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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:42 AM
Original message
Sen. Whitehouse Prepares the Nation for Torture Horrors
Sen. Whitehouse Prepares the Nation for Torture Horrors
by buhdydharma - Feb 27, 2009 - http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/2/27/17407/9646/766/700982

Senator Whitehouse is on both the Intelligence Committee and the Judiciary Committee. Thus he perhaps more than anyone else has access to ALL of the available information on the Bush Torture Network. Including the remaining pictures and videotapes from Abu Ghraib that were concealed from the public view. Pictures and videotapes that even Rumsfeld was shocked by, even though, as has become apparent since, he authorized them....or at least the programs that led to them..

Whitehouse: "...We also have to brace ourselves for the realistic possibility that as some of this conduct is exposed, we and the world will find it shameful, revolting. We may have to face the prospect of looking with horror at our own country's deeds. We are optimists, we Americans; we are proud of our country. Contrition comes hard to us.

But the path back from the dark side may lead us down some unfamiliar valleys of remorse and repugnance before we can return to the light. We may have to face our fellow Americans saying to us, "No, please, tell us that we did not do that, tell us that Americans did not do that" - and we will have to explain, somehow. This is no small thing, and not easy; this will not be comfortable or proud; but somehow it must be done. ..."

VIDEO 8:39 = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGt87QKPpHs
Whitehouse spoke on the Senate floor in support of Senator Leahy's (D-V.T.) proposal to hold a Judiciary Committee hearing on whether to establish a commission to investigate potential wrongdoing by the Bush Administration.
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
1. Rummy was the man behind the torture
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Kip Humphrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:59 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. and Cheney and Bush and Rice.
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. and Tenet and Powell, don't forget those two either.
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #7
21. Why not call a spade a spade; A stacked deck of cards
Edited on Sat Feb-28-09 05:35 PM by ooglymoogly
and indict the whole criminal enterprise; The repuke party who is dying to, once again, be able to wear sheets while it tortures, murders, pillages, robs the treasury, cheers on wars and torture and steals elections to facilitate that aim.
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MannyGoldstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 02:02 AM
Response to Reply #6
33. Bill Clinton Began Outsourced Torture
a.k.a. "extraordinary rendition"

http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2005/02/14/050214fa_fact6
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_rendition

It's a shame that this started with someone who called himself a Democrat.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 12:50 AM
Response to Reply #1
31. You're saying the Repug "Rock Star" behaved like a Nazi . . . ????
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biopowertoday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
2. Lets get it all out now and deal with it.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Because when it comes right down to it
we can't go forward until we take a look rearward. This sad chapter has to be dealt with and until it is it will always come back to haunt us, bite us in the ass if you will. I want better for the people who come after me.
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4lbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
3. I've read a lot of foreign press, which had more frequent and detailed reporting of the torture.
I'm already "ready" for it.
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elizfeelinggreat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
12. That should be well known here, that other countries
know what we didn't know and what was kept from US citizens. Otherwise we will just hear that it should never have come out, as if by not showing the photos it never happened. I hope they work on the framing because this needs to be owned up to and we need to place the blame where it belongs.
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. That's what I named the Rumsfeld Doctrine many years ago
It's not the deed that was bad, it was the taking of the pictures that was bad. I can't even pretend to understand that kind of reptilian mind.
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elizfeelinggreat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. Yes, it's a popular notion
I'm sorry to say I've heard it often. Our side needs to confront it, although I don't believe we'll change the 'reptiles' themselves we can shame them.
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. Shame the Americans who sided with this reptilian bunch
But the reptiles themselves need to be charged with war crimes.
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ooglymoogly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #15
24. self delete
Edited on Sat Feb-28-09 06:32 PM by ooglymoogly
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Optical.Catalyst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
5. This 'Preparing the Nation' and slow piecemeal release of information only benefits the Republicans
It all needs to be dumped out at once so the torrent of outrage will sweep Chimpy and his gang into prison.

Like the story about boiling a frog. Put a frog in boiling water it will jump out. Put a frog in water and heat it up slow, it will stay until it dies.

Slow doesn't make the grade with war crimes. It all needs to come out at once so public opinion will back putting Bush and Cheney on trial.
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elizfeelinggreat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. You said it
much better than I did (just above)!
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loudsue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
8. This will lead to international cries for a war crimes trial and arrests in the Hague.
Bush & Cheney and Rumsfeld need to be hung in the town square. I wish we could take all of their genes out of the gene pool.
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GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
9. How trite ...
to remind Americans to be proud of their country.
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Cobalt-60 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
10. republican party = torture party
I refer to them as the torture party.
It makes my conservative friends miserable.
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
11. They will see their apathy and carelessness and blindness.
Thank you Senator Whitehouse. It is time for the truth. Some of us are painfully waiting.
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DavidDvorkin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 10:48 AM
Response to Original message
14. It has to be reported for the people to be revolted by it
If the press ignores what Whitehouse reveals, then it will have no large-scale effect.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
18. This is a set up for another worthless "COMMISSION" READ IT HERE:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5154501&mesg_id=5154501

THEY ARE SETTING THIS UP FOR A COMMISSION..

COMMISSION = WHITE WASH!!!!!!!!!!

go read the full article at link.


look there are dems partly responsible as well...WHO KNEW WHAT WAS GOING ON AND DIDN'T 1. STOP IT OR
2. EXPOSE IT OR 3. WERE COMPLICIT..

This will never see the full light of day..ever...especially with another bogus "COMMISSION" THAT LEAHY WANTS TO USE TO PROTECT THE HIGH CRIMINALS.. don't get me wrong..they will get the little guys..but this congress nor Obama want any of the high powers to ever be held accountable or to prosecute them..ever!! Thats why Obama was the chosen one.
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Would you prefer they do nothing? What would you have Congress do?
Finally, Bush is out and the Executive Junta is over.
Now, Congress can act without opposition in the White House.
Let them act without you sounding off like Rove.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #19
25. turn it over to prosecutors and let them follow the law!!!!!!!!
enough of the damn commissions that go no where, amd hold no one accountable!
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 02:20 AM
Response to Reply #25
34. There is no suggestion anywhere prosecutors will be supplanted! Congress can do
an inquiry if they choose. Oversight is their power and responsibility. I support them doing that.

Let the Justice Department do what they are supposed to do, and allow Congress to follow its own perogatives.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #34
40. I am still awaiting prosecutors for 9/11
sorry but I do not have the same confidence you seem to have!

How's that magic bullet theory working for you ?????????

CBS News Chico California

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEn_6vqp17Y&eurl=http://whatreallyhappened.com/


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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. if I was like
Rove , I guess I could count on the dems protecting me from breaking the US Law..but I know I would be held accountable for ignoring 4 subpoena's and not showing up in front of them!
And I guess if I was acting like Rove , I could get a "review from Obama" if I broke the law...yeah right..I would not go to the bank with that...Rove doesn't seem to bother Obama..seems Obama is doing everything in his power to protect Rove!Any common American would be held accountable for breaking the law, and the president would not invert himself to openly protect someone who has violated the constitution.

I am an American, I have the right to want to see the laws of my land upheld...and to say so loudly...if that makes me sound like anyone....I should damn well say I sound like an American, who cares about my country and the what constitition used to mean, I make no excuses to protect anyone from breaking the laws of my nation!!!!!!!!

Keep your Rove analogies to yourself.

The pathetic thing is, many people here used to care about those laws as well, we BOTH know that!
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pokercat999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 05:32 AM
Response to Reply #19
38. I would PREFER that ANY Dem's involved in any way
come forward with full and complete confessions! Then I would PREFER that we use that information as the basis for a real and complete CRIMINAL investigation sparing no one. Finally I would PREFER that we open up ALL classified govt documents. We will never be a free people if the govt can keep secrets from us.
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AzDar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
20.  AzDar sez : "One must clean out the infection before the wound can truly heal."
:patriot:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
22. We may have to face our fellow Americans saying to us: No, please, tell us we did not do that






http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?r111:1:./temp/~r111tKW7IO ::



COMMISSION OF INQUIRY -- (Senate - February 25, 2009)


--- Mr. LEAHY. When historians look back at the last 8 years, they are going to evaluate one of the most secretive administrations in the history of the United States. Now, the citizens of this country have said we should have change, and we should. But we also know that the past can be prologue unless we set things right.

In the last administration, there was a justification for torture. It presided over the abuse at Abu Ghraib, destroyed tapes of harsh interrogations, and conducted extraordinary renditions that sent people to countries that permit torture during interrogation.

They used the Justice Department, our premiere law enforcement agency, to subvert the intent of congressional statutes, even to subvert nonpartisan prosecutions, and instead to use them in partisan ways to try to affect the outcome of elections. They wrote secret law to give themselves legal cover for these misguided policies, policies that could not withstand scrutiny if brought to light.

Nothing has done more to damage America's standing and moral authority than the revelation that during the last 8 years we abandoned our historic commitment to human rights by repeatedly stretching the law and the bounds of Executive power to authorize torture and cruel treatment.

As President Obama said to Congress and the American people last night, ``if we're honest with ourselves, we'll

admit that for too long we have not always met'' our responsibilities.
Now, the President said that about the economy, but the same holds true here. It is only by understanding how we arrived at this moment that we can move forward. How can we restore our moral leadership and ensure transparent government if we ignore what has happened?

There has been discussion, and in some cases disagreement, on how best to do this. There are some who resist any effort to investigate the misdeeds of the recent past. Indeed, some have tried to extract a devil's bargain from Attorney General Holder, a commitment that he would not prosecute for anything that happened on President Bush's watch. That is a pledge no prosecutor should give, and, to his credit, Eric Holder did not.

There are others who say that regardless of the cost in time, resources, and unity, we have to prosecute these administration officials to lay down a marker. The courts are already considering congressional subpoenas that have been issued and claims of privilege and legal immunities, and they will for some time.

Over my objections, Congress has already passed laws granting immunity to those who facilitated warrantless wiretapping and conducted cruel interrogations. The Department of Justice issued legal opinions justifying these executive branch excesses which, while legally faulty, would undermine attempts to prosecute.

A failed attempt to prosecute for this conduct might be the worst result of all if it is seen as justifying abhorrent actions. Given the steps Congress and the executive have already taken to shield this conduct from accountability, that is a possible outcome.

The alternative to these approaches is a middle ground, a middle ground I spoke of at Georgetown University a little over 2 weeks ago. That middle ground would involve the formation of a commission of inquiry dedicated to finding out what happened. Such a commission's objective would be to find the truth. People would be invited to come forward and share their knowledge and experiences, not for the purpose of constructing criminal indictments, but to assemble the facts, to know what happened and to make sure mistakes are not repeated.

I have seen what happened before in prosecutions. We don't find the full truth. We prosecute those at the bottom of the chair of command, but we don't find out what those above did.

While many are focused on whether crimes were committed, it is just as important to learn if significant mistakes were made, regardless of whether they can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt to a unanimous jury to be criminal conduct. We compound the serious mistakes already made if we limit our inquiry to criminal investigations and trials. Moreover, it is easier for prosecutors to net those far down the ladder than those at the top who set the tone and the policies. We do not yet know the full extent of our government's actions in these areas, and we must be sure that an independent review goes beyond the question of whether crimes were committed, to the equally important assessment of whether mistakes were made so we may endeavor not to repeat them. As I have said, we must read the page before we turn it.

Vice President Dick Cheney continues to assert unilaterally that the Bush administration's tactics, including torture, were appropriate and effective. But interested parties' characterizations and self-serving conclusions are not facts and are not the unadulterated truth. We cannot let those be the only voices heard, nor allow their declarations to serve as historical conclusions on such important questions. An independent commission can undertake this broader and fundamental task.

I am talking about this process with others in Congress, with outside groups and experts, and I have begun to discuss this with the White House as well. I am not interested in a commission of inquiry comprised of partisans, intent on advancing partisan conclusions. Rather, we need an independent inquiry that is beyond reproach and outside of partisan politics to pursue and find the truth. Such a commission would focus primarily on the subjects of national security and executive power in the government's counterterrorism effort. We have had successful oversight in some areas, but on these issues, including harsh interrogation tactics, extraordinary rendition and executive override of the laws, the last administration successfully kept many of us in the dark about what happened and why.

President Obama issued significant executive orders in his first days in office, looking to close Guantanamo and secret prisons, banning the use of harsh interrogation techniques and forming task forces to review our detainee and interrogation policies. I support his decisions, and I am greatly encouraged by his determination to do the hard work to determine how we can reform policies in these areas to be lawful, effective and consistent with American values. My proposal for a commission of inquiry would address the rest of the picture, which is to understand how these types of policies were formed and exercised in the last administration, to ensure that mistakes are not repeated. I am open to good ideas from all sides as to the best way to set up such a commission and to define its scope and goals.

A recent Gallup poll showed that 62 percent of Americans favor an investigation of these very issues. Respected groups including Human Rights First, the Constitution Project and thoughtful Senators, including Senator Whitehouse and Senator Feingold, have also embraced this idea. The determination to look beyond the veil that has so carefully concealed the decision making in these areas is growing. Next Wednesday, the Judiciary Committee will hold a hearing to explore these ideas and to continue the conversation about what we can do moving forward.

Two years ago I described the scandals at the Bush-Cheney-Gonzales Justice Department as the worst since Watergate. They were. We are still digging out from the debris they left behind while those in the last administration continue to defend their policies, knowing full well that we do not even know the full extent of what those polices were or how they were made. We cannot be afraid to understand what we have done if we are to remain a nation equally vigilant in defending both our national security and our Constitution. I hope all Members of Congress will give serious consideration to these difficult questions.

I argue it will be the quintessential American thing to do.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Rhode Island.

Mr. WHITEHOUSE. Mr. President, during my brief tenure so far in the Senate, the Judiciary Committee has confronted many difficult issues, battles over judicial nominees, complex legislative matters, a historic investigation into misdeeds of the Bush administration's Department of Justice. In that process, the committee saw U.S. attorneys fired for political reasons, the Civil Rights Division run amok, declassified legal theories asserting that the President can secretly ignore his own executive orders. We saw unprecedented politicization of a noble department, and we saw those Office of Legal Counsel memos approving interrogation techniques long understood, long known to be torture. Fortunately, throughout that time, Chairman Leahy sought answers. His efforts were evenhanded but unyielding. We know so much of what we know now because Patrick Leahy was satisfied with nothing less than the whole truth.

Today his work continues, and I wish to speak in support of his efforts. The backdrop is, of course, a grim one. Over and over, as I travel around my State of Rhode Island, I hear from people facing challenges that seem almost insurmountable, challenges President Obama spoke about in his address to Congress last evening. Every day it gets harder and harder to find a job, to pay the bills, to make ends meet. Every day it seems more difficult to see a way out. The Bush administration left our country deeply in debt, bleeding jobs overseas, our financial institutions rotten and weakened and an economy in free-fall. This is the wreckage we see everywhere, in shuttered plants, as my colleague from Pennsylvania sees at home so cruelly, in long lines, and in worried faces. But there is also the damage we cannot see so well, the damage below the water line of our democracy, damage caused by a systematic effort to twist policy to suit

political ends; to substitute ideology for science, fact, and law; and to misuse instruments of power.
If an administration rigged the intelligence process and, on faulty intelligence, sent our country to war, if an administration descended to interrogation techniques of the Inquisition, of Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge, descended to techniques that we have prosecuted as crimes in military tribunals and in Federal courts, if institutions as noble as the Department of Justice and as vital as the Environmental Protection Agency were subverted by their own leaders, if the integrity of our markets and the fiscal security of our budget were open wide to the frenzied greed of corporations and speculators and contractors, if taxpayers were cheated and the forces of Government rode to the rescue of the cheaters and punished the whistleblowers, if our Government turned the guns of official secrecy against our own people to mislead, confuse, and propagandize them, if the integrity of public officials, the warnings of science, the honesty of Government procedures and the careful historic balance of our separated powers all were seen as obstacles to be overcome and not attributes to be celebrated, if the purpose of Government became no longer to solve problems but simply to work them for political advantage, and a bodyguard of lies and jargon and propaganda was emitted to fool and beguile the American people, something very serious would have gone wrong in our country.

Such damage must be repaired. I submit that as we begin the task of rebuilding this Nation, we have a duty to our country to determine how great that damage is. Democracy is not a static institution. It is a living education, an ongoing education in freedom of a people.

As Harry Truman said, addressing a joint session of Congress back in 1947:


One of the chief virtues of a democracy is that its defects are always visible, and under democratic processes can be pointed out and corrected.


We have to learn the lessons from this past carnival of folly, greed, lies, and wrongdoing so the damage can, under democratic processes, be pointed out and corrected. If we bind ourselves to this history, we deny ourselves its lessons, lessons that came at too painful a cost to ignore.

Those lessons merit disclosure and discussion. Indeed, disclosure and discussion makes the difference between this history being a valuable lesson for the bright and upward forces of our democracy or a blueprint for those darker forces to return and someday do it all over again. As we work toward a brighter future ahead, to days when jobs return to our cities, capital to our businesses, and security to our lives, we cannot set aside our responsibility to take an accounting of where we are, what was done, and what must now be repaired. We also have to brace ourselves for the realistic possibility that as some of this conduct is exposed, we and the world will find it shameful, revolting. We may have to face the prospect of looking with horror at our own country's deeds.

We are optimists, we Americans. We are proud of our country. Contrition comes hard to us. But the path back from the dark side may lead us down some unfamiliar valleys of remorse and repugnance before we can return to the light. We may have to face our fellow Americans saying to us: No, please, tell us we did not do that, tell us Americans did not do that. And we will have to explain somehow.

This is no small feat and not easy. This will not be comfortable or proud, but somehow it must be done.

Chairman Leahy has embarked on the process of considering a new commission, one appropriate to the task of investigating the damage the Bush administration did to America, to her finest traditions and institutions, to her reputation and integrity. The hearing he has called in coming days will more thoroughly examine this question to help us determine how best to move forward. I stand with him. Before we can repair the harm of the last 8 years, we must learn the truth.
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-02-09 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #22
41. Nice List. Let's start adding things. #1. Bush stole the White House from the People.
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Mike 03 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 05:41 PM
Response to Original message
23. Maybe this material is what Seymore Hersh was trying to clue us into. NT
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-09 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
27. patrick (or anyone else) better not give them immunity n/t
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 12:25 AM
Response to Original message
28. Whitehouse is also on Foreign Relations - hope he can connects some dots across Cmtes. nt
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 12:28 AM
Response to Original message
29. And I say, I want those on national news and the people who gave the orders
at the dockett for ahem, warcrimes

Oh and Senator Whitehouse, shocking people is a good thing

These people need to grow the fuck up and stop believing in fairy tales, such as Murican exceptionalism

Yes we did it, it was done in my and your name
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jaundicedi Donating Member (41 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 12:48 AM
Response to Original message
30. It has come to this in my lifetime...
...that I should hear conduct authorized by the leaders of my nation, and done in my name, compared to the atrocities of Pol Pot...and that I should not be surprised nor able to be offended by the analogy. I am glad my grandmother didn't live to see this.
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Jeep789 Donating Member (935 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 01:37 AM
Response to Original message
32. I'm already revolted by what I have seen
and even more so by what I am certain they did. But the truth must come out to prevent it from ever happening again.
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Swagman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 03:51 AM
Response to Original message
35. the truth must out-before any healing can begin.
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Blackhatjack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 04:01 AM
Response to Original message
36. I'm telling ya ... Repubs no longer even know Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld etc.
They wouldn't know 'em if they ran into them in the hallway.

You can bet there is some creative re-writing of history by Repubs, and they won't take a bit of credit for their role in making torture happen.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 05:11 AM
Response to Original message
37. What horrors will we discover?
It's sickening to even think about.
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-01-09 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #37
39. Sy Hersch told about it in 2004
Edited on Sun Mar-01-09 11:54 AM by flyarm
I am sure more is known now and all has so far been covered up..my fear is a commission and that it will be covered up forever.

We need the special prosecutor law over turned and sppoint a special prosecutor..not another white wash commission!
Understand this, dems in congress saw these tapes..and why were they not on the steps of congress screaming to the media to release these tapes then..to stop this torture and this behavior??????

I fear a commission like the Warren Commission and the 9/11 commission and the Rockefeller commission..to be another white wash.
How's that magic bullet theory working for us now..
and don't even get me started on the 9/11 commission..that was a disgraceful joke on us and the world.
If this stuff is not prosecuted under the full US and International law..these same people will resurface in our children's lifetime ..if not in our own.

After all Obama just sent Kissinger to Russia to represent his administration and therefore..us.The same Kissinger who is in my lifetime one of the worst criminals to work in our government..the same Kissinger we all screamed about when Bush put him in to run the 9/11 commission ..until he was removed because 9/11 families went beserk over his assignment.

These people come back and get new life because they are never held accountable or put in jail or prosecuted ..nothing they get a "commission" white wash!

see :

Warren commission
Rockefeller Commission
Tower Commission
9/11 commission http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEn_6vqp17Y&eurl=http://whatreallyhappened.com/


and many more such white washes.

Lets set the record straight for once..and get a sepical prosecutor..and lets really hold people accountable, and get those responsible behind bars..so they can never break our laws or international laws again, and then and only then can we hold our heads up and say to the world this is unacceptable to the American people!

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2004/07/15/hersh/index.html

Thursday, July 15, 2004 12:26 EDT
Hersh: Children sodomized at Abu Ghraib, on tape
After Donald Rumsfeld testified on the Hill about Abu Ghraib in May, there was talk of more photos and video in the Pentagon's custody more horrific than anything made public so far. "If these are released to the public, obviously it's going to make matters worse," Rumsfeld said. Since then, the Washington Post has disclosed some new details and images of abuse at the prison. But if Seymour Hersh is right, it all gets much worse.

Hersh gave a speech last week to the ACLU making the charge that children were sodomized in front of women in the prison, and the Pentagon has tape of it. The speech was first reported in a New York Sun story last week, which was in turn posted on Jim Romenesko's media blog, and now EdCone.com and other blogs are linking to the video. We transcribed the critical section here (it starts at about 1:31:00 into the ACLU video.) At the start of the transcript here, you can see how Hersh was struggling over what he should say:

"Debating about it, ummm ... Some of the worst things that happened you don't know about, okay? Videos, um, there are women there. Some of you may have read that they were passing letters out, communications out to their men. This is at Abu Ghraib ... The women were passing messages out saying 'Please come and kill me, because of what's happened' and basically what happened is that those women who were arrested with young boys, children in cases that have been recorded. The boys were sodomized with the cameras rolling. And the worst above all of that is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking that your government has. They are in total terror. It's going to come out."

"It's impossible to say to yourself how did we get there? Who are we? Who are these people that sent us there? When I did My Lai I was very troubled like anybody in his right mind would be about what happened. I ended up in something I wrote saying in the end I said that the people who did the killing were as much victims as the people they killed because of the scars they had, I can tell you some of the personal stories by some of the people who were in these units witnessed this. I can also tell you written complaints were made to the highest officers and so we're dealing with a enormous massive amount of criminal wrongdoing that was covered up at the highest command out there and higher, and we have to get to it and we will. We will. You know there's enough out there, they can't (Applause). .... So it's going to be an interesting election year."
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