CA controller to suspend tax returns, welfare checks, student grants

[Iwillnevergiveup]

John Chiang announces that his office will suspend $3.7 billion in payments owed to Californians starting Feb. 1, because with no budget in place the state lacks sufficient cash to pay its bills.
By Evan Halper and Patrick McGreevy
January 17, 2009

Reporting from Sacramento -- The state will suspend tax refunds, welfare checks, student grants and other payments owed to Californians starting Feb. 1, Controller John Chiang announced Friday.

Chiang said he had no choice but to stop making some $3.7 billion in payments in the absence of action by the governor and lawmakers to close the state's nearly $42-billion budget deficit. More than half of those payments are tax refunds.

California to delay some payments
The controller said the suspended payments could be rolled into IOUs if California still lacks sufficient cash to pay its bills come March or April.

"It pains me to pull this trigger," Chiang said at a news conference in his office. "But it is an action that is critically necessary."

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-budget17-2009jan17,0,4472460.story

[Iwillnevergiveup]

1. This news is scary enough

but until this nightmare gets resolved, it will probably impact msny home owners' ability to pay property taxes due April 10.

[rucky]

2. Great. The unemployed have to make the first sacrifice.

Cowards. Picking on the most vulnerable members of society.

[zazen]

3. Exactly. Cut salaries of highest paid govt/univ admins first (see x post)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=114x54098

I simply cannot comprehend how those CIOs, asst CIOs, vice provosts and vice chancellors and asst vps ad infinitus, making the NC equivalent of 150K (yes, some have five kids in college, but most don't), cannot take a small cut in pay to put into a kitty to at least save WELFARE checks.

I spose that's socialist redistribution, but they were unfairly overpaid in the first place relative to secretaries, laborers, and adjunct faculty working for slaves' wages.

[GodlessBiker]

4. Lease payments for cars for high-ranking officials will continue, I'm sure.

Not sending tax refund checks is common law conversion. He should be arrested.

[juno jones]

8. I used to live in a rather shady part of Sac

There were a lot of hookers there and in the early morning when I went to work there were guys in state vehicles picking them up for a little pick-me-up (right out on the street,no less) before work.


I wouldn't be surprised if some of the expensive unmarked vehicles we saw were those some of those 'high-ranking officials'.

[Iwillnevergiveup]

16. Junofeb....we need more like you in CA

won't you consider coming back?

:hi:

[juno jones]

19. Thank you

We probably will. Mr Feb (American mutt when he interacts occasionally on DU) is from San Jose. We have deep roots and decades long friendships in CA. Right now, I'm in WA because the educational opportunities are still there for my kid. When he gets into state school, there's a good chance we will come back (I'm holding out for Mendocino :) ) because there's really no place like it. Heck out in this world, if they find out you're from CA, you can become a minor celebrity. Had a few traveling friends who related that. Holland and CA are considered the coolest places in the world to be from.


I just hope CA will be in a Politically better place when we return.

:hi: Wishing you luck and perserverence. We left coasters gotta stick together. :)

[formercia]

27. The 'Trickle down' theory in action.

:rofl:

[Wiley50]

5. I See the Class War going HOT in Feb. in CA

There are a whole bunch of folks on welfare in CA who are already miserable.

If their checks don't come there will be huge riots happening. Guaranteed.

Something will have to be done before the situation goes ballistic.

The gangs out there have enough guns for a real melee.

If you thought the Rodney King riots were bad..........

[lonestarnot]

12. I feel it brewing. I'm taking cover from a state away!

[juno jones]

6. We left after Arnie was elected

We thought it would be bad but we never dreamed it would be this bad.


Oh well, my California boy husband is not so homesick upon hearing this news, maybe I'll get a break in his bitches about WA weather.

[Iwillnevergiveup]

7. Yes, and now we have

our curiously unengaged senior Senator Feinstein considering a 2010 run for Governor.

:thumbsdown:

[juno jones]

9. Oh God No!

I love CA! I can't believe this is happening.

DiFi, no thanks!

[AngryAmish]

10. California did it to themselves

All this weeping and woe is me...you elected your leaders. You passed and kept that Prop 13 that kept property taxes absurdly low.

You elected the governments who gave away the store to state and local employees over the years. You did not keep an eye on the pension fiasco.

So now the state has their hands out and demands that Americans who elected responsible governments GIVE THEM MONEY because they screwed up their own state. I do not pay taxes for your mismanagement. I pay quite a lot for the mismanagement in Illinois, thankyouverymuch.

You soiled your own nest.

[lonestarnot]

11. Wow that is harsh. Nothing about the victims at the bottom.

What are leaders paid for anyway? Still can't figure out why CA voted for Arnie. :shrug:

[nichomachus]

32. Many of those "victims" routinely vote for the no-tax blowhards

A lot didn't, but a lot of people who will weep and moan about not getting money owed them by the state went to the polls grinning and drooling and voted for anyone who would promise "no new taxes." They've bought into the lie that you can run a 21st Century enterprise with 19th Century revenues.

As the Prop H8 fiasco has showed us, CA is not as "liberal" as many people think it is. There are a few pockets of liberals in the big cities and in certain areas, but the majority of the state is pretty red.

But it's not just CA -- the problem is acute here and gets attention because the state is so big. Other states, probably your state, is in just as deep shit. Heck, Massachusetts is talking about privatizing everything that isn't painted on.

This, of course, is the GOP's plan all along.

1. Destroy the middle class
2. Drive down wages
3. Increase public debt to astronomical levels
4. Lower taxes on the corporations and the ultra-wealthy
5. Privatize the infrastructure
6. Eliminate all spending for social programs
7. Use the military to deal with the civil unrest that will follow

I'll leave it to you to figure out where we are on that agenda.

[reggie the dog]

40. no way

no way did most people getting welfare checks vote for no tax blowhards.

[bread_and_roses]

48. Don't be quite so sure

I volunteer with a community organizing group. That attitude is far more common than you would think. And is it surprising? "They" watch the same TV news and read the same newspapers as the "middle class" - who have voted for years for the same blowhards, even though it is clearly against their self-interest. Humans are humans are humans are humans, and are largely governed by their social environment, the prevailing mores/ideas. Ours have been poisoned by Neo-Con Free-Marketeerism for many years now.

[nichomachus]

61. Please prove that

I know people getting welfare who are die-hard conservatives and hate liberals. My own sister -- who isn't on welfare -- had her job and her husband's health-care saved by their unions. They are both anti-union.

What got us into this mess is a history of Americans voting against their own interests, because they were told to by Faux News.

[varelse]

52. Please don't blame the poor in California for this

our welfare recipients don't own property, and many of them weren't even born when Prop 13 was passed. Certainly most recipients of student loans weren't of voting age for that one.

Also, please remember that Proposition H8 has a great deal of strong opposition here, and that it did not pass by an overwhelming margin. Many of us who voted against it but didn't do "enough" to support its opposition were blindsided, because we were not aware of the extent to which outside influences had been brought into the state to support this hateful, discriminatory and unconstitutional amendment.

[nichomachus]

62. I'm not "blaming" anyone

merely saying that people routinely vote against their own best interests. If they didn't, there isn't a Republican in the country who could get into office. The GOP represents the top five percent of the country and is out to screw everyone else.

[juno jones]

13. Arnie first won the same year that many districts were

switched to machines. I've always had suspicions.

Given what we now know about voting machines, his election is suspect at best in abscence of paper ballot talleys.

CA has supported many other states with it's fed taxes over the years. Like in the 90's when everybody had it good under Clinton, Silicon Valley was a part of that nationally-claimed success.

The quality of life there still beats the hell out of many places in this country.

PS: His election is a testament to run-off voting. He was first in a field of over 130 candidates. With around 30-odd percent of the vote IIRC. If it had boiled down to just him and Bustamente, there might have been different results.

PPS: I grew up in Freeport and lived for years in Springfield. Il politics are not that pristine.

[Le Taz Hot]

15. OK, I'm not going to let this go by.

First off, Prop 13 is not much of an issue these days as most of the people taking advantage of Prop 13 have either died or sold off their property long ago.

MILLIONS of us worked VERY HARD to wake up people about Ahnie. Do WE deserve Ahnie too?

You're diatribe against state and local employees is newspeak for UNIONS so you just outed yourself, there, bud. Most of us here think unions are a good, progressive idea.

California gives WAY more money to the Feds than we get. Look it up if you don't believe me.

Anymore Rush talking points you want to throw out there or was that about it?

[juno jones]

17. Thanks Taz

You said it better than I could.

CA is a union state. I have many friends who are union nurses and teachers there. And the rest of them are 'damn hippies' living off the grid and are not to blame for any of this, in fact they are fuelling the farmers markets and green tech that's gonna get our asses outta this.

Good lord, the CA-2-minute-hate just came out of left field there.

[jaundicedi]

24. Unfortunately

The Correctional Workers Union is the only union with any real political power in California. That's why we have more people in prison by percentage than any country or any state and why we keep building more while everything else goes to hell. I over-simplify...but not by much.

[Le Taz Hot]

26. Nope.

The Teachers Union in this state is much more powerful as they've been responsible for getting people elected and preventing them from being elected. They bring in an enormous amount of people for grassroots efforts for the Democrats.

The reason we have more people in prison is the mandatory drug sentencing which is a FEDERAL mandate. I will give you that the other reason is the "Three-strikes-you're-out" legislation which people voted in via the Proposition process.

There are very real reasons this state is broke, many of which we are not allowed to discuss on DU.

[jaundicedi]

45. Sorry but.........

The Correctional Workers Union Lobby has been the biggest contributor to the winner of the last 4 Governor's campaigns...Often on both sides. The teacher's union runs a weak second. That's why teachers in California get crappy wages and the guards frequently make six figures.

[AngryAmish]

18. I founded a union local

I am who I am today because of the great benefits my father earned as a Machinist took care of our family when he was unable to work when I was a boy.

So I am union bashing? Do you know anything about the pension crisis in Cali?

[Le Taz Hot]

20. Oh, no, I know nothing

in that I've been here for 53 years and have also been a union member.

Btw, Illinois? You're pissin' on California, all 38 MILLION of us? Does the name "Blackwell" ring a bell? Rahm Emmanuel? Daley, Jr. & Sr.?

You're wastin' my time, here Einstein.

[nichomachus]

33. Prop 13 is still very much in effect

It wasn't a one-time thing. It caps property taxes and prevents the counties from raising money through increasing property taxes. Everyone who owns property is taking advantage of Prop 13.

But I do agree on the other points -- and no, those of us who voted against Arnie don't "deserve" him, but as I said above, many of the people weeping and wailing about the situation did vote for him and would gladly vote for anyone who promised not to raise taxes.

[Le Taz Hot]

36. You misunderstand.

I didn't say Prop. 13 wasn't in effect, I was asserting that it was not a significant contributor as to the reasons California's economy is in the dumpster.

I just took exception to the poster's assertion that we ALL deserved Ahnie because some misguided idiots who wanted him in for nothing more than the fact they they thought it would be cool to have "The Terminator" as governor.

[nichomachus]

59. No I don't

Prop 13 is a huge contributor. It is what prevents the counties from raising property taxes to account for increasing expenses. It is a huge contributor to the economic mess. It basically ties the hands of public officials.

[varelse]

53. Welfare recipients? Students?

you can't seriously be claiming that these people, who will be hit the hardest by this crisis, voted for Prop 13 or even that most of them voted for the Republican running for Governor?

[nichomachus]

57. Yes I can be seriously claiming that

Americans are notorious for voting against their best interests and then weeping about it later.

I used to teach in a state college. I had students who were there on an affirmative action program, receiving welfare, and student aid, telling me that they were proud conservatives and they hated liberals.

[varelse]

64. Prop 13 passed in 1978

many of the people being affected NOW were not eligible to vote at all, or weren't even born yet. I wasn't eligible to vote on it either - my parents, bless their hearts, voted against it. :(

[bobbolink]

55. How many deaths will make you feel justified?

Hmmmmmmmmmmm?

[nichomachus]

58. I have abolutely no idea

what the fuck you are talking about.

[bobbolink]

60. I'm very sure you do.

"But I do agree on the other points -- and no, those of us who voted against Arnie don't "deserve" him, but as I said above, many of the people weeping and wailing about the situation did vote for him and would gladly vote for anyone who promised not to raise taxes."

Keep the blame going... it must give you something you need inside.

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Liberal_in_LA]

23. I was a kid when prop 13 passed. Don't blame ALL calfornians. Many from out of state also.

[Iggo]

28. I did it to myself?

Thanks!

[Iggo]

29. So by that logic...

...everything that's wrong with the United States is your fault, Angry Ahmish.

You did it to yourself by electing and re-electing the Bush administration.

Hey! This is a fun game!

[varelse]

50. Actually, it looks like we did it to our poorest and most vulnerable citizens

many of whom were not even around to vote for Prop 13 - which, by the way, was billed as a way to keep seniors from being forced out of their homes by rapidly rising property values. :(

Please keep in mind, though, that CA still contributes more federal tax dollars per capita each year than we draw out.

[varelse]

51. deleted - duplicate

I could have checked before I tried to re-post but noooo I had to dupe it instead. (needs more coffee).

[Earth_First]

14. This is why I completed and filed my taxes today. I fear that New York may be the next in line. n/t

[Iggo]

37. I haven't got my W-2 yet.

I'll file the same day I get it.

[spanone]

21. maybe the people of california should suspend paying their taxes

[varelse]

54. Maybe we should demand that our taxes be properly apportioned

to help our poorest and most vulnerable residents first. BTW I'll do fine without my tax refund - it the state could give me the option of deferring it until next year, or even declining it, I'd take that option. I can afford it. I will not be homeless, or hungry, or go without medical care due to the lack of that one check.

The same can not be said of the students, disabled, the families on welfare, the quickly growing population of unemployed/underemployed CA residents.

[maryf]

56. Rec this post!!

Tax refunds being held over a certain income level, like 100,000 wouldn't be bad, but like you said people who need the money to survive?? this is inhumane...

[Iwillnevergiveup]

22. Well, it's about 7:30 a.m. in CA now

and as we blog, thousands of people waking up, rubbing the sleep out of their eyes, and stumbling out to pick up the paper are NOT going to have a very enjoyable first cuppa joe. Sunday's L.A. Times will be full of righteous anger in letters to the editor. Guess this could be classified as a Saturday news dump.

[Belial]

25. Is this a game of chicken?

I am not trying to downplay anything.. but I know gov't has a way of playing chicken with itself all the time.. ie "You dont do this, we are going to do this" We have all seen it happen on the federal level and I have seen it happen on that state level a few times.. Just talking this out.. Thoughts?

[Iggo]

30. It's a game of chicken they play every year.

[madville]

31. Just making the case for their bailout

They are just making the case and putting out PR for when they get their Fed gov bailout.

[1776Forever]

34. WOW! Ohio Gov. just asked for 5% cut in Government workers pay here.

$1 billion in worker givebacks sought
Union being asked to consider 5 percent pay cut, fewer hours and no more holiday pay

Saturday, January 17, 2009 3:09 AM
By Alan Johnson

http://www.columbusdispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2009/01/17/PAY_CUT.ART_ART_01-17-09_A1_62CIK2O.html?sid=101

The Strickland administration has sent shock waves through the state work force with a contract proposal seeking around $1 billion in concessions from employees, including a 5 percent pay cut, reduced hours and elimination of paid holidays and personal days.

[nichomachus]

35. All part of the plan

Grover Norquist is popping champagne corks as we speak -- this was his goal all along.

[NNN0LHI]

38. Isn't this the kind of stuff that could lead to riots?

[reggie the dog]

39. how in the hell will the poor eat????

or pay the rent????

prostitution??? drug dealing???? theft???? riots and REVOLUTION???????

[Usrename]

41. Can they get Gray Davis back? Is it too late for that?

They've been had by the RW takeover and they probably haven't even figured it out yet.

[Iwillnevergiveup]

42. The day the Terminator took over

was almost as sad as the day Al Gore conceded. Some nasty, nasty Enron-style stuff went down and conspired against Gray Davis. In a nutshell, the crooks "won" that round.

[Usrename]

43. That's exactly what happened.

Barbara Boxer was the lone voice against the thievery.

Lieberman actually helped whitewash the whole deal.

Oh yeah. It was a nasty piece of work alright.

[1]

44. california must get their shit in order. it's a california problem...

and california is smart enough to fix it.

[MadHound]

46. Trouble is, it's not just a California problem

It's a problem that's going to impact all of the rest of the US. If California goes under, which is(or at least recently was) the sixth largest economy in the world, it will take the rest of the country with them.

[slackmaster]

47. The word is "refunds"

A tax return is a document that taxpayers file. Those aren't going to be suspended.

:argh:

[alarimer]

49. This is all the governor's fault.

They recalled Gray Davis for having a huge budget shortfall. Now it's even bigger due to to the Governator's insane tax policies.