My son will never wear shoes as well made as my father did

[ThomWV]

Just thinking' out loud. I know young people who have never owned a pair of shoes not made of canvas; my father never owned a pair of shoes of which any part was made of canvas. My last pair of Thom McCans did not wear out, they rotted away unused in a Miami, Florida closet.

You used to be able to buy well made shoes in this country everywhere, in fact you could not buy shoes that were not well made - there were none on the market. I wore a man's sized shoe, in fact about the same size as I wear today, by the time I was an early teenager and so I can still recall my father complaining about both the price of shoes and my ability to wear them out in no time at all. His shoes, he proudly proclaimed, had lasted him 20 or 30 years as I recall. Their style supported his claim though it may have been an exaggeration. Where did shoes like that go - or more correctly when did the public come to demand less.

Now here is the odd thing about shoes and their cost. The price of well made shoes did not creep out of reach for the common man. The price of shoes moved with inflation in general - which was horrible during both the Nixon and Carter years - but in fact well made, and more particularly American made, shoes were never overly expensive. What happened is that one day shoes of much less quality became available at a much lower cost. Warehouses of shoe boxes where if you could find what you liked in a size that fit you could have it on the cheap replaced stores where sizes and widths were consistent and sewn leather was the order of the day. You can see which one we chose over time.

I don't know that we so much shipped our shoe-making jobs over-seas as we simply started buying a different sort of shoe that was only available from over-seas.

I was told not long ago that socks are no longer produced anywhere in the United States. Apparently the increment of cost that cause the last sock producer to go out of business in this country was that of sewing the toes shut. It was that one extra step of American labor that broke the international-trade-camel's back. Imagine that, seven inches of zig-zag stitching per pair and another domestic industry gone.

[xchrom]

1. at some point marketing less expensive became like a pay rise.

the squeeze was on our wages -- starting in the seventies -- and cheap was sold along side that.

[Wickerman]

2. Agree with shoes being crap

I have a 20 year old pair of wingtips that I've re-soled twice that I love. I don't wear them much as my profession no longer calls for that style, but they'd surely be in great condition with their third set of soles if needed. The casual shoes I buy last about a year and cost the same as my wingtips would, adjusted for inflation, if I could find similar quality.

As far as socks go, not quite true. There is a producer of socks in Iowa that makes and markets their own. They actually make a sock out of corn byproduct.
http://www.foxsox.com/Catalog/category.aspx?code=EARTH

Last I heard they still made their socks locally.

[Muttocracy]

11. I bet a long of younger people have never heard of resoling shoes

I've never done it myself but my dad had his business shoes resoled over and over. Invest in good tops, resole the bottom, and they last for decades.

Now the shoe designs and lack of cobblers make it nearly impossible.

I'm someone who's happy to wear fairly cheap simple clothes but I'm willing to spend a ton on a few pairs of quality shoes and try to take care good of them.

[Liberal_in_LA]

44. resoling is back in style. listened to news segment about it. Women getting their shoes fixed.

sign of the times.

[donco6]

60. I've resoled my good shoes several times.

When I do the math, it's worth it.

[XemaSab]

3. The canvas isn't the problem

It's the cheap stitching and cheap glue that hold the things together.

In some ways canvas is a better shoe material than the leather they use anyways. I wanna know what part of the cow has leather with the strength and consistency of cardboard. :shrug:

[ThomWV]

8. Not to be crude but the answer is underbelly and forelegs.

One wonders what happens with all the leather produced by the hamburger industry. Maybe it goes back into animal feed but with Mad-cow that wouldn't seem like a good idea. Do that many SUVs have leather interiors?

[Mind_your_head]

37. THAT is a really good question!

Where do all of those cowhides go? That's gotta be a LOT of leather!

[LiberalEsto]

53. Couches and recliners? nt

[donco6]

4. I have my friend buy me shoes in Spain.

They're fantastic. Not cheap, but they last forever.

Are people just too fearful to start up a company that makes high-quality, higher-priced shoes? I'm sure it's risky . . .

[Dorian Gray]

52. I actually buy my shoes from Arche

Quite expensive, but they last me a long time. (So far, I've bought a pair a year, and my oldest pair is about 6 years old. They're sturdy, comfortable, and enduring. At least more so than most other shoe brands today.)

[PDJane]

5. I agree.

I have a pair of shoes in my closet that were made in the US, and which have lasted the better part of 20 years so far. I have four pairs of cowboy boots, two made in Canada and two in Spain, and I expect them to outlast me. I would like to return to that quality. You see, I am allergic to a lot of synthetics. I don't purchase running shoes or wear those plastic clog things that everyone seems enamoured of!

As for socks, I may go back to knitting socks, because I'm tired of having to purchase men's socks to get a pair that fit. In fact, my next glasses are liable to be vintage frames; I want a saddle bridge and cable arms...they stay on and don't hurt my nose.

Frankly, we need to return to a slower life with a different level of consumption.....let it begin with me.

[Greyhound]

6. Just depends on how much you are wiling to spend.

http://www.shopforamerica.com/home.php?storeid=allen&navid=mfg">Allen-Edmonds for example, make excellent shoes and, if you're lucky enough to live in a state were they have a company owned store, they always take your measurements at the time of purchase to ensure you get the right shoe for your feet. If not you have to go to Nordstrom's where it is up to you and the fates to get the proper fit.

But, you are right the nation has degraded so far that it seems impossible to get the good parts back.

In America, cheap is better than good even though cheap always costs more.

[oldnslo]

25. Nordstrom is a safe measuring bet on A-E shoes,

I bought about twenty pair of them from Nordstrom over a 30-year period, and they all fit perfectly.
I still have a few pair, although I retired 10 years ago snd seldom wear a suit anymore. A-E was, and probably still is, one of the best. More comfortable than sport shoes, but look strange with tennis clothes or motorcycle duds.

[tridim]

7. Do you know what word "Canvas" is derived from?

Here's a hint. :smoke:

It would probably help matters if we were legally able to grow the raw materials in this country to make materials like canvas.

[sam sarrha]

13. it would be a $180 billion industry to start, more later with hemp oil diesel and plastics/building

materials like 4x8 ply board, siding planks.. flooring etc

[Horse with no Name]

9. When I was a kid I remember my mom used to take us to Kenney Shoe Store

And I took my youngest daughter there and purchased a nice pair of Thom McCann's.
After that...for some reason, I do not recall them shutting down but they are gone.

[sam sarrha]

10. i heard there were ~ 300 shoe factories in the USA before Reagan, when he left office there were 3

[ms.smiler]

12. As I recall, it was during the Reagan years that the shoe industry starting

moving production to Brazil, then to China. One manufacturer located in the heartland, sold out to someone who moved production abroad, and 3,000 Americans lost their jobs. The original owner of the company was well compensated and one of those, ever so important millionaires of which Reagan was so proud. All I could think was how horrible it was for 3,000 Americans to lose their jobs.

There are shoes made in the USA as well as socks, some union made in fact.

http://www.findusmade.com/

[ogneopasno]

18. Are you thinking of the Dexter Shoe Company? Although that was located in Maine, so maybe not.

It sold to the great Warren Buffet and eventually closed down all its U.S. plants.

[Muttocracy]

14. Some day I want to buy shoes from this U.S. custom running shoe company

esp. for my mom who has hard-to-fit feet

http://www.herseycustomshoe.com/index.php

I see their website has been revamped and a younger guy has taken over the business. Yay! :bounce:

[ogneopasno]

15. Just a thing -- that's not true about the socks. Here are some examples:

Some Wigwam socks are still made in the U.S.: http://www.wigwam.com/

Some Smartwool socks are still made in the U.S.: https://www.smartwool.com/default.cfm

Some Hanes stockings for women are made in the U.S.

More union-made-in-the-USA socks and underwear here: http://www.unionlabel.com/socks--underwear.html

Don't give up! Don't accept it! There are still alternatives. You have to look a little harder, and maybe pay a little more. You have to decide for yourself whether it's worth it or not.

[jmowreader]

64. No Nonsense hosiery is made in the US

The company is Kayser-Roth, who makes all sorts of hosiery and socks in four plants, all of which are in either North Carolina or Tennessee. (One of them is about a half-mile from my office.)

[hedgehog]

16. How about getting shoes that actually FIT!

Believe it or not, the shape of your foot may depend on your ethnic group. You and I may have feet that are the same length, but the ball of my foot might be closer to the heel than the ball of your foot. Then toss in width, arch height, toe position etc. Now toss in the fact that few chain stores carry women's shoes in wide sizes or in sizes over 10. Even if I order on-line and stick to one company, I may wear a 7 1/2D in that style and an 8 1/2 D in that one!

[surrealAmerican]

57. ... and if you think wide sizes are hard to find, just try ...

... looking for narrow sizes. There are only a few manufacturers who even bother making those, and if you are narrower than a AA, you're just out of luck.

[MercutioATC]

17. Church's or Johnston & Murphy shoes should last damn near forever.

They're not cheap, but they're well-made.

[cap]

31. Johnston & Murphy have gone overseas

Most of their shoes are now made in China. They carry a few that aren't

[Wiley50]

19. I think "Red Wing" shoes are still USA made

http://www.redwingshoes.com/

They used to be sold direct sell, like Avon or Tupperware

[ogneopasno]

21. Some are, some aren't. You really have to check. Only a few of their work boots are still union-made

and only a few of their other boots are even U.S.-made, outsourced to scab-ass states like Mississippi. But there are a lot of Red Wing shoes and boots made outside the U.S. It's a goddamn shame.

[tabasco]

42. Chippewa boots are now made in China

by the little known Chinese Chippewa tribe.

[Muttocracy]

62. insult to injury. nt

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

20. I have two pairs of shoes (boots) that will probably last me decades.

One is a pair of Sendra cowboy boots. Sendra is a Spanish company that specializes in western-style boots, motorcycle boots, etc, and these things are nearly indestructible.

The other are a pair of Moma ankle boots. Moma's a small Italian company that specializes in making shoes that, as they put it, look and feel like something that came out of your grandfather's closet.

I can't imagine that I'll ever get rid of either of them. I walk three to four miles a day most days, and after probably a year's worth of walking in each they are still going strong (though the soles on the ankle boots may need replacing soon.)

[damntexdem]

22. Rockports -- I wear nothing but.

Other than my canvas shoes I wear to the gym.

[Lex]

26. Made in Vietnam

apparently. http://www.begup.com/2006/09/rockport-shoes.html

[pipi_k]

29. I had a pair of Rockport flats that I loved, but

weight issues caused my feet to swell and I couldn't wear them anymore.

Had to give them away :cry:

Now, I wear Crocs around the house (with orthotics inside) and for going out, I have two pairs of Drew Bloom II Mary Janes. Very comfortable, and they should last for years.

[oldnslo]

23. Allen-Edmunds still USA made, but no sports shoes known.

[Greyhound]

24. LOL! Check #6. n/t

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

27. I have 2 pair of hikers from Italy I got 10 years ago from an online outlet

I put one pair away and have worn the other year round since, the lug on the bottom is still near like new. They are leather with a soft soft leather lining. They have worn like iron. Problem is my dang feet have grown, and I'll never fit into the pair stored away all these years. Cost 20 bucks each.
My clogs are made in Poland
Sorrels from Canada 15 years old, new liners when needed
Fancy fur boots from Slovakia
Last summers favorite flip flops from China, spent most of last summer barefoot on the beach.
I have no tenners. I can't find any made in the states, my hubby has tenners made in USA thou.
Just dug out my sons snowboard boots, Made in China. Burton. heck.
Hubby Sorrels made in Canada
Sons Hunting boots made in China
Sons tenners made in China or Vietnam
My heels are vintage USA made and the rest Brazil or China.

Well, back to your point, I have to read it again after running around the house looking at footwear.

About Canvas sneakers (I call these tenners) My son just got his first pair of canvas sneakers last month, everything else has been leather or a mix of fabrics. Now that I think of it, I have 3 pairs of size 12 sneakers that he wore out down in the basement. Made of Synthetic and leather. All made in China. Damn. He has a decent pair of black leather dress shoes he has pretty much worn out. I'd like to replace them with something made very well. Then he can just resole them over the years. He is 17.

I've given up asking for made in USA shoes. It's just not out there anymore. It really depresses me. My hubby is a Sucker for ANYTHING made in the USA too, and I can't exploit this, try as I might.

[NNN0LHI]

28. Things go out of style so fast who would want a pair of shoes that lasted a long time?

There used to be lots of shoemakers in the area here who made most of their money replacing the soles on shoes. They are all out of business now. By the time someone wears out a pair of soles the shoes are out of style. No one gets soles replaced any more.

Don

[Libertyfirst]

34. In my little town, we still get shoes resoled. And two shops stay busy doing it.

[Luminous Animal]

45. I do. I have boots that I have been resoling for 25 years.

I decided years ago to only buy high quality shoes and boots that look good on me, rather than what is fashionable. As a bonus, I get complimented on my shoes all the time. No matter what happens to be in vogue. Another thing, classic styles always come back around. If you take good care of those shoes, in about 5 years, they'll be back in fashion.

[firehorse]

30. There are no shoes in my size.

I have a very narrow foot that is a 9.5. They don't make 9.5's anymore. They make 10's and 9's. So if I want to fit the width, I buy a short shoe. If I want to fit the length like a running shoe, I have to buy a man's shoe that is too wide.

My friend wears a women's 10.5 and has the exact same problem.

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

33. You may have luck here?

http://www.qvc.com/qic/qvcapp.aspx/app.nav/params.class.9971.level.3/walk.yah.0100-1023?venue=cgen

link to QVCs offer to narrow 9 1/2. Most made in China.

[BlueJazz]

54. Welcome to DU...Firehorse

[LoZoccolo]

32. You can actually get some pretty snappy-looking military dress shoes.

They have to be made in the United States of America because they are defense and all.

http://www.corcoranandmatterhorn.com/Category.asp?CategoryID=33

A friend of mine was disappointed in the quality of shoes and I suggested these. I wear real combat boots all winter so I get those too. Looks like they have athletic shoes as well!

[Kitty Herder]

35. My brother claims that good quality cowboy boots will last a long time,

if you take care of them. My dad used to say the same thing.

Having never owned a pair myself, I can't vouch for the accuracy of that claim. And for all I know, cowboy boots may have suffered the same fate as other footwear and become cheaply made since I last talked to my brother about the subject.

[Obamanaut]

36. Here are two sites you might find useful.

http://www.madeinusa.org/ I entered ‘shoe’ in their search box, and here are three of the sites listed - there are others


http://www.aldenshoe.com/

http://www.allenedmonds.com/

http://www.redwingshoes.com/boa/

Another site for searches http://www.americansworking.com/

Wife and I had the same conversation when we went out to lunch a couple days ago. Unless we drive 25 miles to the next small town we are limited to three grocery stores, one is Walmart. Walmart is the only place to buy men's clothing in our town, with the only other spot for women's clothes is a Cato's store. Walmart is the only place for almost everything here. The next spot after the 25 mile drive is 65 miles from our house.

We're gonna start using the internet more, looking for USA products.

[truedelphi]

38. The mergers in the eighties did in a lot of shoes. I remember some big-assed company

BOught out the little company that made this kid's shoe called "Roos"
kids loved them because there was a side pocket on each shoe - so you could put a Penny or a secret note or something in there. PArents loved them because they were sturdy and came in lots of colors.

When the big company that bought them - they didn't know what to do with that line, and immediately stopped shipping the shoes to the neighborhood stores.

[1776Forever]

39. Here is the story behind the closing of the G.H. Bass Shoe Company that moved from Maine in 1998

3/1/98
Town awaits closing of Bass shoe plant with fear, sadness
Close to 350 of the 3,900 residents in Wilton, Maine, will lose their jobs when the G. H. Bass factory closes in June, after 122 years.

http://www.projo.com/words/story429.htm

By GERALD M. CARBONE
Journal-Bulletin Staff Writer

WILTON, Maine -- The shoe cutter stretches a whole hide across the chopping block then steps back to inspect the grain. She looks for flaws such as fat wrinkles, brands, and hair follicles.

The backbone and the butt of the hide are where the leather is toughest, so she'll take her best cuts from them. The belly and the shanks are softer and less durable, so she'll cut into these for the shoe's trimmings and overlays.

(snip)

Soon, Nightingale will cut her last shoe. Phillips-Van Heusen, Bass's parent company, announced last month that it will close its Maine factory in June, and will move all of Bass's production to its plants in Puerto Rico and the Dominican Republic. (Now moved to Brazil and the "far east" as reported here - About 80 percent of its footwear was also being manufactured independently, chiefly in Brazil and the Far East. http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company-histories/PhillipsVan-Heusen-Corporation-Company-History.html )

In Wilton, where generations of the same families have crafted Bass's reputation for quality shoes, this news made people cry. For 122 years the people of Wilton have marched to the beat of the G.H. Bass & Co. shoe factory: six generations of workers have punched the clock at 6 a.m., stamped out soles and sock linings to the click and bang of the cutting machines, stitched the leather uppers of Bass Weejuns and Puffie boots to the whirring clatter of the sewing machines.

[AwakeAtLast]

40. These socks are made in Nashville, IN

http://www.forbarefeet.com/index.htm


And they are WONDERFUL!!!

[ContinentalOp]

41. Here are some American made socks for you.

http://store.americanapparel.net/men-socks.html

You can still get plenty of well made shoes in classic styles. They may not be cheap though. And they may not be what you consider "stylish" either. And if you care about fashion and you're buying new shoes all of the time, then what's the point of a well made shoe? I think the shoe issue you're talking about has less to do with American manufacturing and more to do with the fashion industry. Although I suppose our consumer culture and planned obsolescence goes hand in hand with the death of manufacturing so it's all connected.

[ContinentalOp]

43. Here are some of the American made shoes I'm saving up to buy...

http://www.russellmoccasin.com/

http://www.aldenshop.com/

[Shardik]

46. Wow.

I love the Russell motorcycle boots... But the price tag of $430.00 puts them out of reach for me.

[donco6]

59. The measurements on those Russells . . .

Wow. They're serious about custom fitting.

[OneBlueSky]

47. funny you should mention that . . . I just waterproofed and polished my Bates Floaters . . .

that I've had for at least 30 years . . . I wear them a lot during the winter, and they look like I could have bought them last year . . . the leather is thick and smooth, the stitching is all intact, and the soles, while showing some wear, have many years left on them . . .

out of curiosity, I surfed the net to see if these shoes are still made, and they are . . . but the leather is that thin, crinkled stuff that most shoe manufacturers use these days, and they just look a whole lot cheaper than my pair . . .

another example . . . a couple of years ago, my favorite Adidas high top basketball sneakers finally gave out, also after about 30 years . . . I was thrilled to find that the shoe is being made again in a "retro" version, and I quickly ordered a pair from Zappos . . . when I got them, they were so poorly made, and of such inferior materials (again, that thin crinkly leather) that I sent them back . . .

I still have a pair of Chippewa boots that are at least 40 years old and almost as good as new (though I don't wear then all that much, only when the snow is really deep) . . . also have a great pair of square-toed Frye boots from the same era that I don't wear anymore, but that have a lot of miles on them and are still in excellent shape . . .

you're absolutely right . . . you just can't find a decent pair of shoes these days, certainly nothing to compare to the classics from the past . . .

[JCMach1]

48. I have had well-made shoes from everywhere

with the exception of Europe... I don't buy European because they NEVER fit my American foot properly.

And yes, you can still get them.

Kind of funny really, I got tired of my daughters going through school uniform shoes every 3-4 months. I just found and bought them a pair of CROC school shoes designed to look exactly like the usual ones they wear. And yes, they last.

[Dulcinea]

49. I believe New Balance are US-made.

http://www.newbalance.com/corporate/aboutus/corporate_about.php

[JVS]

50. Some are, some are made in China.

I was at the shoe store after Christmas. US made was $89.99, Chinese made was $59.99

[JVS]

51. Apples and oranges.

Shoes of your father's era were what would now be considered dress shoes. Most shoes now are what were once considered sport shoes. My grandparents had plenty of old shoes before they died, but late in their lives they got themselves "gym shoes" because comfort (rather than durability or appearance) became a priority with them.

[rug]

55. I would settle for more aerodynamic shoes.

[melm00se]

56. really good shoes

are pricey. I have a 3 pairs of daily wear shoes, all 3 are Johnston and Murphy, all of which have been sent back twice to J&M for a refubishment. each pair was $150+ but they are 100% worth it:

they fit like a glove right out of the box
no real break in needed (other than scuffing up the bottom)
when they come back from the refurb process they look like they are damn near brand new again.

You can buy cheaper shoes (and I have) but they don't last nearly as long and aren't as easy to fix.

Spend the money (save up if you can't afford them), make sure that you rotate your shoes (shoes that dry out last a lot longer), use shoe trees (no "elf toe") and polish them and they will last far far longer than any "throw away shoe" that you can pick up for <$50.

[Waiting For Everyman]

58. It's the same with clothes - remember real tailoring, and custom alterations?

Department stores used to do alterations for free.

[ThomWV]

63. It is the same thing with hundreds of things - and that was the point

I don't care if the socks story is true or not - there are certainly a lot less socks being made here now than in the past and if it wasn't the seam at the toe then it was the price of the cotton or some other thing but the fact is the industry is essentially gone.

[deaniac21]

61. Shoes?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCF3ywukQYA