A must see: Great achievements in American socialism

[devilgrrl]

A slide show of two dozen excellent things the federal government bought with your money.



Feb. 6, 2009 | Brave souls named Beck and Hannity and Limbaugh have raised the alarm: Socialism will soon be loosed upon the land. What is this "socialism" of which they -- and Malkin, McCain and Morris -- warn? Socialism is apparently what is created when a president you do not like spends money on things of which you do not approve.

Since the collapse of the economy and the election of Barack Obama, the American right has been engaged in a two-front ideological battle. Conservatives are fighting to prevent Democrats from spending America out of the current economic predicament, because it has long been a conservative article of faith that massive government investment in jobs and infrastructure does not work. But pressing that argument about the present also means looking backward, and trying to rewrite the history of the 1930s, when nearly everyone except conservative ideologues agrees that a huge Keynesian jolt to the economy did work.

Rather than publish another essay, though there have been some fine ones lately, about just what really happened during America's last episode of so-called socialism, we've opted to go to the visual record. As Marshall Auerback noted, in the process of modernizing the rural South and upgrading the infrastructure of America's largest cities, President Roosevelt's New Deal left behind a durable, physical and very visible legacy of schools and hospitals -- even aircraft carriers. (We'll leave discussion of Social Security and unemployment insurance for another time.) The following slide show gives a small sampling of the bricks-and-mortar achievements of red, white and blue "socialism."

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2009/02/06/new_deal/

:thumbsup:

[inthebrain]

1. Socialism is the empowerment and rebellion of the working classes against those that exploit them

I doubt many really have a clue what it is.

Altthough there are some less rebelious examples in American history than others. Primarliy the Shakers and Brook Farm.

Scoialism is more than some government program. It's the control of the means of production by the working classes.

[angrycarpenter]

2. This is what the conservatives fear.

A physical legacy that one can point to for many years and say that the government can really work for it's people when they need help. What have conservatives given us? Debt and bomb craters.

[corruptmewithpower]

3. Every nation has a public(Socialist ) sector and a private(capitalist)

sector. I suggest we forgo word games and try to find the optimum balance between the two.

[blindpig]

7. There is no 'optimum balance'.

As long as Capital exists it will strive to maximize profits and that striving will overturn all attempts at regulation due to the money power which is the nature of Capital. Is not the history of the last 75 years clear on this?

It's socialism or barbarism.

It's capitalism or nature.

Which side are you on?

[corruptmewithpower]

8. Half the people on the planet have tried communism, or extreme socialism.

Watever you want to call it, it was a grand experiment and a dismal failure everywhere it was tried. It was the leading cause of man made death in the twentieth century. Famine and poverty and mass murder just isn't acceptable anymore, so take your extremist totalitarian notions to the toilet and flush.

[blindpig]

10. And how do you know this?

Is it because you've been spoon fed 'common wisdom', ie, propaganda, your entire life and haven't had the gumption to look into things yourself?

The world is considerably different than the US propaganda machine, which includes our 'education system', would have you believe.

[corruptmewithpower]

14. I believe your handle has a ring of truth to it.

You are indeed blinded by cognitive dissonance. I don't think there is a cure, so be a try to be content in your madness.

:crazy:

[blindpig]

15. Enjoy your pasture.

Will you be surprised when the knacker comes for you?

[corruptmewithpower]

18. You'll love this

http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/20TH.HTM

[blindpig]

22. Discredited.

That the US doesn't even make the list is all ya need to see to know it's bullshit. Looks like some of that Samantha Power crap, it's genocide unless we've got our hands in it.

The numbers on communists countries are grossly inflated.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

23. According to the table Mexico's responsible for the deaths of 1.4 billion people.

And 76 billion in China.

:rofl:

[corruptmewithpower]

28. Million, not billion

If you look at the introduction page you'll find a search window where you can access any of the 5000 pages of text or 1100 documents on the website. Dr Rummel was a runner up for the NOBEL peace prize.

[corruptmewithpower]

25. The US does make Rummels list, though were not near the top.

Cognitive dissonance will overcome any and all evidence linking your heros to their actual atrocities. Your mind will simply not accept facts that conflict with your preconcieved notions. Thus' If Stalin and Pol Pot are are just a couple of great comrades and fello travelers to you, so be it.

[conturnedpro09]

35. Oh boy...

No, you're right. All that bad stuff about Stalin is just made-up American lies. With no personal accounts or witnesses or anything like that to back it up at all. Poor guy. :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:


(Seriously, we're better than this. Lord knows history needs to be debated and analyzed until the end of time. But communist mass murder doesn't deserve to be swept under the rug anymore than America's history of slavery does.)

[devilgrrl]

11. Oh yeah sparky? Explain Socialist Scandinavia too us all then.

:popcorn:

[corruptmewithpower]

12. Sweden is not extreme

Sweden's public sector(socialism) is about half it's economy. It's private sector is the other half. The swedes are continually refining the balance between socialism and capitalism.

[devilgrrl]

16. And wouldn't that just be awful if we were more like them!

:sarcasm:

[corruptmewithpower]

19. We are more like them.

[reggie the dog]

24. the USA is not at all like Sweden

People in Sweden have an idea what solidartiy means and they also understand the term paid vacation.

[progressoid]

20. I think that is what he/she is suggesting up thread.

"I suggest we forgo word games and try to find the optimum balance between the two. ]/i]

[eridani]

29. But when you get basic needs met, then what?

How do you allocate the surplus? There are too many possibilities and not enough time and resources, so it sort of has to be market, no? I don't think that everything belongs in the public sphere, although it should always be primary. I mean, you can have roads without iPods, but not iPods without roads.

[blindpig]

31. Planned economy

In a planned economy you produce what is needed, and this includes not just the necessities but also the amenities which make life pleasant and stimulating. Producing surpluses past the point of prudence is a capitalist thing and results in the problem of overproduction, which is one of the underlying causes of today's debacle. Why should people labor for no good reason, surely they can find better things to do with their time.

How will this be accomplished? I dunno. That is for those who are present in the post-revolutionary society to decide. Hannah Bell posted a quote from Marx which summed this up nicely but I'm afraid I cannot remember it exactly, something to the effect, " I am not writing a recipe book for the chefs of the future."

[eridani]

33. Amenities are not necessary, and we can't have all of them we might not

The government is best for utilities, infrastructure, education and health care, but unbelievably stupid about cars and iPods. If you don't believe that, drive a Yugo or Trabant sometime.

[conturnedpro09]

34. Neither.

Dealing in absolutes is almost always flawed. n/t

[rockymountaindem]

4. Right. And today some of them might call the Cathedral of Learning "pork"

When in reality, the whole point of Keynesianism is not what people are building, but rather the simple fact that they are employed and getting a money wage they can spend. I thought maybe we had all grasped that by now.

[ColbertWatcher]

6. Not only was Milton Friedman a great economist ...

... (gag) he was a time traveling great economist!

[ColbertWatcher]

5. Thank you, the slide show is amazing.

Who knew the baseball hall of fame was made courtesy of socialism?

[elizfeelinggreat]

9. k & r

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. I stayed at the Timberline last summer.

Beautiful piece of craftsmanship.

[Blue_Tires]

17. k+r

[ShortnFiery]

21. Socialism = Military and Government Health Care; GI Bill etc.

[alfredo]

26. Fire departments, sewers, interstates, public schools.

[eridani]

30. The computer industry, the aviation industry n/t

[alfredo]

32. So America is Socialistic, but too uptight to admit it. Admit it, accept it,

and use it for the betterment of all.

[David Zephyr]

27. Kicking this up for more to see.

Thanks.

[Greyhound]

36. Morning on the east coast kick. n/t