It's downright embarassing we lost to Bush in 2004 considering how anemic he is now

[Herman Munster]

Amazing the difference two years makes.

[Bonobo]

1. We didn't lose. The election wasn't an election. This isn't a democracy.

Take the red pill, Herman. You're in the matrix whether you choose to accept it or not.

...But I know what you're saying about Bush. But seriously, we didn't lose.

[Turbineguy]

2. Well, there's a lot of people

around here who don't think "we" lost. But that's another story.

[helderheid]

3. We didn't lose.

[blm]

4. Media complicity that also covers up for GOP election fraud. Time and time again.

It took a category 5 hurricane to blow back against the 5 years of spin the corpmedia was perpetrating upon the American public and especially the casual voter.

[iamjoy]

5. I Wish Katrina Had Been In 2004

If Dubya had goofed off while a city drowned, he never would have gotten a second term.

AND, if Katrina had been in an election year and Dubya had somehow gotten his ass in gear instead of partying, at least the situation on the Gulf Coast wouldn't have been as catastrophic.

[we can do it]

6. Booshit Never Did Win - Either Time

[Selatius]

7. I think I'm in the minority when I say Bush actually beat Kerry by 3,500,000 votes nationwide.

If Ohio had went Kerry's way, it wouldn't have mattered if Kerry lost the popular vote.

There is evidence to suggest fraud happened.

However, I don't have evidence to exactly pinpoint how many votes were switched or destroyed, just that some of them were switched or destroyed. Is it possible Bush managed to invent 3,500,000 votes more than Kerry? Possible, but the problem with many voting machines is there's no paper trail to know the extent of the fraud, and it is the extent of the fraud that interests me.

The extent is one question that will likely never be answered.

[bullimiami]

10. i think you are wrong. i think the fraud was massive and it was widespread.

i think without the shenanigans it was kerry in a landslide.

[Selatius]

14. I believe fraud happened, but I can't tell if it was big enough to affect the outcome.

As I had said, you can prove fraud happened, but proving the extent of the fraud is a whole new ballgame altogether. To recap what I'm trying to say:

Did some amount of fraud happen? Yes, most likely.

Was the extent of the fraud large enough that it affected the outcome of the election? There's no complete paper trail. That's the problem. Also, states have discretion over allowing 3rd party poll monitors to watch. Several states banned them, including EU poll monitors from Europe. That's also another big problem.

Even if that many votes were switched or destroyed, you have nothing with which to take to a court of law. You can prove something exists, but it's different from proving its size. It's like walking in the dark and hitting a wall. You know there's something there, but you don't know if you can walk around it walking 5 feet or 5000 feet.

[EstimatedProphet]

12. Yep, you're in the minority

[bullimiami]

8. its a shame we didnt take to the streets with pitchforks, tar and feathers.

we let them steal it big and obvious and we sat on our hands. i still blame kerry for not fighting for his rightful victory.

[saltpoint]

9. The little man had to cheat to beat Gore AND Kerry -- in FL and OH.

So I don't really consider him a "winner" of any election.

And the historians have yet to have at him. They're dipping their sharp pens in the ink even as we speak. I wish a long, long life for lil' Dubya. I want him to know every syllable of disregard History holds for him.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

11. Indeed.

[omega minimo]

13. Bullshit

Red herrings wrapped in a straw man :thumbsdown:

[pretzel4gore]

15. the good news....

bush never won in 2k, and he lost in 2k4; kerry must be sick with it all, knowing the facts but unable to do anything! the damage the greedy tapewormy gop fukkers have caused isn't even known yet (and the pigmedia will try to keep bad news under wraps until a full democ admin is running things, which will be in early '09 - then hang onto yer hats!)...but perhaps we have been living high off the hog for too long anyway. Perhaps our wellbeing shouldn't hinge on exploiting the poor in africa, asia and indeed right here! Perhaps bush, in over reaching, has exposed the facts that power does indeed corrupt, using modern technology and advanced crowd psychology etc makes alice in wonderland bushbug politics easy...so perhaps media will be recognised as destructive as a raging gang of rapists, if allowed to dominate the society that relies on them for information.
The good news is the day of the hypocrite/fascist/lying punk is over - and it doesn't depend upon us! global warming, and economic collapse, with all the attendant mayhem, will make mr pig wish he stayed in his pen....
gobush!

[Peace Patriot]

16. You need a trip to www.TruthIsAll.net.

Hint: We didn't lose.