Armour shows how Henry VIII grew into an ‘absolute monster’

[Adsos Letter]

Source: TimesOnline/UK
Ben Hoyle, Arts Correspondent

Early in Henry VIII’s reign the Venetian Ambassador described him as “the handsomest potentate I ever set eyes on, with an extremely fine calf to his leg . . . and a round face so very beautiful that it would become a pretty woman”.

Six wives, one Reformation and a lot of feasting later, Henry had become, by the time of his death in 1547, larger than life.

Just how large, and when, has long been a source of speculation, but research by the Royal Armouries in Leeds has now provided the nearest thing to a definitive set of vital statistics. The findings will go on show at the Tower of London from April.

Analysis of suits of armour made for Henry and reunited for the first time since the Tudor era proves that the king was 6ft 1in — well above average even today. As a young man he had a sportsman’s physique, with a waist measuring about 32in and a 39in chest. By his late forties, his waist had drifted to nearer 48in and in his final years he appears to have been carrying a 52in waist and 53in chest.


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/men/art...

[xchrom]

1. 52'' waist?!?!

those wives were dealing with WAY more than i thought.

they may have handed 'thank you' notes to the headsman.

[Adsos Letter]

3. Indeed xchrom...

:rofl: :hi:

[Berry Cool]

7. Luckily, they didn't all get beheaded.

Although the vast majority of the population still seems to think they did.

[TahitiNut]

11. Anne Boleyn and Catherine Howard would get little solace from that.

Jane Seymour died before he got around to dispatching her.

[WolverineDG]

21. And he died before he could behead Catherine Parr

Anne of Cleves took his divorce settlement & ran.

dg

[WolverineDG]

20. Divorced, beheaded, died; Divorced, beheaded, survived

Henry VIII was a fascinating person in history.

dg

[Earth_First]

2. I don't see hot hotdogs has anything to do with this... n/t

[mikeytherat]

17. What kind of man eats Armour hot dogs?

mikey_the_rat

[B o d i]

4. Why did you include a link for posting new threads in general discussion?

:shrug:

I think this is the one you wanted http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/men/article5635985.ece

[Adsos Letter]

6. Thankyou B o d i

I have two windows open, and became disoriented... :crazy:

I'll edit it. :D

[rpannier]

5. His fall from a horse left him unable do much of anything very physical

Yet he kept on eating like he did before the fall.

I find the story interesting thanks for the post

[Berry Cool]

8. He also developed gout and a nasty ulcer on one leg

that oozed pus and caused him constant pain.

I'm sure he was a real peach toward the end.

I understand that when he got really big they actually had to come up with a harness and winch they could use to haul him up into the air, fully suited in armor, and deposit him atop his horse.

[the_chinuk]

13. It wasn't just him ... It was also ME, the Baron Vladimir Harkonnen!!!!

... some of the knight's armor costumes got pretty intense and heavy. They had to hoist a lot of riders.

But actually I just wanted to work the Baron Vladimir Harkonnen in here somehere.

[rpannier]

14. When you read stuff like that

It makes it easy to see why so many people were dead by 35 (not as the result of being killed at the hand of another person)

[Stevenmarc]

9. Talk about canned ham

[Duer 157099]

10. here's hoping they stop the series before it gets that far

[leftchick]

26. I just read

they will not be making that Henry heavy during the series. I can see why. Who the hell would want to go to bed with this?

[BirminghamExaminer]

30. Who would want to go to bed with a guillotine?

[the_chinuk]

12. I guess Henry VIII had a posse ...

Enjoy!

[muriel_volestrangler]

15. You've missed off an 'I'

Just sayin'. :D

[the_chinuk]

18. Oh, bloody hell! B-) n/t

[WolverineDG]

22. Um, yeah, but that's not Henry VII nt

[Princess Turandot]

16. He was a monster in more ways than one IMO...

Catherine of Aragon was treated very badly by his father H7 (in the period between the untimely death of Arthur, Prince of Wales (her first husband) and then by Henry VIII, after his divorce. (Some of his biographers defend his actions re: the divorce by the need for him to produce an heir, except that women could inherit the English throne, as Mary I, his first daughter by Catherine did, followed by his daughter by Anne Boleyn, Elizabeth I.)

Anne Boleyn was in all likelihood innocent of the charges against her. If Jane Seymour had lived, I don't think he would have killed her since she was the mother of his heir but he may have ultimately divorced her. He started looking for wife 4 about 30 days after Jane died. Number 4, Anne of Cleves, lucked out: he almost immediately had that marriage annulled and treated her very well. (It helps to be related to other important powers, which may be one reason why Catherine of Aragon wasn't suddenly found to be guilty of treason and sent to the Tower.)

Katherine Howard was a teenager child largely manipulated into marrying him by her unscrupulous relations. (From what I've read, she likely did 'cheat' on him.) He also almost killed Number 6 (I'm starting to sound like Dr. House!), Katherine Parr (who married him after he had attained the OP's said bulk) for challenging his interpretation of scripture. An arrest warrant was issued for her, but she was apparently was a smart cookie and made up with Henry before the warrant (or she herself) was executed.

Talk about family values! It's no wonder that Elizabeth I never married!

[Coexist]

19. how did that old mnemonic device go?

divorced, beheaded, died, divorced, beheaded, survived... is that it?

[dugaresa]

23. he was a monster but the need for an heir was most likely

a legacy of parental guilt...

His father Henry VII did not have a strong claim to the throne. He married the late king's daughter Elizabeth of York to settle the "war of the roses", however there were many folks who had far greater claim to the crown. In fact both Henry VII and VIII did their best to execute everyone who had a better claim and who happened to even move a pinky in their direction. Henry VII's strongest claim to the throne was beause his mother Margaret Beaufort was the descendent of John of Gaunt by his mistress Katherine Sywnford...(later legitimized through their late marriage)

Remember that up until that point, the only woman who have held the throne was Matilda (direct heir to William the Conqueror and thus had a strong claim) and she was deposed before even being crowned. Later her son Henry II would regain the crown in his own name.

With that legacy...men like Henry VII and Henry VIII did not want to trust that their subjects would unite under Mary as queen. In Mary's favor, I think had she been married off young to an English noble with an equally strong claim to the throne, Henry may have been able to rest in peace had their been male grandchildren. But..remember this was an era when women died in childbed pretty frequently ..yet another reason Elizabeth I may have not wanted to marry and go into the business of pushing out babies.

So Henry wanted to make sure that the Tudors could retain their claim on the throne...and to a degree they did through the marriage into the Stuart line...

[WolverineDG]

29. There was a long civil war when Matilda claimed the throne

she & Stephen kept swapping places. Sharon K. Penman wrote a book about it: When Christ and His Saints Slept.

The war only ended when both sides agreed that Matilda's son Henry would become king after Stephen died.

dg

[WolverineDG]

24. Actually, up until Mary I, England had never had a queen

except for Matilda & there was a long, bloody war over that. Henry grew up at a time when the War of the Roses was still in living memory & probably wanted a male heir to prevent that from happening again. (Not saying that as an excuse; more like the underlying reason for his desire for a son) I don't think he would have looked for #4 had Jane Seymour survived

Yes, he did treat Katherine horribly, but he never had her arrested for continuing to refer to herself as Queen of England & his wife & when she died, he was heartbroken. Anne's behavior on this news (she celebrated openly) didn't help her situation with him at all & probably worsened it.

Oh don't get me started on those damn Howards. :grr:

dg

[pipi_k]

28. My thoughts as well

"I don't think he would have looked for #4 had Jane Seymour survived"

I agree...

He had gotten his male heir from Jane, and he was already dead by the time Edward died, so while he may have played around with other women while still married to Jane (had she survived...and probably even before she died) he probably would have honored her as the mother of his only son.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

25. Henry the XIII also had portraits done through his years and although you don't have

the measurements, you can see how he became much larger.

http://www.marileecody.com/henry8images.html

1509 (17 years of age)


1520 (28 years of age)


1536 (45 years of age)

[LostinVA]

27. Very, very interesting -- thanks!