"We're going to talk about this helicopter thing. The one I flew in seemed perfectly adequate to me.

[Stinky The Clown]

"Of course, I've never had a helicopter before. Maybe I just don't know I'm being deprived."

President Obama, speaking about the wildly escalating costs of the new Marine One fleet commissioned to a non-US entity by the bushies.


Dear President Obama: Scrap the bushies' contract and talk to Sikorsky ...... They already **know** how its done.

[davepc]

1. How many people would drive a 30+ year old car to work everyday?

Yet we expect the president to fly in transportation built in 1978.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

2. A lot of people expect the President to make $45,000/year, pay for the WH, and use public transport.

You know, because that's what they do. Nevermind that it's the most difficult job in the world and that all of our livelihoods depend on him/her.

[Lost in CT]

3. Well I do... but honestly it looks good. nt

[dkf]

7. I don't care how it looks, what kind of shape is it in?

Its all the inside parts I'm worried about.

I'd think that 30 year old equipment would have to be looked at for replacement sometime. If it takes years and years they better be working on it.

[Lost in CT]

10. I agree He needs new birds... ones made in Stratford and Bridgeport ct

Not some foreign country.

[CTyankee]

11. I noticed that Rosa DeLauro is on this with a vengeance. She wants that helicopter

to be built by Sikorsky (in her district), not a company that doesn't even MAKE helicopters (Lockheed).

[ProgressiveProfessor]

19. Lockheed is the prime because there is much more to the helos than just the airframe

Lots and lots of mods updates, avionics, comm gear etc.

That said it still should be a US made airframe

[dixiegrrrrl]

34. Lockheed has been fed Bushie contracts for years and years.

So much so that even people who usually don't notice have been asking questions.

We have that big AirBus contract snafu issue down here, in Mobile.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

40. And Sikorsky, Vertol, and Bell haven't

[Bandit]

5. After every hundred hours of flight time the engine gets a total overhaul

After every twenty five hours major maintenance is done. While the actual helicopter may be thirty years old, every major part has been replaced more than once.There is no comparison between a Presidential Helicopter and a thirty year old car.

[ret5hd]

6. Do you think you can find a single individual piece of that aircraft...

that is more than a few years old?

My bet is "no".

[Stinky The Clown]

20. Maybe some of the airframe ......

... but your point is spot on. Those are the best maintained helicopters on earth and the the parts are replaced freely and often. Major overhauls are done at about the same frequency as most conscientious car owners change their oil!

[tangent90]

24. Like the axe I own that belonged to Abraham Lincoln.

It's had a new head and 3 new handles. :-)

[Donnachaidh]

8. If it's been properly maintained and kept up -- you betcha I would

That 30 year old transportation is probably EASIER to maintain, because it hasn't got all the computerized bullshit the newer contraptions have.

Newer cars break down and cost more to maintain because of *planned obsolescence*. Older is sometimes BETTER, despite all the hype.

[madokie]

12. easy there on the electronics

it is common for an auto today to go a 100,000 miles without any maintenance other that an occasional oil change. I've seem some go much more that that. Back before the electronic age in autos we were lucky to get 10,000 miles on a set of points and plugs with the engines for the most part being toast by the time they made it to the 100,000 mile mark. The largest contributer to that has been the precision of the variables of a running vehicle engine due to computers in the vehicles themselves. It would be the same with that helicopter.

[Donnachaidh]

29. oh come on

If you were DUMB enough to go 10,000 on a set of plugs you deserve the problems you get. And these copters are WELL maintained.

"Gotta buy the newest toy" is NOT a good argument for replacing well-maintained equipment.

[madokie]

36. you lost me there

:hi:

[tangent90]

25. Sorry but you are wrong. Newer cars of any brand are far far more reliable than

those built 30 or more years ago.
Even tire blowouts are virtually nonexistent nowadays.

[Donnachaidh]

28. hogwash

The *gotta buy the newest fastest toy* is what f*cked the economy.

Those helicopters are far better maintained, with CHEAPER parts than the latest goodie being pushed by the Military Industrial Complex.

[cliffordu]

30. I really wish you knew what you were talking about.

Parts no longer in inventory get cut by hand, one at a time.

[tangent90]

32. And they have been refitted with all the latest computerized gizmos you hate so much.

:eyes:

[Stinky The Clown]

35. It isn't quite so black and white ........

Let me start by saying that I agree with your general sentiment. "Gotta have the newest toy" is a big part of what has raised the military budget to the obscene levels at which it now hovers.

But, back to helicopters ...... they have enormous vibration issues and are more sensitive than comparable fixed wing aircraft. Fixed wing aircraft suffers some airframe deterioration by the pressurization cycles. Most helicopters are not pressurized, but they suffer even **greater** airframe stresses because of the vibration. Add in pressurization and their airframes are quite vulnerable to failure, relatively speaking, when compared to fixed wing.

Yes, the Marine One fleet is very well maintained and likely has many more years of life left in them, but they do eventually wear out. I just don't think we're at that point yet, but who knows?

I know for a fact that Sikorsky airframes are built like tanks.

I'll use their S58 as an example. They originally started in service as far back as 1951. They were originally piston powered.

Like this one:



They eventually went into the Marine One fleet (The White Tops). Here's two for Kennedy.



Later, the factory refurbished the old airframes and fitted them with new turbine engines and redesignated them the S58T.



They're still flying. Some of those airframes could be approaching 60 years old.

[ipfilter]

13. You can't compare an aircraft to an automobile in terms of age.

The age of an aircraft is determined by the number of hours flown. We train our Air Force pilots in T-38's built in the 60's. We fly Shuttles into orbit and those were built in the 70's.

[dkf]

16. Your comparison of the shuttles is NOT a comforting thought.

[ipfilter]

17. True, they have had some mishaps, but neither of them

were caused by the age of the airframe.

[tangent90]

23. My plane was built in 1970 and it is better than new. It's called maintenance.

:D

[EnviroBat]

38. You are aware that those "30 year old" vehicles

are maintained to standards that keep them damn new as new as the day they were built, right?

[bdamomma]

4. Good President Obama slap down those republicans!!

with all the problems this country has and the repigs are talking about helicopters.

[madokie]

14. mcPalin even

sorry bastards anyway

[madokie]

9. I have a feeling that is going to happen

Obama's too smart to not do that.

[Stinky The Clown]

21. I sure hope so.

Sikorsky holds a special place for me. My Dad worked there from the time I was five or six. He and Mom raised my brother and me quite comfortably and put us through school just on what he earned there. I worked there a few years after I got out of the Navy ...... building helicopters that often found their way to Viet Nam. It was also a very frequent sight to see one of the Marine One fleet on Sikorsky's tarmac getting some overhaul or upgrade or another. The Marines took care of those aircraft, but the factory was always deeply involved, too.

Every presidential helicopter except the very first one has been a Sikorsky.

[gratuitous]

15. Don't lose sight of one fact

This was in response to an unscripted question from John McCain. How many times did you see George W. Bush taking unscripted questions? And how many times were those asked by political rivals? And President Obama handled the question with grace and aplomb. A very significant development, if you ask me.

[ProfessorGAC]

18. Exactly What I Thought, Too

He handled it marvelously. It was impromptu and he gave a clever answer that elicited laughs from the press.

I thought it was great.
GAC

[Stinky The Clown]

22. Yeah .... I think it was part quip and part knowlegeable reality

[Orsino]

26. "Adequate" for presidential commuting is not the same thing as combat-ready.

I applaud the point I think Obama was making, but that was a flip answer, and will not endear him to the military fetishists.

In any case, I would hope that he also hinted that we shouldn't outsource more goddamned manufacturing.

[madokie]

27. I just realized that what President Obama was saying when he said those words

were that here we are in a fix like we've not seen in any of our lifetimes and here we are going to talk about the helicoptor. The helicopter he has had no say in procuring. fuck mcPOW sideways with a splintery two by four

splchk

[Stinky The Clown]

37. Did you hear that motherfucker, Gramps', wording of the question?

He called it "your helicopter" ...... that's fucking ballz.

[madokie]

39. Yea I heard him, seen him too with them shifty eyes a darting here and there

knowing full well that what he was saying was 100% bullshit.

[tangent90]

31. Yep! Nothing says American like Sikorsky!

:D

[spanone]

33. hey mcprick, your buddy w* ordered these copters...didn't hear you whining then

President Obama is kind enough to call on mcshit first and he hit's him with a 'gotcha' question

fuck you john

[Fumesucker]

41. A helicopter is a collection of 30,000 parts flying in formation..

The A&P mechanic is the one who makes sure the formation is as tight as possible.