If Hilary Clinton gets the nomination..."I'll never vote for her."

[rpannier]

(I am adding that this is a sarcastic post about people who make sweeping comments about Clinton, Edwards, Obama, etc without considering what the option is...a republikkan. But apparantly my post is not clear or people are only reading the title and then responding. I picked Sen Clinton because she seems to generate the most hostility here. This post was inspired by a DUer who posted that they would NEVER vote for Obama a few days ago)

What's that?
What if Brownback gets the republikkan nomination?
F**k No. If he wins, we'll be a friggin Theocracy. If he gets it, I'll vote for Clinton. But only if it's Brownback.

Who???
Tancredo?!
F**K THAT!
That guys a racist lunatic. He makes Brownback look good.
Okay, Okay. If either Tancredo or Brownback get it, I'll vote for Clinton.

Wha...what if Mitt Romney wins???
You gotta be kidding! Mitt 'the piece of sh*t' Romney!
No way. He's about as bad as Brownback.
Okay, okay. If he gets it...I'll vote Clinton.

I don't think any of those three will get it...but if they do...

Huh? Who? Mc Cain.
You mean the forked tongue express John McCain.
If he gets it we'll be in Iraq long after my elementary school aged daughters have died of old age.
There's no f**king way I'd EVER take a chance of HIM being President.
If it's him...I'll vote Hilary.

Santorum???!
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
He won't run, but if he did, I'd vote Clinton for sure.

Gu...guli...guliani?!
Not just NO. Hell f**king NO.
If he gets it...I'm voting Clinton...

Okay..okay...so I'll be voting for Clinton if the republikkans are running Guiliani, Santorum, McCain, Romney..........

This message has been brought to you by the people who remember how well the "I won't vote Gore" approach worked in 2000.

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bryant69]

15. No Regrets?

So like after Gingrich invades Iran and provokes a nuclear showdown with NK you are committing yourself that you will feel no regrets?

I solemnly swear that no matter how bad the Republicans act once they are in power, I won't regret my small part in helping them get there.

Wish I'd have thought of that before voting for Nader in 2000.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[ShortnFiery]

18. Oh yes, I remember all those THREATS in 2000. We will enjoy a DEMOCRATIC Congress.

Even a President Gingrich will not "get by" with invading countries.

IMO, this is EXACTLY what WE (The Democratic Party) need (HRC getting her political a** handed to her in the General Election) to figuratively drive the wooden spike through the HEART of the Corporate DLC. We need to purge our party of these DINOS. HRC getting wiped out in the General Election may just be the WAKE-UP CALL that the DLC does NOT have our best interests in heart.

No, I was bullied by my husband to vote for Clinton the second time; 2000 to vote for Gore and finally in 2004 to vote for Kerry. EACH TIME, I folded on my conscious and went along with the DLCer Candidate.

Not AGAIN! I will not be coerced into voting for people who also could care less about the average American wage slave ONLY because they are more diplomatic and say nice things before they GUT "the middle class" financially. ;)

[MH1]

23. If you are lumping Kerry in with Clinton and as a "DLCer candidate"

who "doesn't care about the middle class" - I suggest you read up on what Kerry has done - for exmple, empowering microenterprise. The guy who won the Nobel Peace Prize this year won it for something called "Microlending." Kerry has worked hard to bring some semblance of that concept to this country, to empower folks, who are disadvantaged in various ways, through micro-entrepreneurship. His work seems to be mostly unappreciated by the "lefties" on internet discussion boards, but it is important and he keeps doing it.

Kerry has worked hard through his entire career to enact legislation that helps keep toxins out of the environment and make it easier for low-income folk to get health care for their kids.

I guess none of that matters to the "average American wage slave" though...and somehow amounts to "gutting the middle class financially"? :eyes:

Or was it really your "conscious" that "folded" in 2004, and that's not just a spelling error?


Edited to add punctuation for clarification.

[ShortnFiery]

24. No, like Kerry folded like a cheap suit the day after the 2004 election.

He would not have served the middle class well.

I'll let this go, but this time DLCers, be prepared to not again be successful at coercing and bullying the liberal base of the party to vote for a DLC selected candidate. Many of us will go over to the Greens with regard to the General election.

You can curse us, name call us as "traitors," but it doesn't matter because we are doing this for the "long term" health of our beloved Democratic Party.

I know you do not understand nothing save for the here and now, but the DLC is just like the RNC, only more polished. We need a party purge.

I hope HRC is not nominated. If she is, you will have many people "walk out" on voting Democratic for the General Election.

Let's allow time to pass and see what unfolds?

If you're right, I promise to apologize as I, deep down, hope that I'm wrong ... but I'm not. :)

[sharp_stick]

26. Enjoy your time with President Brownback

I'm sure he wouldn't ever consider the idea of martial law to get around congress now would he? Personally I'd vote for Satan himself if he was the dem nominee. Counting on Democratic Congress victories got us into a world of trouble around 1994 or so and is a big reason shrubbie was able to do any damned thing he wanted for six years, but you know that is ancient history. We're back now and it's bound to be permanent.

This idea of voting for a non party and then feeling all superior while the world goes to Hell in a handbasket because a nutjob slid into the top post is kind of sad.

[ShortnFiery]

27. I feel sad, not superior.

You're the one with the moral outrage.

All I'm saying is that I won't be "the only" liberal who will look to the long term health of the Democratic Party by allowing the DLCers to be run "outta town."

We have different perspectives. I love the Democratic Party but I loathe the DLC. :shrug:

[bryant69]

33. I'm sorry to threaten you.

I certainly didn't mean to.

Bryant

[LiberalFighter]

29. So you think as long as Congress is Democratic it would be okay

for the President to be Republican?

Then that President will get to appoint the next 2 or 3 Supreme Court Justices.
All vacancies that occur in district and appeal courts.
All USA's
All other non-cabinet appointments, etc.

[Deep13]

2. I'll vote for whoever the nominee is just to keep more Alitos unemployed.

:shrug:

[BlueManDude]

3. A lot of folks here had that same attitude toward Kerry after he vanquished Gov. Dean

they tend to come around as the election nears.

Still, Hillary is a disaster for the party.

[w4rma]

6. Agreed on both accounts. (nt)

[rpannier]

12. And I believe they will this time around too

I just find it fascinating that people will use the same talking points that I used in my post.

The..."I'll never vote for him or her if she gets the nomination..." shpeel.

It's done without considering the possibilities of what would happen if they abandon the nominee...
Hence the note at the bottom about remembering how well this approach worked in 2000.

[BlueManDude]

14. I'll vote for her but I think she's got a ceiling that makes winning a 2 person race impossible

he best hope would be a Giuliani GOP nomination which would precipitate a 3rd party from the right.

[yardwork]

4. For crying out loud. The election is not until November 2008

and people are already threatening to vote against the Democratic nominee, thereby handing the election to whatever dumb-shit the Republicans nominate? Grow up.

[rpannier]

9. The point of my post is just that

We listen to the people who complain about Hilary or John or whomever.
They make this point without considering who the republikkans will run.
When they're hit with a name of an opponent their whole attitude changes.

[yardwork]

34. I recognize that this was your point. I was responding to those responding.

[rpannier]

41. My apologies

I was just sort of surprised at some of the replies I was getting.

I can understand people's frustrations with each candidate.

I don't understand how after 2000, people (especially DUers)can say they'd vote for a third party, knowing full well we could easily get a repeat of 2000.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

10. Question - If you are SO against talking about the 2008 election

why in the world did you click on this thread??? Seriously, if people want to talk about the 08 election that should be able to. If you don't care - don't click - your right, your prerogative !

peace out.

[yardwork]

35. Where did I say I was against talking about the 2008 election?

Don't put words in my mouth.

[ShortnFiery]

11. Country comes before party, and HRC is in bed with The Right Wing.

She will continue to send our jobs overseas, so it won't matter much if I vote my conscious for ONCE in the past three Presidential Elections ... finally be true to myself and vote Green. But who knows, maybe HRC will try to bring in the Greens with her "big tent" approach? :rofl: When hell freezes over, the entire party will then be fully OWNED by the DLC.

I hope and pray that she does not get the nomination. I'm sorry, I'll have to quit DU if she does win the nomination because I will NOT vote for Corporatist DLCer, not again. :grr:

[still_one]

5. too bad she isn't going to get the nomination

As the primaries determne who will be the top two candidates, Edwards, Richardson, Obama, and others will consolodate their votes, and Clinton will NOT be the nominee

sorry to burst your bubble

[Laura PourMeADrink]

7. Nader?

I will vote for her - but I will be holding my nose the whole time.

[rodeodance]

8. if that happens we are in REAL trouble!

[NavyDavy]

13. if you vote for anyone other than a dem.....you shouldn't be

on a democrat site, period.

[rpannier]

16. I agree with you.

And that's why at the bottom of my post it says

"This message has been brought to you by the people who remember how well the "I won't vote Gore" approach worked in 2000."

I didn't think I needed to list this as a sarcastic post about people who say they won't ever vote for "Blah Blah" without considering who the opposition is, but I guess I needed to.

[NavyDavy]

20. no I got the meaning of the post...and I agree with you

[LiberalFighter]

30. I wonder how many wished they could change their vote in 2000

knowing Gore and what Bush has done?

[Leopolds Ghost]

36. Gore won in Florida by 300-600 votes but refused a state-wide recount.

The only condition under which Gore would have won is if he had demanded a state-wide recount. Nader or no Nader. When Bush proposed a recount, Gore (thru his spokesman, Lieberman, refused. He insisted on counting the votes only in a few urban counties, not all the disenfranchised rural blacks whose ballots were lying around, undercounted, throughout the state. Do you regret voting for a man, Gore, who folded like a cheap suit during the recount and refused to claim what was his?

[ShortnFiery]

19. Right, if HRC wins the Nomination, I'll leave DU ... but until then it's primary season.

On Edit: If so, I do think I will be able to return after the General Election because after FOX brings out it's sharp knives, HRC will figuratively not have a political butt left. Mark my words, she'll lose in a landslide because the other networks will fall in line with FOX, i.e., all corporate media benefits from Republican Presidents much more than Democratic ones. ;)

[NavyDavy]

21. with attitudes like that we surely will give the WH back to the

Repukes....

[ShortnFiery]

22. Well, we can fight like hell to keep HRC from winning the Nomination.

IMO, that's our only hope for a Democratic President in 2008.

[johncoby2]

17. AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TreasonousBastard]

25. Me? If Hillary gets the nod I'll stamp my little feet and...

beat my little fists against the wall and spend months whining on every discussion board in the world.

Then I'll vote for Nader. Or Kucinich. Or whoever has a name I can remember to spell on a write-
in ballot.

Or maybe I just won't vote at all. That'll teach 'em!

[TheLeftyMom]

28. Good lord if Brownback got the nod from the pukes

EVERYONE MOVE TO CANADA NOW! I'm from KS and that man is an idiot.

Whew, sorry for the all CAPs, I had visions of life suddenly being like The Handmaids Tale... which I am sure would be an ideal situation in his warped mind.

[sshan2525]

31. Let's just forget the 08 election and declare the GOP ....

...the winners now! It will accomplish just as much as voting for a third party. I am no fan of Hillary Clinton. I will not vote for her in the primaries, but if for some awful reason the Democratic voters choose her as the nominee, I will hold my nose and pull the lever. It appears that many are thinking that the possibility of the DLC getting "a message" from their vote is an acceptable or equal trade-off to the possibility that we will live under four more years of Rethug tyranny is as dangerous as it is ludicrous. 1) A third party candidate is never going to be elected President in this country under the "winner take all"/electoral college system currently in place. That system of rules is not going to change anytime soon because the two current parties with power are not going to allow it. 2) The vast majority of votes for third-party candidates will be taken away from the Democratic nominee thereby helping the enemy. 3) Any and all Democrats are preferable to any and all Republicans. 4) Neither the DLC or even the Democratic Party will get "the message" you hope to send. They and their similarly insular cronies in the media will misunderstand, as they always do, that "the message" was that the Dems were too liberal, not too conservative. The only way to fix this is to emulate what the Rethugs did 30 years ago to eventually take control: begin electing candidates on a local level who have liberal/progressive ideas and continue to promote them to state then national office. Get rid of the DLC by replacing them with real Democrats, not Rethugs. Let another GOP member into the White House and we may not be around to remove him in 2012.

[Beelzebud]

32. Better hope she isn't the nominee then. Everyone I know says this...

[Firespirit]

37. Sorry but

I have a personal problem with HRC. My problem with her is not her war vote, not her stands on issues, and not really even her DLC status. It is with a specific action that she took which I find completely unforgivable, and unless she apologizes for it, she is totally off the table for me. But she'll never apologize for it.

I'm also highly likely to be in a blue state in 2008. So my vote counts less than that of someone in a swing state.

If she is the nominee, no, I WON'T vote for her. But if she is the nominee, expect a three-way race. Since so many Dems and Goopers are dissatisfied with their choices, I am just waiting for a "unity candidate" to surface. Bloomberg?

[sshan2525]

38. And what "unforgivable" problem might that be?

There is not now and never will be such a thing as a "Unity" candidate. The game is way too polarizing to have any candidate appeal to both sides. Think Hillary is too conservative? What kind of politics would a "Unity" candidate have to practice to get even a small percentage of Rethugs to vote for them? All of my reasons above why a 3rd party is not viable in the US have been proven in previous elections. If one votes for a 3rd party one is risking four more years of Rethug rule, period. This country CANNOT take that chance. All other principles or reasoning should be put aside for that reason alone.

[Firespirit]

39. My problem with Hillary:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jane-hamsher/why-is-hillary-clinton-ta_b_33076.html

Sorry, but this is non-negotiable. I will not vote for someone who attacks other party members, WHILE the Chairman and several candidates (who won their races) took the ethical and honorable side.

[sshan2525]

44. Sorry, I don't get it......

Politics is an ugly business that produces ugly words and actions. That isn't right but it's true. I can't see how this would cause one to vote for someone who might inadvertantly give the election to the Repukes. That will produce ugliness many times what Hillary is capable of. (shakes head in disbelief & sadness at people's "cut off their nose to spite their face" attitudes)

[RiverStone]

40. If HRC gets the nomination, I'd be deeply disappointed, but...

I'd reluctantly vote for her. I do want my DEM vote to go to a DEM - even HRC.

My disdain for the rethugs and the BushCo regime far exceeds my dislike for HRC's DLC/corporate connected bravado and IWR voting b.s.

I'm holding out hope folks will tire of her by next Fall and her media darling status with the MSM will dim.

I'd happily and enthusiastically vote for Obama, Gore, or Clark!

[GirlinContempt]

42. I guess if your only choices are evil A and evil B

you should pick the lesser.

[Orsino]

43. They haven't yet invented the Democrat...

...that would come with all the evil, world-destroying baggage that's necessarily attached to any modern member of the GOP. That machine is so antithetical to freedom and democracy that I will vote against it under any conceivable circumstances.

So, yeah, unless a Rebublican manages to persuade me that s/he'll really end the war (yeah, right), I'll even vote Hillary.

on edit: I won't, however, bash anyone who names Hillary among the war pigs, and refuses to vote for her on those grounds. It really is the war, stupid, and that must be top priority.