Can Californians do this?

[Cleita]

I can't, but can Californians, who are out of work, state employees who have been screwed over and any and all Californians who are fed up with this Governor do this kind of protest I'm about to suggest? Can you guys get in your cars and head over to the I-5 hwy and start driving towards Sacramento? Can we get millions of cars on that hwy to drive there and once in Sacramento circle the capitol and jam all the roads going there demanding Schwarzenegger resign and the Lt. Gov. John Garemandi take over immediately? Screw it, we don't have the time or money for a recall or election and we can't let him destroy our state any further. Let's demand he resign and let a new Governor be sworn in. Better than that, let's swear in the Attorney General, Jerry Brown, a former Governor, who actually knows how to fiscally run California, to be an interim Governor until we can hold an election. It's really time for a revolution and I can't see him ordering the National Guard on this one if no one is armed. A million car protest in the state capital honking horns should send a really loud message. I don't think you need a protest permit for this one as there is no precedent.

[wryter2000]

1. I suppose I'll have reason to

I'll probably get an IOU instead of a tax refund. :)

However, I think the Rs in the legislature are more of a problem than the Governator. They're the ones holding the budget hostage. Even Ahhhnold has told them we need to raise taxes and fees.

Maybe we could all make posters with a picture of a Republicant and take them to the protest.

[Cleita]

14. I believe IOUs for tax refunds are a possibility.

:hi:

[Johonny]

17. yeah the super majority rule on tax legislation

has basically frozen the ability of the state to respond to financial situations.

[noiretextatique]

2. i'm in...i will be driving through Sacramento

on the 15th and the 18th. let's demand a resignation from that idiot.

[Webster Green]

3. They would probably test some horrible new crowd control weapon..

But I'll go if everyone else does :P

[Oregone]

4. Isn't California totally broke now? Practically insolvent?

I mean, at this point, what do you want to do? Im totally in the dark, but can anything be done as of now to actually fix the Californian budget and economy that is a reasonable and sufficient solution to all parties (and by parties, I mean citizens, state employees, etc.)?

I million car protest might just emit greenhouse gases. But as I said, Im totally in the dark.

[Cleita]

15. Those cars won't be emitting any more gases than they would be being

driven around town. Get real.

[Oregone]

18. Just a joke about the emissions, but really, as to what I asked...

Whats the number 1 thing that needs to be done that Arnold isn't doing. Yeah, he sucks, but what does he, or anyone, have to work with right now?

[Cleita]

19. It's obvious he has failed on his campaign promise to open the books

and take care of the budget crisis in California. He needs to raise taxes on the very people who put him into office. He can't do that. Also, he can't seem to get rank and file Republicans to cooperate with him that much. He seems to have no control over the party in the state that he should be the leader of. Instead he has targeted ordinary workers and citizens, hurting them financially, to accomplish this making him very unpopular. He has failed. We can't wait until 2010 to fix this. We can't afford recalls and special elections. The most practical way is to demand that he resign and swear in the Lt. Gov. in his place and the only way we do this is to scare Sacramento into it. We do this by showing our displeasure with protests, the torches and pitch forks of previous eras. My million car protests is only a suggestion. There can be many other ways but they must be visceral as well as peaceful. Peaceful, alone doesn't cut it anymore. There has to be visceral and may I say with an element of surprise.

[Oregone]

20. So your ultimate solution to the economic crisis, as far as I can ascertain...

Is raise taxes on rich people? Alright, that probably needs to be done for revenue generation alone, but is that going to be an instant fix (or even a temporary) on the Californian economy itself?

Look, I understand you want to kick him out because you don't like him and what hes done. Im just thinking about the big picture, next step thing here. You can't just kick out people to pave the way to prosperity. Tax revenue is falling, and it has a lot to do with a fragile and crumbling economy.

[Cleita]

21. When he was running for Governor he solicited Warren Buffett as a financial

advisor. Warren told him what to do to get the taxes then needed to fix the budget problems, and that was to raise property taxes. Arnold fired him, telling him to do push-ups or something like that. Warren had the solution. Arnold wouldn't even form a committee on it to explore the idea. Warren is right though, Californians pay only 1% property taxes and that includes the very rich, who own multiple homes and properties and real estate owners from foreign countries like Saudi Arabia and Japan. These are the the targets who are enjoying the pleasures of our state because it's so affordable to them because of our property taxes are so low and this is in the sixth largest economy in the world. Now he's in such a mess that we need someone who knows how to run a government and who isn't beholden to these interests, a Democrat. John Garemandi has loads of experience in government including a successful run as Insurance Commissioner at one time. I know he will set about finding a solution to the problem and getting the funding needed to get us off this IOU merry-go-round.

[Garbo 2004]

71. Arnie did 'open the books' & found there was no misadministration that he'd suggested Davis was

guilty of. The 'results' of his budget review didn't get much publicity, since his administration didn't want to draw attention to the fallacy of his major campaign talking point.

And in subsequent years he didn't fix anything of course.

[crimsonblue]

39. Legalize and tax pot.

BAM! You gots monies!

[Cleita]

42. Do you realize how many foreigners are running banks here with practically

no oversight or taxes paid including Saudi Princes, whom I am certain are partially money laundering operations? I say tax them.

[crimsonblue]

46. That's a lie.

Any commercial, non-investment bank must follow the laws of California (or national laws if a National bank) and follow all FDIC and SEC regulations. To put the blame on "foreigners" such as "Saudi Princes" is racist. Foreign investment did not cause the bankruptcy of California. It was horrendous fiscal planning.

[Cleita]

48. Get off your high horse.

FDIC and SEC are a joke these days. Not enough inspectors to inspect, and not enough regulations to make them effective. If you haven't noticed we have had a big banking crisis lately. Saudi princes refers to the Saudi royal family, a group of dictators who rule their people with stonings and beheadings when it suits them. It's no more racist to refer to them as such than to refer to Hitler as a Nazi or Pinnochet as a muderous dictator. I guess that would make me racist against Germans and Chileans, which would be funny as I am both. I did not accuse the Saudi Arabian people as being part of this cabal because they are the victims. Since I lived in So. California and worked for a company who catered to these people, I know of what I speak. Since when do international arms dealers get the privilege of living here too keeping separate Beverly Hills mansions for each of their wives in violation of our bigamy laws? Yes, these are people who deal in international arms trade. The CIA, FBI and State Department know who they are and yet they are allowed to go and come because well I guess because of their money. I say tax them.

[crimsonblue]

53. wow. where to begin..

First of all, commercial banks did not get us into the credit crisis we are in. That'd be investment banks. They were the ones packaging and repackaging mortgage backed securities. Commercial banks are still regulated just fine. It is investment banks that had many of their regulations loosened. Oh, I forgot about credit unions too. Credit Unions are given all the rights of a real bank but without any of the regulatory hurdles.

Also, you are being racist. To say this problem is because of bigamist, dictatorial, murderous Arabs is not only racist, it is extremely delusional. Why is it, or should it, be illegal or immoral for a non-American to own land in this country? How does foreign investment in this country hurt the US?

Finally, just because you worked for a company "that caters to these people" (btw, nice pejorative use of "these people"... that's a bit racist), does not mean you are an expert on the economic crisis. Just because there may be some Saudi rich assholes doesn't mean they are to blame; there are rich assholes everywhere.

One last thing, you're plain ignorant if you don't think that every trade or business that is engaged in this country isn't taxed. See here for proof.

[Cleita]

59. Okay, I guess to say that former Prez. Bush

was a drunk, who wore cowboy boots would be racist against white people because he's white? I'll bet you don't know what real racism is. How do you feel about the current immigrant problem? Hmmm? "These people" as in rich assholes of any ethnicity or nationalism are whom my company catered to including Amurikans. I don't use the word race very much anyway as it doesn't exist. Nationality, ethnicity and cultural differences do exist. Very rich people who keep slaves and got their money because they are royalty don't get much respect from me. So sorry. It has nothing to do with their genes.

Foreign interests should never be allowed to buy our real estate and our home based businesses, let alone run our ports! This is a real flaw in our laws. Let them pay rent if they want to do business here just like we have to in many other countries. Yes, and we know how everyone and every business is taxed in this country. It's just that some are less taxed than others or is that another part of the newspaper you haven't read either along with the part about the banking crisis.

Also, there was a time when international banks could maintain offices in this country only to service their own clientele who were traveling abroad here in the USA. They never were allowed to take money from Americans for bank accounts and lend money. The laws for chartering banks back then forbade it. It was to protect our money and banking industry.

[Hannah Bell]

80. Tell everyone how much tax was *paid,* not what the useless regulation is.

[dysfunctional press]

79. "separate Beverly Hills mansions for each of their wives in violation of our bigamy laws"

one question- were the marriage ceremonies for the saudi's in question held in the u.s, or in saudi arabia?

unless the multiple marriages were carried out in the u.s., how would they be in violation of our bigamy laws?

[Cleita]

82. According to your reasoning the slaves that they bring over

here to be servants in those mansions are somewhat grandfathered in because they were originally indentured in SA. That wouldn't be in violation of our Thirteenth amendment? Is that right?

[dysfunctional press]

84. nope. btw- which amendment covers bigamy?

thwe bigamy laws are broken by the ACT of the marriage itself- if the marriage was carried out where the ceremonies are legal, it wouldn't be a crime. the multiple marriages may not necessarily be recognized in this country- but if the ceremony itself wasn't carried out here, the bigamy laws wouldn't be broken. if you don't believe it- research it for yourself. :shrug:

[Cleita]

86. You really are stretching a point aren't you? Tell that to the polygamists

arrested and investigated in Utah. From what I understand many of the marriages are done in Mexico.

[dysfunctional press]

87. that may be why they're done in mexico...

although another point that might make a difference is the nationality of the bi-/poly- gamist.

[pampango]

92. I "knew" it had to be the foreigners' fault some how. Thanks for the explanation.

:banghead:

Watch out for those people who look different or talk different! And the Canadians, too. They're sneaky because sometimes you can't tell them from a "real" American without asking to check their passport.

[Oregone]

65. Who would invest in that, when the feds raid the industry for their jollies?

[Cleita]

75. The feds won't be able to raid if it becomes legal.n/t

[global1]

5. "Terminate The Terminator" - New California Slogan.......nt

[Cleita]

22. "IOUs Don't Feed the Children" is another one. n/t

[kestrel91316]

6. My car would never make it.

[EFerrari]

7. There's DUers all along the way. You can do a relay.

Mine will take you from here to Sacto and back to here and it gets 30 MPG. It's older but the windows work!

[Howardx]

8. i blame the legislature

i dont much like arnold but in this case i think its the repubs in the legislature blocking things.

[Cleita]

9. Protest them too, but Arnold needs to go first. n/t

[Mz Pip]

52. This is true

The Repugs in the legislature won't even return Arnold's calls. We've got some real GOP whack jobs in our legislature, pig headed, dogmatic and inflexible.

[girl gone mad]

10. I don't understand what the point would be.

California is out of money. People in the private sector are losing their jobs, housing values have fallen dramatically. State employees need to understand that they will have to share in the pain, unless they would rather face a real revolt from the people who pay for their salaries and benefits.

[Cleita]

11. Hmm. I guess Ghandi and MLK have no meaning for you. n/t

[girl gone mad]

27. lol..

yeah, I'm sure MLK and Ghandi would have been all for turning future generations into debt slaves so that current government employees don't have to make any sacrifices while the private sector crashes and burns. :eyes:

[Cleita]

30. Are you sure you are on the right message board? None of your

Rush Limbaugh talking points hold much credence here.

[girl gone mad]

32. Grow up.

It's against DU policy to make those sorts of accusations.

Can you have a conversation without resorting to name-calling?

[Cleita]

38. Name calling? There was no name calling. However, I believe there is a DU

rule about repeating RW talking points. Hey we listen to Rush too.

[girl gone mad]

43. Obama capped salaries..

I guess he must be a RW hate radio listener.

FDR cut government wages. I'm sure it was because he listened to Rush Limbaugh, right?

People are hurting. California can't keep printing money and passing the bill on to their kids. It's furloughs or lay-offs. Which do you prefer?

[Cleita]

47. Oh for Gawds sake. Please tell the whole truth if you are going to put out

mindless drivel like this. Obama isn't Arnold to begin with so stay on message. Obama capped the salaries of CEOs to $500,000 a year on those companies who are to receive taxpayer's bail out money. California does not print money. It would be against the law. FDR what????. Do you have a source for that? I never have seen that in print before.

[Garbo 2004]

66. Obama froze salaries of White House staff making more than 100K.

"The president said the salaries of everyone on the White House staff that exceeded $100,000 would be frozen. If the Obama White House pay structure is similar to that of the Bush White House, more than 100 staffers will have six-figure salaries."
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/President44/Story?id=6693901&page=1

[Cleita]

68. Yes, he did, and on $100,000 a year minimum it's so hard to make ends meet.

:sarcasm:

What about the State employees who live from paycheck to paycheck and are making around $30,000 a year who are getting nothing but an IOU? How about the workers whose hours are cut and they won't even be getting an IOU for the lost hours, just an IOU for what's left. What Obama did hardly compares to what Arnold is doing.

[Garbo 2004]

72. I'm not saying it's at all comparable; facts show the weakness of the other poster's point.

Obama's not pretending that freezing wages at current levels for a few of his WH staff is a substantive remedy to the Federal deficit.

And btw, previous court ruling stated that CA state employees cannot be paid with IOU's.

[Cleita]

73. Actually, having once been a CA employee, I can state truthfully that we

don't get paid at all when there is a budget clash. Maybe that changed since I was employed by the State, but they didn't have to pay us until all the brouhaha was over and then we got it retroactively and not always in one lump sum at the same time. When I bitched about it, I was told that the State didn't have to follow labor laws like private industry had to.

[Garbo 2004]

76. Elected officials & appointees don't get paid if no Budget Act; civil svs employees do get paid.

There currently is an enacted state budget so not having an signed budget is not the issue.

With current cash/flow problem, State Controller indicated that if necessary pay would not be issued to elected officials and their appointed staff.

1992: Federal court ruled that Federal law prohibits issuance of IOU's to state civil service employees. They have to be paid.

[Cleita]

77. 1992 was after my time. Before then things were different. n/t

[girl gone mad]

67. No, Cleita. Obama froze the salaries of White House employees.

Obama sent a clear message of shared responsibility.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2009/01/21/national/w101818S64.DTL&feed=rss.news

Times are tough for everyone. We are in a deep recession, at best.

[Cleita]

69. He froze salaries of those making $100,000 and more a year. It hardly

compares to cutting hours on employees who are making $30,000 to $50,000 a year and then giving them an IOU for what's left.

[Garbo 2004]

64. Actually it's not a matter of furloughs or layoffs. And the Gov's DOF knows that. It's tokenism.

What would really be helpful, absent revenue increases, are massive reductions in funds for the state's social programs, education. What the Repubs want. And add prisons to that list.

[Cleita]

70. I could go for cutting down on the prisons. There are many ways of

sentencing non-violent offenders like hookers, drug possessors, bad check passers, etc. either by community service or fines. I think prison should only be for violent prisoners and those who are deemed a danger to society. Warehousing, feeding and doing all that it takes to keep someone in jail costs too much when they can be supporting themselves while doing whatever they have to do to satisfy the courts.

[Garbo 2004]

56. You do know that gov't employees are only a small portion of the state budget? And not all employees

are paid out of the General Fund?

You don't want future generations into "debt slaves?" Well it's not the state employees responsible for that. Cut all funding for health care, social programs and prisons. And cut education. There you go. The Republican solution. (Well, the Repubs like prisons and law enforcement, they just don't want to pay for them.)

[SidneyCarton]

12. As a State Employee I would suggest you turn off the RW Hate Radio...

Your comment smacks of the same old talking points that characterize State Employees as mere leeches on the body politic. Sure, a clerk like me makes little difference either way, right? Do you feel the same way about the Police, the Firefighters, the Prison Guards? Perhaps they should all just walk away from their jobs, (the guards could leave the doors open on their way out) and "let the market decide."

:eyes:

[girl gone mad]

24. People are broke.

You are asking Californians to put their children into massive, permanent debt rather than to have state workers take pay and benefit cuts. That's insane. Some compensation is extraordinarily out of line with economic reality.

As for the prison situation, how about letting non-violent drug offenders out? CA can't afford the draconian drug policies any longer.

[ourbluenation]

26. its hardly an either or. state employees vs the rest of us. sheesh. n/t

[girl gone mad]

28. I didn't say it was either/or.

Everyone is hurting. The burden needs to be shared. That was precisely my point.

[ourbluenation]

35. ya said this...

You are asking Californians to put their children into massive, permanent debt rather than to have state workers take pay and benefit cuts.

the problems in sacto have very little to do with the costs of administering sacto.

[girl gone mad]

44. Then what do you think the problem is? n/t

[U4ikLefty]

55. If you are from Texas...what do YOU know about our problems?

[donco6]

85. You certainly implied it.

Don't chicken out now. In for a penny . . .

[SidneyCarton]

51. You act as if we don't pay any of those taxes ourselves.

It would certainly be nice to live tax free as a part of the establishment, but alas, sadly that is not the case. State workers get to contribute like anyone else, but our rights to strike and act are somewhat more circumscribed.

Yes we all need to bear this burden together, yet interestingly enough, those who bear the greatest responsibility for this mess, who sit in that cute little domed building in Sacramento, are bearing little of it, if none at all, and are unlikely to do so anytime soon.

[Hannah Bell]

81. California - world's 8th largest economy & highest concentration of billionaires on the globe.

Some people may well be broke, but California is not broke by any means. It's being deliberately bankrupted in order to push through political & economic changes desired by a small segment of the population, in order to steal public resources & what remains of public power. It's effectively a rolling coup, the same type of thing that happened in Germany in the 30s, & you're all for it. I don't know your situation, but destroying the public sector is not going to help most people one damn bit. It will accelerate the chaos. Money is a fiction, get it? What's real is assets & labor, & control of the money supply is what's used to make labor work cheap & steal real assets.

"We're broke! No mo-o-ney!" I suppose since such fools exist we're going to live it all again.

[Cleita]

83. You mean we've gone down to 8th largest economy from 5th at the beginning

of the Bush administration? This is how much a combination of Bush and Arnold have disintegrated our State. There still are enough billionaires IMHO to tax to end our economic woes still. We need real leadership to accomplish this and Arnie isn't it.

[Garbo 2004]

23. Politcs, perception and PR is what the furloughs are really about. Rather than substantive

contribution to reduction of General Fund deficit.

Not all state employees are having their pay cut. Employees of the Legislature and State college/university system not impacted by the pay reductions.

Constitutional (elected) officers are not furloughing their civil svs employees or cutting their pay. There's been no court decision regarding the authority of the Gov to cut their pay. So in the meantime or until their bosses choose otherwise, employees of those state agencies will not be furloughed and will receive full pay.

And not all state ops are funded by the General Fund. Cutting pay of staff not paid out of the state's General Fund doesn't address the General Fund deficit, but it is being done nonetheless. So some of those estimated savings touted by the Administration will not translate into savings for the General Fund.

And I wonder how many of those people who you say would "revolt" are also among the folks who vote for measures on the ballot that have increased state obligations and mandates without regard to the fiscal impact to the state's budget?

And by the way, state employees pay state taxes and fees too. What will be the impact of reducing their incomes on general fund tax revenues?

[ourbluenation]

25. i'm at a private non profit that relies mostly on state funds. this isn't about state employees only

[Garbo 2004]

37. Indeed. n/t

[Garbo 2004]

13. The Repubs in the Legislature have been the obstructionists for years on raising revenue.

I'm not a fan of the Gov but he's not solely responsible. Any Gov would have problems with the Repubs in the Legislature blocking viable budget bills that include increasing revenue.

[Cleita]

16. Oh, puleeze, he is very responsible because he's stupid and doesn't know

how to control his own.

[Garbo 2004]

29. Heh. Dem Gov's haven't controlled Dem state Legislature & the Repubs in the Leg have their own

agenda. Arnie's not in a position to "control" them. They've not been best buds for a long time, if they ever were.

[Cleita]

33. Which only proves my point that he is ineffective as a governor and as

a leader of his party in this state. Control means that he has their support and apparently he doesn't making him pretty much a political eunuch.

[Garbo 2004]

49. Legislative power doesn't translate into obeying Gov. True of Dems & Repubs

in the Leg, regardless of who the Gov is.

Arnie was an outsider from the start. He may have been chosen by certain interests, but I don't think the Repub legislators were all that happy about the choice. They would have preferred one of their own kind from the party, which he wasn't.

[Cleita]

50. The Repub legislators hated the choice because they knew like we did

that he had become Governor by a coup orchestrated by the wacko wing of their own party. It's time for Arnie to go and the only way is by recall or resignation. Since we can't afford to recall him and we can't afford to vote him out of office in a year's time, we have to demand he resign and that the Lt. Gov become the interim Governor until the elections of 2010.

[Garbo 2004]

57. Jeebus, the Repubs in the Leg are the wacko wing of the Repub party.

Arnie wasn't chosen by the them.

[Cleita]

60. Some are, but some like my Assemblyman is actually a decent fellow, not

that I would vote for him, but since he does get reelected he has proven himself to be an American first and a Republican second.

[Cleita]

34. Dupe.

[girl gone mad]

31. He hasn't helped, but he didn't create the problem.n/t

[Cleita]

36. So who created the problem? If you say Grey Davis, I will smack your

ass back where it belongs.

[crimsonblue]

40. because he was awesome.

don't you forget it!

[JuniperLea]

41. Davis was right

But you never hear anyone say that out loud.

[Cleita]

45. Well, I do and I get the same reaction when I suggest that.

Davis did not hand his problem to Arnold, it was taken from him because Arnold said he could do better and he can't. Davis would have worked out the right solution if he had been able to finish his second term, which incidentally he had just be re-elected to.

[Garbo 2004]

61. Davis inherited a time bomb planted by Wilson and the Legislature, both Dems & Repubs.

When it hit, Davis was Gov. He did what he did to keep the electricity flowing in California.

[Cleita]

63. Yes, and if Davis had been allowed to finish his second term that he was

only a couple of months into, he would have come up with a solution. He was getting there. Also, when it came out what Enron had done, it would have helped vindicate him maybe even getting him on track to recouping a lot of the money. The recall spoiled all of that. I have visions of doing harm to Darryl Issa at times, but because I'm not a Repig, I won't think of that kind of revenge.

[JuniperLea]

74. The first thing Arnold did

Was to waste a bunch of money we couldn't afford to spend on a vote we would never cast in the direction he wanted it to go. He's a confused man. In typical Pubbie fashion, Arnold gave us a break on our car registration, only to find CA needs that money again. Read his lips...

[bridgit]

93. Don't forget his underwater smoking tent, that was a *stupendous* idea...

http://ga1.org/anr_actionnetwork/alert-description.html?alert_id=973077

[a la izquierda]

58. LOL!

I was appalled, when Davis was recalled. I lived in CA at the time and said to my husband that electing Arnold would be a disaster. I was spot on. We live in OK now...not nearly as much of a disaster.

[kiranon]

54. Not just governor but term limits (no one with knowledge left to figure out this mess)

and also Republicans only obstruct on ideological grounds. Sound familiar? It's happening in the U.S. Senate right now. Also, the 2/3rds majority to pass the budget makes it almost impossible as a small minority can prevent the budget from being passed. I am not a fan of Arnold's and believe his negotiating skills are not up to par but it is more than him.

[Cleita]

62. Of course it is. California politics have always been hot potatoes. For someone

inept like him to come along and try to fix things was ludicrous. He needs to go because he's incompetent. Garamendi has far more experience in doing California politics and I think we need him right now.

[Warren DeMontague]

78. Sacto is already one giant traffic jam.

I don't think anyone would know the difference.

[JI7]

88. this is what happens when you place Term Limits on Legislature

get rid of term limits. make it tougher to get propositions on the ballots. and get rid of proposition 13 and things would improve in California.

[1]

89. can they? yes. will they? no. n/t.

[Initech]

90. Fuck Ahnuld. Thank god his term is up this year and he isnt eligible for reelection.

[bridgit]

91. Sure. I live within a block of the capital, people march & shut down the streets routinely...

Prolly need a permit though :( Better least let someone know, authorities in this town are pretty good at traffic control. Could be diverted out into rice patties & corn fields, then you'll piss off farmers and little good comes of that :(:( Don't bother exiting on J St either, it's grid locked anyway :(:(:(

Not you, but it's interesting to see how many people from other states care so little for the details of what's going on in Cali not to mention Schwarzenegger. He was just the tool of Ken Lay & ENRON during the rolling blackout days ah the memories. We could use that 9bil Texas smack talking pirates bilked out of our power grid right about now + interest and yeah we're so hippy dippy we'll take a check just cut the damn thing! Consider it restitution.

http://www.theassassinatedpress.com/palast.htm

Everyone thinks it was Reagan and yeah it was, but he was just a tool too. The guy that got the boat sinking quicker decades ago was Howard Jarvis - Prop 13 ala Grover Norquist's theories of nearer_to_'0'_taxation wherever possible and let they that don't have chew their own feet off escaping the trap. All those high-ball hammered dudes and republican legislators that re-fucking-fuse to tax their high rolling cronies and their luxury stations in life.