Parents complaining about cheese sandwiches are not low income

[Fireweed247]

Low income families can get free/reduced lunches. The parents that are complaining are people who didn't pay their bills or learn to fix a sandwich at home. I don't think anyone is advocating the elimination of the free lunches for children in need. Most people are complaining about middle class people who feel the system owes their children a free lunch and actually go out of their way to protest the cheese sandwich when it takes less effort to just pay their damn bill.

[pnwmom]

1. Some of the parents could well have children on reduced-price lunches.

They are still expected to pay the balance.

[nichomachus]

2. No -- I'm advocating not humiliating children to get even with their parents

If the parents can afford it and don't pay for the lunches, feed the kids anyway -- then send the sheriff to whack the parents around.

[marshall]

33. What if the kids are buying cigarettes with the money?

Lots of kids spend their lunch money on something else, especially if they know they'll get a free sandwich anyway.

[Warren Stupidity]

34. yeah that's it. of course.

:headbang:

[nichomachus]

41. What if they were secertly funding Al Qaida?

What if they were contributing to the Iranian nuke program?
What if they were buying online porn?
What if . . . . .

[barb162]

60. I've seen that happen. Candy, smokes, etc.

It's not all that common, but I've seen it.

[Orrex]

67. Good point. I'd rather they spend it on coke and hookers

Any kid who'd subject him or herself to the humiliation of getting a "courtesy" lunch simply to get a pack of smokes obviously has much larger issues going on, and humiliating him or her with a half-assed sandwich won't do anything to solve the problem.

[tanngrisnir3]

38. That's the point: the kids who get the sandwiches are the ones whose....

parents have not or cannot pay.

There is no issue about feeding hungry kids; it's more of a bullshit smokescreen about public humilation and Chicken Little fears of kids differentiating between themselves.

The kids are being fed.

[Fresh_Start]

3. or the parents lost their jobs after the beginning of school

enrollment for free lunch program

I'd guess that its possible to enroll later in the school year, but it surely isn't as easy to do so

[kiva]

18. I was under the impression that schools filed these applications

all year long, which makes sense since it's to their benefit to have larger federal payments. I did look at the form online, and it's incredible simple to fill out--as it should be.

[WolverineDG]

37. According to the Albuquerque policy

they're given 10 school days to get that form filled out &/or their lunch bill paid. The children are sent home with notes (which can go astray) AND the parents are called daily by the school. They get plenty of time to get things worked out before the cheese sandwich gets served.

dg

[bertman]

45. "The children are sent home with notes (which can go astray) . . .

I love the "which can go astray" line.


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[barb162]

57. "And the parents are called daily. "

SO there should be no foulups even if things go astray.

[barb162]

59. That sounds like the school district is bending over backward to help.

[Fireweed247]

68. ya!

n/t

[proud2BlibKansan]

66. It's very easy to do

Forms are in the school office and the district processes them all the time.

[Warren Stupidity]

4. "Faced with mounting unpaid lunch charges in the economic downturn"

why would that be? Huh? Coincidence?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090225/ap_on_re_us/cheese_sandwich_flap

"middle class people who feel the system owes their children a free lunch"

Oh bullshit. Right wing hate radio drool. Pathetic.

[AlCzervik]

5. stop pointng out facts!

Did you see this one line---

Some districts, she noted, don't allow children without money to eat anything.

[Warpy]

11. The $90,000 the district has already collected is not chump change

to a school district! The parents paid up because the kids complained about cheese sandwiches five days a week. None of them went hungry.

A lot of kids who were really in need but whose parents were too proud to ask for help were also identified when those parents got sick of hearing the kids complain about cheese sandwiches five days a week.

This has been a great success here. The school district got money, more poor kids got identified and enrolled in the free hot lunch program, and nobody ended up going hungry.

[Donnachaidh]

6. So all those under-employed but not QUITE poor enough to pay all their bills

Can just STFU or collect cans, just because you think a cheese sandwich is enough?

There is a brand NEW class developing daily in this country -- the NOT QUITE poor enough class. They may still be trying to pay bills on time, they may be hustling the few part time jobs out there.

And THOSE folks are getting kicked not ONLY from the pukes -- but from quite a few of the *supposed* "compassionate when it's convenient" Dems here.

Got news for you -- many of those people are in SHOCK. Many of them have NEVER had to ask ANYONE for help. NEVER. And those people are suffering an economic PTSD. They KNOW they have to ask, but they don't want to.

And it's because of the ATTITUDE shown in this OP and many others. Yeah, they may be late on their bills. But they are facing far more than *throw a few bucks at the school*. They may be trying to keep their vehicle from being re-possessed. They may be trying to keep their homes HEATED.

They KNOW that they are NOT going to see compassion. They KNOW they are going to face SHAME from those who are still fortunate enough to work.

And this argument is going on and on because some of you think these people are doing this on purpose? Is it any wonder WHY these folks don't mention they are having problems - and don't ask for help?

Look at all the compassion being spewed all over this board. It's SHAMEFUL how many are yowling over providing children food!

SHAME on you.

[leftstreet]

7. Wish I could rec your post

:applause:

[Lars39]

10. Post of the day.

:yourock:

[redqueen]

12. I applaud your effort...

shame it's most likely all for naught.

[Warpy]

13. Uh, anybody who's in enough trouble to need to collect cans

has kids who are eligible for the free hot lunch program.

Yes, they are doing the work to identify these kids.

Nobody is going hungry.

Back in the 50s, they would have.

[knitter4democracy]

16. Not so.

At least our lunch lady (who's seriously awesome) wouldn't pull that kind of crap on our school's kids.

[knitter4democracy]

14. That is exactly it.

I see it every week when I volunteer at my kids' school. Here in Michigan, we're seeing more and more hard-working, good, honest folks struggling to make it when they never have before. It's awful. Those near-poor (who really are poor if the government would update its stats once in awhile) are hurting more than ever.

[tnlefty]

17. Thank you!!!!

Around here, TVA rate increases have hit people hard, too, and more people are having a difficult time keeping up.

[Fireweed247]

21. Shame on me?

I have seen many posts declaring that DUers are against the free lunch program and I didn't think that was what was really going on.

Look at your post, at the people you are say are hurting...do you really think they are the ones complaining about their children getting a cheese sandwich?

[TorchTheWitch]

23. Bravo! Beautifully said!

You totally rock!

[lumberjack_jeff]

35. Feeding your kids goes to the front of the bills-to-be-paid list. n/t

[Donnachaidh]

40. ahh let's quibble...

:eyes:

As I said -- shame on you.

[barbtries]

44. thank you

i'm with you

[Kixel]

51. I get what you are saying...

But that pride hurts the school district. If they apply for free or reduced lunch, the school gets additional funding through programs like Title I. Additionally, free lunches are subsidized by state and national programs. If parents are too proud to apply for a free lunch, an institution which is probably stretching their budget already is losing money. The $90,000 collected is probably the food budget for a good portion of the year.

Using pride as an excuse to not fill out the paper work hurts the schools-institutions which are already struggling with their budgets (the stimulus checks haven't been distributed yet) is not a good way for anyone to go. I'm all about kids getting free lunch, but parents need to take the responsibility to make sure their kids are getting taken care of. To not do so because of pride is hurting their kids and the school-which makes it foolish pride in my books.

I'm a research analyst in the eduction industry-a huge focus of my job is school funding. I can see why schools were forced to make this choice. Why is the parents pride more important that a school budget? Money isn't magic. The parent's pride can't produce it anymore than a school's desire to feed the children can.

[Incitatus]

52. Well said

It is absolutely disgusting to see these attacks against free lunch programs on this site.

[Mollis]

64. Once again, great post

:applause:

[WolverineDG]

69. If the choice is a cheese sandwich or nothing, I'll take the cheese sandwich

What a lot of DUers are missing is just how much it costs to provide lunches (free or not) at all, which schools are not constitutionally required to do in the first place. There are grants & federal money for that, but they have to account for every penny & they don't get credit for giving food away "for free." The schools are required to provide an education. The $300K projected budget shortfall in Albuquerque is not chump change. That's several teaching positions.

What a lot of DUers are conveniently overlooking is the steps this particular district takes to give the parents time to either contact the school or apply for reduced or free lunch programs. I think it's hypocritical to expect the school to bend over backwards to do something they are not legally required to do & not expect the parents to do a simple task such as return a phone call, visit the school, fill out a form, or :gasp: actually make a lunch so their kid doesn't get a cheese sandwich.

dg

[rvablue]

8. I totally agree with you Fireweed. n/t

[Lost in CT]

9. Please stop repeating facts and using logic.

You are interfering with the righteous anger....

[Fireweed247]

15. the last time this article was posted...

the parents had dressed the kids up as sandwiches to protest at a school meeting. I'm sure that didn't embarass their children. They apparently had the time to attend this meeting but cannot find the time to make a sandwich. I don't believe that anyone who was truly low income would complain, they would be grateful.

[EFerrari]

19. And you know that, how?

[Fireweed247]

22. because people who are truly in need

wouldn't complain about getting a free cheese sandwich. If they were really embarassed about it, they would probably just hide away, not make a fuss. If people were truly low income and in desperate need, they would fill out the simple form getting their children a free hot lunch.

[EFerrari]

24. So, your answer is simply conjecture.

I hope that if you ever need anything, people are more generous to you.

[Fireweed247]

26. I am 'low income'

but I make my own bread, and my own sandwiches and I sure as hell wouldn't complain if someone gave me a free one.
That is how I know.
No one who is truly suffering, just out of work, would take the time and embarass themselves complaining about a cheese sandwich.

But the whole point of this thread is that I don't think any Duers are against the free lunch program. People are starting threads as if Duers are against helping poor children in need. I was sticking up for them because I thought people were missing the point that these were not children on the free lunch program that were doing the complaining.

[EFerrari]

28. You make a lot of assumptions about other people. n/t

[Fireweed247]

30. yeah okay whatever

but I am sure if you were down and out, feeling depressed and bad about yourself, you would go to the PTA with your kid dressed up as a sandwich and complain that your kid got a free cheese sandwich for lunch. I was just using common sense and the little known fact that people need only apply for free lunches if they have no money.

[EFerrari]

39. See above. n/t

[Lars39]

25. You need to read this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5151065

[Fireweed247]

27. that person gets a free lunch

they are not the ones complaining about a cheese sandwich.

[Lars39]

29. You must have barely skimmed it.

[Fireweed247]

31. it seems unlikely that someone who cannot fill out a form

to get free lunches would be complaining about a cheese sandwich. Whomever these parents are doing the complaining for the truly poor people who cannot fill out their forms, would be putting their energy to better use by helping them get their forms filled out and turned in.

[SoxFan]

20. Mmm...cheese

[tblue37]

50. Wouldn't that be cheesecake? nt

[Kceres]

32. I agree. I am a lunch lady.

We would never deprive a hot lunch to a free/reduced lunch child, it's against school policy to begin with. The kids who get cold sandwiches are the kids NOT ON subsidized lunch whose parents received multiple notes and telephone calls. I always feel sorry for the cold-sandwich kids, but it always works. The child complains and the parents pay their bill!

[Fireweed247]

49. Thank you for your well informed perspective!

n/t

[ConcernedCanuk]

36. I'm 58. - - Cheese sammiches, sometimes just cheese and crackers are one of my staples

.
.
.

I don't see the problem here . .

now if they were DIRT sandwiches which some kids have to eat . . .

then I would understand the complaints

shut up and eat already . . .

[Kansas Wyatt]

42. When I was in school, I would have preferred a cheese sandwich over...

Some of the hot lunches being served.

Who hasn't had a cheese sandwich as a kid anyway?

Bet there are kids in other countries who would have loved to have a cheese sandwich as a main course meal.

[mia]

43. ...and their kids may be charging the extra ice cream and chips to

their lunch accounts. I'm a teacher and I've seen students run out of money in their lunch accounts - especially with the younger students. I don't think that schools should allow the students to "charge" these extras to their lunch accounts. They should bring the extra dollar like the other students do. The kids are getting an early taste of the "charge it" mentality, and I doubt that parents are even aware of why their children's accounts are running low early. The schools need to find another way to make money other than by selling the kids junk food. They fill up un this stuff and barely eat their cafeteria lunches.

[NashVegas]

46. I Think the Whole Concept Of Putting Lunch on Credit Is Ridiculous

Where do kids first learn to handle money, anyway?

[Fireweed247]

47. they are letting kids charge up junk food!

wow, that sounds like a really bad idea!

[CreekDog]

48. And kids not getting fed properly are not deadbeats

feed the kid, figure out the bill later. :banghead:

[killbotfactory]

53. Shaming kids in front of their peers for their parents behavior is wrong.

A free nutritious breakfast and lunch should be offered to every kid, regardless of their parents ability to pay. A full belly is a prerequisite for proper learning.

[Incitatus]

54. I don't care what the reason is that a kid can't bring or pay for his lunch.

Whatever the reason, it is NOT the kid's fault and they should be provided a decent meal. For many of them, it is the best meal they will get all day.

"Most people are complaining about middle class people who feel the system owes their children a free lunch and actually go out of their way to protest the cheese sandwich when it takes less effort to just pay their damn bill"

Wow, that sure sounds like an argument I would expect to hear on a DIFFERENT site.

[joeunderdog]

55. Quick question:

How many bologna and cheese sandwiches can you make for one $110M airplane? Just one plane.

Seriously.

[Heidi]

56. Kids shouldn't be penalized for how their parents "feel," right or wrong.

NT

[Fireweed247]

58. I am FOR FREE LUNCHES

So many people keep missing the point, but I have read many lunch ladies responses and they also say that the kids not paying CAN pay, their parents just aren't doing it. This policy is a way to get the parents who CAN pay to pay so it doesn't hurt the lunch program that needs those funds to continue. If they fill out their paperwork, the school gets reimbursed for the meals, if not the school loses money. This policy has been working to return the much needed funds to the schools as well as get the children who need free/reduced lunches on the program.

It would be nice if the schools had more money, everyone wants their tax dollars to go to more important things than the military, Israel etc. but since that is not the case and the schools are hurting, it is not wrong to expect the parents who CAN pay to pay for their children's meals. My local school is so low on funds, children are asked to bring in kleenex, glue, tape....things that should be normally provided. The schools are hurting, that is the point. All DUers wish the schools had enough money to feed all the children but they do not.

Many parents have stated that their children are not shamed by this policy and many actually would rather have a sandwich. Maybe there is a solution in this. Give ALL the kids sandwiches. I cannot believe that they are outsourcing school meals to fast food companies, and so many people here keep calling the free lunch a great hot meal. Maybe you all haven't been to a school lately but the lunch food is all crap. They give them fried french toast sticks with a cup of syrup and teachers do nothing to monitor how much sugar they eat and then they send them back into class. And people wonder why kids can't focus anymore. I can't believe the schools are raising funds by selling the kids junk food, which is another reason some of these lunch credit cards are maxed out. And people wonder why a large percentage of children are overweight.

My solution: Get the Chick Fil A, sodas, junk food.. out of the schools and provide Sandwiches, milk and fruit to all!

[dustbunnie]

62. Guilty, guilty, guilty!

:D In high school I subsisted on chips, ice cream and fries. That was it, Every day. My mother would have killed me if she knew. But we all ate like that then.

I completely agree with you. You could even add hot soup to the sandwich, salad/fruit lunch and it wouldn't be a big deal. The book Fast Food Nation has a whole section on how mega-fast-food corps are taking over schools and promoting childhood obesity as well as a host of health issues.

As you say, even generic school caf food in general is not very good, with over-boiled veggies, fake mashed potatoes, chemically-altered mystery meat dishes served up to kids who could benefit from more nutritious fare. Sandwiches made with whole wheat bread, decent "real" fillings, be they meat, fish or veggie, along with soup and fruit would be a much better choice.

We're actually lucky. Lots of countries don't have national food programs. Even the more socially minded Canadians don't, although there are efforts made to feed children in pockets of economically depressed areas. The system here may not be perfect, but at least it exists!

[Fireweed247]

63. I love the soup idea

For the people who need their hot food, soup is inexpensive and healthy and one lunch lady could handle putting it on the burner as well as handing out sandwiches. Perhaps they could provide a sandwich bar so kids could make their own. I think this could save a lot of money, it would be so much healthier and feed everyone-problem solved!

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

61. Sorry To Say It, But The Knee Jerking Zealots Don't Like Reasoning, Logic And Facts.

They just want to bitch bitch bitch about stuff without having to like, ya know, actually THINK about the thing they're bitchin about LOL.

You are right in what you say. But the zealots are gonna continue their knee jerk idiocy anyway.

[Fireweed247]

65. Check this out...from another thread....

"More importantly, the study shows that private food service is associated with a reduction of 1 percent to 3 percent in scores on the Michigan Educational Assessment Program (MEAP tests for grades 3-9), after controlling for affluence, school resources and student traits. This is especially true for students in grades 3-5 and with the English, reading and writing tests."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5155409

It is time to get the crap corporate food out of our schools? Perhaps we can now agree on something...