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Do you think Bush can just drop pardons on the desk and walk away?

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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 07:19 PM
Original message
Do you think Bush can just drop pardons on the desk and walk away?
If major pardons are coming wouldn't you expect there to at least be someone home to answer questions about them? If Bush is effectively gone and Dana has put in her last day then just how do Pardons show up. Will some flunky in the White House Press Room just simply announce them tomorrow, sunday, or monday morning?
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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. Why not?
Bush's M.O. for most of his adult life is that he doesn't have to explain anything or answer any questions. I have consistently imagined the worst this asswipe could do for eight years, and I don't think I've been pleasantly surprised more than two or three times.
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Mike 03 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. Isn't that the tradition? I'm no expert on pardons, but I didn't expect anything
other than that he would make upsetting pardons and that I'd just have to accept this, just like all the other horrible things he's done.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
3. I'd expect the paperwork to be processed through the DoJ and ...
... each individual granted a pardon provided with some signed declaration to that effect. There remain MANY senior individuals working within the DoJ to perform those tasks -- and eager to do so. Until they're removed/replaced, they continue in the performance of their "marching orders" even under the new President.

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TheKentuckian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 07:38 PM
Response to Original message
4. Yup, that's exactly right
no explanations required.
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 07:39 PM
Response to Original message
5. Yes. n/t
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
6. The Pardon Game
Edited on Fri Jan-16-09 09:38 PM by Dover
I don't know what the final date is for receiving Bush's submissions for pardons, but you
can bet that it has been calculated right down to the second....


BBC - The Pardon Game (Listen to audio)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/documentaries/2009/01/090107_pardon_game.shtml

-----

This was just written Jan. 7, 2009 - An Overview Of The Presidential Pardoning Power
Interesting timing:


Submitted by Vanessa K. Burrows
Legislative Attorney

http://pardonpower.com/CRSReport.pdf


-----

Pre-Emptive Pardons - Can you be pardoned for a crime before you're ever charged?


With six months to go before President Bush leaves office, the White House is receiving a flurry of pardon applications. The New York Times reported that "several members of the conservative legal community" are pushing for the White House to grant pre-emptive pardons for officials involved in counterterrorism programs. Wait—can a president really pardon someone who hasn't even been charged with a crime? Yep....

http://www.slate.com/id/2195689/

----


President Bush, the Plenary Power of Presidential Pardons, and Potential for Abuse

Nov. 23, 2008
Nadler Introduces H.R. 1531 Urging No Preemptive Pardons

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/1237043/president_bush_the_plenary_power_of.html?cat=62


----



Here's some info from Wikipedia:

In the United States, the pardon power for Federal crimes is granted to the President by the United States Constitution, Article II, Section 2, which states that the President:

shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment.
The Supreme Court has interpreted this language to include the power to grant pardons, conditional pardons, commutations of sentence, conditional commutations of sentence, remissions of fines and forfeitures, respites and amnesties.<4> All federal pardon petitions are addressed to the President, who grants or denies the request. Typically, applications for pardons are referred for review and non-binding recommendation by the Office of the Pardon Attorney, an official of the Department of Justice. The percentage of pardons and reprieves granted varies from administration to administration (fewer pardons have been granted since World War II).<5>

The pardon power was controversial from the outset; many Anti-Federalists remembered examples of royal abuses of the pardon power in Europe, and warned that the same would happen in the new republic. However, Alexander Hamilton defends the pardon power in The Federalist Papers, particularly in Federalist No. 74. In his final day in office, George Washington granted the first high-profile Federal pardon to leaders of the Whiskey Rebellion.

Many pardons have been controversial; critics argue that pardons have been used more often for the sake of political expediency than to correct judicial error. One of the more famous recent pardons was granted by President Gerald Ford to former President Richard Nixon on September 8, 1974, for official misconduct which gave rise to the Watergate scandal. Polls showed a majority of Americans disapproved of the pardon, and Ford's public-approval ratings tumbled afterward. Other controversial uses of the pardon power include Andrew Johnson's sweeping pardons of thousands of former Confederate officials and military personnel after the American Civil War, Jimmy Carter's grant of amnesty to Vietnam-era draft evaders, George H. W. Bush's pardons of 75 people, including six Reagan administration officials accused and/or convicted in connection with the Iran-Contra affair, Bill Clinton's pardons of convicted FALN terrorists and 140 people on his last day in office - including billionaire fugitive Marc Rich, and George W. Bush's commutation of I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby's prison term.

The Justice Department recommends anyone requesting a pardon must wait five years after conviction or release prior to receiving a pardon. A presidential pardon may be granted at any time, however, and as when Ford pardoned Nixon, the pardoned person need not yet have been convicted or even formally charged with a crime. Clemency may also be granted without the filing of a formal request and even if the intended recipient has no desire to be pardoned. In the overwhelming majority of cases, however, the Pardon Attorney will consider only petitions from persons who have completed their sentences and, in addition, have demonstrated their ability to lead a responsible and productive life for a significant period after conviction or release from confinement.<6>

It appears that a pardon can be rejected, and must be affirmatively accepted to be officially recognized by the courts. Acceptance also carries with it an admission of guilt.<7> However, the federal courts have yet to make it clear how this logic applies to persons who are deceased (such as Henry O. Flipper - who was pardoned by Bill Clinton), those who are relieved from penalties as a result of general amnesties and those whose punishments are relieved via a commutation of sentence (which cannot be rejected in any sense of the language.)<8>

The pardon power of the President extends only to offenses cognizable under U.S. Federal law. However, the governors of most states have the power to grant pardons or reprieves for offenses under state criminal law. In other states, that power is committed to an appointed agency or board, or to a board and the governor in some hybrid arrangement.

While a presidential pardon will restore various rights lost as a result of the pardoned offense and should lessen to some extent the stigma arising from a conviction, it will not erase or expunge the record of that conviction. Therefore, even if a person is granted a pardon, they must still disclose their conviction on any form where such information is required, although they may also disclose the fact that they received a pardon. In addition, most civil disabilities attendant upon a federal felony conviction, such as loss of the right to vote and hold state public office, are imposed by state rather than federal law, and also may be removed by state action. Because the federal pardon process is exacting and may be more time-consuming than analogous state procedures, pardon recipients may wish to consult with the appropriate authorities in the state of their residence regarding the procedures for restoring their state civil rights.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon
---


Constitutional Pardon Power
http://igs.berkeley.edu/library/hot_topics/2008/Dec.2008/pardon.html




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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. An interesting dilemma for Bush

From:
President Bush, the Plenary Power of Presidential Pardons, and Potential for Abuse
Nadler Introduces H.R. 1531 Urging No Preemptive Pardons


An interesting article worth reading. Here's an excerpt:



...The timing of any criminal action brought on the basis of presidential acts is less open to debate. On October 16, 2000, the Department of Justice's Office of Legal Counsel (OLC) issued a memorandum in which it revisted and reaffirmed its 1973 conclusion that indictment and criminal prosecution of a sitting president would impermissibly interfere with the executive branch's ability to perform its constitutionally assigned functions. This opinion and the legal precedents it cites presumably precludes any criminal charges against President Bush during his term of office. However, the OLC concluded that the Constitution does permit criminal prosecution of a president for acts committed during his presidency after his term of office ends.

Unless President Bush persuades the OLC to rewrite its longstanding opinion on presidential amenity to criminal prosecution to preclude post-presidency indictments and convictions for crimes committed in office, he is awkwardly poised between pardoning his administration members for crimes he authorized, thus placing himself at risk of their providing compulsory testimony against him after he leaves office, or not issuing pardons and running the risk that top members of his administration will be tried and convicted for crimes he authorized. Or, he can issue the longshot self-pardon along with a slew of executive pardons, gambling that the self-pardon will protect him, while ensuring that his legacy will be cloaked in disrepute.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/1237043/president_bush_the_plenary_power_of.html?cat=62

Sources: http://www.democrats.com/nadler-pardon-resolution; email from democrats.com; http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/sitting_president.htm; http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2008/11/20/pardon/; http://www.questia.com/googleScholar.qst;jsessionid=JyLJny6sTrTNv1t3XRfgRLcYJgkpxVvWLGQGQvZnpTXClDsx3DGn!857321274?docId=5001641459.

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book_worm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-09 09:58 PM
Response to Original message
8. Probably will be announced at the last minute like the Clinton pardons.
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