Are we on the leading edge of the next Great Depression?

[Postman]

And why is the 900 pound gorilla in the room being ignored?

Credit Default Swaps and Derivatives......

[Lint Head]

1. It's being ignored the for the same reason George Bush is not in jail.

:dem:

[Postman]

2. Because both parties are guilty of deregulating the Market?

[rwheeler31]

3. Oh for God's sake we are in a depression.

These financial guru-res make me sick.

[RJ Connors]

6. Thank you, that was my thought also. And it is clearly

going to get worse, before it gets better. So one thing we really don't need right now is a bunch of Republicans obstructing an effort to minimize the damage, to score points with their nut case base.

[Political Heretic]

4. It's being ignored because the capitalist class doesn't want to lose the tools that made them rich

..and they aren't going to be the ones seriously hurting during this Depression.

And they believe things will turn around again and they can go back to their society-raping lifestyle of sucking the system dry for their own exponential, exploitative gain.

That's why.

[waiting for hope]

7. Can we go squat in their 9,000 square foot

homes when they finally get kicked to the curb? I smell a mob forming down the road, I wonder if they do to?



Mine is all shiny and sharp... :evilgrin:

[sendero]

24. Pretty much..

... but something tells me that they are not going to get their wish this time.

I see torches, pitchforks, and new new deals that will make them CRY.

[Old Codger]

5. Good grief

we are long past the "leading edge", we are in the midst of a good(bad) beginning of a deep depression.

[blues90]

8. I would say we are at the tipping point

ready to go right over the cliff. Some will survive this and I feel many , many won't.

I don't have any idea how I will survive this , you reach a certain age and you have no doubts where you fit into this depression.

I still feel a lot of the talk is to hold off mass panic.

[Greyhound]

9. Because a 900 lb Gorilla is a scary thing and if we acknowledge it's presence

it also follows that we are well and truly fucked. Shortly thereafter comes the realization that we (most of us) have wasted our short lives pursuing an illusion that was built for the single purpose of fooling us into to expending our lives in the pursuit of someone else's dream, and have passed the yoke on to our children as it was passed on to us, and that just sucks.

"Hanging on in quiet desperation"

[drmeow]

11. "Hanging on in quiet desperation"

didn't used to be the American way.

[Greyhound]

18. No, but it's been a very long time and they are dead.

It was a beautiful dream, too bad so few of us understood it.

[terisan]

16. Hmmmm. Good image of pursuing dreams of others--passing the yoke.....

[liberal N proud]

10. The one that safeguards were put in place to prevent?

The one that one political party has spent decades attacking the safeguards that were put in place to prevent?

The one that one political party has spent decades trying to make happen?

Yeah we are at the cusp of Depression II

[Postman]

12. BOTH parties are responsible, my friend...

Bill Clinton signed the repeal of the Glass-Steagal Act in 1999.

He was also responsible for a large portion of our manufacturing base leaving the country...can you say NAFTA?

Remember Ross Perot's comment about NAFTA? "If NAFTA is signed you're going to hear a giant sucking sound of jobs leaving the country"

[yourout]

14. Ding..Ding..Ding.....the biggest "Stain" on the Clinton presidency had nothing to do with a dress...

and everything to do with a pen.

Yes NAFTA and the Glass-Steagal Act were Republican ideas that were forced in his face but ultimatly he signed them so he is partly responsible.

[terisan]

26. Glass Steagall was passed in Congress with veto-proof majority-34 Democrats voted yes.

The current VP Joseph Biden was one of those Democrats, Kennedy was another.

[madrchsod]

13. it does`t have to be.......

[BlooInBloo]

15. I wonder how many people here actually know what a (financial) derivative *is*"?

Without referring to another source of knowledge.

[Postman]

17. All I know is what Thom Hartmann told me....

a derivative is a bet....

[BlooInBloo]

20. Thanks.

[closeupready]

23. I worked in derivatives for a while, and even I can't explain what they are or how they work.

n/t

[Greyhound]

25. I do.

I also know that the proper word is effect, not affect (errata from another thread).

[lib2DaBone]

19. Credit Default Swaps and other chicanary....

..were the proud work of Phil Gramm and his wife (Wendy), who served as chairman of the CFTC.

Wendy paved the way for the infamous ENRON deals. No one ever went to jail.. well, not for long.

Then Hubby Phil came back and deregulated the CDS markets and swept the SEC to the back of the room. We don't need no stinkin' regulation.

Thus..we ended up where we are today. And, as you may remember, Phil Gramm is the media darling and was "Economic Adviser" to John McLame.

And of course, our media protects Phil Gramm and John McCain.. and all the other criminals in Washington, D.C.

-----------------------
Who’s to blame for the biggest financial catastrophe of our time? There are plenty of culprits, but one candidate for lead perp is former Sen. Phil Gramm. Eight years ago, as part of a decades-long anti-regulatory crusade, Gramm pulled a sly legislative maneuver that greased the way to the multi billion-dollar sub prime meltdown. Yet has Gramm been banished from the corridors of power? Reviled as the villain who bankrupted Middle America? Hardly. Now a well-paid executive at a Swiss bank, Gramm co chairs Sen. John McCain’s presidential campaign and advises the Republican candidate on economic matters. He’s been mentioned as a possible Treasury secretary should McCain win. That’s right: A guy who helped screw up the global financial system could end up in charge of US economic policy. Talk about a market failure.

http://jontaplin.com/2008/05/31/foreclosure-phil-gramm/

[wuvuj]

21. Not looking good....

This compares job losses so far with the last 2 recessions....rate of fall has not started to slow....I think this one is going to hurt...

[Postman]

22. Rachel Maddow showed this graph....

I nearly fell out of bed looking at it....

[Venceremos]

27. Yes but we'll get through it

My parents lived through the first one and came out better for it. They were extremely financially responsible, thrifty, didn't try to "keep up with the Joneses", kept one credit card to use only in case of emergency, etc. Those qualities are sorely lacking in my generation, to everyone's detriment. So although a depression is going to hurt and bad, when it's all said and done, I think our society will end up better for it.

[Cynical Guy]

28. It's not being ignored.

They can't see it. It's not in print, it's not sitting in the room, and very few of the people in positions to regulate these instruments understand them. Try to explain compound interest to a normal person, and they'll pass out. This type of stuff hurts the heads of people who are very bright.

Credit Default Swaps and Derivatives are not necessarily bad things. But a total lack of controls allowed them to be misused.

Should options and futures contracts all stop? No. Those are well regulated and work very well.

How pensions and foundations were ever suckered into investing in non-tangible returns is beyond me.