Can anybody convince me that the high speed LA < --- > LV rail is pork?

[Stinky The Clown]

[ejpoeta]

1. apparently anything can be pork.... someone just has to call it that.

it's kind of ridiculous, really.

[Hello_Kitty]

2. It's money being spent on something other than blowing up, or locking up, brown people

Hence, it is pork in the Republican dictionary. See also it's synonym: welfare.

[Hello_Kitty]

3. Oh, and did you catch how Senator Fuckface described it?

"A train from Disneyland to Vegas" Like it's the friggin' Monorail to the Goofy lot or something.

[sutz12]

7. See that's why they hate it..

It's taking all of that good wholesome family entertainment and connecting it directly to sin city.

Did you catch the :sarcasm: in that? I hope so. You'd think they would love connecting the two biggest cash cows in the southwest together.

[Mr. Sparkle]

4. anything not going towards big business and then recycled back to the republicans .. is pork!

[sutz12]

5. Pork is generally anything you want to do, but I don't.

If I want to do it, it is a public works project, and therefore valuable.

Got it?

;)

[Lost in CT]

6. It's a damn good idea. nt

[Dreamer Tatum]

8. If it was a good idea, the casinos would have paid for it by now

I don't see how rushing people to and from Las Vegas does much of anything new for the economy.

[Cronus Protagonist]

11. Why would they do that when they can get it for FREE sucking on the government's teat?

lol

[Orrex]

12. That's my view as well

It's not as if there are millions of jobs in LV awaiting those high speed commuters.

[Deep13]

13. It's energy conservation.

An alternative to cars.

[Hello_Kitty]

14. Creates jobs and cuts down on driving and flying.

It's a helluva lot more stimulative than giving those casino owners a fat tax cut.

[Dreamer Tatum]

23. That's the alternative? A tax cut to casino owners?

Let me get this straight: building rail between one city and one of the last places a lot of people should be going right now is going to help the economy...how?

Building a white elephant employs people to apply white paint, and that's about it. Is any part of the desert likely to get developed because of the train? No - if a train goes 200mph, who the hell wants to stop in Barstow or Baker?

If high speed rail to population centers would help Vegas, there'd already be a spiderweb going from San Diego, Phoenix, and LA. If you want true economic growth from high speed rail, connect Houston and Dallas. Philly, New York, and Boston. Portland and Seattle. Minneapolis and Chicago. LA to Vegas is a vanity project.

[NashVegas]

30. At What Price?

This is Las Vegas we're talking. A city that's going to have to go to war with three other states for its water supply.

If we're going to do this, may as well hand over Social Security to Wall St. now and just get it over with.

[Deep13]

9. It is a useful project that Congressmen from both states want.

Call it whatever you want, but it seems like a good idea to me.

[ContinentalOp]

10. Well, you can kind of look at it as a big handout to the vegas and socal tourism industries...

but so what? GOOD!

[Hello_Kitty]

17. Maybe LV's economy could grow beyond casinos and tourism if they had rapid transit.

And while they're at it, they should connect that train to Phoenix too.

[Sebastian Doyle]

22. And then on to Tucson.

Might as well add another 100 miles of track, if you're already in Phoenix.

Eventually they should have a high speed rail line running parallel to the main north-south and west-east Interstate highway corridors, like I 5 on the west coast, or I 10 which starts in LA and goes through most of the major cities on the southern edge of the US

[Hello_Kitty]

27. Absolutely, and then on to Santa Fe and Albuquerque. eom

[girl gone mad]

28. Or water? n/t

[Dreamer Tatum]

31. Yes, then you could be a fry cook or a maid in Vegas and still live in Phoenix

Please. Connecting Southern California with high speed rail would do far more for the economy. Outside of gaming, there is very
little commerce in Vegas, and I am not in favor of encouraging development of a desert area that requires so many natural resources to sustain as livable for humans.

[Hello_Kitty]

33. Uh, you mean a desert climate like So. California?

Don't let all the greenery fool you, they don't get much precipitation there.

[Dreamer Tatum]

34. Not a good time to make that claim

We've gotten 5 inches in two weeks here.

And SoCal is more sustainable than Vegas every day of the week.

[Hello_Kitty]

37. We got about the same amount in Phoenix last week.

We had to let water out of the Roosevelt dam into the Salt River basin because it was full.

Edit: Really, you're sounding like one of those Global Warming deniers who seize upon a cold day to "prove" that it's a hoax.

[Dreamer Tatum]

38. And there was a lot of snowfall up high

Very, very nice to see the reservoirs get some love, the groundwater get charged, and snowmelt to be more significant.

[jmg257]

15. It depends if one figures it the right way to spend the money, that could be spent on current

transportation.

Here's a good article for both sides...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25265682/


Could America’s fastest train whisk us away from $4-a-gallon gas guzzlers?

Thanks to a $45 million infusion from a transportation bill signed by President Bush in early June, there could someday be a magnetic levitating train, or “maglev,” soaring from Disneyland to Las Vegas at a maximum speed of 310 mph — 180 mph on average.

After the research phase is complete in about three years, the private partnership behind the effort, American Magline Group, comes to its biggest crossroads: obtaining $12 billion in funding for construction.

...

America’s fastest train could compete with air travel. Flying from Anaheim, Calif., to Vegas on a passenger jet cruising at about 550 mph can cost upward of $150, while a ticket for the same route on a maglev would cost $55, according to the American Magline Group.

Plus, the maglev doesn’t pollute. It’s energy efficient. And it's low-maintenance because the train levitates — thanks to magnets — avoiding wear-and-tear on the underlying “guideway.” That’s what propels the vehicle through a magnetic field established by the electrical grid. Upping the current accelerates the train. Lowering the current slows the train. And reversing the current stops or pushes the train backwards.
...

“It’s great to have a train that goes 200 mph from Disneyland to Las Vegas, but that money could improve things in Los Angeles, Chicago, Miami, New York ... Seattle,” said FRA spokesman Steve Kulm.

[Still Sensible]

16. no

[BR_Parkway]

18. You think they'd like this - all this infrastructure is something they can try to

privatize and make money off of later on down the road.

[Kajsa]

19. You mean providing mass transit

to an area choked with cars and air pollution is " pork", according to
the Repubs?

So riding around in a gas guzzling tank is preferable,

Typical pretzel logic.

[SmileyRose]

20. rich people take private jets - the rest of us are unworthy of the investment

we are only liabilities. You don't invest in liabilities.

[kestrel91316]

21. Well, one COULD make that argument if one thought Las Vegas

was a city doomed to turn to dust within 50 years........

But I still would support it, because it would shave HOURS off the drive to Ely from Los Angeles.

[sutz12]

24. It's a down payment on transcontinental high speed rail...

First LA to LV.

Next LA to Chicago.

Then coast to coast at 200+MPH. NY to LA in 24-30 hours, and a lot greener and cheaper than air travel.

[customerserviceguy]

35. According to Sade

LA to Chicago is "coast to coast".

OK, so I'm not such a smooth operator!

[Sebastian Doyle]

39. Well, Chicago is on the "coast" of Lake Michigan, right?

So she's not entirely wrong.

The logical route for any LA to Chicago run would be the old Route 66

I think there's a song about that.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBmr5EuwCEQ

[sutz12]

41. Route 66 goes too far south...through Texas and Okla.

Screw them. :)

Ordinarily, I wouldn't want engineering decisions made based on politics, but :shrug:.

Run it up through SLC (yech), over through Denver and then to Chi-town and points east.

But, you're right. Geologically, it probably makes more sense to go through Albequerque and St Louis. ;)

[ColbertWatcher]

25. I can't. Sorry. n/t

[AntiFascist]

26. This has been proposed since at least 1990....

the huge investment required was probably a deterrent to getting investors. They've also had some wild plans for growing LV into some sort of mega-metropolis, but I would think that water scarcity would be a concern.

[tkmorris]

29. Pork = Money spent on someone else's state

[madrchsod]

32. pork? it`s the whole dam sow

southern california needs to get cars off the roads. public transportation in southern california is a far better investment

[Ichingcarpenter]

36. The thing is the Vegas route has the least physical barriers to overcome

getting out of California and making a high speed rail corridor east.
San Diego is another option but is further south and has more terrain problems
and besides LA serves a bigger population center.

I'm not big on Vegas but if you know the terrain of California
and you want intercontinental high speed rail to happen, this is a good place to start.

[AntiFascist]

40. Back in the good ole days when California had a budget surplus...

there were plans for spending this surplus on a statewide high-speed rail system. Guess who was behind the energy crisis (deregulation) that turned the surplus into a huge deficit, which consequently also had the effect of making electricity much more expensive for the entire state.

[Ichingcarpenter]

42. Reagan.......?

I don't think it was Jerry Brown.

[AntiFascist]

46. Enron and Kenneth Lay, may he lie in peace...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis

Enron CEO Ken Lay mocked the efforts by the California State government to thwart the practices of the energy wholesalers, saying, "In the final analysis, it doesn't matter what you crazy people in California do, because I got smart guys who can always figure out how to make money." The original statement was made in a phone conversation between David Freeman (Chairman of the California Power Authority) and Kenneth Lay (CEO of Enron) in 2000, according to the statements made by Freeman to the Senate Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs, Foreign Commerce and Tourism in April<13> and May 2002<14>.

[and-justice-for-all]

43. Sorry, I can not...

I think every major city should have a electric monorail system.

[liberalpragmatist]

44. It's not specific to an LA-LV line - that's a GOP lie.

The LA-LV line was cited as a possibility and the possibility of the funding going to an LA-LV line was why Harry Reid was on board for its inclusion. But the money is not earmarked for that line - it's general funding for high speed rail that could go to any high-speed rail corridor.

... Reid spokesman Rodell Mollineau is fast to point out that the $8 billion is not an “earmark” and that “the state rail grants will be prioritized for high-speed rail projects. The secretary will have complete flexibility as to which program he uses to allocate the funds, however. The proposed Los Angeles-Las Vegas rail project would be eligible to receive funds, as would the Northeast corridor. This was a major priority for President Obama and Sen. Reid, as a conferee supported it.”

Link: http://www.politico.com/blogs/anneschroeder/0209/Shenanigans_Reid_on_a_Rail_.html

[LSK]

45. you mean a project that needs to employ workers to complete???

:shrug:

[Tesha]

47. High speed rail all along the West Coast would be a far, far better investment.

(And watch Las Vegas get abandoned once it becomes uneconomical
to import water to that artificial land.)

Tesha

[Initech]

48. Well as an LA resident I can say this is badly needed.

But of course the fuckfaces don't want it passed because it doesn't directly benefit big business. A lot of the airlines - especially US Fareways would be lost without the LA - Vegas route. Fuckers. :mad: