MarketWatch: Goodbye, McMansions

[marmar]

New homes get smaller
Say goodbye to McMansions, Americans are buying 'right-sized' homes

By Amy Hoak, MarketWatch


LAS VEGAS (MarketWatch) -- These days, a bigger home isn't always a better one: Recent research suggests that homes being built today are getting smaller.

The average size of homes started in the third quarter of 2008 was 2,438 square feet, down from 2,629 square feet in the second quarter, according to the U.S. Census Bureau. Similarly, the median size of homes started in the third quarter was 2,090, down from 2,291. The statistics confirm what the housing industry has suspected for a while.

"We've been hearing for a long time 'Why is the home size not declining?'" said Gopal Ahluwalia, vice president of economic research for the National Association of Home Builders. He spoke about the trend at the International Builders' Show, held in Las Vegas this week. Anecdotally, he had heard smaller homes were being built as housing prices tumbled and the economy began to weaken. Still, "we never had data to back it up," he said.

Gayle Butler, editor-in-chief of Better Homes and Gardens, said for many homeowners, it is not so much a matter of downsizing as "right-sizing," giving up big homes with unused space and buying a home that better fits their needs.

"Either by necessity or choice, they're willing to take a step back from the McMansions," she said at the Builders' Show. In fact, according to a survey conducted by the magazine, 32% of participants said they expected their new home to be either somewhat smaller or much smaller than the one they already live in, she said. The magazine's online study involved 733 potential new-home buyers. ............(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Say-goodbye-McMansions-homes-getting/story.aspx?guid=%7BAADD01FF%2DCCEC%2D4B22%2D9328%2D042B81EB6F23%7D

[spanone]

1. good, they are not only impractical, they are ugly

[marmar]

2. Agreed. I drive thru some of those ersatz suburban subdivisions.....

.... with four styles of oversized houses with facades to give them their own "unique" (LOL) look and think to myself: "This is what hell is like."

[Warpy]

12. Hell around here is an expanse of two and three car garage doors

facing the street with the McMansion hidden back behind them, only narrow walkways between the massive garages indicating something might be back there.

Walking in those areas feels like you're a bug on a plate.

The maid district hides behind concrete block walls with a guarded gate, but it's not a whole lot better, huge heaps of ostentatious masonry on tiny lots, just enough space left over for a patio table, gas grill, and small dunk pool.

I'll take my high crime area with sidewalks and front porches, thanks.

[YOY]

5. But nobody explains what should be called "common sense" to the buyers.

My parent retired in a small McMansion. I tried to ask them just what they needed with a 6 bedroom house with bathrooms. The best answer I could get was, "This is for when you guys come home for the holidays." 6 years later they have 4 Kids, 2 spouses, and 3 grandkids and we have NEVER all happened to come all at the same time. There is always 2 bedrooms empty and 3 big couches that could sleep a person as well.

Oh well, they can afford the utilities and already paid it all off (They invested well.) It's still far more than they should ever need.

[mnhtnbb]

14. My Republican brother/SIL justified their empty nest house purchase in CA

4 BR 3 BA 4100 sq ft home with big LR/FR separate dining room with the same BS. They have 5 kids
and wanted to have them all home at the same time. My nephew (their youngest son) who spent
Thanksgiving with us told us that in the last 5 years, the whole family has been together
exactly twice for 2 days!

[cali]

21. I don't think my almost 90 year old mother could live in a small house

she moved out of a 5,500 sq ft house on 6 acres and bought a small house on 1/2 an acre which she promptly knocked down to build a 3,000 sq foot house. It's just her there at night, which is pretty scary, even if she does have an elevator. Part of the reason for size is she has a damn big library to house, but I think it has more to do with the fact that she's always lived in big houses or flats. Almost 90 and she still travels to her home in London 4 or 5 times a year- and that place isn't small either.

Me? I live in a very small, funky house.

[SheilaT]

22. Have they never heard of

hotels? It's an amazing concept. You pay money for a temporary place to stay, and someone else cleans it every day.

Just a little sarcasm.

I recently relocated halfway across the country and I am renting a two bedroom apartment because I do want to have a spare bedroom if my sons come to visit, and they were here at Christmas. Meanwhile, the spare bedroom is where I keep my yarn for knitting/crocheting and I usually do my needlework there because it has good light. The entire apartment is about 900 square feet, and when I buy a place, I do want slightly more space because of all the stuff I have. But we're not talking McMansion, maybe 1200 square feet all told would suit me fine.

[YOY]

29. That's common sense. One extra bedroom is a cool thing.

I mean the term "guest bedroom" does exist and all. I did make the "hotel comment" to my folks..."You're not staying in a motel while you're in town!!!" A sweet sentiment but not exactly wise.

I wish we had an extra bedroom frankly. One would be nice. If the Mrs. and I ever decide on having another kid it would be great for the kids to have separate rooms. In the mean time it would make a cool home office.

[SheilaT]

35. It can be a very good idea to stay

at a hotel/motel when visiting relatives. You're not locked in to their schedule. You can do things you want to do, without having to spend every minute with them. You're not cluttering up the place with your presence. :) My ex and I always stayed in a hotel when visiting either side of the family, and it made things much nicer all around.

[lunatica]

39. Unfortunately, or fortunately, depending...

Your parents may have to take some of their children and grandchildren in if finances get too difficult. In that case it's much better to have the extra room so things don't get too cramped. Everyone may be glad they had a large house.

Our society may change back to extended families living together again.

[YOY]

46. It may be the other way around actually.

They are stable (my parents) and have a large enough nest egg. My little brother is having problem at work. My older sister was on a short list for people who could be cut but really dodged the bullet. I'm actually sitting pretty...thanks to Joe Biden and his actual use of a brain.

[Obamarama]

3. Gee, that's coincidental. Mansions went out of fashion with the demise of the last gilded age.

This is a good example of history repeating itself, if one is trying hard to look for a silver lining to this economic cloud we find ourselves under.

These huge, poorly-constructed, ostentatious, energy inefficient cracker boxes are a blight on our landscape. Good riddance to bad design, energy waste, and the "mine-is-bigger-than-yours" mentality.

[mnhtnbb]

4. We have replaced our 3071 sq ft house that burned down with 1800 sq ft

house. We bought a 1500+ sq ft house on the same street (where our house burned down) that had
been a rental for 20 some years. We added just under 300 sq ft, remodeled to make a true master, gutted
the kitchen, gutted/expanded the bath that serves as master and powder room on the main floor.
My husband still has his office in this house.

We're now toying with the idea of rebuilding on the lot--but the plan we're working with is just
under 2000 sq ft. We have a detached garage and studio apartment on the lot that didn't burn,
and being able to rent that for income during retirement is the prime motivation for even thinking about rebuilding. Otherwise, we plan to keep the lot until our son graduates college in 2012 (because
his drums will be in the garage once we rent the apartment beginning with the 2009-10 academic year) and then sell it.

Still, we're looking at living with a much smaller house whether we rebuild or stay here.
We're quite comfortable here.

[Mist]

6. Not surprising--the heat and a/c bills must be staggering. nt

[CrispyQ]

7. A former boss of mine lives in a 10,000 square foot house.

Her husband was a luxury home builder, so of course their home is always the latest, greatest & biggest. A few years ago she revealed that their heating bill was over $800 a month. Holy fucking shit!!! :wow:

[Lorien]

9. A friend of mine in Glendale, CA pays over $900 a month for electricty

for her 2,500 sq. ft home...and she never uses heat or air conditioning! She's had state inspectors out there five times to try to determine why her bills are so high. They say that nothing is amiss. Her neighbor pays $1,200 a month, so I guess that's normal for their neighborhood. Thanks Enron! Isn't privatization great?

[Thothmes]

28. Good Grief, I get knots in my stomach paying $100.00 a month electric bills.

[mnhtnbb]

11. That actually sounds fairly energy efficient for cold weather.

We lived in a 4600 sq ft house in NE, built in 1925, and our heating bill one winter month
in the late 90's was almost $1000--10 years ago.

[Nikia]

23. I was going to say that too

If we hadn't gotten new windows a couple of years ago, our 2900 sq ft 50 year old home would have cost that per month with the cold winter this year. Right now, we are looking at over $500 per month.

[Lorien]

8. The McMansions being built in my area are much bigger than that

they average around 3,800 square feet. There's a 4,500 sq. ft. one that replaced a 1,600 1920's craftsman bungalow not far from me. It was completed over a year ago and just sits there, unsold, like every other spec home in this area.There's another one that's over 5,00o sq. ft. around the corner; at least they kept the original building on that one and just added on, and, on, and on...Spec building these days is certifiably insane.

[Phentex]

19. Same here. I keep wondering what will happen to them...

Even if the prices drop, who wants that much upkeep or utility costs?

They are just sitting here empty.

[KittyWampus]

37. may I suggest that they would make nice 2 family homes?

[intheflow]

38. Sounds just like what they've been doing in my neighborhood.

Ripping down cute, historic bungalows and placing these massive homes with no yards on the lots. I'm really glad to see this trend ending.

[HughBeaumont]

10. This thread is pretty telling, even if much of the first sub-thread is "ignored".

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=3187335

I never understood why people would want these wasteful pieces of shit. People with 3 kids don't NEED 8 bedrooms. Plus, wouldn't they be a bitch to CLEAN and repair?

[Warpy]

15. My dad said when I inherited, I'd do well to move

out of my neighborhood of little post WWII houses in what is now the inner city.

I don't think he understood why I bought here. The houses are 800 square feet, mine expanded to 1200 by a very bad reno of an attached garage into studio space for my looms. The area is convenient to everything and bus service is a block away, important to somebody who keeps going legally blind.

Plus, it's not a whole lot to clean.

I still feel like a pea in a barrel from time to time and think my next place will likely be smaller rather than larger.

[arcadian]

25. With out even clicking on it, I'm gonna guess it's OMC

The 'damn the environment', 'damn sustainibilty' people who tout, 'it's their money they can do what they want to with it' are really very annoying, haven't heard much from them since the economy has been collapsing, they must be in line with their hands out looking for a bail out. :rofl:

Yup, I was right, OMC.

[HughBeaumont]

26. Ding ding ding ding ding ding ding!

You know because in addition to being less than progressive, he's also unable to leave without the last word.

[Lars39]

42. He has the knack of being in more deleted sub-threads than any other DUer.

Most any other "alertable" would have been banned by now.

[arcadian]

13. Hopefully this will save America's cultural rural landscape as well.

Kids of farmers selling off papa's land to developers and speculators because they don't want to farm. Greedy little children.

[Neecy]

47. I just bought a house in rural Kansas

It's in a charming small town, not a single stoplight in the entire county. It's 1600 sq, all brick, and I paid less for it than you'd pay for a good used car. I'm having it updated now and I'll move in sometime in March. There are amazing housing bargains to be had in small towns, especially those that don't have local industry for employment.

There are only two blights on the landscape: one is a huge McMansion down the street from me, which looks bizarre planted in the middle of a cute little neighborhood. The other is the house across the street from me, which has a huge AMERICA banner planted on the house. I'm sure he'll love my Obama sticker. The town is 80% Republican but I'm looking at the bright side - I'll have 20% Democratic neighbors.

[madrchsod]

16. 1400sq foot is easy to clean,cheap to heat,and cheap to decorate

when we sold drapes and window blinds the cheapest assed customers were the people in mcmansions. they spent over a thousand on a window and wanted a price cut on 100 dollar metal shades. the best customers were retired people who paid cash,asked for our advice,and never questioned the price. those were the people who never lived in mansions but just working class homes and understood money is fleeting...

[Bonhomme Richard]

17. It never made much sense to me to pay for rooms that...

you walk into once a year.
I live in a 1800 sg ft cape cod which provided plenty of space to raise a family. Now as they have moved out we even have more space.

[gollygee]

18. We wanted a house where we wouldn't all hang out in different rooms all the time

Like where we would be together as a family in the evenings and on weekends. Growing up, our house was like 1800 square feet I think (so not even all that big), and mom was in one room, dad was in another, my sister was in a third, and my brother and I (close in age) were in a fourth. We never really hung out together. When we were looking for a house not long after we got married, we chose one that was just over 1200 square feet. Now, my husband, daughter, and I (and pretty soon another daughter) hang out in ONE room together, where we play board games and chat and that kind of thing. I love it.

Either you're paying to heat a bunch of unused space, or you aren't spending your free time together. I didn't like either alternative.

[cherish44]

20. Some people are just all about "stuff"

I have friends who built a $300,000 house on an income of about $100,000 a year. I live in a rural area and $300,000 can buy a lot of house out here. Each of their three kids has their own bathroom. They buy all new furniture every 2 years. They've never had a car (actually top of the line "designer" mini van) for longer than 2 years before they buy a new one (never used). Kids wear designer clothes, Mom is always perfectly groomed, with manicured nails and highlighted hair. How do they afford it? My only guess is they're in debt up to their assholes because I know neither of them have rich parents.

[tom_paine]

24. Good riddance. Even though Mcmansions are here to stay and this is mostly M$M hype BS

But it sounds nice, and I am certainly in agreement with the principle of the thing. Mcmansions, from an environmental point of view, are insane.

[knitter4democracy]

27. I'm still below the average?

I can't understand why. My house is lovely and just right. I can't imagine trying to clean anything bigger.

[pipi_k]

33. I noticed pros and cons about large and small homes

Our previous home was about 2300 or 2400 sq. feet.

Four bedrooms, 2 1/2 baths, full basement, huge kitchen, the works.

It was a pain to clean, but stayed clean longer because there was more room for spreading out.

Now my home is two bedrooms, two baths, a sunroom, very small kitchen, etc. Maybe 1600 to 1800 sq feet. Once I clean it, it's harder to keep clean because there's not that much room for people and dogs to spread out, so it gets dirty faster.

Oh, and living with a pack rat....that doesn't help either.... :cry:

[knitter4democracy]

51. Our last house was a pain to keep clean.

1100 s.f., one bathroom, one room we all ended up in all the time. Yeah, it was really hard to keep it clean, so our bigger house now is nicer that way, but I sure am tired of scrubbing the rust out of three toilets every few days. Ugh.

[marions ghost]

30. Some of these McMansions will make

good condos and apartment buildings one of these days.....& some of the bigger ones would be good B&Bs or small hotels.

They can be retrofitted and if I had one I'd be thinking about how to get the rental apartment
happening...

[annabanana]

34. I expect that more than some of them will end up boarding houses...

What with the wholesale de-housing of the population...

[marions ghost]

44. yes

boarding houses, apartments or even condos. I see it coming...

If I had to choose between a large impersonal apartment complex or a small group housing situation (in one house-like building), I'd choose the latter, as long as the essential amenities were separate, ie a bath room and small kitchen. Also a separate entrance. Laundry/workshop/garage/yard/porch/storage facilities could be shared...

This situation actually could be very desirable for a lot of people.

[SheilaT]

36. Actually zoning laws will

make those kinds of conversions difficult in many places.

Plus, from the McMansions I've seen the insides of, they would mostly be very tricky to retrofit for apartments, hotels, B&Bs. They are full of wide open spaces -- one thing I never like about them is that there's often much less privacy inside those huge places compared to something smaller because all the rooms open up to each other. If someone has a TV or radio on in one room, it's heard everywhere.

It's also going to take almost unimaginable cultural changes for people to go back to living in boarding houses. In my lifetime (and I'm 60) I don't think I've ever seen them. Young people for the last about thirty years have almost entirely lost the concept of sharing an apartment with someone.

[marions ghost]

43. good points

of course zoning laws, covenants would have to be changed, etc. Changing those would be better than seeing these McMansions deteriorate, I'm sure most neighbors would agree. There are ways to chop up interior spaces if it's done comprehensively. Energy efficiency is certainly an issue. But I don't think it's too hard to imagine retrofitting as many of these places have extra space that could be reclaimed for additional kitchens, separate entrances, re-routing of ducts, etc. I'm not talking boarding houses so much--I'm talking apartments.

The cultural changes you speak of might be the most difficult obstacle actually. Americans aren't enthusiastic about sharing living spaces. But still there are plenty of people living in apartments & duplexes and such, and the demand for loft living is up in urban places. There are lots of examples of large older houses in cities that have been made into very nice multiple occupancy. I believe that if you do something creative with spaces and make it look good, somebody will always want to rent it or buy it. It's not only younger people--a lot of seniors and singles of any age would like the "duplex" or "triplex" situation...

I'm just confident that one of these days the folly of people living in these monster houses will go the way of the Hummer...there could be a booming business in "downsizing" these things...in the end, it's all just boards and bricks.

[nadinbrzezinski]

31. We will be looking for home SOON, long story

I was looking at what we can afford, and nowhere near where we are living right now.

Mind you, this apartment is not that big either.

[pipi_k]

32. Back in the 90s...

whole neighborhoods full of McMansions were going up left and right in my area.

Impressive, maybe, to people who wanted a show of wealth and/or prestige or whatever.

But the construction left a lot to be desired. Cheap, cheap, cheap.

Lots of particle board shit. Seeing those things being constructed almost overnight was sort of scary because I, at least, wondered how energy efficient they would be. Maybe some are, maybe some aren't.

My house began life back in the late 50s to early 60s...strangely enough, as a hunting cabin. The guy who built it used real wood throughout, including the walls.

If it were any more energy efficient, we probably couldn't live here without oxygen masks.

We added to it over the years. It's relatively small, but perfect for us, and suited for the area. I don't ask for a whole lot from a house as long as it has two bathrooms...

:7

[spooky3]

41. The construction quality (and ugliness)

are the things that bug me the most about them.

Some people value (excess) space above quality - in fact, many don't seem to understand the difference between cheaply built and poor materials and higher quality of both.

Many modern houses have much better floor plans, though, than my little old house with its tiny kitchen - actually, every room is tiny! I wish the developers were less greedy and would build something in the middle that would work for a lot of us, instead of trying to cram the biggest possible house on small lots.

[KittyWampus]

49. the nail-bangers I know say the houses are way more efficient but energy gains are lost due to size

[IDemo]

40. 1100 sq ft here. If it were just me, 400 - 500 would work just fine

[Raine]

45. I HATE McMansions, they're HIDEOUS

if you need something that big than you have too much damn CRAP! :argh:

Edit: and I say that about too much crap from personal experience, I have too much of it myself. :-(

[RadiationTherapy]

48. My family and I are in 1400 sq ft

Biggest place I have lived as an adult.

My income/lifestyle is definitely less than my parents' was at my age.

[stuntcat]

50. It's too late for me :(

Arlington county finally made some rules about how much bigger people could make their houses around here. But for us it's too late, the people next door have added a house and a half onto the little square brick house that used to be just like ours.
Now we don't have any privacy anywhere in our yard or in the back room of our house. Everywhere we go around here we can see the neighbor's windows. And the building they made shades part of my back yard, some of my flower beds only get an hour of sun now.
I hope they enjoy paying what it costs to heat that monster x( Thanks to them I just want to get the Hell out of Arlington. I feel like they're ALL OVER ME.