How many employees of Goldman Sachs are serving in Iraq?

[Robson]

The obvious answer is that few if any are actually involved personally in this war. They are too busy making money, and important, and spending their million dollar bonuses on $1000 pizzas.

This isn't a war fought by those that hob-nob and party with the NY Wall Streeters, (or elsewhere) rich and powerful. This is a war fought by those many young Americans from throughout America with minimal education and wealth, but still ambitious and smart enough to know they need an edge and an education. It wasn't given to them on a silver platter.

They and their familes pay the ultimate price while the rich and powerful, often of both parties, either pontificate or claim faux outrage....but it is always the surfs of America that pay the price.

And that in itself should outrage us all.

[whistle]

1. Sure, as war profiteers

[fishnfla]

2. I think their are 150K plus boots on the ground

working them oil futures. on the government dime, working on the combat pay. well that, and their lives......

[Lucky Luciano]

3. Nothing wrong with making money

Working for Wall St does not make you immoral. A choice between working on Wall St or going to Iraq ain't no choice at all. It is sad that so many people, often the serfs as you put it, must have their lives torn apart (or worse) for *'s war...but people working for GS, ML, BSC, LEH, UBS, JPM, etc should not be universally blamed.

[Robson]

4. Wall Street = Redistribution of wealth,etc

The goal of Wall Street is putting more money into the hands of already very wealthy Americans and taking money out of the hands of average Americans. The trillions upon trillions of dollars that change hands on Wall Street are all subjected to the deduction of a commission/fee tariff that ends up reducing the net worth of all Americans and redistributing the wealth of the country to a select few. They get their cut of America even if they contribute nothing.

The ultimate redistribution consists of the lives that are expended by average Americans in this process called a trillion dollar war that is never participated in by most of the elite.

[BlooInBloo]

14. You must be new to DU.

[wmbrew0206]

5. At least one.....

I personally know of one GS employee who took volunteered to serve in Iraq:

From:
Wall Street Journal
February 8, 2007
Pg. 14

Wonder Land

The Snake Eater

By Daniel Henninger

The Marine and Army officers who patrol Iraq's dangerous places know
they need an identification system similar to cops back home. The troops
now write down suspects' names and addresses. Some, like Marine Maj.
Owen West in Anbar, have created their own spreadsheets and PowerPoint
programs, or use digital cameras to input the details of suspected
insurgents. But no Iraq-wide software architecture exists.

Operating around the town of Khalidiya, north of Baghdad, Maj. West has
been the leader of a team of nine U.S. soldiers advising an Iraqi
brigade. This has been his second tour of duty in Iraq. When not
fighting the Iraq war, he's an energy trader for Goldman Sachs in New
York City.

I doubt he is the only one.

[Robson]

6. Good point - but I agree with Rangel.

But I doubt if there are many that come from the ranks of privilege. There are always exceptions that feel a sense of duty.

I agree with Charlie Rangel that this country needs a public service draft that will involve every young American of every socio-economic level, in the military as well as other needed and important functions such as park service border patrol, disaster relief, etc.

Not only is the draft an important socio equalizer where the entire country is brought together, but it would eliminate that phrase that Republicans and others like to use, "the troops are only doing what they volunteered for" which they use to clear their conscience. When the country is at war both the rich and poor will feel the pain. Perhaps such public service could be used to provide education credits that would cover the cost of college and advance the skill level of the country.


edited spelling.

[Lucky Luciano]

7. ok...while on the subject, I know another one

A guy we just hired on our trading desk did a tour in Afghanistan. Amazing things is that he is 32 years old and was leading a squad for several years. Now he is humble enough to take orders from 23 and 24 year old kids making more than he ever made. He is always ready to help and serve us in any way that we demand while also making it clear that he is an alpha. He will go far. That humility is very endearing.

...and we are not all from privilege as you suggest. I came from a humble background. Both of my parents were teachers. I prefer to hire traders from humble backgrounds. They are hungrier. Those with privileged backgrounds are good for sales and I-Banking roles as their connections afford them many immediate opportunities to add to the bottom line - but straight up trading? That is better for someone who is hypercompetitive and ultra-hungry.

[Robson]

8. Agreed ....but while we're on the subject

Agreed....privilege doesn't necessarily provide redeeming qualities, or the qualities that one wants in an employee. No guarantee there but their connections always help.

BTW while we're on the subject, my belief, not that it will ever change anything, is that the capital markets, investment banking, and deal making are providing a relative, and very selective few with riches far beyond their actual contribution to the US economy. They are skimming off a significant portion of the economy, that has resulted in loss of wages and benefits for the vast majority of Americans and has also impacted our trade imbalances and offshoring of production. I'm not comparing them to Wal-Mart clerks but to scientists and engineers that invent and design and execute the production of high value products that affect the longer term economy.

[Lucky Luciano]

9. Our wavelengths are actually pretty close to being aligned

I agree that the scientists and the engineers are the real producers in this country or any other country for that matter. I am actually a mathematician that became disillusioned with the position in society given to people like myself. So, I figured, "If ya can't beat 'em, join 'em." I can truly say that I like what I do, office politics aside.

I am not sure how to fix the situation though. The trouble with scientists and engineers is that they are often bad businessmen. I have seen it a lot where they had good ideas and inventions, but did not have the good sense or right personality to become successful at making a good business out of their ideas. Often times they are too introverted and they do not have the strong personalities needed to execute. I guess this is why they get the short end of the stick in the end very often. I can say that in this day and age, being a trader does require real skill sets that are becoming ever more technical. It really is a meritocracy. That said, an Ivy League degree, and a connection or two will always help. I had neither, and it was a huge disadvantage for me. What I did have, however, was ruthless persistence. I put all of my chips into the pot (lots of school loans and a little too excessive for a grad student) - it was to the point of bankruptcy or get a Wall St job. I won, and I am proud.

[Bucky]

10. "serfs" of course. "Surfs" are the salty, wet rolly things on the beach.

[Robson]

11. Thanks

Thanks.....I sometimes find it utterly amazing how easy it is to misspell and type wrong words like "where" instead of "wear", or here instead of hear, or surf instead of serf. What can I say except it's the thought that counts not the technicalities...LOL, although it only reflects what you paid for it.

btw I should use the spell checker.

[sanskritwarrior]

12. There's this guy as well.........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilario_Pantano

And then there's me...........My family is well off, and one of my father's friends offered me a 250K salary a year job at his company. I was basically going to go straight from the Infantry to a VP position. I thanked him and told him I was more than happy in my current job in the Army.........

Now, the majority of soldiers today do come from lower class or middle class families, but I have to say there are more "rich kids" in the Army now than I ever remember.

Two soldiers in my shop (S-2) are prime examples......

CPL (name redacted) Mueller from Denver, Colorado, her dad owns the largest construction firm in Denver, she said her family was worth 10 million dollars

PFC (name redacted) Arenas from Chicago, Illinois his dad owns an import export business and is worth (according to Arenas) 75 million dollars.........

Granted they areso many more low income people, but when I was a private I would never have met a soldier like these two........

[Leopolds Ghost]

13. Sanskritwarrior, are you going back?

See, this is the thing I don't get... I'm highly skilled at design and planning, have essentially started a business, and people don't take me seriously. No way any of the folks I know would give me a job making over $35 grand. What do you have to do, go off and kill folks in battle to prove you can take orders and are thus a good hire? That's what seems to have happened after WWII when everyone who served got a job.

[sanskritwarrior]

17. Yes in November or so

n/t

[sanskritwarrior]

18. I don't know bro.......

What I do know is that the longer I'm in the military, the better the job offers I have received are.....

I've been offered 12,000 a month to work for Blackwater (not my cup of tea)

Been offered 250K year as I previously mentioned

I was offered a job 3 weeks ago to train civilian intel analysts for a PMC that started at 150K plus benefits

None of that even mentions the job offers I got from an Israeli company and a job from a Kurdish company in Irbil........(I made a few friends in Kurdistan)

All I know is that I am 33 years old, I have two combat tours in Iraq, I spent most of my Army career in Intel and then switched over to Infantry a few years ago. Since the end of my second tour the job offers come in about once a month, completely unsolicited.................

[Skittles]

15. serving y9our country and working hard means nothing anymore

they will sell your job to the lowest bidder now

[WinkyDink]

16. They're being served in Dubai.