" rates that may be 250% - 400% (or perhaps 600%) higher than the still profitable "discounted" rates charged to insurance companies) cannot be defeated NOW, how much harder will it be to defeat this industry after it has been further enriched by the bonanza of mandatory insurance?



Will not a false, "incremental reform" (which mandates purchase of a defective, overpriced insurance product) actually make REAL REFORM (Single Payer Healthcare for All) even HARDER?

Will not the predatory insurers become even more financially entrenched?

Is not a system of "incremental" reform, which relies on a private insurance system supported by government mandates to purchase their defective product, actually a reactionary step which may make true reform (Single Payer Healthcare for All) much mor difficult, if not impossible?

Do Physicians for a National Health Program, and the http://www.guaranteedhealthcare.org/"> California Nurses Association, deserve to be heard?







Physicians for a National Health Program
29 E Madison Suite 602, Chicago, IL 60602
Phone (312) 782-6006 | Fax: (312) 782-6007 | email: info {at} pnhp.org







:kick:



:kick:



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tabbycat31 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. k&r
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frebrd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
2. K&R!
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1776Forever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
3. Medicaid HMOs better then nothing - but barely..
Finding out what the HMO run Medicaid was like in Florida was a real eyeopener! I thought when my son who developed progressive MS was given this after 2 years of not having any insurance he would be better off. Wrong! The Drs who will accept this small payment for each visit are for the most part under staffed and not up to par on most chronic diseases. So that leaves the Specialist who will take the Medicaid for 2 years just to get certified and then after that will not even see the patients who need them most. We need a complete reform in our health care system! I agree totally with the post! Little is as bad as none and the HMO's strangle the patient and the physician by keeping most of the payment - Read this just on CA HMO's:

A Billion Here, A Billion There: California HMO Figures Are a Challenge for Free-Market Health Advocates

June 24, 2008

http://sentineleffect.wordpress.com/2008/06/24/a-billion-here-a-billion-there-california-hmo-figures-are-a-challenge-for-free-market-health-advocates/

If the Free Market can cure all the ills in our health economy, why are we seeing billion-dollar expenditures for non-health items - even as prices soar and buyers rage? It looks like somebody has taken the Invisible Hand off the wheel.

The California Medical Association, which has its own ax to grind, is publicizing state data about HMO expenditures. (Remember HMOs? They’re the organizations that were going to improve outcomes while cutting costs.) According to data from the Department of Managed Health Care, California HMOs spent about $6 billion last year in administrative expenses - including seven-figure salaries for a number of CEOs.

Meanwhile large plans like CalPERS are facing 8% increases, while individual enrollees - the linchpin of consumer-oriented free market policies - are seeing increases in the 10% range.

If the market is really “rational,” as we’re always being told, why aren’t buyers forcing these overhead costs down?

Sen. Sheila Kuehl is quoted as saying that her bill, which mandates that plans spend no less than 85% of premiums on direct health costs, would have resulted in $1.1 billion more being spent on medical care. I need to read Sen. Kuehl’s bill in detail, but here’s my problem with the principle: The easiest was to get to that ratio is by increasing premiums, not reducing administrative expenses. Unless the bill prevents that, that’s the likeliest outcome - especially since market forces don’t appear to be doing the trick.

In the abstract sense, I don’t care how much profit HMOs make, if they’re getting the right results. If they can provide better health care at a lower premium cost, and make a 20% or 30% profit margin - great! Everybody wins. The problem is that there’s no indication that they can.

For balance, total California health spending is in the hundreds of billions, so we’re talking about marginal figures. But marginal or not, you save a billion here and a billion there and pretty soon you’re talking real money.

And a number of the state’s HMOs fall within Sen. Kuehl’s margins, including CIGNA at 94.3 percent, Inland Empire at93.1 percent, and Kaiser at 90.6 percent. Community-based LA Care clocks in at an impressive 97.1 percent.

But the question remains: If the market can’t get these escalating costs under control - even with administrative expenses in the $6 billion range - how can it be the stand-alone solution of the future?

.......

And remember who started all of this? Oh yes, Richard Milhouse Nixon:

http://www.habitablezone.com/currentevents/messages/473331.html

February 17, 1971
5:30 p.m.

Ehrlichman: "We have now narrowed down the vice president's problem on this thing to one issue and that is whether we should include these Health Maintenance Organizations like Edgar Kaiser's Permanente thing."

Nixon: "Now let me ask you...you know I'm not too keen on any of these damn medical programs."

Ehrlichman: "This is a private enterprise one."

Nixon: "Well that appeals to me."

Ehrlichman: "Edgar Kaiser is running this Permanente deal for profit and the reason he can do it...I had Edgar Kaiser come in, talk to me about this, and I went into some depth. All the incentives are toward less medical care. Because the less care they give them, the more money they make."

Nixon: "Fine."

Ehrlichman: "...and the incentives run the right way."

Nixon: "Not bad."
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
4. K & R
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
5. It would be great if Congress and POTUS listened to doctors and nurses
Edited on Mon Jan-12-09 12:41 PM by BrklynLiberal
instead of the insurance companies.
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. You dance with them what brung ya.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. I gotcha...very good point.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
6. ABSOLUTELY !!!
If the Centrist Democrats are successful at implementing a Republican Mandatory Private Insurance System and label it "Universal HealthCare (it is NOT), it will postpone or destroy any possiblity of a REAL Universal HealthCare system.

There is a PR campaign calling this "Baby Steps" or a "Step Forward".
It is NOT.
Mandatory For Profit Health Insurance is a step AWAY from REAL Universal HelathCare.

K&R 1000 times.


"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone


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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. Without a doubt and this is why the Massachusetts program is
failing and this is the program Tom Daschle supports.
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CreekDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
8. Not from an uninsured's point of view it isn't
if you are uninsured you are screwed, no two ways about it. single payer would be optimal, but if we aren't going to get it, insurance for the uninsured is better than nothing. and if the insurance is group healthcare coverage it may be quite good actually.

i say this as someone covered by a large group coverage with Blue Cross Blue Shield.

which brings up the political aspect of this argument. basically adding coverage for those who don't have it is easier than doing that AND changing coverage for those who already have it. and helping the former folks without impacting the latter is going to help the former more quickly --and those folks need it done quickly.

transitioning to single payer, while desirable should not been seen in the same timeframe as providing healthcare coverage (in some workable form) to those without it currently. because of the political issues involved with changing the system for those already covered, you will make those without coverage wait until an acceptable system is worked out for those already covered.
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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. As I understand it all mandatory coverage means is that you cannot get a job without insurance..
Without a job, how do you purchase insurance?

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area51 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #12
23. Great point.
This is one of the reasons why I was against H. Clinton; she spoke approvingly of the idea that people would have to show proof of medical insurance before being offered a job. Years ago, Newt Gingrich had come up with the insane idea that the reason why people don't have health insurance was because they were "too lazy" to purchase it, and he advocated a law forcing people to buy medical insurance. That to my understanding is MA law (RomneyCare, though it could also be called GingrichCare or HillaryCare). Insurance is the problem, not the solution.


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Pastiche423 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 05:15 PM
Response to Original message
9. K&R!
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
10. NBC had a short segment on the evening news
about how wonderful the Massachusetts mandatory insurance is. They're suppose have part II tomorrow night, I wonder if they'll show the downside of it. Based on what I saw tonight, I'm not optimistic.
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Jim Lane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
13. You write, " Although Obama believes in the ideal of a Single Payer healthcare system...."
I thought Obama's position during the campaign was against single-payer and in favor of mandates along the lines of the Massachusetts plan.

Single payer is certainly better but people would have no basis for accusing Obama of retreating from a promise if he refused to support it.
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. You are right
He didn't support single payer.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. He's not even in favor of "mandates". n/t
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ellacott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. He said that single payer would be ideal
And he thinks is plan is a way to transition to single payer.
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NorthCarolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #13
24. Obama did say Single Payer was a Better Option
and further indicated that "if we were starting from scratch" he would support it. Basically he was acknowledging in a clandestine manner that insurance interests are too entrenched in DC politics to eliminate them at this point.

Reality: Obama Has Consistently Said That If We Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System, But Now We Need To Build On The System We Have

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System. The New Yorker wrote, "'If you're starting from scratch,' he says, 'then a single-payer system'-a government-managed system like Canada's, which disconnects health insurance from employment-'would probably make sense. But we've got all these legacy systems in place, and managing the transition, as well as adjusting the culture to a different system, would be difficult to pull off. So we may need a system that's not so disruptive that people feel like suddenly what they've known for most of their lives is thrown by the wayside.'" New Yorker, 5/7/07


http://factcheck.barackobama.com/factcheck/2008/01/21/fact_check_obama_consistent_in.php
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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-09 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
15. I don't buy nothing being better than something in this area
We'll see. Equal to Congress, more affordable, fully transportable, and undeniable was how Obama pitched his plan and if he holds true then I'd say it IS a serious improvement over what we have now and that perfection is the enemy of the good.

I think we have to go single payer for economic reasons though. We need to lift that weight off our companies and remove the cuffs from our workers. Lots of people stick to jobs they hate over insurance and it makes you an indentured servant.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 12:04 AM
Response to Original message
16. Insurance Companies have to be OUT OF THE PICTURE because
there is no such thing as competition in their minds. Rates rise to great heights and they take advantage of everyone. They are also a financial drudge on the system, just look at Medicare, which is Government run... we do not need Insurance Companies. They just suck money. The money could go directly to covering everyone. I also want to complain that AARP has stuck it to the people, particularly the elderly, when they agreed to the "donut hole". I will consider Obama and everyone working on health care a failure if they go with Insurance Companies or any concept of Insurance.
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.... callchet .... Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
19. Work week ?
Does anybody have any data on what the work week of doctors looks like. Average hours worked , etc. Including specialists.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
20. Gibberish.
The article you posted was 8 paragraphs of why the current situation sucks, and one declarative sentence stating that universal health care with private insurance allowed to participate was bad, without any real explanation.

I'm all for single payer, but understand this. IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN SOON.

The only achievable and useful first step is to get (and keep) everyone insured. Everyone. Ideally, opting into the public insurance pool with a reasonable premium will be one of the options for citizens. At some point, insurance companies will not be able to compete with the public insurance and we'll have de-facto single payer with perhaps some privately run gap insurance options.

Obama is going to have to be pushed hard to deliver even this. Medical care should cost about half of what it does. Half of that overpayment can be attributed directly to the problem that people are uninsured. Once we've solved that problem, we can go after the overhead that private insurance adds to costs.
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ellacott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-09 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. Totally agree
Transitioning to single payer will not be quick and easy. Another cost that needs to be examined is the cost of malpractice insurance.
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