When there's too many women in an office

[Cruzan]

I’ve heard plenty of theories on why women undermine one another at work. Probably the most popular one is the scarcity excuse — the idea that there are too few spots at the top, so women at more senior levels are unwilling to assist female colleagues who could potentially replace them.

Another explanation is what I call the “D.I.Y. Bootstrap Theory,” which goes like this: “If I had to pull myself up by the bootstraps to get ahead with no one to help me, why should I help you? Do it yourself!”

Some people argue that women aren’t intentionally undermining one another; rather, they don’t want to be accused of showing favoritism toward other women.

Others contend that women mistreat one another because of hyperemotionality, leading them to become overly invested in insignificant nuances and causing them to hold grudges. I’ve encountered this phenomenon among women who feel personally assaulted when someone criticizes them or their ideas.

Research shows that, in general, women are the more empathetic sex and are by nature more attuned to their own and others’ feelings. This is a great advantage when dealing with the human complexities of the workplace. But there’s a downside: If women take things too personally when challenged or criticized, they are prone to overreaction. When that happens, there’s trouble.

And, of course, some people assert that while women compete quite ably on the sports field and in the classroom, they haven’t learned how to compete in a healthy way at the office. For example, men often handle their feelings of envy and jealousy with humor and a left-handed compliment: “I’m going to whip your butt on our sales goals this month.” Or, “Who’d you have to pay off for that promotion?” They deal with it, and they move on. Although considered perfectly acceptable for men in most business settings, this kind of banter is not as socially acceptable for women.

Full article

[BlooInBloo]

1. I've long since given up trying to explain why women do whatever women do.

:P

[jeff30997]

2. K&R

Great article,thanks.

[Peregrine Took]

3. I've worked in offices and libraries and the women in libraries, especially the

"old veterans" were absolute monsters - much more vicious than any women I worked with in 25 years of office work.

I'm referring to "head" or tenured librarians. Mean to the bone.

[jeff30997]

5. Strange?

All this talking about head and bone is having a strange tingling effect in my pelvic area.

Excuse me for a little moment while I take a brake to consult a Physician.

[distantearlywarning]

4. It's happened to me

I think this is the ugly little secret of feminism - that women AREN'T actually supportive and nurturing creatures, especially when it comes to so-called "sisterhood".

[BlooInBloo]

6. Not sure how much of a secret it is. After all, listening to girls in school rip on each other...

is one of the scarier experiences a person can have.

People say I can be harsh at times. Fuck that - I'm nowhere *near* high-school-girl-harsh.

(shudders)

[QueenOfCalifornia]

7. Working with

other women, for me, was TORTURE.

It is like a shark feeding frenzy -

"Ooooo, looks like you put on a few pounds over the holidays dear." and "Do you think at your age you should wear a skirt that short?" (I was 30) Those are just the typical comments...

Things get way worse.

My daughter who is 8 asked me the other day, "Why are the girls in our neighborhood so mean?" - They start early and they are vicious -

[arcadian]

8. The article is over-simplified and promotes a stereotype.

The fierce "dragon-lady". Ooooooo... Run and hide. The fact is, most people in business are assholes. Back stabbing and being a hardliner in business is a way of getting to the top and it's not gender specific.

[saltpoint]

9. But how many would be too many, exactly? I think, for example, that one

Phyllis Schaffly would be plenty.

Plenty.

On the other hand, you just couldn't have enough Barbara Boxers and Bella Abzugs and Harriet Tubmans.

[queenjane]

10. I'm a woman--and I agree with much of this

I work as an administrative assistant to faculty at a large private university. 3 years ago, all the faculty admins were put into a formal department, with an administrative manager (a woman) over us. Overnight, a coterie of women, many of whom had worked well together for 10 years or more, became a nest of vipers. Why? Because the female admin mgnr decided to make herself and her position more palatable by pitting us against one another, stoking the office equivalent of perpetual "cat fights". Tattling was encouraged, even rewarded. If someone didn't smile at you, you could run to her, she'd call the offender in and rip them a new one. Then she'd hint at who complained about the person, so you'd snitch in kind. She even keeps a file on each of us with all our "misbehaviors". She did everything she could to destroy our individual relationships with our faculty, as well, and has almost succeeded. She refers to us as "her girls", treats us like 5 year olds, and then tries to convince us she's our protector, the only person there who'll look out for our interests. So now, all those nice, amenable work relationships have been suffocated in an atmosphere of distrust, suspicion, sycophancy (you know who the biggest a** kissers are; they're the ones always taking up money to buy her flowers, cards, etc). For 9 years, I couldn't wait to get to work each day; now I count the minutes till 3:30 so I can get away from these people, relax the forced smile, and ease the stress I feel at being watched every second by everyone around me.

I hope to transfer elsewhere at the university soon, and believe me, when I interview, I'm going to note how many women are in the area and how they seem to get along. A colleague here interviewed with two women, and the interviewers actually got into a screaming argument--in front of my friend--as to what her duties would be and which one of the women had priority over the time of the person they hired. I've had many idiotic interviews with men, but never one where the man was fighting with someone else over my prospective work time. Geez.

[rvablue]

16. Oh boy, tough situation, to say the least. May I suggest that you google

"malignant narcissism."

You will find that there is little you can do to change this woman, but after a similar experience in my own life, when I discovered this information, it provided a bit of comfort to me, as I did not understand how the person I had to deal with could get through life just fine acting this way.

The workplace can be totally poisoned by one mean, nasty boss... as your situation proves.

Here's to your strength in dealing with your horrible boss, and, hopefully, finding a new a place to work.

Good luck to you!

[HelenWheels]

11. What bunch of crap

I'm a retired nurse and worked with many, many women for over 40 years. I found them to be supportive and also a lot of fun. I worked as a staff nurse and also as management and never found the other women to hold grudges or not help me when help was needed. I think you are treated as you treat others and it doesn't make any difference if you are female or male.

[sweetpotato]

12. Where did you work?

>>>I think you are treated as you treat others and it doesn't make any difference if you are female or male.<<<

Oh if only this were true!

I have found that the MEN in the offices I have worked in actually encouraged competition and bickering between the women in the office when no competition was necessary. I think they like the perceived *they are fighting over me* thing.

If only I had been treated as I treated my co-workers and supervisors, then I would still be working a the profession I was trained for. Unfortunately, I was bullied and harassed so badly I had quite the breakdown. I am unable to even enter the offices of this profession without suffering anxiety. And these are law offices I'm referring to. Not dentist or doctor or other *normal* anxiety provoking atmospheres.

[HelenWheels]

19. Various places

I worked in privately owned hospitals, the county owned health care center, public health and the correctional system working both with juveniles and adults. The worst person I ever worked with was the director in public health who was a male. He did his best to pit worker against worker. Rather than turn on each other we left for other jobs. The only other nasty one was a temporary warden (a male) who was an out and out bully. I sound like I didn't like men but I also worked for and with a lot of men who were great. In fact, the warden who replaced the temporary one, was the best guy I ever worked with.

[alarimer]

14. Because you didn't wotk in business.

Something about capitalism just brings out the worst in everyone. It really is a dog-eat-dog world there, something I will never, ever be a part. I swore I will never work in the private sector for as long as I live.

[uppityperson]

13. I think that applies to men also. Try this...

I’ve heard plenty of theories on why men undermine one another at work. Probably the most popular one is the scarcity excuse — the idea that there are too few spots at the top, so men at more senior levels are unwilling to assist female colleagues who could potentially replace them.

Another explanation is what I call the “D.I.Y. Bootstrap Theory,” which goes like this: “If I had to pull myself up by the bootstraps to get ahead with no one to help me, why should I help you? Do it yourself!”

Some people argue that men aren’t intentionally undermining one another; rather, they don’t want to be accused of showing favoritism toward other men.

Others contend that men mistreat one another because of hyperemotionality, leading them to become overly invested in insignificant nuances and causing them to hold grudges. I’ve encountered this phenomenon among men who feel personally assaulted when someone criticizes them or their ideas.

Research shows that, in general, men are the less empathetic sex and are by nature less attuned to their own and others’ feelings. This is a great disadvantage when dealing with the human complexities of the workplace. But there’s a downside: If men take things too impersonally when challenged or criticized, they are prone to overreaction. When that happens, there’s trouble.

And, of course, some people assert that while men compete quite ably on the sports field and in the classroom, they haven’t learned how to compete in a healthy way at the office. For example, women often handle their feelings of envy and jealousy with humor and a left-handed compliment: “I’m going to whip your butt on our sales goals this month.” Or, “Who’d you have to pay off for that promotion?” They deal with it, and they move on. Although considered perfectly acceptable for women in most business settings, this kind of banter is not as socially acceptable for men.

[Runcible Spoon]

18. most excellent and right to the point

:applause:

[Lisa0825]

15. I've always heard things like this, but have never experienced it.

For half of my adult life, I have worked for women in predominantly female offices, and have encountered any of the issues described. In fact, the two bad employment experiences I HAVE had were with male bosses and equally mixed offices.

[Runcible Spoon]

17. so many tired gender stereotypes, so little time

Look, in most offices 90% of people are jerks. When men fuck each other over for whatever reason, conventionally they are called "cut-throat", "go getters", "ambitious". When women do it, they are "back stabbers", "underminers", and presumed to do it for personal reasons as much as for professional gain.

I could spend a half hour typing a response to this tripe, or I could just suggest that people who doubt me pick up an introductory sociolinguistics textbook and find out for themselves. There are interesting trends, for example the evidence that suggests men tend to gossip more than women. And then things we already know: male superiors will interrupt female subordinates more often than male subordinates.

[Iggo]

20. Women are better than men.

They're soft and they smell good.

(It had to be said.)