The Johova's Witnesses just came to my door

[proud2BlibKansan]

At 9:30 on a Saturday morning.

I said "We're not interested" and shut the door.

Then my son went and looked out the window and said they stood for a long time and looked at the bumper stickers on my car.

So maybe I educated them? LOL

[skooooo]

1. uhh..

Aren't you going to tell us what your bumper sticker says?

[proud2BlibKansan]

2. Took most of them off not long ago

But I have 2 OBAMA stickers and a Cost of War sticker from AFSC. And a NO W.

edit: The Cost of War one is a horizontal version of this: http://www.afsc.org/Iraq/ht/a/GetImageAction/i/20159

[JVS]

8. Thetans be gone!

[mitchum]

3. Since they are door-to-door religious nuts who don't vote...

they bother me far less than the rest of their ilk

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. They are the only ones who ever go door to door here.

And not often.

[RTFirefly]

10. They don't vote?

I did not know that.

[JFKfanforever]

21. And they won't sing ANY national anthem either....

(not to mention how they refuse blood transfusions even for
babies and kiddies...)

So... when they show up unannounced and unwanted, I just say,
"In a bit of a rush right now; I'm just on my way to
donate blood!"

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

62. You and I are the only ones in this thread who mentioned that little fact about the JWs.

I loved your response. I promise I'll use it if they show up at my door. (Unlikely since I live in an apartment building with a gate.)

[proud2BlibKansan]

30. No birthdays or holidays either

[LiberalEsto]

15. They also refuse military service

But I still consider anyone who knocks on my door to promote their religion a huge pain in the ass.

[LuckyLib]

41. My small ceramic door plaque reads, "No solicitors. Religious or otherwise. We're happy just the

way we are. If that changes, we'll call you."

No fundies ring our doorbell.

[Kookaburra]

5. They're pretty friendly folks, but

9:30 a.m. on a Saturday morning is a bit ridiculous.

I usually don't mind talking to them, because they're not rude about pushing their religion in your face. They will discuss with you if you want though.

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. I have taught a bunch of their kids

They do a great job of keeping the teachers informed and aware of what their kids should and should not do. I have always appreciated that.

[Traveling_Home]

6. Thank Jehovah's Witnesses for speech freedoms - YOU OWE THEM

"So maybe I educated them?"
To BAD they didn't spend sometime educating YOU!!
http://www.adherents.com/largecom/jw_freedom.html
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

30 May 2000

If you have a front door, a Jehovah's Witness probably has knocked on it.

With well-dressed politeness and practiced persistence, they offer literature, biblical advice and a path to God's kingdom as they see it.

As often as not, they knock at the wrong time, when we're too busy to listen or not particularly interested in shopping for another faith.

But before you shut the door on a Jehovah's Witness the next time, pause to consider the shameful persecution they suffered not too long ago, as well as the rich contribution they have made to the First Amendment freedoms we all enjoy.

The legal clashes Jehovah's Witnesses had with government authorities over their proselytizing and practices led to an astonishing total of 23 separate Supreme Court rulings between 1938 and 1946 -- surely more than any other single religious organization engendered before or since. So frequently did Witnesses raise core First Amendment issues that Justice Harlan Fiske Stone wrote, "The Jehovah's Witnesses ought to have an endowment in view of the aid which they give in solving the legal problems of civil liberties."

Next month will mark the 60th anniversary of the most infamous Jehovah's Witness decision, one the Supreme Court got completely wrong: Minersville School District vs. Gobitis. The court, smitten by pre-World War II patriotic fervor, ruled it was constitutional to require Jehovah's Witness students to violate their faith and pledge allegiance to the flag in public school.

A Pennsylvania school district had expelled Lillian and William Gobitas (their last name was misspelled in court papers) because they kept their arms down during the daily flag salute. The Witnesses' interpretation of the Bible is that saluting the flag would amount to placing another deity before God.

As recounted in Shawn Francis Peters' powerful new book, Judging Jehovah's Witnesses, the Supreme Court's decision unleashed a wave of virulent anti-Jehovah's Witness persecution across the nation that is little remembered today.

Witness missionaries were chased and beaten by vigilantes in Texas. Their literature was confiscated and even burned. Less than a week after the court decision, a Kingdom Hall was stormed and torched in Kennebunk, Maine. American Legion posts harassed Witnesses nationwide. The American Civil Liberties Union reported to the Justice Department that nearly 1,500 Witnesses were physically attacked in more than 300 communities nationwide. One Southern sheriff told a reporter why Witnesses were being run out of town: "They're traitors; the Supreme Court says so. Ain't you heard?"

Partly because of this violent reaction to its decision, the Supreme Court reversed itself with remarkable speed. On Flag Day of 1943, the court handed down West Virginia State Board of Education vs. Barnette, using some of the most eloquent language ever written to describe the First Amendment freedoms Americans enjoy. "If there is any fixed star in our constitutional constellation, it is that no official, high or petty, can prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion or other matters of opinion," Justice Robert Jackson wrote.

The active persecution of Jehovah's Witnesses abated somewhat, although thousands were arrested during World War II for seeking religious exemption from military service. They were accused, baselessly, of being Nazi sympathizers. And Witnesses continued to have run-ins with the law over leafleting, in part because of their sometimes-confrontational style. Peters tells of a Jehovah's Witness caravan riding through Arkansas waving banners that read, "Religion is a Racket" and "Preachers are Crooks."

Today those messages probably would not cause a stir, and even then they should not have triggered violence. But in the America of the 1940s, they were pretty close to fighting words.

Speaking of "fighting words," that concept was embodied in First Amendment law by another Jehovah's Witness case, Chaplinsky vs. New Hampshire. A Witness named Walter Chaplinsky was arrested in Rochester, N.H., for his fiery street-corner evangelizing, which included attacks on the "harlot" Catholic Church and on saluting the flag. The crowd that gathered became so angry that a man tried to impale Chaplinsky on a pole bearing the U.S. flag.

The Supreme Court's 1942 decision placed "fighting words" such as those used by Chaplinsky outside the First Amendment's protection if they "by their very utterance, inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace." That standard remains relevant today and helped defeat politically correct speech codes that would have censored far-less harmful speech.

Perhaps the longest-lasting contribution the Witnesses made to First Amendment freedoms came in a 1940 case, Cantwell vs. Connecticut. The Supreme Court said Jehovah's Witnesses Newton Cantwell and his two sons, Jesse and Russell, should not have been arrested for soliciting without a license on the streets of New Haven, Conn. Before the Cantwell decision, it was not legally clear that the First Amendment protected religious practitioners against restrictions at the state and local levels as well as federal. But the Supreme Court in Cantwell said it did, thereby ushering in an era of greatly strengthened religious freedom.

All religions have the Jehovah's Witnesses to thank for the expansion of that freedom. But in their publications and on their Web site (www.watchtower.org) Witnesses make scant mention of their persecution and their legal battles.

Unlike other groups, the Witnesses have not resorted to televangelism and don't claim a high-profile presence in society. Witnesses -- all 1 million of them in this country, 3.5 million of them worldwide -- spread their message door-to-door and through the publications Watchtower and Awake!

"Their simple but eloquent voices tell a remarkable story," Peters says, "one that lays bare the extremes of cowardice and courage so often found in nations engrossed in war."

[proud2BlibKansan]

9. We don't do church here

So I refuse to waste their time.

[Traveling_Home]

16. Your Freedoms -- Your Loss nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

29. Don't need your lecture but thanks anyway

:hi:

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

61. If he needs a blood transfusion to save his life, he'll have it.

Hardly a loss.

[blaze]

11. Very interesting read

Thanks for posting.

[navarth]

14. Well, that's more reason than ever to be nice to them, I guess...but

they have some REALLY weird beliefs.

But if they stay away from my government I don't mind them too much. They haven't knocked on the door in quite a while.

Interesting thread, thanks to all.

[Traveling_Home]

23. I think you missed the point

"But if they stay away from my government"

They are responsible for much of the Freedom of Speech Laws that keeps the Government away from you! Much better to protect Citizens from a Government than to protect a Government from its Citizens.

Respecting Jehovah's Witnesses historical place in our Social History has nothing to do with their religous beliefs - which should be respected on their own as all our religous freedoms should be. Not knowing our own Constitutional history and at the same time deriding JW for their beliefs shows a lot of the irrational prejudice not only at DU but in our country as a whole.

Respect and Solidarity

[proud2BlibKansan]

31. And the KKK and NeoNazis are also responsible

According to your logic, since they filed suit to guarantee their free speech rights, I should praise them too.

And since the KKK doesn't knock on my door early on Saturday morning, I feel a bit partial to them today.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

46. Bingo!

[DebJ]

24. They stay away from all governments: they refer to Bible

passages stating that Satan has been given control of this world, and interpret part of that control as governments. Ergo, governments are the tool of Satan.
That is why they do not vote, sign up for armed forces, etc.

[defendandprotect]

35. They are Fundamentalits, are they not?

Literalists on the Bible?

[DebJ]

54. After three years of having cool debates with a pair of them at

my home every week, I'd say yes, they use a rather literal interpretation of the Bible. My sister married a Witness and converted. She lives out of state. Out of curiousity, when they came to my door, I invited them in. The husband was rather well-educated and liked to argue. So do I. So we had a good time for about three years. I never converted. Don't see how any self-respecting female could. He always cut his wife off from speaking and definitely communicated that she was inferior to him. She wasn't. He wasn't smart enough to realize she'd more likely have reached me than he could. But then again, with my love of politics and history and government, and my chain-smoking, it just wasn't going to happen!

[TechBear_Seattle]

17. Thank you for the history lesson

I don't much care for them or their religion, but Witnesses have forced recognition of some very important rights. It is important to remember that.

[Traveling_Home]

28. Well said - you are welcome ;-)

[Lint Head]

19. The is great, but, we can thank the authors of the Constitution

for the freedom of speech. The situations depicted in your post could have happened to anyone with the appropriate interpretation of the Constitution. All of our freedoms are challenged at one point or the other. The Jehovah's Witness folks just happen to be in the right place at the right time and they hit it out of the ball park.

I know their beliefs very well. Jesus is not locked away in a closet.
:dem:

[Traveling_Home]

25. True however......

"The Jehovah's Witness folks just happen to be in the right place at the right time and they hit it out of the ball park."

...and MLK got lucky, Obama is jsut in the right place at the right time, Lincoln's fierce defense of the Union wasn't special, ....

Get real - Each and every one of these cases of people standing up "Truth to Power" riskd and risked everything.

Belittle those not like you all you want but don't rewrite our Constitutional and legal history just to fit your prejudices.

[Schema Thing]

22. For all their pride in winning the supreme court case for "freedom", they extend none

of the same freedom to their own members.


I am shunned by most of my family and all of my former church community (which, because JWs are so insular, was my entire community) simply for talking about the fact that my beliefs changed.




"But in their publications and on their Web site (www.watchtower.org ) Witnesses make scant mention of their persecution and their legal battles."


This is because if people talk about their history, they will also dig up the not-so-pretty parts of their history.

[proud2BlibKansan]

33. I have a friend who can tell your story about his family

I am so sorry. :hug:

[elocs]

40. Thanks for the info, but I am pretty sure most here are not interested.

The preference at DU is for the religious caricature punching bag which is generally mocked and derided.

[Aristus]

51. Not a fan of Jehovah's Witnesses. But they were persecuted by the Nazis, too.

That whole thing about them being Nazi sympathizers was idiotic. The Nazis put them into death camps right along with the Jews and everybody else. You know the pink triangle of gay pride? It stems from the identifier gay internees had to wear on their uniforms in the camps. The Jehovah's Witnesses had to wear a purple triangle to identify them in the camps.

I don't like it when they knock on my door uninvited, but nobody deserves such persecution...

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JNelson6563]

56. They forgot about the Swaggart business

They fought hard for Jimmy to be ab le to market the shit out of his pap and n ot pay taxes. They lost. The Watchtower Inc. had to change their policy for lit distribution.

JWs are a cult pure and simple and they love persecution (as much as the next zealot of course). They think they are the only ones who will not die horribly gruesome deaths during the Big A and they look forward to your slaughter with glee.

Julie

[tilsammans]

57. Wow. I had no idea

Thank you for posting that. (Today I've been watching the documentary "Pete Seeger: The Power of Song." Another excellent story of the fight for our basic freedoms.) :patriot:

The JWs come around here often. They're always polite. While they do produce some valid points, I cannot wrap my head around most of it. We chat, and they go on their way.

[Catshrink]

12. They visit us from time to time, but not as much as the LDS missionaries.

The last time a JW came to my door, the woman fell in love with my dog and he with her. I hated to break up the love fest but I did.

I feel like I live in mini-Utah here which is why we have such reich-wing local legislators. Mine are all LDS and incongruently, anti-education.

[liberal renegade]

13. why don't the jehova churches have any windows?

because they don't want to be seen opening christmas presents.

[Thickasabrick]

18. Me too!! Mine came at 10:00. I told them I already had seen their

"tract". Big lie, don't care.

[monmouth]

20. I really scared them one morning, told them I was a Roman Catholic and

then stared at them...Hahaha, they took right off. They don't like Catholics for some reason or other..oh well.

[Donnachaidh]

27. Don't you know Catholics feast on the souls of the JW?

It's twue.. it's twue! :evilgrin:

[monmouth]

32. Bwhahahaha....n/t

[Jamastiene]

26. I have a rule.

Friends: Call before you visit.

Strangers: Move along. I don't open the door to any strangers.

[kestrel91316]

34. Several years ago I was out back working in the garden (it was a corner lot)

when two very polite young women in long skirts approached me across the fence and asked if they might speak with me. I knew they weren't Mormons but hadn't seen JWs before. They handed me a fire-and-brimstone tract and I just sort of shrugged and said "no thanks, I'm not interested" rather than get into a theological debate (my impromptu debate skills are poor).

To their credit, they smiled sweetly and waved and went on their way. Maybe they figured somebody who liked to garden as much as me (my yard was the envy of the neighborhood) couldn't be too bad. Probably best that they didn't know about my pagan leanings.

[TlalocW]

36. The Saturday morning visits were so bad when I moved into my house 10 years ago

That I put up a sign with this image:



And then a checklist of people I didn't want to talk to:
Salespeople
Jehovah Witnesses
Mormons
Anyone who wants to tell me why their religion is better than mine

Next to JWs and Mormons I had two small asterisks that corresponded to small print at the bottom.

* JWs can be an exception only if you're willing to talk about doomsday prophecies your elders have made in regards to Bible verses Deuteronomy 18:20-22, which deal with identifying false prophets (and doing so is really, really easy according to those verses).
* Mormons pretending to be Jehovah Witnesses will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

A friend of mine in Wisconsin told me that a family of JWs - mom, dad, and young daughter - knocked on her door, and she talked pleasantly with them for five minutes on the porch before saying something like, "Is this your daughter? She's so cute!" When the parents smiled and thanked her, she bent down to the kid's level and said, "When you get older, if you can find your way back here, I'll give you sanctuary from the cult your mommy and daddy are in." They quickly left, went out to the street, made some "mystical" signs towards her house, and she was never bothered by them again.

TlalocW

[defendandprotect]

37. Dragging the "kid" around on hot summer Saturdays was sad . . .

We had a neighbor who used to offer them water.

We never opened the door to them --- unless they would have truly needed something.

I think when you do, you're simply encouraging them.

[proud2BlibKansan]

42. LOL!

[Jmac2]

38. They visited me too this morning...

They were polite, told a little about themselves, promoted their website and they went on their way in about 5 minutes. Even though I am a religion hating atheist, it never hurts to give them a few minutes of my time to listen. Its not like they are going to transform my beliefs. So there is no need to be an asshole like the fundies.

I am suprised that some people are so rude and seem to enjoy bragging about their rudeness. Even though being somewhat uncomfortable, it didn't hurt one bit to give them a few minutes. After seeing how some people treat them from the post in this thread, I am happy that they left our incounter not having ran into some of the assholes above.

Next time you go on a voter drive/phonebank or such and run into some republican asshole who tells you to fuck off, curses you out, or calls you a commie. Just remember how you treated the JW's and that you deserved it.

[proud2BlibKansan]

43. Excuse me?

I wasn't rude to them. I said no thanks we aren't interested. Now please explain to me how that was rude. Sheesh.

[MajorChode]

39. Just tell them they are just in time for the orgy

...cuz you were just about to pull down the shower curtain and get out the wesson oil.

Life is too short not to fuck with JWs.

[UTUSN]

44. Despite the history lessons here & comments on our "rudeness" they are ARROGANT

Or "stiff necked" as the book would say.

I used to try to be polite to them, but they wore me down. So now I can tell it's them on sight, usually in 2s or 3s, sometimes with a child. I keep a chain with lock on the gate, not from being a recluse, but because the JWs and/or meter readers or whomever would leave the gate open and my dogs would get out.

They seem to be attracted to my place because it has a tree shading the entry to the gate, a bell, and on the porch a pineapple knocker, a dachsund shoe scraper, a couple of seahorses----------heck, it just dawned on me I live in a CIRCUS!1

So they find it cute until I come from around the corner. Once I said on sight, "If it's about religion I don't want to talk about it!1" The woman said, "O.K., so can I talk to you about the Bible?!1" I was momentarily flabbergasted until I managed to regroup and say, "What did I SAY?!1"

Another time a woman had parked in front of my house and after I said I didn't want a religious visit I said, "And I'd appreciate your parking elsewhere." She didn't miss a beat and said, "This street BELONGS TO THE GOVERNMENT." Apparently, as the historical poster above has shown, they are schooled in their civil rights. I said, "Well, I'm the one who has to cut the grass there and keep my government mailbox there, and I didn't say you physically couldn't park there, just that I'd appreciate it if you didn't, and there are other neighbors across the street and up the street who don't care, while I DO care."


But on a more graceful note, in Spanish they are Los Testigos (witnesses) de Jehovah," which is turned into a joke, "Los testiculos (the testicles) de Jehovah." Accent on the "i" in testiculos.

[MiniMe]

45. My dogs don't like JWs for some reason

Of course they bark at anybody on the other side of the door. So I let them bark, and say "sorry", and close the door. Can't hear a word they say. (good dogs). I don't feel a bit bad about it. I am polite, but I don't want to be preached to in my own home.

[bdamomma]

47. good for you, I hate when people shovel their religion down our throats.

[Catshrink]

48. It must be "save your ass day" because they were just here too.

But we were in the car and on our way out to the doggie park so we couldn't stop to chat. :evilgrin:

[carlyhippy]

49. OMG they were at my door at 10:00 a.m this morning

da man was in the shower, they rang the doorbell and knocked on the door, I have the flu and was asleep, didn't feel like listening today. They slipped a brochure under the door, and I got up to look out the window, and they sat in my driveway for like 5 minutes after they left the door......

[Liberal_in_LA]

58. wow. Jehova stalkers?! What's up with the standing around for 5 minutes after knocking. weird

[carlyhippy]

63. yeah, that is my thoughts.....but I did them a favor

I probably would have ended up coughing or sneezing all over the both of them, they would be sick today. The last time they came by the did the same thing, waited in the car in the driveway for like 5 minutes after they left the door.

[carlyhippy]

50. .

!

[sfpcjock]

52. Assuming that they read LOL

[Catherine Vincent]

53. If anyone rings my door bell and I don't know beforehand, I don't answer.

I tell my niece all the time, "it's my house and I don't have to answer the door!". Salesman, JH, cute kid selling cookies...it doesn't matter. I don't answer the door. I look out the window and watch them go to the next house with a smile on my face.

[Raine]

59. Same with me

unless I'm expecting someone I know (who has called ahead of time) I NEVER open the door. :-)

[earthboundmisfit]

60. My S.O. is rather intimidating, looks-wise -

The one and only time they came to the door, all he did was go to the window (on the front door), looked out shaking his head "no", and they turned tail and split before he could open the door. None have been at our door since - perhaps word got out that if you knock on this door, Sasquatch answers.
:P