****** 20/20 ******

[Sapphire Blue]

Reminder for tonight's 20/20...

"Waiting on the World to Change" - children growing up in the poorest city in America.: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x37700



And a related thread...

The Violence of Poverty; "quiet terrorism": http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x46857

[Reterr]

1. K&R.nt

[Sapphire Blue]

4. Thanks, Reterr!

:hi:

[sandnsea]

2. You were reading my mind

I was just thinking about this program a few minutes ago!!

[Sapphire Blue]

5. I really hope it is widely watched... and that it will open some eyes... and hearts.

:hi:

[Ian David]

3. Stopped watching 20/20 after their hatchet job on Matthew Shepard. n/t

[Sapphire Blue]

7. This is a show about children in poverty.

There are 3 video links in the 1st OP link... about 3 children living in Camden, NJ... Moochie, Ivan, and Billy.

I hope you will make an exception to not watching the show tonight... because Moochie matters. Ivan matters. Billy matters. All of the millions of children living in poverty matter.

[Ian David]

8. Unless they've got Stephen Colbert, then no. They can matter on a different show sometime. n/t

[Sapphire Blue]

11. They matter in this WORLD.

From the other thread...

Franklin D. Roosevelt said "The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little."

Some people understand that. If you are one of those people, I thank you w/every fiber of my being.

Some people don't understand that. They say that "Poverty isn't a winning issue." If you are one of those people, can you look Moochie or Ivan, or the millions of children living in poverty, in the eye, and tell them that 'Poverty isn't a winning issue'? If you can do that, you are driving a stake into the soul of Humanity.


And this, from Elie Wiesel...

Elie Wiesel: "The Perils of Indifference"

(excerpt")

In a way, to be indifferent to that suffering is what makes the human being inhuman. Indifference, after all, is more dangerous than anger and hatred. Anger can at times be creative. One writes a great poem, a great symphony. One does something special for the sake of humanity because one is angry at the injustice that one witnesses. But indifference is never creative. Even hatred at times may elicit a response. You fight it. You denounce it. You disarm it.

Indifference elicits no response. Indifference is not a response. Indifference is not a beginning; it is an end. And, therefore, indifference is always the friend of the enemy, for it benefits the aggressor -- never his victim, whose pain is magnified when he or she feels forgotten. The political prisoner in his cell, the hungry children, the homeless refugees -- not to respond to their plight, not to relieve their solitude by offering them a spark of hope is to exile them from human memory. And in denying their humanity, we betray our own.

Indifference, then, is not only a sin, it is a punishment.

(snip)

In the place that I come from, society was composed of three simple categories: the killers, the victims, and the bystanders. During the darkest of times, inside the ghettoes and death camps -- and I'm glad that Mrs. Clinton mentioned that we are now commemorating that event, that period, that we are now in the Days of Remembrance -- but then, we felt abandoned, forgotten. All of us did.

And our only miserable consolation was that we believed that Auschwitz and Treblinka were closely guarded secrets; that the leaders of the free world did not know what was going on behind those black gates and barbed wire; that they had no knowledge of the war against the Jews that Hitler's armies and their accomplices waged as part of the war against the Allies. If they knew, we thought, surely those leaders would have moved heaven and earth to intervene. They would have spoken out with great outrage and conviction. They would have bombed the railways leading to Birkenau, just the railways, just once.

And now we knew, we learned, we discovered that the Pentagon knew, the State Department knew...

Full text & audio is available @ http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/ewieselperilsofindifference.html

What will Ivan & Moochie be saying years from now when they realize that we all knew?

[sandnsea]

17. How people get on ignore

Couldn't say anymore or I'd get thrown off.

[Sapphire Blue]

22. ...

And a good reason for the 'block replies to me'. Too bad it was discontinued.

[Ian David]

48. Sorry, I'm just being a pain in the ass. n/t

[silverojo]

24. Impoverished kids are more important than Colbert!!!!!

It's so-called liberals like you who give real liberals a bad name. To you, being entertained is more important than giving a damn about people who can't even afford food.

You cry crocodile tears for people being killed in Iraq, but when poverty's killing people here in America, you don't even care to change the channel to LOOK at them.

You've got some seriously screwed-up priorities.


ON EDIT: I've K&R'ed this thread!

[smokey nj]

25. Poverty in the U.S. is not unrelated to the deaths of Americans

in Iraq. I'm sure there aren't many recruiters roaming the halls of prep schools looking for fresh meat and the money that's being wasted on the occupation could be better used here at home improving peoples' lives.

[nam78_two]

6. K&R

Unfortunately I can't watch it because I am at work..
(Quick question-John Stossel isn't hosting is he?)

[Sapphire Blue]

9. I don't know about Stossel hosting, but tonight's show is Diane Sawyer's project.

She's been working on it for a year & a half.

[tomreedtoon]

82. Diane Sawyer's "Novelesque" writing...this show SUCKED.

She was once quoted as saying a good story should "have the texture of a good novel." Well, this sure did. It was, in fact, a "woman's novel," or a "weepie."

There was all sorts of reporting about the misery of these poor people's lives. Oh, it was a box-of-Kleenex show. But it didn't say ONE DAMN THING about how those problems might be helped. There was some vague feelgood stuff about "If we don't do something about this, in twenty years it will be worse." Well, duh!

For instance, with the cute little girl with the alcoholic father, where were the government agencies to take care of the family and give the father some rehab help? Okay, if they weren't there, why weren't they there? Was Sawyer afraid to say that the Bush Administration cutbacks, in favor of rich people's tax cuts, eliminated those programs?

In just about every part of the show, there was commiserating about the fate of these children, and nobody, BUT nobody, suggested there was any positive action that could be taken to help it. Except for the Oprah-esque idea of the rich kids bringing some of the poor kids a couple gaily wrapped boxes of canned beans or something. Gee, you guys don't have a can opener? Too bad...

If you thought this was a useful look at poverty in America, you're only half right. You saw the poverty. You didn't see anyone even suggesting there were ways that could fix it. And certainly in the presence of the corporate suck-up John Stossel, nobody would ever suggest that some intelligent government programs - like the ones Bush and Company killed - might help.

[Sapphire Blue]

83. Ms. Sawyer referred people watching the show to go to the website...

... for resources to help these children. Links posted in the thread below are from ABC's 20/20 website: http://abcnews.go.com/2020/.

******* For Moochie, Ivan & Billy *******: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x52252

You want to do something to change poverty in America? GOD DAMN IT, DO IT! FIGHT CONGRESS TO RESTORE FUNDING HUMAN NEEDS PROGRAMS.

Funny (not) I never saw response from you on a single thread that I've ever posted on the budget battles, and I've posted plenty of them. Not a god damned word from you.

[smokey nj]

10. K&R!

[Sapphire Blue]

12. Thanks, smokey nj!

:hi:

[smokey nj]

13. Here's another kick!!!

[Sapphire Blue]

14. Moochie matters! KICK for Moochie...

:kick: The Children Next Door - 'Moochie of Camden, NJ' : http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2819889

[Sapphire Blue]

18. !

:kick:

[Sapphire Blue]

27. !!

:kick: :kick:

[Sapphire Blue]

15. Ivan matters! KICK for Ivan...

Growing Up In Poverty - 'Ivan's Story': http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2816480

[Sapphire Blue]

19. !

:kick:

[Sapphire Blue]

28. !!

:kick: :kick:

[Sapphire Blue]

16. Billy matters! KICK for Billy...

:kick: Poverty in America - 'Billy of Camden, NJ': http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2823563

[Sapphire Blue]

:kick:

[Sapphire Blue]

29. !!

:kick: :kick:

[smokey nj]

21. Kick!

[smokey nj]

23. .....

:kick:

[bonito]

26. Kick

and 1st rec.

[smokey nj]

30. Two minute warning kick!

[Sapphire Blue]

31. One Minute for the East Coast!

:kick:

[Outdoordude01]

32. It's on right now!

[Sapphire Blue]

45. Welcome to DU, Outdoordude01!

:hi: :hi: :hi:

[moc]

33. "I want to go to school so bad"

"I want to read"

:cry:

[sandnsea]

34. For anyone who wants to know POOR n/t

[blonndee]

35. OMG...Thanks for the heads up.

This is already a heartbreaker. Ivan :loveya:

[Straight Shooter]

36. I don't watch television (no reception) but I'll kick for Sapphire.

:dem:

[Sapphire Blue]

37. Online videos:

The Children Next Door - 'Moochie of Camden, NJ': http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2819889

Growing Up In Poverty - 'Ivan's Story': http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2816480

Poverty in America - 'Billy of Camden, NJ': http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2823563


:hug: Thanks for the kick, Straight Shooter!

[Straight Shooter]

54. Thanks for the links, Sapphire.

You're a tireless advocate for those whom society neglects. Bless you.

:hug:

[Sapphire Blue]

38. ******* To Donate to UrbanPromise and their Special Funds for Ivan, Moochie and others *******

Click Here: http://up2020.servicenetwork.com/

[Sapphire Blue]

39. ******* For More Info on Organizations Working to Improve the Lives of Children *******

Click here: http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=2823067

[Sapphire Blue]

40. ******* If you want to get in touch with Reverend King of Camden *******

Click here: http://www.dkingministries.com/

[Sapphire Blue]

41. ***** More Video *****

'Waiting on the World to Change' - 'High School in Cmaden, NJ: http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2826860

[Sapphire Blue]

42. Billy matters! KICK for Billy!

:kick: 'Waiting on the World to Change' - 'High School in Cmaden, NJ: http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2826860

[sandnsea]

43. Guess John Edwards' house is more interesting n/t

[Sapphire Blue]

44. ******* For Moochie, Ivan & Billy *******

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x52252

Please :kick:!

[BlueStorm]

46. I missed the show...But what I got from it

is really heartbreaking. I know what it is like to grow up poor. Maybe not in the extent that some of these kids probably do, but I do know what it's like to go hungry, not have enough clothes, etc. I know what it's like to live in a crumbling house.

I am still poor. I am only living with my father by his grace otherwise I would be on the streets. Subsidized housing here in GR is backed up and there are many that are waiting for their Sec. 8

My sister is poor, she is on welfare and struggles every day to make ends meet. She has three kids whom she has to provide for. Most days there is no food in the house and she has to scrape together what she does have in the kitchen or beg for money to get a little something for the kids. Many times she has gone hungry just so the kids can eat. She is under alot of finacial stress. Her gas bill, which she thought was $400 dollars is actually $500 and she just got a shut-off notice.

My sister may not be able to work. She has pain in her right hip and right now she has no doctor as our family doctor kicked her off because she hasn't paid some bills.

I know the plight these kids are going through on this special. I have lived it, my sister has and is living it and my nieces and nephew are living it.

It's hard and when I hear some conservatives, especially those that are priveledged, say to us poor folks, "Well, why can't you just get a job?" No, it's not that easy. Even with a job, one can still be poor. One can be handicapped and not able to work.

Ok, I am crying now because this just hurts. All of the pain of having to worry about where our next meal comes from is heartbreaking. I am really worried more about my sister than I am about myself. I do hope she will get the money so that her gas isn't shut off. But it's shit like this that gets me angry at the government. Bush has wasted so much money in Iraq that people like me, Valerie, Ivan and Moochie are suffering.

And to those who like to put their hands on their hips, look down at us and say, "Well you wouldn't be like this if you had a job." YOU work for $5.15 an hour, for 8-10 hours a day, six days a week and tell me if you can survive on that. Not so easy isn't it?

Ok, I'm blathering and I'm crying so I'm just going to go.

Blue

[Sapphire Blue]

47. You matter, BlueStorm! Your sister & her family matter!

:hug:

Poverty is a vital issue. It's time to treat is as such.

[BlueStorm]

50. It is and so many people keep it undercover

or don't want to deal with it. I only get around $650 a month. That is A MONTH. Not a week, not bi-weekly but A MONTH. That is not enough to deal with. I only give my dad $100 for rent and I consider myself lucky for that. I have car insurance I have to pay which is around $70 a month and since dad doesn't have a landline, I have to pay a cellphone bill too. My gas for my car varies as the prices vary. I only have $50 for food and god knows what else I have to pay. I'll admit my money management is not the greatest but I don't know anyone that could be able to manage on what I get. I just got my statement from the SSA and I only got a little less than $5,000 in 2006 alone, and that is in a year.

I am way below poverty level and like I said if it wasn't for the grace of my dad, I would be in a shelter or on the streets as subsidized housing and Sec. 8 are backed up royally here in Michigan.

Blue

[Sapphire Blue]

53. It doesn't have to be this way... if we all care enough to do something about it.

We have work to do. The Congressional budget battle is coming up soon. We must restore funding for human needs programs. And, by God, we will!

[BlueStorm]

55. Let me know about that Congressional thing

I would love to budge my Congresscritters on it. I have Stabenow, Levin and Conyers. So I could bug them about that.

Blue

[Sapphire Blue]

56. The Coalition on Human Needs is an excellent organization that fights for the poor...

... and routinely gets involved in the budget battle.

You can sign up for CHN Email Alerts @ http://www.chn.org/signUp.jsp

About CHN

The Coalition on Human Needs (CHN) is an alliance of national organizations working together to promote public policies which address the needs of low-income and other vulnerable populations. The Coalition's members include civil rights, religious, labor and professional organizations and those concerned with the well being of children, women, the elderly and people with disabilities.

http://www.chn.org/about/index.html

CHN Member Organizations: http://www.chn.org/about/chnmembers.html

CHN Public Policy Priorities for 2007 http://www.chn.org/pdf/2007/2007PolicyPriorities.pdf

Check out their website; you'll find lots of info!

[Ian David]

49. So did I! SO THERE! n/t

[Bluerthanblue]

51. sweet Ivan only wants a place to lay his head.... what a

moving, poignant depiction of life that people don't want to believe exists, or try to excuse as 'choice'.

Thanks for this thread Sapphire Blue- I wasn't surprised by this, but it still made me weep... and reinforced a commitment to being a part of changing the world-

[Sapphire Blue]

52. ...

:hug: Thank you for caring, Bluerthanblue!

[Sapphire Blue]

57. kick for the West Coast

:kick:

[Sapphire Blue]

58. 10 minutes.

[Sapphire Blue]

59. 3 minutes

:kick:

[trashcanistanista]

60. West coast here tuning in

This is unforgivable. Women and kids on the streets. Unconscionable. What the hell is wrong with New Jersey? I can barely watch this.

[sandnsea]

61. This is just heartbreaking

Poor little guy didn't know the meal answer because he'd never had 3 meals a day on a regular basis. I never completely understood biased testing until that moment. These kids are the Super Heroes!

[Califooyah Operative]

63. indeed. nt

[Califooyah Operative]

62. I watched...

a powerful show. veery sad, i teared up a lot.

[Sapphire Blue]

64. Yes. Powerful.

These children are imprinted in my heart.

[trashcanistanista]

65. bookmarking this thread

and donating to Ivan's church. Thanks for your efforts to bring this to our attention. My local news says 2 million kids go hungry in California, so this is everywhere. Camden is especially heinous with the blatant drug activity. What the hell is wrong with this country?

[Sapphire Blue]

67. Thank you for donating to Ivan's church, trashcanistanista!

:hug: :loveya:

[trashcanistanista]

70. Thanks for the link

Only critique, Sawyer did not give a link to help these kids. You would think ABC would set up a fund, I think many viewers would do the same.

[Sapphire Blue]

71. The links to help the kids are all available on ABC's 20/20 website:

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/

Sawyer mentioned that on the show.

[sandnsea]

74. On the drug thing

The buyers came from the neighboring wealthier town of Moorseville. The picture we get on the teevee is black inner city drugs and gangs. The rich white kid is never pictured, and yet its that money that fuels the problem. People just tsk tsk, why don't those black people stop using drugs. But they didn't create that environment, white people brought their money to it and created it.

[Sapphire Blue]

66. Kudos to Diane Sawyer!

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:


Contact 20/20: [e-mail]

[trashcanistanista]

68. Nightline covering this

next.

[Sapphire Blue]

69. ***** KICK ***** for Nightline *****

:kick:

[bobbolink]

84. awwww, I wish I had known that.... would have recorded it, also...

Thanks so much for being on top of this!!

Can you give a bit of recap on what was said on Nightline? Anything new?

:hug:

[Sapphire Blue]

85. Quick recap...

The Camden & Moorestown children met, the teens talked, and the little ones played... Camden's Superman & Mooresetown's Batman.

Sawyer interviewed a Vassar College professor who grew up in Camden, the son of a prostitute & a drug dealer. With the intervention of one person, a mentor, he went on to Yale. He stressed the need for mentoring, for someone to step in for these children. He also compared the childrens' lives to a race... the Moorestown children have no obstacles on their track; the Camden children face enormous obstacles, violence, drugs, poverty. For the Camden children to achieve success is an extraordinary achievement... they have to climb mountains, while the Moorestown children only have to walk.

She interviewed a couple of social workers who also stressed the need for mentoring, for helping these children through the maze of life... said these children have good values, values are not the problem, resources are the problem.

And, that after time, day after day, week after week, month after month, these children become more & more discouraged, they break down. And we can't let that happen!

[upi402]

72. John Stossel is Satan's spawn

other than that 2020's syrup coated cotton candy and I'm on a diet.

[Sapphire Blue]

73. Do you always post when you don't know what in the world you're posting about? Please don't answer.

If the Admin hadn't removed the 'block' function, I would most certainly block you. Your post is nothing but nastiness.

[BuelahWitch]

75. A kick for Moochie, Ivan and Billy!

We should be ashamed that children have to live like this!

[AbbyR]

76. I'll have to wait until I get to work

on Monday to watch this last part - I'm one of the cave people still on dial up. But I watched three recommended parts on Friday, and it was heartbreaking. No one, no one, should have to live this way.

[Sapphire Blue]

77. No one should live like this, but so many do. From sea to shining sea.

[AlCzervik]

78. My heart broke for those kids.

Ivan, i was crying for him. I'm emailing ABC to find out if there is a way to donate to these kids.

[Sapphire Blue]

79. HELP ******* For Moochie, Ivan & Billy ******* HERE:

******* For Moochie, Ivan & Billy *******: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x52252

[AlCzervik]

80. thanks.

:hi:

[Sapphire Blue]

81. You're welcome!

:hi: