After 9-11, did you feel MORE compelled to learn about US government and how

[blm]

its actions effect our lives, our futures and that of the world?


It seems to me that most people NATURALLY would treat post 9-11 government and politics as reason for GREATER scrutiny of details leading up to that attack on US citizens. But, with corporate media controlling the information flow, most people are, instead, still treating government and politics as a sport to be dominated with steroid filled players, and with the media deciding which politician gets 'bulked up' by them.

Even many Democrats are concerned more with the sporting aspect of politics and seem to care less about HOW and why and how best to expose citizens to the truths they need about their government - past, present, and future.

Citizen Democrats need to demand MORE information, and let go of the politics of 'Trust me' that we have been stuck with for decades. We need more open government Democrats elected to office and fewer Democrats who prefer accomodating secrecy and privilege.



http://www.buzzflash.com/interviews/04/10/int04054.html

(...)

Robert Parry:

(...)

And the Democrats -- the accommodation Democrats -- decided that they would simply agree (about Iran-Contra machinations) that Oliver North did it, Reagan was just inattentive, and Bush really wasn’t involved. They kind of bought the cover story. And that cover story basically held for quite a while, until Lawrence Walsh was able to break through and find out that there had been this major cover-up, which doesn’t occur really until 1991 or so.

Another scandal breaking out in 1991 after the Persian Gulf War was known as Iraqgate. And Iraqgate was in a sense the opposite side of the coin from Iran-Contra because, while one part of the Reagan Administration was helping the Iranians in the mid-'80s, another part was helping the Iraqis, who were at war with the Iranians. Essentially the United States was playing both sides in providing sophisticated equipment, including material that could be used for weapons of mass destruction, to Saddam Hussein. Now this was also an embarrassing set of facts that George H.W. Bush did not want to have out. He had been calling Saddam Hussein worse than Hitler at that point. And so the idea that he had been secretly involved in a program in the 1980s to assist Saddam Hussein was information that they wanted to keep under board.

(...)

You also had, in the 1992 campaign, another scandal, which was directly involving George H.W. Bush -- it became known as Passportgate. Going into the fall of 1992, with Bill Clinton ahead, George H.W. Bush was rather desperate. They were looking for what they called a silver bullet to take out Bill Clinton. The outgrowth of this pressure was to search Bill Clinton’s passport file to see if there had been some possible letter denouncing his citizenship. That was the rumor. There was no such letter, but they found a tear in the corner of the passport file. And from that, the Bush Administration formulated a criminal referral to the FBI and then leaked it. The Senior Bush began using that to raise suggestions that he was unpatriotic. And Clinton’s numbers started to fall. It was a very effective dirty trick.

(...)

But after Clinton won in 1992, he and other winning Democrats basically decided to not help or shelve those investigations. At that point, we forget that Lawrence Walsh, the Independent Counsel who was a Republican, wanted to pursue George H.W. Bush because he had found out that George H.W. Bush had been withholding documents that had been long requested for the investigation. Bush also refused to submit to a second interview, which Walsh had postponed until after the '92 election, so Bush would not be distracted. But then after Bush got voted out, he issued pardons for six of the Iran-Contra defendants, which effectively crippled Walsh’s investigation.

Bush was allowed essentially to walk off into the sunset with his reputation intact-- when there was a potential from all four of these investigations to have implicated the Senior Bush in misconduct -- his alleged involvement in the October surprise, his involvement in Iran-Contra, his involvement in Iraqgate, and his involvement in the Passportgate affair. But Clinton and other Democrats felt that it was important to try not to stir things up, to see if they could work with the Republicans cooperatively and with the new Administration coming in. It turned out to be a gross misunderstanding of the situation.

(...)

[valerief]

1. After the second plane hit the WTC, I said to myself, "What the hell

is Bush doing to us?"

I think we know. We're going to be China very shortly.

[blm]

2. Interesting that you would say that - I have long believed that Poppy Bush made his deal with

the Chinese industrialists to be part of the global fascist network - and that the rise of WalMart in the 70s was part of that deal.

Poppy Bush's New World Order was always about the formation of a Global Network of Fascism.

[valerief]

6. Yeah, they want us to be China so much, they even want to build a

Great Wall. I mean, a Great Fence.

[frylock]

3. prior to 911, i was mostly apolitical

[blm]

5. You are exactly the type of citizen I am talking about.

You wanted MORE information, but received slogans and jingoism instead from your government and those who controlled access to real information that would catch you up with the reality of the world and our government as it existed on that day and after.

I will bet there were MILLIONS like you who wanted to KNOW all you could but instead faced a chorus of "there's no purpose in looking back, we have to look forward - trust us."

[Imagevision]

4. Don't forget, the 9-11 report was first edited by the white house who

found that there would only be 18 pages from the report that would be inadmissible to the American people.

[CJCRANE]

7. It's *28* redacted pages.

And the 9/11 Commission was so toothless the report's not worth the paper it's written on.

[MotorCityMan]

8. Good Question

Actually, it was the travesty of the 2000 election that did it for me. I was in shock from seeing CNN's coverage of the election and went to the internet for more information.

That's when I found Bush Watch, Buzzflash, and DU, of course, and began to REALLY pay attention to what is going on.

My late partner pretty much humored me. I start ranting about the 2000 election while it was still undecided, and filled him in on every travesty that * and co. are responsible for since then. He would always say "How much damage can they really do?" I told him that I hoped he was right.

On 9-11, I got off of work early and was shocked and horrified at was going on. At one point I said to my partner, "Mike, THIS is how bad it can get!" I have pretty much believed that *co were involved somehow, even if just by incompetence. And I totally believe that this would not have happened under President Gore.

[Bridget Burke]

20. The 2000 Election & "Florida Recount" did it for me, too.

The night before we voted, I was filled with nameless dread. Of course we knew it would be close. But I'd survived Nixon, Reagan & Bush the Smarter. Why that feeling?

I fell asleep with Dan Rather on TV; he was still there when I awoke. The newspaper machines at work were empty--the "Gore Wins" edition had been aborted.

Over the next weeks, I watched the proceedings in dismay. But I was also interested. I enjoyed learning more about politics & law & wondered why all those political reporters were so bored with it all. They just wanted it to be over. Then, the Supreme Court decision crushed me. The talking heads began yammering about "a peaceful transfer of power"--as if "elections" were just So Twentieth Century.

Of course 9/11 was tragic & horrible. But I never felt the need to "stand beside" our President. (Who slept soundly the night of 9/11, while many of us didn't sleep well for days.) Long before I heared of LIHOP or MIHOP, "gross incompetence" & "cowardice" sprang to mind.

[MotorCityMan]

21. Election night 2000 was so surreal

I only saw one of the */Gore debates, but it was enough for me to think that there was no way in HELL * would be elected.

I stayed awake until about 2:00 in the morning. When I woke up and it was STILL undecided is when the dread started for me. I kept thinking, "There has to be a mistake; I should be hearing about President Gore".

That election had a similar effect on me, BB. It got me interested (a few of my associates might say obsessed) with politics.

The whole month after the election was quite the roller coaster ride. I will NEVER forget the elation at the Florida Supreme Court allowing the recount to continue, and the complete despair at the USSC's shutting it down.

The other thing that really shocked me at the time was my co-worker's attitudes. Most of them were just making jokes about the whole process, usually at Gore's expense. I swear I wanted to start screaming at them, "What is the MATTER with you people? They are stealing a presidential election before your eyes and you're making JOKES?"

[Solly Mack]

9. No

but then , well.... you know :)

I don't use trust and government in the same sentence without crinkling my nose up

[blm]

10. I always think about you when I ask these questions. Too many of us were disengaged

at crucial points in our country's recent history.

You were ALWAYS engaged and protesting government corruption even when it took crimes of office as serious as IranContra to wake me up to pay attention.

[Solly Mack]

11. Nah..not always

I did have a bit of a childhood :)

Seriously though...just since Reagan. I had worked on Carter's campaign back home years before and the coming of Reagan caused me to pay closer attention

As for the Bush family - My mom would speak on what a rotten family they were when I was a child. Over time I learned just how right she was

[blm]

18. I think your mom and I would get along great.

My mom was a far-right fundie - a Mel Gibson's father type Catholic.

[Solly Mack]

19. She was a pretty good old fart

I say that lovingly.

She died years ago. Miss her greatly.

[jillan]

12. Even tho I was always interested in Politics

I think it was the election of 2000 that made be stand up and pay attention. Alot of attention.
But it was the election of 2004 that made me become involved. That was the time when my eyes were opened, or should I say when my mind was opened. It was the internet, the honest discussions that occurred on the Kerry forum and places like DU.

[blm]

14. I think for many here it was 2000 theft, then 9-11, then Iraq war that just

made people realize that there is too much at stake at this point for lies from our government to continue.

[jillan]

16. since the stolen election of 2000

It has been non-stop.
One catastrophe after another.

I am just naive or were things always this screwed up?? Because I don't ever remember anything like this before.
Was it this bad before Watergate?
Iran-Contra?

[Initech]

13. Yeah, I was naive about politics until 9/11 happened.

[Forkboy]

15. I was already so jaded and cynical I almost wanted to know less.

:(

[blm]

17. That's pretty much how I feel some days.

When people ask me about BCCI over the last 5 years, I just tell them to punch in BCCI - Bush - Bath - Bin Laden and that I'll see them in a month. Once they go down that research path, you can't ever be the same about your government.